Ball python twitching when I touch him

I'm so worried about my little Crowley, so he shed last night and took the rest of the night off, he seemed normal, he has a bit of blood in his shed but that always happens and I hear that is normal. Today I took him out and had him in his room for a couple hours and he seemed fine. I then took him to hang out on the couch. At first it seemed like he was enjoying his massages (I don't rub hard or anything), he was even waggling his tail. It seemed like touching his neck (he doesn't usually mind getting his head or neck touched) at a certain spot made him go turbo, he would move really fast. I thought maybe he was hurt so I was barley touching him while petting him to see if he had any sore spots. He'd start moving fast anytime I touched his neck and he started twitching when I touched a spot on his back.

I necked him and he did a double twitch, like a jerking movement and he jerked pretty hard. I am so worried that he is hurt, nothing looks swollen or feels any different. I tried to get it on camera but of course he only did the twitching off camera. I put him back for the night as I don't want to hurt him anymore if he is hurting. Could it be sore muscles from being in a hide for over a week while in shed and not stretching? I was able to neck him a few more times with no twitching. He went around my hand and suddenly twitched really hard, his whole front of his body moved like half a foot away when he twitched.

Is there something really wrong with my baby? I'm just so worried, I've never seen him behave like this before. He normally loves my massages, it looked like he did at first till the twitching. Again, I don't massage hard enough to hurt him in any way and I've been doing it for years with no problems. I hope my little Crowley is okay.

Would also like to add, he hasn't eaten since July 17th, he started his winter fast early I think because he stopped eating when we got a new AC, I accidentally let the place get a bit cold one day. The temps today were normal, my hands weren't cold to make him twitch or anything. He did have his humidity at 70% for the duration of his shed and his hide was near the fogger so it was wet in there too but I figured it would be perfect for him as he was in shed mode. I didn't see any signs of RI, his nose was fine.

He was making some light hissing sounds that sounded more like exhales or quiet hisses when I was touching the spots that were making him twitchy.

It does sound as if he's feeling some pain, possibly, from what you describe, and you know your snake better than any of us. Maybe he pulled a muscle on one
of his "missions"? Or your "massages" are not as soft as you say? No, I don't think he got sore from laying around in his hide...that's what snakes do all the time.

It's rather unusual for a snake to be "wagging their tails" too, unless it's a member of a species that does caudal luring (like copperheads or green tree pythons do).
I sure hope he's OK...bummer that he got chilled & hasn't eaten in a while too.

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

It does sound as if he's feeling some pain, possibly, from what you describe, and you know your snake better than any of us. Maybe he pulled a muscle on one
of his "missions"? Or your "massages" are not as soft as you say? No, I don't think he got sore from laying around in his hide...that's what snakes do all the time.

It's rather unusual for a snake to be "wagging their tails" too, unless it's a member of a species that does caudal luring (like copperheads or green tree pythons do).
I sure hope he's OK...bummer that he got chilled & hasn't eaten in a while too.

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I hope he just pulled a muscle and hopefully he will be okay soon. Crowley does waggle his tail when he really likes massages but today's waggle seemed a lot faster and more like he was waving his tail around to possibly be able to push or latch on something. He's in his hide now and looks comfy.

So I went through my videos I took of Crowley last night and here are some to show how he was behaving (I can only upload one video per post so I will be posting in 3 different comments). First video, he seemed normal, he's usually extra bouncy and happy after a shed but he was moving pretty fast compared to usual.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVdSGKXclVw

The second video is when I started to notice something was off. It shows how I massaged him, at first I thought he was waggling his tail because he was enjoying his massages like he normally does but he was waggling a lot harder than normal and as you can see when I stroke him, he does give a few little twitches. I didn't get any of the big hard twitches on camera, just these little ones.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dn3RZdVmVBE

The third video is when I was really starting to worry, he had started doing his twitching and jerking, off camera of course. He was moving really fast like he wanted to get away from the pain or something. At this point I was only petting him very softly as I didn't want to hurt him more if he was injured. Hope these videos help to determine what's wrong.
https://youtu.be/OAGj-kq6LNQ

Well the good news is that pain seems unlikely, especially in a BP as well-cared for as yours anyway. But snakes have various ways of telling us to bug off and I
think his twitching might be telling you that he's had enough of whatever you're doing. Some snakes, like bull or gopher snakes, are really good at actually shoving
with their mid-body & this is used at various times: a wild snake may not bother to try to bite you, especially if you approach gently from their mid-body (since head
& tail approaches trigger a more immediate alarm response) but instead will shove you aside. The same snake uses this technique in burrows to trap & kill entire
families of rodents before they can escape, so this muscle control serves a dual purpose anyway.

