Boa Health Declining Quickly- Advice Needed

Hello

I am new to snakes, and I got my first snake, a boa, in fall of 2020. He is around 9 months old now, but I am very worried about him.

I bought him from a local pet store that said he came from a local breeder. He is, as far as I know, a standard BCI. He has a 4x2x1.5 PVC viv. The ambient temperature is always between 77 and 80, with floor temps measured by an IR gun being 75 in the coolest spot, 80 in the middle, 83 on the hot side, and a basking spot of 88-90. There are 2 under tank heaters and a CHE maintaining temps on thermostats. He has coco fiber substrate, rocks, and tons of wood and leaf clutter so that he feels safe. Humidity on the cool side is usually around 55-58% and humidity on the hot side is usually around 60-63%.

He seemed to thrive for a while, but since about six to seven months he has started declining. He is losing weight, despite eating as large of a meal as I can safely give him (almost) weekly. He weighs less than he did when I got him. He sheds regularly and has grown in length but not by much. He is 90g right now and I am feeding him ~11-12g rodents weekly, if he will take them. As of the last month his feeding has been intermittent. Sometimes he wont take it at all, sometimes I'll feed him and a day later he'll be back at the front of the cage looking for more. He has never regurgitated but he will lie on his back while eating.

He is weakening. When he was younger he hung to my arm very well but now he falls off of it very easily and appears to wobble when trying to stretch. He also spends most of his time pressed against the front of his viv on the hot side , with half his body on the ground and the other half pointing straight up leaning against the glass. He drinks a lot of water, and I've listened to him breathe and checked his mouth and body for any signs such as mouth rot, scale rot, clicking/wheezing breathing, mites or ticks, but there isnt anything I can identify.

I live out in the country and the closest reptile vet is 4+ hour drive away. I took him there soon after I first got him and they said he was a healthy snake, but it was just a generic visit. I am a student and I have classes during the week, and by the time I get done with classes it is too late to make the long drive to the vet. We have no breaks coming until May. I dont know what to do. A few months ago he was nearly 120g, now I struggle to keep him above the 80s. Is there anything I can do to help him?? :(((

Sorry to hear that you're having trouble with your boa, OP.

Isolate your boa from any other reptiles you have immediately. Your boa is throwing some red flags for something called IBD (Inclusion Body Disease), which is unfortunately circulating within the captive boa population (particularly within morph boas/common BIs). Otherwise unexplained weight loss and a loss of coordination are common symptoms. Call your reptile vet, see if you can get a quick opinion over the phone, and consider getting your boa in to get tested for IBD through the University of Florida. It's not uncommon for baby boas to be a bit uncoordinated and wobble a little when they make a Big Stretch, but this sounds like it could be something more.

The only other thing I could think of that would cause such weight loss is a parasite infection. A fecal test could establish if parasites are at fault quickly. Being weak from weight loss could explain your boa's loss of coordination and weakness.

Your enclosure is a bit on the large size for a boa that young and your hot spot could be about two degrees cooler, but it sounds like your boa is otherwise okay with that setup if they're eating regularly and out and about.

Good luck!

That's an awful lot of weight loss & I'm sorry to say it sounds pretty serious. I think a vet visit is what you need- this doesn't sound like a husbandry issue, unless he was ever over-heated??? (Excessive heat can cause neurological damage to snakes- but you said you're using t-stats & all that.)

Was he fed live rodents? Either by you or before you got him, IF you know? I ask because live rodents can share parasites like intestinal worms that steal a snake's food & health. But this could be something else & I don't wish to speculate. It's not appropriate or ethical to diagnose a seriously ill snake over the internet that we haven't even seen in real life, even IF we were veterinarians, which we are not- some of us are long time keepers & breeders of snakes with many years of experience, but that's all, so please believe me when I say you need some lab work done if you hope to save this snake. Waiting = more risk. Sorry if it's not convenient, so much of life isn't. ;)

If you need more vet options: https://arav.site-ym.com/search/custom.asp?id=3661

Your initial vet check-up wasn't likely to turn up anything- snakes are too stoic for that, so unless they did real lab work (blood & stool) & for actual symptoms, they were just re-assuring you with very little information to support their conclusion. Pet stores have tons of temptation, but keep in mind that their unfortunate animals have often been shipped to them from a long ways away under crowded & very stressful conditions (that weakens their immune system) & with exposure to both captive-bred & wild caught, native & non-native reptiles, some of which are likely to be ill or carriers of diseases & parasites- so bottom line, it's a risky place to buy a snake. In the past, when I was a new keeper, I have done so also, but it takes "luck" too.

