Need Help - New Baby Ball Python Refusing Food

I received my new baby ball python on 11/27/2024, quickly checked her over and placed her in her enclosure. I attempted to feed her a thawed hooper on 11/29 and she wouldn't come out of her hide to feed. I covered the front of the enclosure and have not attempted to handler her and I only enter the enclosure to replace her water and to moisten the substrate in the morning and evening. I waited a week and attempted to feed her again last night (with lights off) 12/6 and couldn't get her to accept the hopper, so I left it in front of her hide for 4-hours and then removed. During my research prior to buying her I made the mistake of looking for the best size enclosure for a ball python, not a baby python. She is in a 4'x2'x2' PVC enclosure. I have exhausted my entire budget sparing no expense for her setup and have nothing left for a smaller enclosure although I could get a tote and heat mat for a separate feeding area if needed. Not sure what to do at this point and need advice to get her to eat. Also, If I can't get her to eat at what point do I take her to a vet or get outside help. I haven't even seen her in the enclosure but suspect she is in her warm hide. Thank you in advance for any and all help. Her husbandry is as follows:

Ball Python: Blue Eyed Lucy
Born: 6/24
Her feeding card that came with her stated: Frozen/Thawed or Live last fed on 11/22
Enclosure:4'x2'x2'
Light Cycle: 12-on/12-off with 1-hour Ramp-up sunrise and sunset
Warm Side Temp: 90 *F
Warm Side Hide Temp: 95 *F
Cool Side Temp: 82 *F
Cool Hide Temp: 80 *F
Basking Rock Under Heat Lamp: 98-100 *F
Warm Side RH 60-65%
Cool Side RH 50-57%
Substrate: 4" Coconut Husk with Sphagnum Moss in Hides
Plenty of additional hiding areas and two water bowls, one near warm hide and one near cool hide

I'm sure a lot of people will have some good suggestions, but, in the meanwhile...my immediate advice:

1. No surface temperature in your enclosure should be above 92F (use a temp-gun if you have one). Ambient (air) temperature should not go above 90F.
2. Yes, your enclosure is larger than recommended, but, you can probably make it work: Just throw a bunch of crumpled up clean paper/newspaper in there to provide a ton of ground litter: Ground clutter=good.
3. The size/weight of your snake will determine how often it *needs* to eat. A *feeding* hatchling can go a month or two, a sub-adult 3-4 months, and an adult 9-12 months.
If your snake ate on 11/22: Don't panic, you should have time for the snake to adapt to its new enclosure and/or pass through a shed cycle.
In addition: just fyi-the hungrier they get-the less discriminating they become about their food. :)

My :twocents:

That's a very thorough description, but pics would still help us to advise you better. This thread will show you how to post them: https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...-Post-Pictures.

https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/fil..._enclosure.jpgI hope I am adding this picture correctly, this is my first forum. This is her enclosure and thank you for the help. I am going to clutter the heck out of it. https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=61847

Your enclosure looks really nice- for us :) but it's too big & open for a new young BP to appreciate. It's really important to get the right kind & size of hides for shy young snakes, especially BPs. Here's a link to the type many of us use (including me) & they're what most of us recommend: (not fancy to look at- just very functional)
https://beanfarm.com/collections/hides Normally you also can find similar ones @ Reptile Basics, but right now they're out of stock on everything but large ones- I just looked.

From what I can tell (pic is too far away) you may be using some decorative things that are not suitable for any or all of the following reasons: too big for snake, doorway is too big or the hide is open on both ends (offers no privacy), "ceiling" is too tall (BPs actually like "back pressure" from a low ceiling & hides that are just big enough for them to curl up in, but without so much room that they feel something else might sneak up on them...in other words, they like to feel "snug"- or so our collective experience suggests. If that's the case- consider these items as "cage furniture" but not "hides" & provide the right kind in addition to what's in there, with proper placement for temperatures of the actual hides. It's always better to get the set-up right before adding a new snake, because now you'll have to disrupt what they already know...which is best avoided or at least minimized. Do the best you can.

You mentioned being low on funds after buying all that you have so far, & while the recommended hides aren't expensive (& they really hold up in the long run! -they're a great value) you can use disposable cardboard boxes in the meantime if you want- cut clean boxes & modify to fit the type suggested above, & when they get dirty, toss & replace them. You should have at least one secure hide on the warm side, & at least one on the cooler side. As already mentioned above, you don't want any surface temperatures above 90-92*-otherwise your snake may be injured (burned) & that's important to prevent.

While we're talking about hides, many snakes (including BPs) will appreciate a "humid hide" also, & it should be either midway or on the cool side, to facilitate shedding & provide a humidity boost they appreciate. For a humid hide, just get a new plastic food container of the appropriate size & shape, & cut a hole in the snap-off top big enough for the snake to come & go (with a meal). Inside, put a thick layer of very damp sphagnum moss* (re-moisten as needed). The container should be about half full with moss, so there's plenty of room for the snake too. *It's sold dry, so soak it first, & allow most of the water to drain off. Snakes are really drawn to their humid hides & it saves us from having to help them shed.

