(Semi) newbie here with many, MANY questions!

Hello, I'm new to this board and figured this would be a good place to get some knowledge on ball pythons. I did have a corn snake a number of years ago but I was perhaps a bit in over my head at the time and had too many animals in general (several came from friends who gave them to me and a couple even reproduced) so in a move that I still regret to this day, it was among the animals I eventually rehomed. Fast forward to now and I feel it's almost time to give owning a scaly noodle another go. But this time, I want to do it right, by the book. Thusly I've dived into research and have watched videos and read articles from several sources to mentally download as much information as I can, but even then I like the more personal advice from such places as this.

To start off, I currently have an empty 30 gallon tank (36"X12"X16") that's already on a nice cabinet stand and everything. It's for fish so the lid would have to be replaced, but the question is should I even bother or go straight for a recommended 40 gallon breeder that's both easier to access (since it's shorter) and offers more floor space that ball pythons enjoy. Or should I start with that if I get a baby and upgrade later since I've heard conflicting messaging in terms of "too much space" when snakes are young?

Next is location and humidity. Where I live the weather conditions change frequently with the seasons (and even by the week/day sometimes) so I've been thinking of putting the enclosure in the basement where it's more stable (the basement is a finished one and I'm down here a lot by default). Would that be ideal? For reference I plan on using coconut fiber substrate since from what I've heard it strikes a nice balance of retaining humidity while not absorbing it too much and rotting, plus its visual appeal and safety if ingested on accident (as I'd like to do in-tank feeding, did out of tank feeding last time and would rather not again if possible).

Then there's heating. Going to do a UTH, but then my question comes with lighting. I know ball pythons don't necessarily need it, but given mine will probably be living in the basement I'd like to give it light so it can have a proper day/night cycle. But with heating already covered, does that mean I can simply do something like attach a regular lightbulb to a lamp so it doesn't add too much heat? Or would that be too much still? Also, I've read that if you want more humidity you should put the water bowl over the UTH (I am aware you keep the UTH itself outside the tank though). Is that a good idea? Does it evaporate the water too fast or make the water too hot?

As for general supplies I know to get things like an infrared temperature gun, humidity gauge, a timer device with thermometer (forget what they're called), hides, decor, ect. I have a general idea of what types I want to get but I'm open to suggestions and recommendations.

With mice/rats, would it be more cost-effective to buy in bulk online or would it still be cheaper to do it locally since it'd for one snake? I fed live last time with my own colony (which was part of the "overwhelming" issue, got to see firsthand how cannibalistic mice can be) but will adhere to frozen/thawed this time. With that in mind, how long do they keep in the freezer? As in, could I buy a year's worth to store or do I need to buy in smaller batches? And is it okay to refreeze if the snake isn't hungry?

And easily the least important part but I might as well put it here, but seeing as I'll only have one snake I'd like to have something with a little pizazz if you will. Have set my eyes on (and forgive me if I get terminologies wrong, have only recently even heard of the thousands of morphs let alone studied them) piebalds and axanthics. The ultimate prize would be a lightning pied (which from what I understand is a combination of the former two) but that's far and away beyond my budget and the others is already pushing it. Otherwise, a piebald with a half/third of white blotches or what I think is a "base" axanthic (the ones with the wild form pattern but in black/gray/white, looking as if it just crawled out of an old cartoon) would be my ideal choice if I can find one that doesn't break the bank.

Thanks for reading, hoping to have a good time here with you all. :D

For a young Ball, that tank is WAY too big. If you insist on using the 30 gal then I would clutter the crop out of it, with hides, rocks, fake plants, branches, etc. Ball Pytbons like to hide and and big open spaces can stress them out. Highly recommend getting a smaller terrarium and work your way up.

I'll let someone else handle the temp and humidity questions. As I use a heat lamp, which is a less popular option. I have a basking bulb and UVA bulb set up with a timer, to give it adequate heat while maintaining a day/night cycle. The problem with heat lamps is that they fry up the humidity. So I lightly spray the tank a couple times a day as well as cover about half the lid with foil. Seems to work.
Just so long as you have a heat gradient of 84-88 on the hot side and 78-83 on the cool side, with a 60-65% humidity.

With the feed, it depends on what age snake you end up getting. If you buy a young ball I wouldn't buy a LARGE supply, as they'll steadily need to have larger and larger prey (or feeding them multiple prey items). If you can get them to eat F/T then definitely do that and keep them on it. Whatever prey you start feeding them, be sure to keep feeding them the same thing. So if you start feeding them rats (or if the person you get the snake from was feeding rats), keep feeding rats. Balls are notoriously picky eaters and likely won't eat a different prey item that's different from what they normally eat. Honestly, sometimes even different COLOR prey items can make a difference.

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Originally Posted by Jakemh91

For a young Ball, that tank is WAY too big. If you insist on using the 30 gal then I would clutter the crop out of it, with hides, rocks, fake plants, branches, etc. Ball Pytbons like to hide and and big open spaces can stress them out. Highly recommend getting a smaller terrarium and work your way up.

I'll let someone else handle the temp and humidity questions. As I use a heat lamp, which is a less popular option. I have a basking bulb and UVA bulb set up with a timer, to give it adequate heat while maintaining a day/night cycle. The problem with heat lamps is that they fry up the humidity. So I lightly spray the tank a couple times a day as well as cover about half the lid with foil. Seems to work.
Just so long as you have a heat gradient of 84-88 on the hot side and 78-83 on the cool side, with a 60-65% humidity.

