New setup not working well? Also is my snake okay?

Hello,

I posted a bit ago and ha e taken a lot of ideas and changed up my snake terrarium. However, one thing I do not know is if the ground is getting hot enough. I setup a thermos stat probe under the soil where my new heat mat is (from bottom up is heat pad, glass, probe, soil) but the thermostat is reading it's 90 degrees but when I touch the soil, it doesn't feel like it's 90 degrees. It's a bit warm but I don't think it's 90. Any idea what's wrong? I have a little pocket size temp checker (Reptitemp is what it's called and it's a digital infrared thermometer) and it says my warm side top soil is more like 85 degrees rather than the 90 something the thermostat reads. So I'm just confused.

Also, I've adopted this snake so Idk if she is a healthy weight or not. She's young measuring 18 inches about and weighs 66 grams I believe. I think she's under weight but input is appreciated. I also do see her spine a bit but I've never had a python ever so I'm not certain if this is ok for young snakes. She eats fine but only takes live. She also is handled very other day for 1 hour and is actually quite comfortable it seems. She even pooped and peed on my back without me knowing till I put her away!

You're going to want to put the thermostat probe outside the tank, sandwiched between the heat mat and the glass. This is safer because inside the tank it can get wet and read a lower temp than it actually is, causing your heat mat to get too warm. Also, since we are 98° normally, 90° is not going to feel especially warm, so trust your infrared thermometer. The temperature of the soil is irrelevant, you want to be taking the temperature of the glass as your snake is likely to push the substrate around and burrow down to the warmth. I'm newer to the hobby as well, but that's what I have learned here as well as from my research outside of the forum.

I'll let the more experienced members chime in about body condition but that does sound skinny to me....

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Southpaw91

You're going to want to put the thermostat probe outside the tank, sandwiched between the heat mat and the glass. This is safer because inside the tank it can get wet and read a lower temp than it actually is, causing your heat mat to get too warm. Also, since we are 98° normally, 90° is not going to feel especially warm, so trust your infrared thermometer. The temperature of the soil is irrelevant, you want to be taking the temperature of the glass as your snake is likely to push the substrate around and burrow down to the warmth. I'm newer to the hobby as well, but that's what I have learned here as well as from my research outside of the forum.

I'll let the more experienced members chime in about body condition but that does sound skinny to me....

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^ all of the above ^




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I check my digital thermometer from time to time shooting it on the wall right next to my furnace thermostat, those are usually pretty accurate. Remember your body temps should be well over 90 degrees so a 90 degree surface might not feel warm to the touch. Once you know your digital thermometer is accurate trust it not your touch. Get the inside floor surface to the desired temp and then cover with the substrate. They will burrow down to get to the temp they want to be at. Sometimes mine sits on top of the substrate in the hot side, sometimes he moves down to the glass. Don't worry about what the substrate temps are as long as the floor temps are correct.

Also don't rely on the thermostat readout. My hot side stays at 95-95 to keep the floor at 89 degrees. The cool side sits at 80 and keeps the glass at 80.

Okay so I should reposition the thermos probe and trust it? I just ordered it and the heat mat so its new tech for me. The probe is currently technically under her hide right now since it's her favorite spot but I haven't seen her move from there to the cool side since the remodel. Im just concerned for heats sake since I don't want her to get sick.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sandaconda

Hello,

I posted a bit ago and ha e taken a lot of ideas and changed up my snake terrarium. However, one thing I do not know is if the ground is getting hot enough. I setup a thermos stat probe under the soil where my new heat mat is (from bottom up is heat pad, glass, probe, soil) but the thermostat is reading it's 90 degrees but when I touch the soil, it doesn't feel like it's 90 degrees. It's a bit warm but I don't think it's 90. Any idea what's wrong? I have a little pocket size temp checker (Reptitemp is what it's called and it's a digital infrared thermometer) and it says my warm side top soil is more like 85 degrees rather than the 90 something the thermostat reads. So I'm just confused.

As stated, use an IR temp gun to get the proper ground temps and adjust thermostat accordingly.