But I think this is something else...how can I put this? I think he's trying to tell you that your attention is a little too much. I must preface this by saying that while
I've bred various snakes, I've not bred BPs, but either way, when snakes get together, a good many of them do some body rubbing, with the male sliding over the
female to interest her in cooperating. If for any reason a snake isn't interested, they say so by moving quickly away or by shoving off the other's actions. Now you
have Crowley for a "pet" but he doesn't quite understand that: your petting & attention might be stimulating him in a mating sort of way, but at the same time, you
aren't his type & he's trying to tell you that, ahem... :D I think he's trying to find a mate on these "missions" & you keep turning up, trying to "lead him astray"? :rofl:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

Well the good news is that pain seems unlikely, especially in a BP as well-cared for as yours anyway. But snakes have various ways of telling us to bug off and I
think his twitching might be telling you that he's had enough of whatever you're doing. Some snakes, like bull or gopher snakes, are really good at actually shoving
with their mid-body & this is used at various times: a wild snake may not bother to try to bite you, especially if you approach gently from their mid-body (since head
& tail approaches trigger a more immediate alarm response) but instead will shove you aside. The same snake uses this technique in burrows to trap & kill entire
families of rodents before they can escape, so this muscle control serves a dual purpose anyway.

But I think this is something else...how can I put this? I think he's trying to tell you that your attention is a little too much. I must preface this by saying that while
I've bred various snakes, I've not bred BPs, but either way, when snakes get together, a good many of them do some body rubbing, with the male sliding over the
female to interest her in cooperating. If for any reason a snake isn't interested, they say so by moving quickly away or by shoving off the other's actions. Now you
have Crowley for a "pet" but he doesn't quite understand that: your petting & attention might be stimulating him in a mating sort of way, but at the same time, you
aren't his type & he's trying to tell you that, ahem... :D I think he's trying to find a mate on these "missions" & you keep turning up, trying to "lead him astray"? :rofl:

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Thanks for reassuring me, glad it's probably not an injury. I will of course stop petting/massaging him if he twitches like this again. That's the first time he doesn't want to be touched like that tough. Glad Crowley is willing to "say" no rather than choose me as a mate like my parrot does. Will see how he behaves tonight and give an update.

I think their skin is more sensitive right after shed. I have noticed this with my snake also. And balls or any snake probably don't like when you mess or especially grab their neck. That massage might feel like your getting ready to grab it by the neck. That will cause a jerking back movement, they are protecting their head area.

Having it wet in an enclosure is not really a good thing IMO. Even during shed time. That is the problem with foggers. IMO you might be asking for trouble by
having one. But we'll see i guess.

I don't think many people have foggers on here but I could be wrong, that would be a good thread question for you to ask. In the husbandry section.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Valyndris

The third video is when I was really starting to worry, he had started doing his twitching and jerking, off camera of course. He was moving really fast like he wanted to get away from the pain or something. At this point I was only petting him very softly as I didn't want to hurt him more if he was injured. Hope these videos help to determine what's wrong.
https://youtu.be/OAGj-kq6LNQ

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He’s not trying to get away from pain he’s probably trying to get away from you. To me he looked completely normal. Just looked like he wanted to be left alone which is typical of snakes. They don’t like handling they tolerate it. Some days they’re more tolerant than others, don’t take it personally. Almost all reptiles are like this. Be careful anthropomorphizing your animals, it’s easier to read them when you understand how their brains actually work. Certain behaviors might look similar to a humans but they’re not similar at all. Snakes don’t like massages, they ultimately want to be left alone to... well snake I guess haha


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Valyndris

The second video is when I started to notice something was off. It shows how I massaged him, at first I thought he was waggling his tail because he was enjoying his massages like he normally does but he was waggling a lot harder than normal and as you can see when I stroke him, he does give a few little twitches. I didn't get any of the big hard twitches on camera, just these little ones.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dn3RZdVmVBE

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Snakes aren’t dogs smh I think your thoughtful behaviors are actually quite detrimental. Snakes don’t want to be pet/massaged. Petting a snake is only enjoyable for the human. It’s ok if the snake isn’t stressed but it’s not something that should be done often. If you want an affectionate animal invest in a pup imo I don’t mean to be rude but thinking a snake is wagging it’s tail bothers me. Colubrids will “wag” their tails but as a warning to be left alone. You might be handling him too much and he just wants peace and quiet.