With the feed, it depends on what age snake you end up getting. If you buy a young ball I wouldn't buy a LARGE supply, as they'll steadily need to have larger and larger prey (or feeding them multiple prey items). If you can get them to eat F/T then definitely do that and keep them on it. Whatever prey you start feeding them, be sure to keep feeding them the same thing. So if you start feeding them rats (or if the person you get the snake from was feeding rats), keep feeding rats. Balls are notoriously picky eaters and likely won't eat a different prey item that's different from what they normally eat. Honestly, sometimes even different COLOR prey items can make a difference.

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I do have a 10 gallon as well in that case if it isn't too far the opposite direction and too small (though again I'd need to get a lid for it). With that in mind, how do I secure it properly since it wouldn't be the horizontal sliding type lid? Are their special clamps I can get to hold it down or do I just put something heavy enough on top?

And yeah I rather figured if I get a young one to get food in small amounts since the size will change. Will definitely try to get one that's already eating rats at any rate, seems silly to start with mice since they won't be big enough for adulthood and I'm more than aware of their pickiness.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Hello, I'm new to this board and figured this would be a good place to get some knowledge on ball pythons. I did have a corn snake a number of years ago but I was perhaps a bit in over my head at the time and had too many animals in general (several came from friends who gave them to me and a couple even reproduced) so in a move that I still regret to this day, it was among the animals I eventually rehomed. Fast forward to now and I feel it's almost time to give owning a scaly noodle another go. But this time, I want to do it right, by the book. Thusly I've dived into research and have watched videos and read articles from several sources to mentally download as much information as I can, but even then I like the more personal advice from such places as this.

To start off, I currently have an empty 30 gallon tank (36"X12"X16") that's already on a nice cabinet stand and everything. It's for fish so the lid would have to be replaced, but the question is should I even bother or go straight for a recommended 40 gallon breeder that's both easier to access (since it's shorter) and offers more floor space that ball pythons enjoy. Or should I start with that if I get a baby and upgrade later since I've heard conflicting messaging in terms of "too much space" when snakes are young?

Next is location and humidity. Where I live the weather conditions change frequently with the seasons (and even by the week/day sometimes) so I've been thinking of putting the enclosure in the basement where it's more stable (the basement is a finished one and I'm down here a lot by default). Would that be ideal? For reference I plan on using coconut fiber substrate since from what I've heard it strikes a nice balance of retaining humidity while not absorbing it too much and rotting, plus its visual appeal and safety if ingested on accident (as I'd like to do in-tank feeding, did out of tank feeding last time and would rather not again if possible).

Then there's heating. Going to do a UTH, but then my question comes with lighting. I know ball pythons don't necessarily need it, but given mine will probably be living in the basement I'd like to give it light so it can have a proper day/night cycle. But with heating already covered, does that mean I can simply do something like attach a regular lightbulb to a lamp so it doesn't add too much heat? Or would that be too much still? Also, I've read that if you want more humidity you should put the water bowl over the UTH (I am aware you keep the UTH itself outside the tank though). Is that a good idea? Does it evaporate the water too fast or make the water too hot?

As for general supplies I know to get things like an infrared temperature gun, humidity gauge, a timer device with thermometer (forget what they're called), hides, decor, ect. I have a general idea of what types I want to get but I'm open to suggestions and recommendations.

With mice/rats, would it be more cost-effective to buy in bulk online or would it still be cheaper to do it locally since it'd for one snake? I fed live last time with my own colony (which was part of the "overwhelming" issue, got to see firsthand how cannibalistic mice can be) but will adhere to frozen/thawed this time. With that in mind, how long do they keep in the freezer? As in, could I buy a year's worth to store or do I need to buy in smaller batches? And is it okay to refreeze if the snake isn't hungry?

And easily the least important part but I might as well put it here, but seeing as I'll only have one snake I'd like to have something with a little pizazz if you will. Have set my eyes on (and forgive me if I get terminologies wrong, have only recently even heard of the thousands of morphs let alone studied them) piebalds and axanthics. The ultimate prize would be a lightning pied (which from what I understand is a combination of the former two) but that's far and away beyond my budget and the others is already pushing it. Otherwise, a piebald with a half/third of white blotches or what I think is a "base" axanthic (the ones with the wild form pattern but in black/gray/white, looking as if it just crawled out of an old cartoon) would be my ideal choice if I can find one that doesn't break the bank.

Thanks for reading, hoping to have a good time here with you all. :D

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I think 30 should be fine. Just make sure to clutter it so that it can feel smaller if you do end up getting one that’s younger. It is better to go with the 10 gallon if you get a hatchling but I wouldn’t say that a 30 gallon would never work. My 9 month old female(who is really small for her age (~185g) is in a 35 gallon and is doing great. I had her in something smaller since this tank is still too big for her, but she doesn’t seem to mind, and honestly just seems to enjoy exploring a lot more than my other ones.

I see nothing wrong with your snake in the basement. I found that with funding the right substrate it was trial and error for me. Coco fibre sounds good, and hopefully that’s the one for you. If not, know that’s there’s many other options.

A UTH is great and having a water bowl over it might help with humidity a little, but not a lot. And ideally you should be replacing the water daily so you shouldn’t have a problem if the water overheating or evaporating too fast. If you’re looking for a big difference, I would invest in making a humidity box for your snake.