Also, I've adopted this snake so Idk if she is a healthy weight or not. She's young measuring 18 inches about and weighs 66 grams I believe. I think she's under weight but input is appreciated. I also do see her spine a bit but I've never had a python ever so I'm not certain if this is ok for young snakes. She eats fine but only takes live. She also is handled very other day for 1 hour and is actually quite comfortable it seems. She even pooped and peed on my back without me knowing till I put her away!

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What size prey are you feeding her and how often?

Why on Earth on your handling her so much? She does sound thin and needs to be eating and resting not spending energy being handled.

A young BP should be handled for 5 minutes at a time or so, every few days, if healthy. They stress easy and again, are often pet rocks when not being handled, so they do not spend a lot energy normally.

I recommend basically leaving her alone and getting some weight on her and then worry about handling.

On the live vs. F/T issue, you might be able to switch her at a later date, but right now you need her eating, so give her what she will eat.

EDIT: I realize this may sound a little harsh, but we are here to help. There can be little margin of error with young snakes and we want your BP to thrive.

Feel free to ask for clarification on anything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sandaconda

Okay so I should reposition the thermos probe and trust it? I just ordered it and the heat mat so its new tech for me. The probe is currently technically under her hide right now since it's her favorite spot but I haven't seen her move from there to the cool side since the remodel. Im just concerned for heats sake since I don't want her to get sick.

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Nope, you reposition the probe OUTSIDE the enclosure and then check temps with your temp gun.

Once I got the thermostats set on my UTH's I use the temp gun to check the temps. I check them once a day and I adjust accordingly based on what the temp gun says, not what the thermostat reading says. After I got them dialed in I have only had to adjust one of them one time since November. The heat in that room stays constant so I assume that helps as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sandaconda

Okay so I should reposition the thermos probe and trust it? I just ordered it and the heat mat so its new tech for me. The probe is currently technically under her hide right now since it's her favorite spot but I haven't seen her move from there to the cool side since the remodel. Im just concerned for heats sake since I don't want her to get sick.

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Take no notice what the temp the stat says ... it’s just a very rough guide .

The hot spot surface temps should be taken using either a digital temp gun or digital thermometer ( with a wired probe- not a stick on thermometer)




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Okay so I've repositioned her temp probe but I still can't get the temp high on the substrate. Even the glass below the substrate isn't too high. The glass gets to maybe 92 degrees on a good day. The substrate over the glass gets to a max of 85 on the hot side. The thermostat is at its highest setting so I'm not certain what to do now. Any tips?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sandaconda

Okay so I've repositioned her temp probe but I still can't get the temp high on the substrate. Even the glass below the substrate isn't too high. The glass gets to maybe 92 degrees on a good day. The substrate over the glass gets to a max of 85 on the hot side. The thermostat is at its highest setting so I'm not certain what to do now. Any tips?

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i would say 92 is just a touch too high actually, don’t worry about the temp of the substrate too much, snakes will burrow to get to the heat and i put a thinner layer of substrate over the hot spot to facilitate that. you don’t want the glass to get any higher because your snake can and will come in contact with the glass.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dakski

What size prey are you feeding her and how often?

Why on Earth on your handling her so much? She does sound thin and needs to be eating and resting not spending energy being handled.

A young BP should be handled for 5 minutes at a time or so, every few days, if healthy. They stress easy and again, are often pet rocks when not being handled, so they do not spend a lot energy normally.

I recommend basically leaving her alone and getting some weight on her and then worry about handling.

On the live vs. F/T issue, you might be able to switch her at a later date, but right now you need her eating, so give her what she will eat.

EDIT: I realize this may sound a little harsh, but we are here to help. There can be little margin of error with young snakes and we want your BP to thrive.

Feel free to ask for clarification on anything.

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You're fine it didn't help I've been in and out a lot. So she is eating one hopper a week and she seems to eat that fine. I know I need to stay live for now. As for why I handle her so much, it's so I can keep trying to get her cage fixed. I know it should have been set up before hand but I didn't get that luxury so it's tough and go. She at least is getting used to it and just slithered all around me. I don't handle her at all after she eats so those are times I hope the temperature is ok. At one point it was too hot getting up to 100 but now it's barely 85 above and she no longer moves to the cool side cause of it. Cool side gets to 69 degrees to so that's another work in progress but I want her to get the warmth she needs right now. I finally got humidity up at least so that's one good thing. I'm also worried her one hide might be too big for her but I'll post pictures as soon as I get to a computer.
I'll be keeping good track of her weight but I just have nothing to go by to know if it's a healthy weight. Sorry for the long reply so many things in my head going off at once

Quote:

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Originally Posted by miatb

i would say 92 is just a touch too high actually, don’t worry about the temp of the substrate too much, snakes will burrow to get to the heat and i put a thinner layer of substrate over the hot spot to facilitate that. you don’t want the glass to get any higher because your snake can and will come in contact with the glass.

