Just need to vent about this Ball Python...

Why is it that the single most expensive snake I've purchased is the one that wants to stress me out the most. Jeebus...

I purchased this little girl from a larger name breeder in the US and had her shipped to me in early April. I got a weight on her at just over 100g and put her in her tub. I gave her 2 weeks to adjust and offered her a crawler rat. Nothing. 2 weeks later after 2 more offers she finally took.

Since that time over the last 4 months she has eaten four more times. Until this weekend she had never touched a rat larger than a 3 week old crawler. For the first time last night she killed and ate a weanling.

I've tried everything, larger tub, smaller tub, bigger hide, smaller hide, and she has been left totally alone other than cleaning her feces up.

She isn't losing weight, she doesn't look anything other than slightly thin, but she is the most cantankerous baby I've ever had to deal with and she is really irking me.

I'm glad to have a place with people who may understand. Blech.

Paul

Some are just like that. She may eventually turn into a good eater, or she may remain picky for life. I have a female YB/granite that took over four years to get up to 1500 grams because she would only eat once a month. Tried different setups, different racks, different temps, different colors of rats, and nothing changed in her feeding habits. She won't eat until she's good and ready.

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Originally Posted by bcr229

Some are just like that. She may eventually turn into a good eater, or she may remain picky for life. I have a female YB/granite that took over four years to get up to 1500 grams because she would only eat once a month. Tried different setups, different racks, different temps, different colors of rats, and nothing changed in her feeding habits. She won't eat until she's good and ready.

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I'm learning that too, about my two BP's. They go on feeding strikes and are picky, then one day they are really really hungry, then the next feeding they aren't anymore.

I was so stressed about my one that went on an 8 month feeding strike (she's an adult). Now she will eat a rat that's been left in her cage even if it's cold and stiff after being rejected by my other BP-- they seem to take turns being picky.

As long as there's nothing else wrong with them or their environment they'll just eat when they are good and ready.

This is exactly why (in all honesty) I don't miss keeping BPs. Few other snakes are this much hassle, so for me it's rat snakes, or Pituophis, or king snakes, rosy boas,
or even Aussie spotted pythons...most snakes feed wonderfully, & IMO "good pets" shouldn't drive you crazy. ;) Heck, my longnose snake feeds better than many
BPs, & they are not usually easy keepers at all.

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Originally Posted by FollowTheSun

I'm learning that too, about my two BP's. They go on feeding strikes and are picky, then one day they are really really hungry, then the next feeding they aren't anymore.

I was so stressed about my one that went on an 8 month feeding strike (she's an adult). Now she will eat a rat that's been left in her cage even if it's cold and stiff after being rejected by my other BP-- they seem to take turns being picky.

As long as there's nothing else wrong with them or their environment they'll just eat when they are good and ready.

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Mine went on a 6 month hunger strike. That scared the life out of me.


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I've had my share of difficult snakes in the past, across a few different species, and interacted with others. Prior to this one there was always SOMETHING I could identify that had the snake's behavior off. Something about the enclosure, or the environment that once changed got the snake to eating right away.

The thing that gets me is that she doesn't act stressed, at all. She is alert and active, always with the tongue flicking. Isn't shy at all, and even getting her to ball up to get her weighed easily is a chore as she just doesn't want to stop exploring when she's out of her tub. (She's 220g as of last pre-feeding weight)

My new Animal Plastics rack is supposed to be here this month, and when it arrives I've got at least 5 snakes getting a new enclosure, when this happens I will probably shift her to a higher spot in the rack and see if a 2ft elevation change helps -_- ...

As long as she is eating and growing I will be content, even if she isn't growing like my best eaters.

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Originally Posted by NewmanLovesSnakes

Mine went on a 6 month hunger strike. That scared the life out of me.


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I would expect this with an older ball python, it's Modus Operandi for the breed, but I'm much more accustomed to seeing a snake that is under a year old have a strong feeding response.

