My Ball Python tested positive for Nidovirus

The title says it all.
My first snake was a corn snake, who I’ve had for the past 6 months. I’ve always wanted a Royal Python, and researched them for years. I finally took the plunge and bought Buddy, who was perfect when I first bought him home. He’s a stunning low white pied with a lovely temperament, I was over the moon.

He was great for the first 2 weeks, he ate for me twice. Then out of the blue, he stopped eating. I tried to leave him be, knowing this is common in royals. Then after a month of not eating, I noticed he had a bubbly mouth. I knew this must’ve been an RI, so took him to the vets the very next day. Upon talking through my vivarium, temps and humidity, the vets said they seemed to be good. The vets took swabs and blood work from Buddy but said it would take a week or so to get results. They gave me antibiotic injections to give him daily, and nebulise him twice a day which I have been doing for the past 10 days.

However, today I received my results back. Buddy tested positive for Nidovirus. I didn’t know what this was at first, but upon researching it a bit I realised the fatality and I am absolutely heartbroken. He came from a big breeder so I will definitely provide them with the results, but I’m not sure what they’ll say about this. I have never seen a bad review against this breeder, which makes me very confused with how my snake can have Nidovirus but no one else (that I can see) has experienced this? I also checked reviews for my corn snake’s breeder and I’m met with the same thing. All positive reviews.

I’ve kept Buddy completely quarantined from my corn snake, and have been careful, I assume Nidovirus affects all snakes, however I can’t find much information on it. I don’t know if my corn snake has it, and whether I can even get him tested as it can lie dormant in them.
I am heartbroken, as I’m sure I will have to get Buddy euthanised as there is no cure. I just wanted to share this here as I can find very little information on it. Has anyone else had any Nidovirus experiences? I can’t possibly see how it can be preventable which is so upsetting.

I'm so sorry for your sad situation. I have no personal experience with this, just wanted to share this, not knowing where you are (but it can happen anywhere):

https://www.9news.com/article/life/a...f-b8928893d4ba

And notice the date on that ^ ^ ^ news story was December 30, 2020

I'm sorry. Nido has hit a lot of collections hard and it seems like in the past year we're hearing more and more about it.

The seller may not have even known it was sick since was eating and appeared outwardly healthy. Often the stress of shipping can cause it to flare up if the snake is carrying it.

If you search for "nidovirus" on Youtube you can find videos with experiences that other breeders have had. Some lost a lot of animals.

Sorry to hear that. Hope your snake pulls through. From what I've read, Nidovirus can lay dormant and have flareups like a cold sore. Only it's much worse. When they're not having flareups they can even test negative even though they are a carrier of the virus.

I have just gone through the same thing. Bought 2 ball pyhtons in December and in January they started showing signs of an RI so brought then to my reptile vet and nothing seemed to shift it so we sent off swabs and while waiting for them to come back my albino female passed away and once I got the result I has to bring in my pied female to be euthanized. Broke my heart. I had never heard about it before and its the most horrendous thing when you read about it.

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Originally Posted by SnKReptiles

I have just gone through the same thing. Bought 2 ball pyhtons in December and in January they started showing signs of an RI so brought then to my reptile vet and nothing seemed to shift it so we sent off swabs and while waiting for them to come back my albino female passed away and once I got the result I has to bring in my pied female to be euthanized. Broke my heart. I had never heard about it before and its the most horrendous thing when you read about it.

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That is so very sad, I'm so sorry about your losses. So sudden & unexpected- just awful.

Because buyers are afraid to name the breeders they got sick snakes from often times they don't get that reputation until some one says the name and then others realize "me too"... To have a "Big breeder" sending out snakes with Nidovirus is dangerous to the whole reptile community.

Nidovirus is not an automatic death sentence. This narrative is solely down to the fact that the ability to test for the virus is stupidly easy but our actual knowledge of the virus and its behaviour/pathology/prevalence is pretty hazy.


https://youtu.be/EU4iJMdD6Tw

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Originally Posted by Amos1974

Because buyers are afraid to name the breeders they got sick snakes from often times they don't get that reputation until some one says the name and then others realize "me too"... To have a "Big breeder" sending out snakes with Nidovirus is dangerous to the whole reptile community.