Good luck, I hope you get him some help, quickly. I'll admit that IBD crosses my mind too- pythons tend to get very sick much quicker whereas boas can have this for a while before becoming symptomatic. Sure hope that's not what it is though- again, you need professional vet help on this.

Thank you for your responses. I'm going to call the vet on Monday first thing. I hope I will be able to get him in quickly.

I dont have any other reptiles, so unless he has something that could pass to dogs or cats, I think that there shouldn't be an issue.

I have looked at his poop but never seen anything too concerning in it, but I will save his next poop to get it tested.

He has never overheated to my knowledge. I have always had his cage on thermostats, one for each heating element with the probes directly above the heating pads on the bottom of the PVC cage, secured with thermal tape. The CHE is for ambient temperatures more than it is a basking area, but I do monitor the area directly below it and the branch next to it to make sure they're not getting too hot. Where I live it can get very cold in the winters, which is why i invested in a PVC cage so early.

He has never eaten live rodents to my knowledge, and I have always fed him f/t rodents. He might have as a hatchling though.

I fed him today. He has gotten worse since the last I fed him. He curled into a tight ball like a curly fry at first and was striking somewhat everywhere. He bit and dropped the rodent twice, I wasnt sure he was going to take it. When he did finally start to eat it after I helped a little, he kept spinning around while doing so and started bobbing up and down afterwards, before going to his favourite digesting branch. I have seen him lying on his back while eating before, and he has never been the most accurate, but this was much worse than I have seen before. It will be at least two days before the vet opens and I may not get into the vet that day either though I hope that I will.

Just a hunch on my part but does he happen to be a morph? Is he all black?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OatBoii

Thank you for your responses. I'm going to call the vet on Monday first thing. I hope I will be able to get him in quickly.

I dont have any other reptiles, so unless he has something that could pass to dogs or cats, I think that there shouldn't be an issue.

I have looked at his poop but never seen anything too concerning in it, but I will save his next poop to get it tested.

He has never overheated to my knowledge. I have always had his cage on thermostats, one for each heating element with the probes directly above the heating pads on the bottom of the PVC cage, secured with thermal tape. The CHE is for ambient temperatures more than it is a basking area, but I do monitor the area directly below it and the branch next to it to make sure they're not getting too hot. Where I live it can get very cold in the winters, which is why i invested in a PVC cage so early.

He has never eaten live rodents to my knowledge, and I have always fed him f/t rodents. He might have as a hatchling though.

I fed him today. He has gotten worse since the last I fed him. He curled into a tight ball like a curly fry at first and was striking somewhat everywhere. He bit and dropped the rodent twice, I wasnt sure he was going to take it. When he did finally start to eat it after I helped a little, he kept spinning around while doing so and started bobbing up and down afterwards, before going to his favourite digesting branch. I have seen him lying on his back while eating before, and he has never been the most accurate, but this was much worse than I have seen before. It will be at least two days before the vet opens and I may not get into the vet that day either though I hope that I will.

---

The vet you're planning to see does have plenty of experience with snakes & other reptiles, right? (I know some vets will see anything just to help out, but reptile medicine is quite different, so hopefully yours is listed with ARAV.)

The stool has to be fresh (same day, preferably much less than full day) for the vet to see much. They do a fecal float & use magnification (microscope) to check- not likely you'd see anything.

It sounds like you've given him very good care (though I agree w/ previous post that the highest temps. could be a couple- 2-3- degrees lower). I kept a BCI for many years, btw.

