Looking for Straight Goods on Snake Sex

I've read lots of different opinions on this, and I'm looking for answers from people that have experience in the matter.

How many females will a male fertilize in a season?

I've heard 6 or more, I've heard only a couple, I've heard you just dump the male in with 6 females, stir and let simmer...

What's the truth on this? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

There is no "truth".

It all depends on the male, the females, and whether or not you as a breeder have done your job.

You have to remember, these are animals, not DVD players ... you can't "program" them ... they do what they want ... all you can do is put them in the right direction.

Most important thing to remember ... males will breed themselves to death if you let them ... I know a guy that bred a very young $18,000.00 snake to 15 females a couple of years ago ... 12 became gravid ... and the $18K snake died.

Small, young males should only be bred to a small number of snakes ... larger, stronger males will do well with more ... You really have to listen to your animals and let them guide you. Every year I start off with a "base plan" and then let it evolve over the course of the breeding season as I observe how well (or not well) the males are breeding and assess their overall health.

-adam

Wow, Adam.. what actually caused the death of the snake?

poor little guys immune system must of been shot to nothing.:(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

You have to remember, these are animals, not DVD players ... you can't "program" them ... they do what they want ...
-adam

---

Thank you lots of good info there.

The sad truth is that I can't program a DVD player either... I guess I'm really gonna be in trouble. I have to get my lady to turn on the TV for me.. not because I'm the typical pathetic male.. just... well.. I guess I am pathetic.. but atypically so...........


OH.. and my guess about the death of the male? The first female he was bred to found out he was cheating on her.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

I know a guy that bred a very young $18,000.00 snake to 15 females a couple of years ago ... 12 became gravid ... and the $18K snake died.

---

Ouch...bet he won't make that mistake again. =P

Thanks for the info Adam. I'm glad your willing to tutor and share info for people like myself that. I learn so much from your tutulage. Thank you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by srozell

OH.. and my guess about the death of the male? The first female he was bred to found out he was cheating on her.

---

LOL - that is a good theory. :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shelby

Wow, Adam.. what actually caused the death of the snake?

---

Don't know for sure, but my guess would be pnemonia ... Like Tony pointed out ... too much stress from over breeding will weaken the snakes immune system big time.

-adam

That's interesting. Learn something knew every day here..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Don't know for sure, but my guess would be pnemonia ... Like Tony pointed out ... too much stress from over breeding will weaken the snakes immune system big time.

-adam

---

I guess it's a good thing we don't always get our prayers answered, but hey.. what a way to go!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by cassandra

Ouch...bet he won't make that mistake again. =P

---

I bet someone will. It's a shame when any snake dies before its time regardless of how much it cost. Of course he would have been ahead if somehow he could have gotten 11 gravid and saved the male. Still, some breeders might consider this scenario to have come out ok depending on what priorities are used to measure it. Even if only 4 eggs hatched from each of those 12 females that became gravid that's 48 babies. Most likely this was a het for a dominant type morph male. Some breeders might go for dozens and dozens of recessive hets but more likely to try this extreme breeding with the visible dominant type morphs and a couple years ago homozygous dominant type males where even more rare than now so it was probably a heterozygous dominant type male. Even if the morph devalued 75% between the time (next year?) he bought the $18,000 male and when he sold the estimated 12.12 visible morph offspring that's still $108,000 (if both genders where the same price) for a 500% profit. I'm not saying it justifies probably having caused the death of the original male but if the breeder was motivated chiefly by money he might try it again. Even if he only wanted to proliferate the morph as quickly as possible it was still a success on that basis and one of the dozen estimated sons can replace him. If you judge lifespan in progeny the original male might have had an average “full” life but of course it’s not ethically justifiable to breed a snake to death, it’s just understandable what might have motivated it and why it might happen again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RandyRemington

.....and when he sold the estimated 12.12 visible morph offspring......

---

Now why couldn't you just round that to 12 ;)

Good point Randy.....When it comes to streching a male that thin, I think the decision to keep it up falls alot on the breeders experience and ethics.

If you have a male that is a strong breeder, why not keep him that way and not use him up.

I hear of breeders selling 'worn out' females because they won't breed.....does this happen with males also?

I know of one situation when a male was breed to around 12 females....then lost alot of weight, had trouble eating, and was 'weak' for a while after breeding season was over....and if I remember correctly, the guy did not perform as well the next year.

daniel, keep an eye on the ads for the next2-3 months. i bet you'll see alot of breeder males and proven girls for sale! i'll ask anyone why would you sell a proven girl? and i'd be real cautious about breeder males in the next couple of months too.


vaughn

Even more specific than generally worn out, do they run a fair risk of loosing hemipenises over time? I once talked to a boa breeder who had a highly motivated male they believed had lost both of his over the years to females pulling away after lock. They would use him to court females before switching in a more prized male they wanted to do the actual breeding. Maybe female boas are more likely to cause problems in this area for males but you have to figure snakes have two for a reason. I've never really paid attention but my vet once told me they tend to switch sides between breedings. Perhaps even just loosing one would significantly cut down on breeding potential and if it's not uncommon to loose them it seems reasonable that the more times they have been bred the more likely they are to have damage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RandyRemington

had lost both of his over the years to females pulling away after lock.

---

:O OWWWWWIEE!!!! :O

That can't feel good! Such a vivid picture in my head now too...

Thanks RANDY!!! :mad:

<mumbles under breath>

I have had my ball python for about a year and i do not know his/her sex and there are no close vetenarians to do the probing i have tried the popping technique awhile ago but stop b/c nothing was hapening and i did not want to continue to apply pressure b/c i dont know if it will hurt him/her has any1 tried doin this? if so please give me a description on how the process worked

Here you go:
http://www.vpi.com/9VPITipsAndTechs/...exOfSnakes.htm

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RandyRemington

They would use him to court females before switching in a more prized male they wanted to do the actual breeding.

---

I'm with Ken on this...ooowww...and what would you call this guy afterwards? The fluffer? =)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by cassandra

I'm with Ken on this...ooowww...and what would you call this guy afterwards? The fluffer? =)

---

ROFLMAO - just had to explain what that was the other day to my girlfriend. lol

im not saying what that breeder did was right
but i would love to die the exact same way that snake did...

Im not going to let my wife see this thread, she might start using the immune system excuse :(