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Originally Posted by pbenner

Why is it that the single most expensive snake I've purchased is the one that wants to stress me out the most. Jeebus...

I purchased this little girl from a larger name breeder in the US and had her shipped to me in early April. I got a weight on her at just over 100g and put her in her tub. I gave her 2 weeks to adjust and offered her a crawler rat. Nothing. 2 weeks later after 2 more offers she finally took.

Since that time over the last 4 months she has eaten four more times. Until this weekend she had never touched a rat larger than a 3 week old crawler. For the first time last night she killed and ate a weanling.

I've tried everything, larger tub, smaller tub, bigger hide, smaller hide, and she has been left totally alone other than cleaning her feces up.

She isn't losing weight, she doesn't look anything other than slightly thin, but she is the most cantankerous baby I've ever had to deal with and she is really irking me.

I'm glad to have a place with people who may understand. Blech.

Paul

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Yes! I feel your pain! Mine is on just under 4 months without a single meal. Also most expensive, and a female. She's holding at just under 200g. I've tried smaller cages, different hides, live feeders....nothing. She's very active and curious in the cage. I wont mess with her until 3 consecutive, successful feedings and it's NOT fun. lol

Good luck with yours and keep us posted!

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Originally Posted by Shayne

Yes! I feel your pain! Mine is on just under 4 months without a single meal. Also most expensive, and a female. She's holding at just under 200g. I've tried smaller cages, different hides, live feeders....nothing. She's very active and curious in the cage. I wont mess with her until 3 consecutive, successful feedings and it's NOT fun. lol

Good luck with yours and keep us posted!

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So sorry to hear this...I wondered why you've been sorta "quiet" here. There's no torture like what a fussy snake can inflict. :rolleyes: Unless it's a kid like "Randy" in the movie
"Christmas Story" (1983). He might have been a ball python in a previous life? :D

This method will normally WORK if done properly ...
I wait until evening as they're nocturnal of course . I let the rodent thaw out in the reptile room so they get the smell ..
Many will only strike if the the room has dim/ low lighting !
Then I warm up the mouse / rat with a hairdryer and offer with tongs IMMEDIATELY whilst still warm . If refused simply repeat the heating and offering as many times as needed. .
A couple of mine will only strike feed from within their hides so I dangle the warm rodent in front of the hide's entrance - usually works but if it fails simply reheat the rodent with a hairdryer and immediately offer again whilst it's still warm continue until it's grabbed ...
Incidentally , if it shows no interest at all not even a tongue flicker maybe it's best to leave for a week or so.

Worrying CAN be part of being a Royal owner although I have a pair of HC ALBINO Royals that feed every single time ( every ten days or so ) .. but I also have a huge Pied Royal who hasn’t eaten for me since I bought him a few months ago .. he still looks amazing , he’s active and sheds well and isn’t losing weight so I’m not worried ( just frustrated) .,

I’ve never had dealings with a very small youngster with no weight on them ..


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Originally Posted by Zincubus

This method will normally WORK if done properly ...
I wait until evening as they're nocturnal of course . I let the rodent thaw out in the reptile room so they get the smell ..
Many will only strike if the the room has dim/ low lighting !
Then I warm up the mouse / rat with a hairdryer and offer with tongs IMMEDIATELY whilst still warm . If refused simply repeat the heating and offering as many times as needed. .
A couple of mine will only strike feed from within their hides so I dangle the warm rodent in front of the hide's entrance - usually works but if it fails simply reheat the rodent with a hairdryer and immediately offer again whilst it's still warm continue until it's grabbed ...
Incidentally , if it shows no interest at all not even a tongue flicker maybe it's best to leave for a week or so.

Worrying CAN be part of being a Royal owner although I have a pair of HC ALBINO Royals that feed every single time ( every ten days or so ) .. but I also have a huge Pied Royal who hasn’t eaten for me since I bought him a few months ago .. he still looks amazing , he’s active and sheds well and isn’t losing weight so I’m not worried ( just frustrated) .,

I’ve never had dealings with a very small youngster with no weight on them ..