And personally, I wouldn’t bother with lighting unless you need it so that the ambient temps can be higher. Too strong of light can cause bps to be stressed so it’s probably best to not even bother with it. However if you want to, you definitely can, just watch your snake and see if it does become stressed from it.

In terms of lighting and heating: because you have a UTH, it’s not really required for you to have a heat lamp that also creates a hot spot on one side of the enclosure. All I would worry about is that your UTH is at around 90, and that your ambient temps, throughout the enclosure is no less than 75. If your ambient temps are less than that, then it would be important to add a heat lamp.


Another thing to add to your supply list is a temperate controller. That should always be plugged into your UTH. And make sure to keep the UTH on at all times. If you know that then that’s great, just wanted to make sure when you said “timer device with thermometer”.

I think for just one snake, it’s way cheaper to buy it locally since you shouldn’t be keeping the mice/rat frozen for more than 6 months(although I only go with 3 months to be safe). And it’s best to find a local mice/rat breeder that sells frozen since they’ll be cheaper than local pet stores. I’ve looked into online but it costs me $30-50 shipping fee, on top of the mice I have to buy. I don’t remember what the mathematical term is, but in the end I’d have to buy over a years supply of rats in order for the online cost to be cheaper than buying it locally. Of course the price might be different where you live, but I would try to do some math and calculate what ends up being cheaper.

And definitely do not refreeze the rat! Once the rat is thawed out, bacteria will be all over it! Feed it to your snake, and leave it overnight in the enclosure if you want, but definitely don’t leave it longer and do not refreeze.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

I do have a 10 gallon as well in that case if it isn't too far the opposite direction and too small (though again I'd need to get a lid for it). With that in mind, how do I secure it properly since it wouldn't be the horizontal sliding type lid? Are their special clamps I can get to hold it down or do I just put something heavy enough on top?

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There are some simple clamps you can buy at many pet stores, otherwise a specific lid with locks online that matches the dimensions of your enclosure will work too. Some people have said that placing heavy object on the lid would work, but personally, I wouldn’t trust it.

The thing with enclosure size and a young BP is that...it depends on the individual snake. But it's a safe generalization to say that when they are little guys they will be more comfortable and feed more reliably in small enclosures. Some youngsters do OK in larger enclosures as long as there are plenty of hides and clutter. Others just can't cope and will get stressed and refuse to eat.

Since you have a 10 gallon handy I'd start with that. You can get a screen lid plus clamps on Amazon or from your local pet shop. Just a UTH (on a thermostat, of course) will be fine as long as you don't keep your ambient temperatures too low.

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Originally Posted by Faith.luu

I think 30 should be fine. Just make sure to clutter it so that it can feel smaller if you do end up getting one that’s younger. It is better to go with the 10 gallon if you get a hatchling but I wouldn’t say that a 30 gallon would never work. My 9 month old female(who is really small for her age (~185g) is in a 35 gallon and is doing great. I had her in something smaller since this tank is still too big for her, but she doesn’t seem to mind, and honestly just seems to enjoy exploring a lot more than my other ones.

I see nothing wrong with your snake in the basement. I found that with funding the right substrate it was trial and error for me. Coco fibre sounds good, and hopefully that’s the one for you. If not, know that’s there’s many other options.

A UTH is great and having a water bowl over it might help with humidity a little, but not a lot. And ideally you should be replacing the water daily so you shouldn’t have a problem if the water overheating or evaporating too fast. If you’re looking for a big difference, I would invest in making a humidity box for your snake.

And personally, I wouldn’t bother with lighting unless you need it so that the ambient temps can be higher. Too strong of light can cause bps to be stressed so it’s probably best to not even bother with it. However if you want to, you definitely can, just watch your snake and see if it does become stressed from it.

In terms of lighting and heating: because you have a UTH, it’s not really required for you to have a heat lamp that also creates a hot spot on one side of the enclosure. All I would worry about is that your UTH is at around 90, and that your ambient temps, throughout the enclosure is no less than 75. If your ambient temps are less than that, then it would be important to add a heat lamp.


Another thing to add to your supply list is a temperate controller. That should always be plugged into your UTH. And make sure to keep the UTH on at all times. If you know that then that’s great, just wanted to make sure when you said “timer device with thermometer”.

I think for just one snake, it’s way cheaper to buy it locally since you shouldn’t be keeping the mice/rat frozen for more than 6 months(although I only go with 3 months to be safe). And it’s best to find a local mice/rat breeder that sells frozen since they’ll be cheaper than local pet stores. I’ve looked into online but it costs me $30-50 shipping fee, on top of the mice I have to buy. I don’t remember what the mathematical term is, but in the end I’d have to buy over a years supply of rats in order for the online cost to be cheaper than buying it locally. Of course the price might be different where you live, but I would try to do some math and calculate what ends up being cheaper.

And definitely do not refreeze the rat! Once the rat is thawed out, bacteria will be all over it! Feed it to your snake, and leave it overnight in the enclosure if you want, but definitely don’t leave it longer and do not refreeze.

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I guess a better layman term would've been "regulator." The ones that connect with the UTH and has a probe you attach close to the heat source so you can set a temperature on the device to keep it at the desired range. IIRC there are models with an extra probe to measure humidity too.

As for lighting I suppose it isn't too much of an issue then. There are window wells that let in some sunlight during the day so it wouldn't be in perpetual darkness (I'll be sure to place the tank out of direct sunlight though of course).