His symptoms (loss of coordination) seem to be neurological & serious, I'm sorry to say. I'm very glad this is your only reptile right now, so you don't have to worry about contagion to others. And no, it's very unlikely to be anything that dogs or cats could catch- that's one big difference with our cold-blooded pals. They can't pass much to us either.

Any chance he's been exposed to some sort of toxic chemical? That's another possible explanation for this sort of thing.

I hope the vet can help with whatever this is- & I hope you'll update us here too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OatBoii

He curled into a tight ball like a curly fry at first and was striking somewhat everywhere. He bit and dropped the rodent twice, I wasnt sure he was going to take it. When he did finally start to eat it after I helped a little, he kept spinning around while doing so and started bobbing up and down afterwards, before going to his favourite digesting branch.

---

...based on what I've read and heard, this really sounds like end-stage neurological symptoms of IBD. I can't actually and ethically offer you a diagnosis (not a vet, and even if I was I couldn't ethically give you one over the internet), but I can suggest that you prepare yourself for one. Unfortunately, there is no cure for IBD, and euthanasia is generally seen as the most humane option for animals in the end stages of the disease.

I highly suggest using the herp vet locator that Bogertophis shared and seeing if there are any other herp vets around you. Give them a call, tell them your boa's symptoms, your concerns about IBD, and ask to be seen as soon as possible. This is an urgent, serious matter and you should get your boa to the vet as soon as possible. If your vet does come back an IBD diagnosis, please know that this isn't your fault. A large part of the reason why IBD is as prevalent as it is within the hobby is unscrupulous breeding, the refusal of many breeders to test, and the fact that boas can be asymptomatic for years before the disease manifests. The fault isn't on you, particularly as a new keeper.

If it's any consolation, there is currently no evidence that IBD can spread to or effect dogs, cats, or humans.

He is not a morph, as for as I know he is a common BCI. He may have hets if he actually came from a local breeder, but if he does I dont know them. He was sold to me as a common BCI so I'm assuming that's all he is.

The vet I am going to call is experienced with reptiles but is not ARAV Certified. There are only 3 ARAV certified vets in my entire state, one of which does not work at a vet clinic, one is a university professor, and the third is a vet for the zoo. I used the link provided in an earlier reply and did some research. I'm not sure I could get in contact with any of these veterinarians, let alone get an appointment with them. One of them used to work at a vet clinic though- should i call that clinic and ask if they have another experienced reptile vet?

Thank you for the heads up about the fecal. And I will lower his temps a few degrees as well. It is also good to hear that none of the mammals in the house are in danger either.

I dont believe he has been exposed to anything. I clean his tank with reptile safe cleaners. There hasn't been a bug spray in my house since last spring, and it's not early enough for the planes to be crop dusting yet. We havent started gardening yet either this year, so the chances of me bringing in anything from the fields is low. We dont make a habit of using any pesticides or other treatments anyways, but we do clean the house a lot. Every other day. However, my snake is in a room that we clean sparingly, and I have never used any chemical cleaners within 10 or so feet of him. Plus, I always wash my hands before and after I handle him, so i dont think it's that either. But it's possible I'm missing something? How much or little exposure would be needed to cause such serious issues? I hate the idea that our constant cleaning may have gotten chemicals in the air or something and caused all this :ccc

Edited for new response-

I was somewhat thinking that this was perhaps something terminal or unfixable like IBD. I wish there was an ARAV Certified vet near me, but the closest one that actually works at a clinic is in another state, over 8 hours away, and I'm not certain he would even survive the trip. I have already started looking into euthanasia. I just dont want him to suffer, and seeing him today struggling so much it really made me think about how to tell whether he has quality of life left anymore. I dont want him to slowly starve to death :( Could my town vet put him to sleep even if they're just a normal cat/dog vet?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OatBoii

He is not a morph, as for as I know he is a common BCI. He may have hets if he actually came from a local breeder, but if he does I dont know them. He was sold to me as a common BCI so I'm assuming that's all he is.