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Just took Crowley out, he seems fine today, I put him in his room and within 15 minutes he went in his favorite hide in there, he does that often where he gets up early and hangs out in there before doing his missions. He's got a heat pad to make it 80 degrees in that hide and I have a humidifier in there for the perfect setup for him. I haven't tried to massage him but he was fine with normal handling. Glad he's okay.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MarkL1561

Snakes aren’t dogs smh I think your thoughtful behaviors are actually quite detrimental. Snakes don’t want to be pet/massaged. Petting a snake is only enjoyable for the human. It’s ok if the snake isn’t stressed but it’s not something that should be done often. If you want an affectionate animal invest in a pup imo I don’t mean to be rude but thinking a snake is wagging it’s tail bothers me. Colubrids will “wag” their tails but as a warning to be left alone. You might be handling him too much and he just wants peace and quiet.


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If there is one thing a snake DOESN'T like it's being grabbed or restricted in any way. The snake appears to be in "flight mode" when you grab at him.. Also, if the snake were in pain you would probably be hissed at and then eventually struck at doing that over and over again... This clearly looks like a snake that is not happy about whats going on in my opinion.. I will support the sentiment that this is a snake not a cat or a dog.

Do you have a "thermostat" on that fogger? If you have a sensor that measures humidity and turns on the fogger automatically you should probably be ok, but you dont ever want alot of condensation to be in the cage. Some condensation on the sides is ok, but water on the floor, or inside his hide should not be there. Too high of humidity can easily cause an RI, or scale rot. Personally I just mist my Snakes every other day. this keeps the humidity in 50% to 70%. I keep it closer to 50% when not in shed, and closer to 70% when in shed.

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Originally Posted by sur3fir3

Do you have a "thermostat" on that fogger? If you have a sensor that measures humidity and turns on the fogger automatically you should probably be ok, but you dont ever want alot of condensation to be in the cage. Some condensation on the sides is ok, but water on the floor, or inside his hide should not be there. Too high of humidity can easily cause an RI, or scale rot. Personally I just mist my Snakes every other day. this keeps the humidity in 50% to 70%. I keep it closer to 50% when not in shed, and closer to 70% when in shed.

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Ya, it's on a "thermostat" for humidity, I don't know what it's called either. I fixed the issue where he can bring his hide to where it condensates. I get a bit of water on the side and the fogger drips in a water bowl, that's pretty much it. I had his hide where it wouldn't get wet but sometimes he'd drag it to the wet area, which I fixed by adding an empty water bowl in the way. Usually when he did this I'd take him out that night and dry off his hide but decided to leave it as he could use the humidity for his shed.

I'm glad he is back to normal after that night.

For everyone saying he probably doesn't like being touched, here is a video when Crowley was loving his massage. He was doing the happy waggle and flexes around my wrist so I can massage harder, which I don't even he wants me to. He's not trying to get away. I don't have videos of this but he especially loves massages from my husband, he'll go right to his hand and hook on so he can get the royal massage.
https://youtu.be/JVZzMkmsG8w

Dude... it’s a snake. Please respect that it’s a snake and not a puppy. In the end though it’s not my animal so do whatever you like. I love my animals as well but I realize the limitations of the reptilian brain. Reptiles do not love their owners and they do not like being handled. They’re wild (rather simple minded) animals that we keep at home for our enjoyment. Personally I think it’s best to respect that they just want to be left alone. Handling is good as long as it’s not stressful and to me it seems that you’re making your sessions pretty stressful. I really do believe you’re misinterpreting and anthropomorphizing the snakes behavior to his detriment. I’m not really sure why you decided on a snake as a pet when you so adamantly want something affectionate. Snakes are not affectionate in any way. We just anthropomorphize their behaviors to make us feel better. It’s not dangerous if we’re aware that we’re doing it but you seem to truly believe your snake is human reincarnate or something. To me this is a basic understanding of biology and is needed for proper husbandry of these animals. So the next time your snake seems “off” it’s most likely what you’re doing to it that is causing it.


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