And yeah I forgot that I already checked online rodent places and the shipping fees alone would probably cost what I'd normally pay for a year for a single snake. :rofl:But as for the thawing part, how do you prevent wasting a mouse/rat if a snake goes off feed? Are there ways to tell if they're hungry or is there simply going to be moments where you have to toss out a food item and try with another one later? Not too big a deal if so (plenty of young trees in my yard to bury carcasses that would enjoy the extra fertilizer) but might as well ask regardless. That and I need to brush up on my research of snake behavior so I can read things like stress and discomfort more accurately when the time comes.

Also been having more thoughts on bedding. Seems like everyone has a different opinion on the stuff and I'm honestly at a loss now. I have tons of newspaper so that'd be a nice free option but then it doesn't look as nice and doesn't hold moisture as well. But then I see people mention how coconut fiber has gotten stuck in their snake's mouths and how its humidity-holding properties aren't as important for ball pythons compared to other more humidity-loving reptiles so it's like... :confusd:

I'm a big proponent of PVC enclosures and would highly recommend them if it's financially feasible.

Check out the T8 write up in the stickied post.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

And yeah I forgot that I already checked online rodent places and the shipping fees alone would probably cost what I'd normally pay for a year for a single snake. :rofl:But as for the thawing part, how do you prevent wasting a mouse/rat if a snake goes off feed? Are there ways to tell if they're hungry or is there simply going to be moments where you have to toss out a food item and try with another one later? Not too big a deal if so (plenty of young trees in my yard to bury carcasses that would enjoy the extra fertilizer) but might as well ask regardless. That and I need to brush up on my research of snake behavior so I can read things like stress and discomfort more accurately when the time comes.

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Sometimes you just can't tell when a snake is not going to want to eat, so you should count on having to waste prey items occasionally. In the long run, it's still cheaper than feeding a cat or dog. ;)

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Originally Posted by Spicey

Sometimes you just can't tell when a snake is not going to want to eat, so you should count on having to waste prey items occasionally. In the long run, it's still cheaper than feeding a cat or dog. ;)

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My solution to avoid wasting food is a Kingsnake!

So if I were to get a baby and thereby start it out in the 10 gallon, what's the average estimate to when it gets big enough to move into the bigger 30 gallon? I know it varies considerably depending on gender, feeding rate, genetics ect., but just for humor's sake if you spitballed a number.

And on top of that, is it generally better to get a baby compared to an adult? Since then it grows up with you and such (and of course the joy of watching it grow).

My main recommendations would be buy a good thermostat like a Herpstat. It's the most important piece of equipment for a snake to keep them healthy and happy. There's on/off types that are cheaper, however that's full heat on, full off, and some of these type will fail in the on position when they quit working. I prefer proportional that keep a lower powered steady heat, safety fail in the off position and have alarms to alert me if temps go too high or low. Set up your cage 1-2 weeks in advance to make sure everything is running at correct temps.

Next would be depending on your climate, don't be set on putting your snake in a fish tank. There's many reasons most aren't suitable from lack of air flow to simply not enough floor space. Plus they are breakable and heavy as hell when you need to clean or move them. In a warm ambient area a small tub setup with a heat mat would be better, in a changing cooler climate I'd spring for a PVC cage with a radiant heat panel. Heat lamps drain humidity like crazy and aquariums don't hold heat or humidity worth a squat because they aren't meant to. Misting or relying on substrate being wet or blocking off airflow is not consistent or healthy, you don't want your temps and humidity all over the place daily, you want them to stay steady or your snake is far more likely to get sick and have issues shedding.

I've used a bunch of substrates, now I just use paper because it's easier but all of them have their pros and cons, try out what you like and see how it goes. One snake it's not hard to keep up on but be aware you can't always tell when they've peed so a sniff test works better than visual check with bedding. I wouldn't bother with lighting as long as there's windows in the room for some ambient.

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Originally Posted by GoingPostal

My main recommendations would be buy a good thermostat like a Herpstat. It's the most important piece of equipment for a snake to keep them healthy and happy. There's on/off types that are cheaper, however that's full heat on, full off, and some of these type will fail in the on position when they quit working. I prefer proportional that keep a lower powered steady heat, safety fail in the off position and have alarms to alert me if temps go too high or low. Set up your cage 1-2 weeks in advance to make sure everything is running at correct temps.

Next would be depending on your climate, don't be set on putting your snake in a fish tank. There's many reasons most aren't suitable from lack of air flow to simply not enough floor space. Plus they are breakable and heavy as hell when you need to clean or move them. In a warm ambient area a small tub setup with a heat mat would be better, in a changing cooler climate I'd spring for a PVC cage with a radiant heat panel. Heat lamps drain humidity like crazy and aquariums don't hold heat or humidity worth a squat because they aren't meant to. Misting or relying on substrate being wet or blocking off airflow is not consistent or healthy, you don't want your temps and humidity all over the place daily, you want them to stay steady or your snake is far more likely to get sick and have issues shedding.

I've used a bunch of substrates, now I just use paper because it's easier but all of them have their pros and cons, try out what you like and see how it goes. One snake it's not hard to keep up on but be aware you can't always tell when they've peed so a sniff test works better than visual check with bedding. I wouldn't bother with lighting as long as there's windows in the room for some ambient.