The vet I am going to call is experienced with reptiles but is not ARAV Certified. There are only 3 ARAV certified vets in my entire state, one of which does not work at a vet clinic, one is a university professor, and the third is a vet for the zoo. I used the link provided in an earlier reply and did some research. I'm not sure I could get in contact with any of these veterinarians, let alone get an appointment with them. One of them used to work at a vet clinic though- should i call that clinic and ask if they have another experienced reptile vet?

Thank you for the heads up about the fecal. And I will lower his temps a few degrees as well. It is also good to hear that none of the mammals in the house are in danger either.

I dont believe he has been exposed to anything. I clean his tank with reptile safe cleaners. There hasn't been a bug spray in my house since last spring, and it's not early enough for the planes to be crop dusting yet. We havent started gardening yet either this year, so the chances of me bringing in anything from the fields is low. We dont make a habit of using any pesticides or other treatments anyways, but we do clean the house a lot. Every other day. However, my snake is in a room that we clean sparingly, and I have never used any chemical cleaners within 10 or so feet of him. Plus, I always wash my hands before and after I handle him, so i dont think it's that either. But it's possible I'm missing something? How much or little exposure would be needed to cause such serious issues? I hate the idea that our constant cleaning may have gotten chemicals in the air or something and caused all this :ccc

Edited for new response-

I was somewhat thinking that this was perhaps something terminal or unfixable like IBD. I wish there was an ARAV Certified vet near me, but the closest one that actually works at a clinic is in another state, over 8 hours away, and I'm not certain he would even survive the trip. I have already started looking into euthanasia. I just dont want him to suffer, and seeing him today struggling so much it really made me think about how to tell whether he has quality of life left anymore. I dont want him to slowly starve to death :( Could my town vet put him to sleep even if they're just a normal cat/dog vet?

---

Darn, I was hoping it was a neurological idiosyncrasy associated with some morphs as was hinted at by bcr229. I've not heard of this in boas (only BPs), but I'd take bcr229's word for it.

You'll have to do the best you can as far as choosing a vet. I think the IBD test requires a blood sample to be sent to FL- if your vet can do that, it would sure help.

You mentioned crop dusting in your area- can you smell it in your house? If so, I'd suspect that's enough to affect your snake- they're much smaller than us, & simple creatures whose bodies don't handle toxic things very well.

Another thing I've seen (though it was MANY years ago) was a few pet stores that (at the time, not knowing any better) were using pieces or even entire flea collars intended for dogs & cats in the enclosures that housed their reptiles to rid them of the mites they came in with. This sort of exposure could slowly poison them, sadly, though maybe not before they were sold to unsuspecting pet buyers & thereafter went downhill. Any chance your local pet store did something like that?

What sort of cleaners do you use? Plenty of them are toxic to reptiles- things that leave a lingering scent from certain plant oils (like cedar)- that's a maybe?

As far as IBD- I'm glad you're prepared for the possibility- can't say that's what it is- I'm real concerned about the crop dusting where you are too. But yes, your regular vet can probably euthanize successfully IF it comes to that and IF they're willing to try- they can also do a phone consultation first with a more qualified herp vet to be sure they know what to do. I sure hope it doesn't come to that. :please: But like you said, I wouldn't let him suffer either, if it comes to something you can't fix & his quality of life can't be recovered.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bogertophis

Darn, I was hoping it was a neurological idiosyncrasy associated with some morphs as was hinted at by bcr229. I've not heard of this in boas (only BPs), but I'd take bcr229's word for it.

---

I was thinking someone may have dumped a super motley onto an unsuspecting pet store. Yes there are unethical breeders out there who still produce them.

There are a LOT of potential conditions that cause the symptoms being described, ranging from viral infections to overheating to exposure to chemicals. Without a vet visit, bloodwork, and a ton of tests or a necropsy should the boa pass away there's no way to know.

Calling the clinic where the one vet used to work and asking if another reptile vet is on staff isn't a bad idea. Worst case they say "no," best case they may be able to connect you with someone. Sometimes there are good exotic vets that just haven't made it to the ARAV registry/finder yet. I wish I could offer more advise on the vet front, but I can't.