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I've specifically left her on live because it's all she's taken for me. The breeder told me she was eating F/T like a beast for him weekly, so I'm at a total loss. I'd never call a professional breeder a liar, but I'll be damned if this snake doesn't make me want to.


I'm praying that maybe I'll get a little of the "Complain loud enough and You shall receive..." since I've finally blasted my woes out for those who have the highest chance of care to read. Haha.



@Shayne - I feel your pain. It's so hard for me to not drag her out and get pictures of her as I haven't REALLY been able to show her off. I'm hoping that every time she eats that it's the start of a good habit and I'll get to show her off, but alas....

She's almost translucent as light in color as she is, but she's got enough pale and shades that she's a beautiful looker if you can see it.

So guess who didn't eat for me this week...

Yeah...

*curse words in frustration*

:(

Okay so try one last thing . . . cut off the tail of a frozen rat, thaw it, and set it near the entrance of the hide. See if the snake is suddenly more alert and interested. If so then offer one a couple hours later after the snake has worked up an appetite. I find that thawing them right next to the enclosure tube-light on top of the enclosure allows them to be the perfect temperature -- and the smell of thawing rat also probably drifts down a bit.

But then again, BP's will be BP's and I swear they give us a hard time for their own amusement.

2 months after my last post, with a regular feeding schedule I finally found some live ASFs locally to me. I bought an adult male and 2.2 weanlings.

She's gone through a blue cycle and had a good shed, last night I noticed that she was out and about in her tub so I looked and she had made a poop.

I cleaned up the poop, took her hide out to wash it and threw in the ASF. At first she ignored it, so I left her to go wash her hide and when I came back she had coiled and killed the ASF. I turned off the lights and left her, and she ate.

This will be the 4th meal she's taken from me. I pick up more ASF adults in a breeding colony in 2 weeks. I'm going to do a similar offering with a rat of that size next week, but if she doesn't take it I'll be going back to ASFs.

At least she's saved herself from starvation for another period.

In closing, I'd like to note that everyone else still eats like a pig.

Paul

:frustrate Congratulations! We feel your pain...:frustrate For what it's worth, BPs seem to enjoy hamsters too...I know from experience, I used to raise & sell them, & any
with temperament "issues" were culled as snake dinners. Russian Dwarf hamsters are pretty easy to breed, & social with each other...NOT so of the reclusive Syrian
type hamsters (aka Teddy Bear), they're a pain to breed, they're cranky with people and other hamsters alike, lol.

Full disclosure: hamsters are a higher fat diet though, so not thought to be the healthiest for snake maintenance. Just another option though. I've heard ASF's are
awful to breed...just what you need, lol.

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

:frustrate Congratulations! We feel your pain...:frustrate For what it's worth, BPs seem to enjoy hamsters too...I know from experience, I used to raise & sell them, & any
with temperament "issues" were culled as snake dinners. Russian Dwarf hamsters are pretty easy to breed, & social with each other...NOT so of the reclusive Syrian
type hamsters (aka Teddy Bear), they're a pain to breed, they're cranky with people and other hamsters alike, lol.

Full disclosure: hamsters are a higher fat diet though, so not thought to be the healthiest for snake maintenance. Just another option though. I've heard ASF's are
awful to breed...just what you need, lol.

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I hate hamsters with a vehement passion. Literally the worst rodent on the planet. If I get desperate again I'll try that route but I for sure don't want to breed them.

In regards to ASFs, I'm getting a beat up metal rack designed for mice that I'm going to look at and "disassemble" as I repair it. There is a local fabrication company that works with a CAD guided laser cutter and has an industrial bender that could easily help with the fabrication of a bin and rack system. I do the IT for their server and their laser system.

But Mice and ASFs were on the menu just to continue my worship of Capitalism. Oddly enough feeder rodents sell pretty well, all in all.