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I decided to look around the house as there's a ton of plastic storage tubs lying around and found a nice (mostly) transparent one at 19"x13"x11" with straight walls for maximum floor space for the size. Perfect for a baby I assume? Just needs some air holes drilled in. Only other extra thing to add would be some clamps since I'm sure it could be opened easily from the inside as it's just a simple snap-on one. And there's plenty of bigger tubs to choose from as it grows or if what I found is too small.

Question is how does a UTH work with a plastic tub? Do you need to elevate the tub at all and/or other steps so it doesn't melt the plastic or is that a non-issue as long as it doesn't overheat?

And as for the holes themselves, how many is generally recommended? Like a couple rows on the lid and a couple more on the sides? I do know that you can cover or uncover holes as needed with maintaining humidity (which would mean I can more comfortably go with newspaper now that I think about it).

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Question is how does a UTH work with a plastic tub? Do you need to elevate the tub at all and/or other steps so it doesn't melt the plastic or is that a non-issue as long as it doesn't overheat?

And as for the holes themselves, how many is generally recommended? Like a couple rows on the lid and a couple more on the sides? I do know that you can cover or uncover holes as needed with maintaining humidity (which would mean I can more comfortably go with newspaper now that I think about it).

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You want a thin layer between the bottom of the tub and the UTH to allow air flow, and same for underneath the UTH and table/ surface.

For mine I have about 20 3-4 mm holes on each of the long sides of my tub. You can make more or less depending on how much you need to adjust the humidity.

To answer your earlier question on when you should switch from the 10 gallon to the 30 gallon tank, I would say that once your snakes length is equivalent to the sum of the length and width of the enclosure is when it’s a good time to switch.

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Originally Posted by Faith.luu

You want a thin layer between the bottom of the tub and the UTH to allow air flow, and same for underneath the UTH and table/ surface.

For mine I have about 20 3-4 mm holes on each of the long sides of my tub. You can make more or less depending on how much you need to adjust the humidity.

To answer your earlier question on when you should switch from the 10 gallon to the 30 gallon tank, I would say that once your snakes length is equivalent to the sum of the length and width of the enclosure is when it’s a good time to switch.

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How would I go about propping it up then? Just put some thin books or the like underneath the corners of the tub so it's just hovering above the mat, and some kind of heat-resistant object (like say a slate cutting board) under the mat itself?

EDIT: Just saw a video that most heat mats come with little pads to raise up the heat mat so that answers the second part of the question.

So many issues with some of the suggestions in this thread...

no space is needed between either the tub or the UTH and the surface it’s on, and it MUST be controlled by a thermostat. Period. A properly regulated UTH will not melt a tub.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...ight=Macguyver

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One thing I'm still unsure of is a humidity gauge/thermometer brand. Any recommendations on that? The most I know so far is to avoid the dinky little circle things you stick to the enclosure wall since I've heard more than a few times how unreliable they are and the potential issues if they fall off and get stuck on the animal's scales.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Any recommendations on that?

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The more popular and on the cheaper side would be Acurite.

There are more expensive options like Hygroset or other brands that people use for cigar humidors that do well with high humidity and are very accurate.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

The more popular and on the cheaper side would be Acurite.

There are more expensive options like Hygroset or other brands that people use for cigar humidors that do well with high humidity and are very accurate.

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My conundrum is, from what I can tell I want one with a probe to insert into the tank since I don't see how ones that are just the device itself will work since it'll either (ironically) get messed up by the humidity and/or will just constantly get knocked over by the snake. Or if it's a stick-on-the-wall type then it runs the risk of falling off and getting stuck to the snake as expressed before. But it seems like all the ones with the probe(s) that I look at are either way above my price range (which is $20-$30 or so) or are riddled with middling to negative reviews about how they work only for a month or are inaccurate from the get-go.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

But it seems like all the ones with the probe(s) that I look at are either way above my price range (which is $20-$30 or so) or are riddled with middling to negative reviews about how they work only for a month or are inaccurate from the get-go.

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I have one of these that have decent reviews that are within your budget and they come with a probe. They're also made by Vivarium Electronics that make proportional thermostats that have been a good industry standard. I'm sure you can do some googling regarding people's opinions:
https://www.reptilebasics.com/thermometers/TH-100/

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

I have one of these that have decent reviews that are within your budget and they come with a probe. They're also made by Vivarium Electronics that make proportional thermostats that have been a good industry standard. I'm sure you can do some googling regarding people's opinions:
https://www.reptilebasics.com/thermometers/TH-100/

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Ah. I actually saw that one in particular on a YT channel and thought it'd be a good fit, but the person who made the video messed up the link to it in the description so I couldn't find it. Thank you! :D

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Ah. I actually saw that one in particular on a YT channel and thought it'd be a good fit, but the person who made the video messed up the link to it in the description so I couldn't find it. Thank you! :D

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No worries.

There are some complaints about humidity being off so maybe you can do a salt test on it and see if it's really off or not.

Also, I did have to put a piece of folded paper in the battery tray to keep it more secure so there's definitely some kinks to work out.

The reason I like hygrometers used for cigar humidors is because most electronic ones have adjustable humidity so in case you end up doing the salt test and humidity is off, you can make the necessary adjustments.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

No worries.

There are some complaints about humidity being off so maybe you can do a salt test on it and see if it's really off or not.

Also, I did have to put a piece of folded paper in the battery tray to keep it more secure so there's definitely some kinks to work out.