As Bogertophis said, there's a chance that crop dusting, cleaners, or plant oils (specifically those from cedar, pine, and similarly fragrant woods) could be at fault here. Snakes have developed neurological symptoms from overexposure to pine products in the past, and breathing in cleaners and whatever they dust on crops just isn't good for anything. Certain anti-flea products (including the ones repurposed to fight mites) have also caused issues. The wonderful Allison Theus (AKA Crispysnakes) shared a good write-up on No-Pest Strips a little while back; she's also a good resource for IBD-related stuff.

If it's any more consolation, you seem like a well-educated keeper who's been doing a good job by your boa. It sounds like he's had a good life with you -- however brief it's been -- and you should be proud of that. Feel free to PM me if you feel the need.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bcr229

I was thinking someone may have dumped a super motley onto an unsuspecting pet store. Yes there are unethical breeders out there who still produce them.

There are a LOT of potential conditions that cause the symptoms being described, ranging from viral infections to overheating to exposure to chemicals. Without a vet visit, bloodwork, and a ton of tests or a necropsy should the boa pass away there's no way to know.

---

Ugh, I forgot about that one (super motley)- thanks.

And I agree, there's more possible causes for these symptoms too- so try not to jump to a conclusion without tests & all.

I will double check with my vet that they can perform the test.

It is rare to smell the crop dusting in the house, but yes I have smelled it before. However, they have not dusted the crops around me since I got my snake. I got him in the fall of 2020, and they wont crop dust until typically it gets much closer to summer.

I dont think they put flea collars in the display cages, but I wouldnt be that surprised to learn that they had used a flea spray to treat for mites. The more I've learned about reptiles, the less I've liked or trusted all pet stores, but especially mine since it's local.

In his cage I use zoo-med wipe out, and for his water bowl I use a diluted vinegar water mix. In the house proper we dont have any pine/wood cleaners but we do use a lot of lysol for dusting and Bona for mopping. The only place we use bleach is in the bathroom.

I will also call the vet where the ARAV vet used to work. Bare minimum maybe they can perform the test if my vet can't do it?

Thank you all for your replies and support. This is hitting me really hard, especially the fact that even if I perform all the tests, he is probably not going to make it. Whether he was exposed to ambient chemicals, was overheated, got a virus, or he has IBD the end result is still all the same,, right? It was really painful to watch him try to eat tonight. I'm going to try to get him in as fast as I possibly can, but based on the seriousness of his issues I am not very hopeful about his chances.

I know how you feel- you've been a thorough & conscientious owner, & it's just "not fair", & with your first snake even. This is not a typical situation or there wouldn't be so many of us keeping snakes- it's really rotten luck. I really don't think it's anything that you did (though do keep Lysol away so that reptiles aren't breathing it). We're not seeing your snake, but your descriptions are pretty complete- & I'd have to agree it doesn't look too good, but I'll hope for you & your boa anyway. I hope you get the help you need from the vet(s). And know that we're here for you too.

Update: he's sitting on his branch with his mouth open. Just. Sitting there. It's nearly 1 am and I just got up to shoo the cat away because he was being noisy and i noticed him. He isnt facing vertically he's horizontal. Is this a sign of regurgitation?

Thank you for your kind words. I am getting more and more worried about him as the day passes, and I am not sure I'll get back to sleep now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OatBoii

Update: he's sitting on his branch with his mouth open. Just. Sitting there. It's nearly 1 am and I just got up to shoo the cat away because he was being noisy and i noticed him. He isnt facing vertically he's horizontal. Is this a sign of regurgitation?

Thank you for your kind words. I am getting more and more worried about him as the day passes, and I am not sure I'll get back to sleep now.

---

Hard to say without seeing him (I'm not sure what you mean about his position, "facing horizontal"-?) but sometimes before a snake regurgitates, they'll sit with their mouth open. Or he might be having trouble breathing?

What I mean to say is that his head is flat on the branch- not lifted. I did watch his breathing and it seems to be even, though I'm not sure how quickly or slowly he should be breathing? He hasn't shown signs of difficulty breathing up to now, and I dont see any foam/frothing that might indicate that. Sometimes his mouth, like... idk, it spasms? Surges? It sort of seems like a gagging motion?? He's never regurgitated for me before but can snakes gag?