Best,

Paul

I have completely given up stressing over my BP’s eating habits. One of mine would only eat every 3 or 4 weeks for his first year, now he would eat every 2 days if I offered. I had a female that never missed a meal for a year and a half, now she eats once a month. I have 6 of them and it is like hitting the lottery if they all eat on feeding day! Never have that worry with my retic or burm!


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ASF will add weight faster then any rat will. All my BP an young BC/BI get ASF. Your braver then me feeding a snake a live adult one as ASF are ten times more vicious then rats. Build your own rat rack here:
http://www.arbreptiles.com/cages/rat_rack.html

Use 1/4" wire as ASF hoppers will climb out of 1/2". I use 1/3 (2/3 when replacing males). You can't add a male to a colony (or females sometimes). Just leave some first litters in the colony for replacements. Cheap Tractor Supply Co food food works great for feed. The new style mixing tubs need wire over the nail hole or the ASF will eat their way out.

Compared to Norway rats ASF grow slooooooooooooow. One mature ASF has more protein then a large rat. .

You found what your snake likes, get the weight on then change over to F/T. An ASF colony having a litter of 15-20 every 30 days will fill the freezer fast.

Good luck!



If you have a picky snake for some reason a stinky male rodent will get a strike before a female (from what I've seen).

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Originally Posted by pbenner

I hate hamsters with a vehement passion. Literally the worst rodent on the planet. If I get desperate again I'll try that route but I for sure don't want to breed them...

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It sounds like you've only dealt with Syrian hamsters, or else inbred Russian Dwarf hamsters? Because the latter are NOT biters, they're cute & friendly...I worked with them for years & sold many to pet stores. I even guaranteed their temperament, even if one was mishandled & not at all at fault, & I only ever replaced one or two out of SO many. That said, I hate to have the prolific cuties be snake food...so rock on & feed your ASFs. Good luck. :rolleyes:

Same here. My baby, hatched 8-12-19, is making me crazy! Our other 4 eat like Champs! No muss, no fuss. This one, who hasn't yet reached 100g, just will not eat. She's afraid of hoppers, so I went for multiple fuzzies, nope. She gathered them up into a pile and curled around them like they were her eggs. I ended up adding them to my ASF colony since one of my ASF'S had just birthed a litter(our first litter! Yay!) She took them in, no problem. This week, I tried a hopper again, thinking maybe the fuzzies were too small for her to recognize as food. Nope. She made friends with it. She won't touch f/t or freshly killed. Aaaaaagh!

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

It sounds like you've only dealt with Syrian hamsters, or else inbred Russian Dwarf hamsters? Because the latter are NOT biters, they're cute & friendly...I worked with them for years & sold many to pet stores. I even guaranteed their temperament, even if one was mishandled & not at all at fault, & I only ever replaced one or two out of SO many. That said, I hate to have the prolific cuties be snake food...so rock on & feed your ASFs. Good luck. :rolleyes:

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Teddy Bear Hamsters were my first experience and I got the crap bit out of my finger twice by the "class pet". I was the only one interested in cleaning his cage (haha). Looking at it, yes, it was a Syrian hamster. Also, the second one you listed too. Such a smart chap you is! Probably mishandled and would agree. I know that if I bought a line of them that I could work out issues, but I'm happy to go with ASFs for now. We should have (3) colonies soon with space to expand for more.

Paul

- - - Updated - - -

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Originally Posted by Kt011092

Same here. My baby, hatched 8-12-19, is making me crazy! Our other 4 eat like Champs! No muss, no fuss. This one, who hasn't yet reached 100g, just will not eat. She's afraid of hoppers, so I went for multiple fuzzies, nope. She gathered them up into a pile and curled around them like they were her eggs. I ended up adding them to my ASF colony since one of my ASF'S had just birthed a litter(our first litter! Yay!) She took them in, no problem. This week, I tried a hopper again, thinking maybe the fuzzies were too small for her to recognize as food. Nope. She made friends with it. She won't touch f/t or freshly killed. Aaaaaagh!