The reason I like hygrometers used for cigar humidors is because most electronic ones have adjustable humidity so in case you end up doing the salt test and humidity is off, you can make the necessary adjustments.

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I've heard of salt testing hydrometers, what does that mean?

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

I've heard of salt testing hydrometers, what does that mean?

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So with the salt test the hygrometer should ideally show 75% humidity. If it doesn't, you would know by how much the hygrometer is off or if it's adjustable, you'd calibrate it to 75%. I've only seem cigar hygrometer that can be adjusted. Unfortunately, I haven't seen ones for reptiles that can be calibrated.

You can google salt test and there's multiple instructions on how to do it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

So with the salt test the hygrometer should ideally show 75% humidity. If it doesn't, you would know by how much the hygrometer is off or if it's adjustable, you'd calibrate it to 75%. I've only seem cigar hygrometer that can be adjusted. Unfortunately, I haven't seen ones for reptiles that can be calibrated.

You can google salt test and there's multiple instructions on how to do it.

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I see. I'll do some research on that then, thanks again. :)

EDIT: With that in mind, how does the cigar humidor that can be calibrated work in terms of putting it in enclosures since it doesn't have a probe and such?

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

EDIT: With that in mind, how does the cigar humidor that can be calibrated work in terms of putting it in enclosures since it doesn't have a probe and such?

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So you're not adjusting the humidor. Humidor is where you keep the cigars. [emoji6]

Once hygrometer gauge is calibrated with the salt test, you can just put the whole gauge in the enclosure or mount it somewhere.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

So you're not adjusting the humidor. Humidor is where you keep the cigars. [emoji6]

Once hygrometer gauge is calibrated with the salt test, you can just put the whole gauge in the enclosure or mount it somewhere.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

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Sorry, the hydrometer used for cigar humidors. :P

Anyway, what I'm wondering is how to put it in the enclosure to where I can see it, but it won't get knocked over by the snake all the time?

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

what I'm wondering is how to put it in the enclosure to where I can see it, but it won't get knocked over by the snake all the time?

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Safest way would probably be to hot glue it somewhere but that might be an issue if you need to change the battery.

I have one of mine on a velcro with a adhesive backing but that's not too recommended in case the adhesive comes off and gets stuck on your snake.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

Safest way would probably be to hot glue it somewhere but that might be an issue if you need to change the battery.

I have one of mine on a velcro with a adhesive backing but that's not too recommended in case the adhesive comes off and gets stuck on your snake.

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I think at this point I'll try my luck with the probe one you linked me then. What's a recommend place to put the probe for accurate readings?

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

I think at this point I'll try my luck with the probe one you linked me then. What's a recommend place to put the probe for accurate readings?

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I'd put it right on the substrate and see how it goes. Even if your BP moves it, it's not a big deal because it doesn't control anything, like a thermostat would. Or you can suspend it down and let it hang almost touching the bottom and then tape it on the outside of the terrarium so it doesn't drop down further. Kinda like this:https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...90035f1d96.jpg

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

I'd put it right on the substrate and see how it goes. Even if your BP moves it, it's not a big deal because it doesn't control anything, like a thermostat would. Or you can suspend it down and let it hang almost touching the bottom and then tape it on the outside of the terrarium so it doesn't drop down further. Kinda like this:https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...90035f1d96.jpg

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That second option sounds perfect, definitely going to try that. You've been a tremendous help, can't thank you enough. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

That second option sounds perfect, definitely going to try that. You've been a tremendous help, can't thank you enough. :gj:

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No worries at all. You can dm me if you have any additional questions.

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So I've been cruising around Morph Market a lot (don't worry I'm just browsing for now, won't make a move until I have everything I need, set up and running to the desired specifications) and I've noticed many are on live prey. Question is if I get one that's on live feed should I not try F/T until after a few feedings post-arrival? And yes I am aware that it needs about a week to itself to settle in and adjust from the move before feeding period.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

So I've been cruising around Morph Market a lot (don't worry I'm just browsing for now, won't make a move until I have everything I need, set up and running to the desired specifications) and I've noticed many are on live prey. Question is if I get one that's on live feed should I not try F/T until after a few feedings post-arrival? And yes I am aware that it needs about a week to itself to settle in and adjust from the move before feeding period.

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To be safe, I'd have him take 3 consecutive meals before switching. With that said, it also depends on your comfort level and the weight of the BP.

You may want to pose that question to the breeder and see what they suggest. If the BP has a strong food drive, then you may want to try and give ft right off thr bat.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

To be safe, I'd have him take 3 consecutive meals before switching. With that said, it also depends on your comfort level and the weight of the BP.

You may want to pose that question to the breeder and see what they suggest. If the BP has a strong food drive, then you may want to try and give ft right off thr bat.

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Sounds about right then. I guess to add further, I'm just about 100% positive that whatever affordable morph I get (I've decided to try and pay under $400 including shipping so piebalds and the "colorless" axanthics are about out the window unless I get lucky, have started looking at bananas and coral glows instead), it's going to be male. And given that males are generally smaller than females at adult size are they okay with large mice their whole lives or do they still need to transition to rats at some point? Unless I manage to get one that's already been started on rats as I've seen a number of babies on there already started on them. ;)

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Sounds about right then. I guess to add further, I'm just about 100% positive that whatever affordable morph I get (I've decided to try and pay under $400 including shipping so piebalds and the "colorless" axanthics are about out the window unless I get lucky, have started looking at bananas and coral glows instead), it's going to be male. And given that males are generally smaller than females at adult size are they okay with large mice their whole lives or do they still need to transition to rats at some point? Unless I manage to get one that's already been started on rats as I've seen a number of babies on there already started on them. ;)

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You can definitely find a Piebald for that price shipped. I know Mike Wilbanks has a couple around that price because I've been stalking his site for a Banana Pied female. You'll find Bananas for much lower than that.