Snakes cannot cough- it's only with difficulty that they regurgitate. You said you just fed him today, so I hope he's not trying to regurgitate, but nothing you can do if he does. Try to get some sleep, eh? ;)

It pains me to say that he did regurgitate overnight, and passed away as well. I'm assuming the severe stress of regurgitating was just too much for him. Or maybe it was something else. I'll never know without an autopsy, and hes been dead for who knows how long already.

Thank you all for your guidance and support. This all happened so fast over the last day... I thought I would have more time, as he had been declining but not acutely. I have a lot of guilt, sadness, and regret right now. I wish I had caught on sooner, and perhaps at least spared him some pain.

Have a good Easter Weekend everyone. Thank you for your time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OatBoii

It pains me to say that he did regurgitate overnight, and passed away as well. I'm assuming the severe stress of regurgitating was just too much for him. Or maybe it was something else. I'll never know without an autopsy, and hes been dead for who knows how long already.

Thank you all for your guidance and support. This all happened so fast over the last day... I thought I would have more time, as he had been declining but not acutely. I have a lot of guilt, sadness, and regret right now. I wish I had caught on sooner, and perhaps at least spared him some pain.

Have a good Easter Weekend everyone. Thank you for your time.

---

I'm truly sorry to hear this, :tears: & it pains me to say I'm not actually surprised, from what you've been describing. In a way it's for the best, you might have gone to a lot of trouble & expense taking him to the vet next week, only for the same outcome. I don't think they could have done much for him, & unless you got hold of very experienced herp vets, I doubt they could have told you much either. Please do not feel guilty...I don't think you did anything that caused this, & I suspect you couldn't have helped him either. These things just happen sometimes- it was rotten luck. So sorry.

If you want to have a necropsy done* his body needs to be refrigerated (not frozen)- that's totally up to you, & there's a few reasons you might want to do so: for one thing, if it was IBD (as a few of us suspect) or something else that's similarly contagious & lethal for snakes, you'd want to let the source you got him from know, as their other reptiles were exposed & at risk also. I wonder if they've heard from other customers about their pet reptiles dying suddenly under similar circumstances, & also if they'd admit it if they had? (Much depends on how well you know & trust them.) They should want to know that this is suspected, so they can avoid buying snakes from the same "local breeder" too. :confusd:

The other thing is that if you plan to get another pet reptile to replace your lost pal, it's best that you don't do so for probably a year+ if in fact it was IBD. There could be lingering traces in your home, assuming he wasn't strictly quarantined in one closed-off room (& no one with one pet snake would do that) that could infect the next pet snake you get. So please do think about that- not saying you would or wouldn't want to "replace" him soon, everyone feels differently about such things, but in this case, I'd suggest you wait a long while & read up on disinfection methods for IBD- sadly his symptoms DO point to that being the cause of his death. It might have been something else, but I'd treat this as if it was IBD at this point, & I doubt you'll be able to have a necropsy done- it was hard enough for you to find a qualified vet to even see him.

Again, you did all you could to keep him comfortable...you couldn't have known...it wasn't your "fault", & I'm sorry for your sad loss. His passing was unfair but inevitable...you've been a good owner, & I hope some day you'll give reptiles another chance to share your life. FYI, the first pet snake I ever had came from a pet store too, & seemed healthy- she was a beautiful adult corn snake. But she went downhill for no reason- not wanting to eat, & I'm pretty sure it was pesticide exposure to kill mites while she was in the pet store. :tears: There was nothing I or my vet could do either, so I know how you feel. For me, that was actually decades & many snakes ago- I didn't give up, & I hope you won't either.

I'm so sorry, OP.