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Wait so even though the glass is hot enough, the substrate is alright to not be at basking temp? She also no longer moves from hide to hide cause of the temp difference I feel. She just stays in the hide over the pad all the time never moving to the other.

I like for the temperature on the glass to be 88-90. I'm not concerned with the substrate surface temperature. As mentioned before the snake will usually burrow pretty close to the glass. Best wishes with the new BP.

Set your tstat so that the temp of the glass is between 88-90. Dont worry about the temp of the substrate. The snake will burrow down to the warmth. Check temps with your IR thermometer. As long as the glass is between 88-90 you are fine!

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sandaconda

You're fine it didn't help I've been in and out a lot. So she is eating one hopper a week and she seems to eat that fine. I know I need to stay live for now. As for why I handle her so much, it's so I can keep trying to get her cage fixed. I know it should have been set up before hand but I didn't get that luxury so it's tough and go. She at least is getting used to it and just slithered all around me. I don't handle her at all after she eats so those are times I hope the temperature is ok. At one point it was too hot getting up to 100 but now it's barely 85 above and she no longer moves to the cool side cause of it. Cool side gets to 69 degrees to so that's another work in progress but I want her to get the warmth she needs right now. I finally got humidity up at least so that's one good thing. I'm also worried her one hide might be too big for her but I'll post pictures as soon as I get to a computer.
I'll be keeping good track of her weight but I just have nothing to go by to know if it's a healthy weight. Sorry for the long reply so many things in my head going off at once

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While you are doing things in her tank, it's probably best to put in her a separate container instead of holding her. That would be less stressful.

Hopper mice are recommended for the first few meals, but given her size, that might be appropriate. CAN ANYONE ELSE CHIME IN?

Either way, you should be looking to move to a small mouse ASAP.

When you say, "work in progress" on temps, what's your timeframe?

Temp adjustments take hours. You have a snake that needs your help, please make this a priority.

She is probably underweight, being fed small prey, and doesn't have proper temps.

Again, not trying to be harsh, but she is depending on you.

At her weight she is fragile and needs to have as little stress as possible. Handling her so much is stressful. She may not be acting scared when you handle her, but that still isn't a reason to handle her that much. If you need a safe spot for her when working on her enclosure, please set up a separate holding container with a little substrate, some paper towel, and a hide or just some crumpled up paper towels so she can feel sheltered.

If her current hide is too big for her, you can crumple up some paper towels and put them in there to help her feel more enclosed.

If she is 66 grams that's hatchling (right out of the egg) size, and you you say you've had her for four weeks and that she was at the pet store for awhile before you got her? Then she's underweight. You say you 'believe' that's her weight? Can you weigh her? I would feed her every 5 days (maybe even more often - can someone with more experience chime in, please?) and offer her rat fuzzies or small mice as soon as she will take them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by miatb

i would say 92 is just a touch too high actually, don’t worry about the temp of the substrate too much, snakes will burrow to get to the heat and i put a thinner layer of substrate over the hot spot to facilitate that. you don’t want the glass to get any higher because your snake can and will come in contact with the glass.

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^ This .. every single word ^


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I'm doing everything I can and I check everything every day which is where the adjustments are coming from. One day they work, next they dont. I think I might have struck gold though as the glass temp is staying in good range now that I know that is the one to worry about. Just gotta give her time to see if she'll go to the other side now or not.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sandaconda

I'm doing everything I can and I check everything every day which is where the adjustments are coming from. One day they work, next they dont. I think I might have struck gold though as the glass temp is staying in good range now that I know that is the one to worry about. Just gotta give her time to see if she'll go to the other side now or not.

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Glad to hear things are settling in.

Keep up the good work and keep asking questions.