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The best advice is to just keep trying and to watch for the point where they may need to be given help.

Paul

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Originally Posted by pbenner

Teddy Bear Hamsters were my first experience and I got the crap bit out of my finger twice by the "class pet". I was the only one interested in cleaning his cage (haha). Looking at it, yes, it was a Syrian hamster. Also, the second one you listed too. Such a smart chap you is! Probably mishandled and would agree. I know that if I bought a line of them that I could work out issues, but I'm happy to go with ASFs for now. We should have (3) colonies soon with space to expand for more.

Paul ...

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I can relate...I've known about 4 Syrian hamsters as pets from way back when they were the only ones available. :( Mixed results, even friendly ones could be cranky pets.

Many years later, I had a fussy snake that I wanted to breed Russian dwarf hamsters for. The first ones I got (from a pet store) were so inbred that even though very young, they literally charged & attacked to bite hard (!) from across the cage. :O I'm good at taming most creatures but these were like wild psychos, no kidding. Took 'em back to store after a week, & later I fully understood why some other nearby pet stores refused to carry them at all: they had the same large source from nearest big city (L.A.), & all the local pet stores were ending up with hamsters they couldn't sell, except to snake keepers, & I sure hope no one fed them live! :O (that was in Calif, btw)

I then got a pair of R.D. hamsters from a herp society member- they had wonderful temperaments but were plain (agouti) type fur; as luck would have it, I was offered from elsewhere a sickly albino with a litter she could could barely feed with all sorts of coat colors (interesting genetics) & I saved them all (pinkies have teeth and will bite, so I supplemented them with cottage cheese & bits of raw kale...it worked!). They reproduce fast, they're social & friendly when not inbred...very cute pets actually. With a promise to exchange any unsatisfactory ones, I then sold tons of them to local pet stores* (all different colors- they were very appealing & sold well as pets). Only 1 or 2 ever returned out of countless...they're also social with each other, not loners like the Syrian type. They really "supported" my snakes well...;) They're on the small size for BP meals, but you might find that BPs like them so much they'll eat multiples, lol.

*The best pet rodents come from snake-keepers that have "customers" for any that should be culled, LOL. Even I was amazed at the quality I had in no time, & still kept all my fingers...:D Best of luck though with your ASFs. :gj:

Well,

We decided that we would eat again. I'd noted that she was actually out and about in her tub more than usual and threw her a rat this AM before I left for work (Live, Crawler 2weeks 4 days, male) and she had it dead before I came home to let the dogs out. Obviously it doesn't show that she ate, but she did take in some more nutrition.

Last meal was the ASF posted above.

Paul

Either I got lucky or I am finally winning. I gave her the sibling of the other rat she ate, so 3 weeks old) and she pounded it too. So hopefully she's coming around. Was normal feeding day and I hadn't remembered her more recent feeding.

I'll give her another go next week.

It's about time!!

Paul

Dang, has been right at a month since my last update. After the 2nd male rat she refused again. Over the holiday I was finally able to trade some rats for a group of ASFs and have been waiting for her to come out of her last blue. This morning during cage cleaning I took the oldest ASF, broke his neck and put it right outside her hide. She smashed it immediately.

Maybe ASFs will be the answer, we will see.

Ugh!

Paul

Ball pythons...can't live with 'em, & ya can't live without 'em! :rofl: (keeping my fingers crossed for you & "Ms. Picky")

Probably the last post I make here. Obviously making a public complaint post *and* changing her offered food source has done the trick.

We are 4/4 on ASFs and 4/30+ on normal rats. For now we'll stick with the ASFs and hope she starts gaining weight seriously.

Thanks again for the support. Proof that not giving up is the key. I'll check back in a few months here with some weight gain information once she starts.

Paul

Good job! So happy for your well-deserved & slow-to-arrive success. :D