As mentioned earlier, snakes are very stoic creatures. They'll hide any sort of illness until they can't anymore. It makes it a bit difficult to notice when things are just starting to go wrong, particularly if you're new to snakes. Please don't feel guilty about what's happened. You've done very good by your boa and gave him a few months of high-quality life. If you were sold a boa that was a silent carrier of disease or defect -- knowingly or unknowingly -- the fault doesn't lie with you. I hope this doesn't dissuade you from keeping reptiles in the future -- you seem like a very good new keeper, and you boa seemed to be doing well before all of this happened.

It may be possible to arrange for a necropsy through a vet if you'd like some proper answers. The stress of regurgitation is probably what brought things to an end, but if any disease was at play, it may still be possible to test for it via necropsy. Store you boa's body in a refrigerator if you think this is something you'd like to do.

My inbox is open if you'd like to chat or vent.

I messaged Allison Theus today regarding post-IBD clean-up, and she passed along some information that's very useful:

• The virus that causes IBD has a half-life of only eight hours and becomes inactive after a couple of days.
• The virus is susceptible to F10, clorihex, and bleach. Her procedure for moving snakes into previously occupied tubs is to clean the tubs with F10, wipe the tubs down with a Clorox wipe, and then let the tub sit for a week before moving anything in.
• The virus is transmitted via blood and bodily fluids, so cross-contamination is not as much of a worry. That said, she doesn't scrub water bowls with the same sponge and uses disposable gloves between snakes when cleaning as a precaution.

I hope this is helpful, OP. You should be able to clean and reuse your enclosure and life support (ie. heaters), but I'd recommend throwing out anything that can't be sterilized (ie. wood, substrate, etc.). A good cleaning of the room your boa was in should be enough to remove any lingering viral particles as well. In the event you find and fall in love with a new reptile, you don't necessarily need to wait a year for the virus to clear out.

I would recommend notifying the pet store as Bogertophis suggested. Furthermore, I wouldn't recommend going back there for any reptiles in the future if you decide to go that route. There's a good chance they'll still be using the same supplier. If you're interested in pursuing boas in the future, I can recommend a few breeders who do test and clear their boas for IBD (Allison being one of them).

Again, I'm sorry for your loss. You didn't deserve this. :(

WrongPython, thanks so much for the updated info on post-IBD clean-up! I stand corrected, it's been a while since I read up on it, & I should have known there'd be better information by now. :gj: It's a horrible way to lose a pet- very discouraging for anyone- but at least if someone wants to try again, the old advice no longer applies.

You can thank Allison for the information -- I'm just the one that's sharing it here. :)

A lot of the information I share regarding IBD more or less comes from her. Most of the stuff regarding IBD you see on the internet is either something Allison's shared, old and out-of-date, a clinical journal article, or some YouTube video just pays lip service to it. It's a serious, unfortunately fairly prevalent disease that the boa hobby needs to take more seriously, but I think the dearth of information out there speaks for itself. It would be nice to see a push within the boa sphere to tackle and understand IBD like the Morelia sphere's doing with Nido. A few people have tried to start such a conversation (again, Allison), but it just hasn't been taken up yet.

...I should probably get on that sticky for IBD I said I'd do a while back.

Thank you for your kind words, and the updated IBD info. I'm going to order the F10 so that I can clean out my enclosure. At the moment, I don't know whether or not I will be looking to find another pet. Possibly. However, I would appreciate the name of some more reputable breeders or places to look for snakes. I have wanted a snake for over a decade, and although I am very sad today, I know that I will want another snake eventually. If I do, I will let you all know.

Due to the difficulty of even finding an experienced reptile vet near me, the decision was made to give him a "viking funeral", as befitting his name- Odin. I won't lie, my eyes are hurting and I'm exhausted from crying. Part of me wants to take a long break from pets. The other part of me wants to start looking immediately. Logically, I know the best course of action is to wait, but the heart wants what it wants I suppose. I think I'm leaning more towards taking a break at the moment though.