BTW- :welcome:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wesleysparks40

Frozen/Thawed or Live last fed on 11/22

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Lucky you got a feeding card at all. I would ask the breeder about the exact details on this. Was the FT prey a mouse, or something else? How was it presented (on tongs, on a tray, in the hide, with the snake in a feeding cup, etc)? Was it room temp or warmed? How many FT feedings did this snake have relative to live feedings? (It could be the snake prefers live, but once or twice took an FT.)

A couple other observations: that light looks pretty bright. I'd try to dim it.

If the RH is reading 10% higher in a zone that's almost 10 degrees warmer, I'd not put much faith in those RH readings since they don't make sense. An RH of 54% at 82F (your cool side) is a dewpoint of 64F; at 90F (on the warm side) that would give an RH of 42%.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wesleysparks40

I received my new baby ball python on 11/27/2024, quickly checked her over and placed her in her enclosure. I attempted to feed her a thawed hooper on 11/29 and she wouldn't come out of her hide to feed. I covered the front of the enclosure and have not attempted to handler her and I only enter the enclosure to replace her water and to moisten the substrate in the morning and evening. I waited a week and attempted to feed her again last night (with lights off) 12/6 and couldn't get her to accept the hopper, so I left it in front of her hide for 4-hours and then removed.

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I'm not convinced that you have a problem at all. Ball pythons take a while to settle into their new enclosures. You've only had her for 10 days. Have patience. If Lord Sorril says a hatchling bp can go a month without eating, then you shouldn't start worrying until then. I would, however, address the excessive temps immediately.

I am going to purchase the new hides this evening and make a humid hide for her as well out of some Tupperware I have. I checked the calibration on the push sensors I am using in the enclosure, and they were completely out of wack. I calibrated them using an accurate psychrometer and I also mounted a digital hygrometer/thermometer in the back. I rechecked all of my surface temps which are steady at 92 with the exception of the large flat stone I have directly below the heat lamp, it will reach 102 *F just as the controller shuts off the lamp and then falls to about 94 *F. Some of this temp maybe reflected light so I will need to recheck this at night. I changed the differential setting on the logic controller that I am using which should help as well. I feel a whole lot better knowing that she is okay going without eating every week. Should I continue to wait to handle her until she starts feeding? I will have to move her around when I make modifications such as the humid hide and other hides. Thanks everybody!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wesleysparks40

Should I continue to wait to handle her until she starts feeding?

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I suggest you wait until she has three successful feedings before handling her.

Okay no problem on waiting to handle her, I just want her to adjust well. I also scaled back the ambient lighting by 50% so it's not so bright.

I will post an update once I get her to eat and post new/better pictures of both her and the enclosure adjustments so that people who have similar issues will have a thread of dos/don'ts. I'm really excited to finally have a ball python. I had a male eclectus parrot for 27-years that I was very close too, he died of cancer last year. Not able or even willing to try and replace him with another bird I thought I would give a python an amazing home, and when she wouldn't eat, I started to panic!

Snakes are a lot quieter than parrots...quite a change. I'm sorry you lost your pal of 27 years, & it's quite normal to panic when a new snake won't eat- they're quite different from most other pets, but in time you'll "get" where yours is coming from, I'm sure. And we can make some generalizations, but they all have their own personality too, along with prior experience that might impact their current attitudes, so staying low-key for a while & letting them settle in is important. Even captive-bred snakes are essentially wild creatures that rely on their instincts to survive...& to them, we appear to be giant predators, since the only thing that picks them up in the wild is a predator that's about to eat them. So when you do start handling, keep that in mind- they feel safer when hiding, not out in the open.

I decided to construct a separate feeding tote which gives me more control over her feedings and allow me to get in her enclosure and make changes. Good thing too because I had to remove everything from the enclosure to find her. She somehow managed to wedge herself in the corner of the enclosure and the ponytail palm pot. I wouldn't even have thought she could get back there. After being placed in the tote she went right after her meal. I weighed her, she is 99-grams. Looks like every week I will have to remove everything to find her, feed her and put everything back. Guess I brought this on myself with a "big set-up for a baby".

I purchased the new hides recommended and they are nice, made really well thank you. Added a humidity hide and more plants. I have more coming, but they are back ordered. I purchased a roll of brown masking paper from the local hardware store, ripped and crumpled it for ground clutter, it doesn't look half bad. I removed the single-stage controller I was using and purchased a two-stage controller which is working out a lot better.

I uploaded pictures to the gallery keyword, Bella.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wesleysparks40

I decided to construct a separate feeding tote which gives me more control over her feedings and allow me to get in her enclosure and make changes.

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Sounds like it is going well! Good job! :)

Side Story:
My first ball python I would feed in a cardboard box outside of her enclosure. Over time she associated my hands with feeding time and would take a few crazed strikes at me whenever I reached in to perform husbandry. It is not a big deal when they are small, but, as they get older-those half-hearted strikes become full on feeding bites (and getting bitten and then have the snake 'constrict' and twist the teeth in your skin-is no fun for anyone).

Eventually I just started leaving the rodent in the room for a few minutes to 'scent it' in advance and I would see her head stick out and I would know where to reach in with forceps and dangle the prey item. Sometimes I would use a plate on top of the substrate beneath the rodent to make sure she did not get a mouthful of 'dirt' while eating.

With a much larger collection now-all of my ball pythons eat within their enclosures and have associated the scent of rodents (not my hands) as the indicator of feeding time.