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You know I read a story and an exchange between a buyer and big breeder a year or so ago. I'll leave the breeder's name off of this because this was an alleged situation and I don't know how true it is. Buyer picked up a handful of snakes from the breeder, over time found that they had nido, reached out to the breeder, didn't have a good experience, and took to forums/FB to comment on the situation.

Two things happened as a result of this. One, the breeder got involved and began displaying some pretty poor customer service, and two and more importantly, the fans of this big breeder started attacking the buyer on his posts. Of course all the responses weren't an attack on the buyer, but there was a lot of blame shifting, excuses, alternate theories, etc etc.

I do think if you have a bad experience with a breeder you should let the community know, but at the same time I understand why some people might be hesitant to do so based on situations like that one.

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Originally Posted by asplundii

Nidovirus is not an automatic death sentence. This narrative is solely down to the fact that the ability to test for the virus is stupidly easy but our actual knowledge of the virus and its behaviour/pathology/prevalence is pretty hazy.


https://youtu.be/EU4iJMdD6Tw

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Re video ^ ^ ^ Very interesting in depth discussion. Long video, you can skip at least the first 6 minutes of irrelevant chatter. Lots yet to be learned on this- thanks!

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Originally Posted by Hugsplox

You know I read a story and an exchange between a buyer and big breeder a year or so ago. I'll leave the breeder's name off of this because this was an alleged situation and I don't know how true it is. Buyer picked up a handful of snakes from the breeder, over time found that they had nido, reached out to the breeder, didn't have a good experience, and took to forums/FB to comment on the situation.

Two things happened as a result of this. One, the breeder got involved and began displaying some pretty poor customer service, and two and more importantly, the fans of this big breeder started attacking the buyer on his posts. Of course all the responses weren't an attack on the buyer, but there was a lot of blame shifting, excuses, alternate theories, etc etc.

I do think if you have a bad experience with a breeder you should let the community know, but at the same time I understand why some people might be hesitant to do so based on situations like that one.

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I remember that "hot mess", & much of this seems to come down to how much is not yet known about Nido, & how to interpret tests done. New snakes are under so much stress (shipping & whole new environment) & that naturally lowers the ability of their immune system to function well. This goes back to what I always tell people when they get a new snake of any age: treat it like a patient in ICU (intensive care unit in the hospital) or like a newborn human baby for a while- it needs rest & good food, with a low-stress environment & optimal conditions, while it's body recovers from all it has been exposed to. I can see where even if breeders test for Nido, the snakes they ship out could have tested negative for it & potentially then later, under stress, test positive for it. What a nightmare for everyone.

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

I remember that "hot mess", & much of this seems to come down to how much is not yet known about Nido, & how to interpret tests done. New snakes are under so much stress (shipping & whole new environment) & that naturally lowers the ability of their immune system to function well. This goes back to what I always tell people when they get a new snake of any age: treat it like a patient in ICU (intensive care unit in the hospital) or like a newborn human baby for a while- it needs rest & good food, with a low-stress environment & optimal conditions, while it's body recovers from all it has been exposed to. I can see where even if breeders test for Nido, the snakes they ship out could have tested negative for it & potentially then later, under stress, test positive for it. What a nightmare for everyone.

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Exactly. This is actually one of the issues we had at my company when we started talking about bringing people back into the office prior to the covid vaccine being widely available. The concern was we could have employees test negative before coming back, but testing negative today doesn't mean you don't get exposed tomorrow. There's just no guarantee that if I test my stock monthly or whatever, that someone still won't get a sick snake. There's also those people who might have it in snakes they already own, and try to blame the breeder of a new snake they just got, when in reality it was already in their collection. Taking advantage of the lack of information.