Knowing that you've wanted a pet snake for over 10 years tells me that sooner or later, you'll be ready to try again. I hope so. It's not unusual at all to out-live our pets, & while that's sad, it's just horrible to lose one so young as Odin was, & with no way to really help him. When you're ready & know what you want, there are many here who can give you good references for where to look. Meanwhile, we're all sorry for your loss- believe me, most of us know how you feel.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OatBoii

Thank you for your kind words, and the updated IBD info. I'm going to order the F10 so that I can clean out my enclosure. At the moment, I don't know whether or not I will be looking to find another pet. Possibly. However, I would appreciate the name of some more reputable breeders or places to look for snakes. I have wanted a snake for over a decade, and although I am very sad today, I know that I will want another snake eventually. If I do, I will let you all know.

Due to the difficulty of even finding an experienced reptile vet near me, the decision was made to give him a "viking funeral", as befitting his name- Odin. I won't lie, my eyes are hurting and I'm exhausted from crying. Part of me wants to take a long break from pets. The other part of me wants to start looking immediately. Logically, I know the best course of action is to wait, but the heart wants what it wants I suppose. I think I'm leaning more towards taking a break at the moment though.

---

First, it always hurts to lose a pet. I am really sorry. I agree with others and that it sounds like you got a sick animal. It doesn't sound like this was your fault at all. Please do not blame yourself. Give it some time and see what you want to do.

I can recommend 3 breeders, two of whom I've gotten Boas from.

1. Jeff Ronne/The Boaphile.

He's been doing it forever and builds cages as well (that's how I know him - I have 12 of his cages). Has some amazing BI morphs - from mild to wild and inexpensive to expensive. Good guy and great animals.

2. Tommy Carpenter (TC Reptiles).

He specializes in locality boas. I got my Dwarf BC, Feliz, from him. Good guy, reasonable prices, and his animals are amazing - if you are looking for as nature intended (not a morph), look no further.

3. Boakings. I got both my BI's from Gil at Boakings. He's a small breeder and knows his animals very well. He hand picked my female Ghost BI, Behira, for me (she was my first Boa) because of her temperament and she was established (1+ years old) etc. Then I bought Jeff, my VPI T+ Sunglow Jungle Motley from him. He's based in NY and I live in CT, so I got to meet both animals at shows before taking them home.

I listed them in no particular order and recommend all 3 because of direct experience. There are other breeders that I've heard are excellent as well, but this should cover the gamut. You have a great locale breeder and two great BI morph breeders.

Feel free to PM if you want to get in touch with any of the breeders listed, or have questions about them.

I hope you get some closure and if you want another Boa, keep us posted, and Good Luck!

This is a heartbreaking situation. You have been in my thoughts, though I followed this thread quietly because your information needs were being well met and I didn't want to add to everything you were already struggling to process.

I've kept snakes all my life and worked as a vet tech in exotics practices, and I have to say that as sad as your loss has been, I so much hope you will decide to get another snake. For someone who appreciates them as you do, they can bring a whole world of enjoyment, learning, and even companionship. While illness and premature losses may sometimes happen with any pet, I believe with all my heart that they are more than worth the pain.

I can recommend one more breeder should you decide you are interested - and that is Michael Beach of Woodcliff Herps. I got my pair of Tarahumara Mountain Boas from him, and can attest to the fact that he is an ethical and communicative breeder who's been in the business for a few decades now. He specializes in the smaller locality Boas (no morphs), including the true dwarf species like my lovely Tarahumara pair. I'll copy his list below of planned pairings for this year, though of course there is no way to know whether they'll actually produce this year or not. If you do contact him, you'll find he is responsive and very interested in making sure that his snakes are cared for properly.

Boas
1.1 Hog Island (Sears x Lemke)
2.2 Tarahumaras Rio Bravo)
2.2 Sabogae Pearl Island (Vin Russo)
2.2 Silverback Amarali (Joe Terry)
1.1 Venezuelan Bc (Rio Bravo)
3.3 Peruvian Bc (Rio Bravo x Rio Bravo / Jim Pomaville x Pomaville & Pomaville x Blast) Surinam Bc (WC Futo FLRT x Futo FLRT)
1.1 Pokigron Surinam (Rio Bravo)
2.2 Dwarf Dumerils (EU imports - my proven full grown 2010 & 2012 adults are 4-5 ft max)
3.3 Brazilian Rainbow Boas (All completely unrelated)