Male is a good way to go but once fully grown, a large mouse won't be enough for him. You'll have to either end up on a small rat or feed 2-3 large mice per feeding.

Most breeders feed rats from the start because it's what they breed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

You can definitely find a Piebald for that price shipped. I know Mike Wilbanks has a couple around that price because I've been stalking his site for a Banana Pied female. You'll find Bananas for much lower than that.

Male is a good way to go but once fully grown, a large mouse won't be enough for him. You'll have to either end up on a small rat or feed 2-3 large mice per feeding.

Most breeders feed rats from the start because it's what they breed.

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Sorry that was a typo I meant $300 (which seems to be the benchmark for piebalds). I suppose I could bite the bullet if I really really want one though, but the bananas/coral glows have also been catching my eye as of late. Really digging the gray, almost purplish colors against the brighter yellows.

Again though, I'll have plenty of time before making a choice.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Sorry that was a typo I meant $300 (which seems to be the benchmark for piebalds). I suppose I could bite the bullet if I really really want one though, but the bananas/coral glows have also been catching my eye as of late. Really digging the gray, almost purplish colors against the brighter yellows.

Again though, I'll have plenty of time before making a choice.

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I'm right there with you. Bananas are gorgeous!

Yea, don't hurry. They live 20+ years so you want to make sure you get the "right one".

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Originally Posted by Snagrio;2741754

Also been having more thoughts on bedding. Seems like everyone has a different opinion on the stuff and I'm honestly at a loss now. I have tons of newspaper so that'd be a nice free option but then it doesn't look as nice and doesn't hold moisture as well. But then I see people mention how coconut fiber has gotten stuck in their snake's mouths and how its humidity-holding properties aren't as important for ball pythons compared to other more humidity-loving reptiles so it's like... :confusd:

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I have a bioactive enclosure so I obviously use loose substrate, if you are worried about ingesting you can cover the top layer with large leaf litter and when feeding you can put them on top of a plastic lid in the enclosure or something that isn't the substrate but some snakes won't eat even after just being moved in the enclosure a little. The way I think about it is that they digest bones so a bit of soft substrate probably isn't gonna be detrimental.
Also remember that they need higher humidity when shedding so the substrate has to be able to handle this.
I'm sure you know but don't use pine or cedar or any wood that secretes oils, even kiln dried is risky!
One last thing (even though you haven't mentioned it) I wouldn't recommend aspen, even though they live in a pretty lowish humidity place they spend basically all their time in more humid places like rodent burrows and stuff - it also rots really easily!

Also just a tip for enrichment, they love climbing from time to time - males and juviniles are also sometimes classed as semi arboreal and researchers have found a main diet for males in the wild is birds in trees!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by noodle.obsessed

I have a bioactive enclosure so I obviously use loose substrate, if you are worried about ingesting you can cover the top layer with large leaf litter and when feeding you can put them on top of a plastic lid in the enclosure or something that isn't the substrate but some snakes won't eat even after just being moved in the enclosure a little. The way I think about it is that they digest bones so a bit of soft substrate probably isn't gonna be detrimental.
Also remember that they need higher humidity when shedding so the substrate has to be able to handle this.
I'm sure you know but don't use pine or cedar or any wood that secretes oils, even kiln dried is risky!
One last thing (even though you haven't mentioned it) I wouldn't recommend aspen, even though they live in a pretty lowish humidity place they spend basically all their time in more humid places like rodent burrows and stuff - it also rots really easily!

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No worries, already know to avoid those and am aware of the aspen controversy (at least as far as BPs are concerned). Thinking what I'm going to do first, is after I get everything I need, set it up to test with newspaper first and see how that goes with maintaining humidity and if it doesn't work out and requires repeated upkeep at a frequent pace, I'll go with coconut fiber as the backup plan.

While on the topic, I need an opinion. Is this tub the right size and are the clips I put on the lid enough security or do I need to get a tub with the built-in clipping handles?

[IMG]IMG_20200816_202325534.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]IMG_20200816_202338095.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]IMG_20200816_202418829.jpg[/IMG]

Holes aren't drilled in yet since I want to make sure I can use it first.

EDIT: Darn I can't figure out this image system for the life of me.

Hopefully this workshttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...50b0c9d3c1.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...6b224c0c53.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...95cd77e89b.jpg

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Been studying mites, and I have a question regarding banana/coral glow morphs (one of the likely ones I'll choose), because they both develop tiny freckles on their scale patterns with age that look eerily similar to mites. Are they that hard to tell apart or is it not too difficult to decipher what's a natural freckle on such morphs and what's a mite? The most I've heard is that dots on the chin, belly and vent would more than likely be mites but otherwise it looks hard to be sure which is which.

Heaven knows I've had more than enough trouble with mites as it is lately with my chickens (been battling the blood-sucking demons for a month or so, but I've finally gained the upper hand) so the last thing I'd want to see is more of them on my precious future snake. :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Been studying mites, and I have a question regarding banana/coral glow morphs (one of the likely ones I'll choose), because they both develop tiny freckles on their scale patterns with age that look eerily similar to mites. Are they that hard to tell apart or is it not too difficult to decipher what's a natural freckle on such morphs and what's a mite? The most I've heard is that dots on the chin, belly and vent would more than likely be mites but otherwise it looks hard to be sure which is which.

Heaven knows I've had more than enough trouble with mites as it is lately with my chickens (been battling the blood-sucking demons for a month or so, but I've finally gained the upper hand) so the last thing I'd want to see is more of them on my precious future snake. :P

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A freckle won't move or wipe off with a paper towel.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GoingPostal

A freckle won't move or wipe off with a paper towel.

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Also if you end up using a loose substrate, mites will pop between your fingernails if you squeeze them. :explosion

Well, now I'm in an awkward waiting game. Chanced upon a local Craigslist ad last night for a baby banana pied (the two morphs I've been looking at the most combined into one, what are the odds) that will come with his setup. Emailed them and asked a bunch questions since all the ad gave was some pictures of the animal, that the owner didn't have time for it anymore and that there would be a rehoming fee (that they annoyingly didn't even state).

No reply yet but if they get back to me and the setup that comes with him is a full if not mostly complete one then I'll go for it if the price is reasonable ($400-500 would be my limit). I'll keep waiting through this weekend.

And before anyone worries I know the Craigslist etiquette of not going alone and meeting in a public place and so on, have done this many times before. ;)

Well, gave up on the Craigslist ad since there's been no response (sounded shady anyway) and I just got some equipment delivered.

Got a temperature gun, thermostat, heat pad and tank screen clamps with a thermometer/hydrometer coming in tomorrow. Today or tomorrow I will get a tank screen, coco fiber substrate, water bowl, hides and fake plants.

Still have some more questions however. For one, are apple and/or maple tree branches safe for use (after baking of course)? Have a bunch of them growing in the yard so that would be perfect. Also plan to put in a rock or two so it has a rough surface to help with shedding, I've heard those should be boiled? Have lots of those to choose from at any rate (collected them as a kid).

And I've ultimately decided to go with the 30 gallon I already have since it's on a nice stand and will make the display look nice. I'm aware that's rather big for a young one but I'll put in extra hides and foliage clutter so it can feel as secure as possible. I plan to use tinfoil to cover half or more of the top for humidity, but should the foil go over the heated side or non-heated side? I'm assuming the former since the water bowl with be partially over the heat pad and that will help maintain humidity. Also what can I use to cover the three tank sides that can either be easily removed for cleaning or won't be affected by getting wet?

Finally as for hides themselves, I know they like to be snug inside them but what's the generally recommended starting size(s)?

Hi,

I can answer some of those.

Generally fruit woods are pretty safe - the only really important ones not to use are those with toxic/ irritant sap if fresh. So cedar and pine are best avoided.

Be carefull of the rocks - you need to use igneous ( Sp? ) rocks as anything containing air can explode when heating as the air expands. A good check is what is recommended to use as rocks surrounding a fire when camping as there is a lot of info online regarding this.

I usually leave a small gap in tank covering on the cool side and obviously a larger gap surrounding the heating element side as this promotes a good natural airflow through convection.

I normally keep the water on the cool side to help limit growth of bacteria but it really shouldn't be a problem if cage maintenance is up to spec.

The insulation for tank covering/ privacy is best placed on the outside of the tank - polystyrene sheeting or cork sheeting is my preference with an aquarium backgrounds to improve the visuals between it and the glass. Cork sheets are thinner but what you chose will depend on the stand design it sits on etc. Either way they are outside of the glass so there is no issue with cleaning or dampness affecting them. ;)

For hides the thing people tend to forget is the height, snug in ALL directions works best. I use plant pot saucers a lot for smaller snakes and just cut and smooth an opening in the sides then flip them over. Plastic or glazed works better as, in the terracotta ones the snake can scuff their eyecaps ( drove me insane the first time I saw this on a snake and couldn't identify the problem ) while coiling inside the hide. For hatchlings I now use 4 inch pressed bamboo saucers and then order larger as needed.

They are not the most attractive visually though so feel free to free think on alternatives.


del

I'm sad. The coral glow I've had my eye on was sold mere days before I was ready to inquire for purchase. Knew I should've asked to put it on hold until I could get my setup ready. :tears:

So I've got just about everything set up and almost ready for a snake to move in, but I have a major problem. It seems like the heat is having issues penetrating the substrate enough. There's about 2 inches or so of coconut fiber and the temp gun doesn't even crack 80 Fahrenheit right over the heat pad, with the ambient temperature elsewhere in the enclosure hanging around 70. I push all the substrate away and the heat pad section's in the perfect sweet spot of 90-92, but that's only if it's down to the bare glass. The thermostat is cranked up to 108 (apparently as high as it can go, it's the Jump Start one) with it averaging out between 102-106, and the heat pad itself is a Zacro 12 x 8 inch, 16 watt for 30-40 gallon setups (which in my case is the former).

The whole setup's been sitting there for a few hours so I'm know what the issue is. Maybe the fiber's just taking a long time to warm up because I didn't use warm water when sponging up the bricks (the water wasn't cold but a little cooler than room temperature)? Or should I just remove some of it period?