Hopefully though as the hobby continues to gain popularity we'll learn more. Kinda like parvovirus in dogs, we identified that what in the 70s? Now we have decontamination methods and vaccines.

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Originally Posted by Hugsplox

Exactly. This is actually one of the issues we had at my company when we started talking about bringing people back into the office prior to the covid vaccine being widely available. The concern was we could have employees test negative before coming back, but testing negative today doesn't mean you don't get exposed tomorrow. There's just no guarantee that if I test my stock monthly or whatever, that someone still won't get a sick snake. There's also those people who might have it in snakes they already own, and try to blame the breeder of a new snake they just got, when in reality it was already in their collection. Taking advantage of the lack of information.

Hopefully though as the hobby continues to gain popularity we'll learn more. Kinda like parvovirus in dogs, we identified that what in the 70s? Now we have decontamination methods and vaccines.

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Funny you mention the similarity to the COVID situation, as they mentioned that too, in the video shared (post #8), when it comes to tests that are negative but later show positive, etc. Lots more research is needed & in the meantime, we need to be careful about finger-pointing & let the science sort this out.

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Originally Posted by SnKReptiles

I have just gone through the same thing. Bought 2 ball pyhtons in December and in January they started showing signs of an RI so brought then to my reptile vet and nothing seemed to shift it so we sent off swabs and while waiting for them to come back my albino female passed away and once I got the result I has to bring in my pied female to be euthanized. Broke my heart. I had never heard about it before and its the most horrendous thing when you read about it.

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What we’re the symptoms you saw from the ones that had to be euthanized??

Looked just like an RI. Open mouth breathing, bubbling in the mouth. She even took a meal towards the end cause she looked to be getting better but when I got the results my vet said their is no cure and there will be lesions all over her body inside and will only get worse so kindest thing was to put her down.

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Originally Posted by SnKReptiles

Looked just like an RI. Open mouth breathing, bubbling in the mouth. She even took a meal towards the end cause she looked to be getting better but when I got the results my vet said their is no cure and there will be lesions all over her body inside and will only get worse so kindest thing was to put her down.

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I'm so sorry for your loss & for her suffering. RI's are not rare, especially among BPs- so this should scare anyone with a snake that exhibits the symptoms of an RI, especially when you have more than one snake & knowing this is contagious. The takeaway is to get your snake tested for Nido if they show signs of an RI- and to practice good quarantine (for a long enough time!) when adding any new snakes to one's collection- no matter how "reliable" the source. Nido is a horrible disease- thank you for sharing your experience here to raise awareness.

Ya I got her off a very highly recommended place. You just never know. Thankfully I was lucky and the rest of my collection didn't get it because I quarantined. Its so important.

Wow, thanks to asplundi for giving the open door to this virus (nido) through the discussion with Travis and DVM Dale Porcher. A wealth of information that we all as keepers need to know. We really have to stay on top of our husbandry and quarantine practices is what I get out of this. Always being watchful and careful for signs of illness and inappetance in our collections. Thanks again asplundi!

I'm glad this thread got bumped, since that linked discussion is fantastic. Here's a link to the podcast version:

https://soundcloud.com/theherpetocul...dr-porcher-dvm

Good to hear that RAL is recommended by Dr. Porcher. I've been using their services and this makes me feel even more secure in doing so.

Thanks MA. Definitely will take a listen to it. I’ve already taken a page out of this topic and incorporated new cleaning and disinfecting practices. Thanks again

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Originally Posted by Malum Argenteum

I'm glad this thread got bumped, since that linked discussion is fantastic. Here's a link to the podcast version:

https://soundcloud.com/theherpetocul...dr-porcher-dvm

Good to hear that RAL is recommended by Dr. Porcher. I've been using their services and this makes me feel even more secure in doing so.

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Makes me feel better too. I've done a full test panel for all 3 of my snakes. Can't be too careful.

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Originally Posted by Malum Argenteum

I'm glad this thread got bumped, since that linked discussion is fantastic.

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There is a second discussion from 13Dec2021 as well, episode #102 :gj: