Which BCI morphs age well?

I am pondering eventually getting a BCI, and browsing MorphMarket, there are, of course, hundreds of morph combos that look awesome as babies/juveniles. However, I am curious to know which morphs are most likely to still look good, or possibly even improve, in adulthood. Sort of following along with this general question, I also would love to learn about these points in particular ...

- Is there a visual difference between the different Albino lines (Kahl, Sharp, VPI, Central, Caramel, etc.)?

- Are there any genes that tend to improve color retention with age, like Hypo does with BPs?

- Out of the morphs that produce more red (Blood, various Albinos, etc.), which ones stay the most red, vs. browning out?

- Leopard and IMG turn blacker with age; what is the effect of these genes when in combination with other genes that affect color/pigmentation?

Any info, and of course owner pictures, would be more than welcomed!

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...a86be5fbe7.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...eb36d6502a.jpg
This is my red pastel boa. Although it’s not a morph, instead it’s a line bred trait. He’s only a year old but has held onto his color quite well. His blushing looks so much better in person but here are a few pics. Otherwise when you’re picking out a new snake ask the breeder for pictures of the parents. Usually they have a plethora of pictures of their breeders.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by RedRabbit

- Is there a visual difference between the different Albino lines (Kahl, Sharp, VPI, Central, Caramel, etc.)?

- Are there any genes that tend to improve color retention with age, like Hypo does with BPs?

- Out of the morphs that produce more red (Blood, various Albinos, etc.), which ones stay the most red, vs. browning out?

- Leopard and IMG turn blacker with age; what is the effect of these genes when in combination with other genes that affect color/pigmentation?

Any info, and of course owner pictures, would be more than welcomed!

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I'm not a boa expert, but I can chime in on the ones I know.

Kahl is the most common albino available. I'm told Sharp holds its colors the best as a single-gene, but I have seen kahl line animals do so as well. Either one will hold significantly more color as a Sunglow (hypo + albino).

Hypo does help retain color with age in albino, though I have not seen it in particular for other morphs. Maybe in the snow-type morphs (albino + anery + hypo vs without).

Aside from hypo, I think IMG improves with age in general and improves colors in albino combos. I.e. more and brighter oranges/yellows when you have both genes. I think adding hypo would improve from there as well.

I haven't learned much about leopard, but blood (not just het blood) do seem to hold a lot of red color from adults displayed at expos near me.

I've only got 2 boas with no breeding plans, but here's pics of them.

Cas, male Kahl line Sunglow yearling
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...8f51002ca2.jpg

(And his baby picture)
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...6f2461aabf.jpg

And Darcy, female hypo
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...d75cf1251c.jpg

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by MarkL1561

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...a86be5fbe7.jpg
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...eb36d6502a.jpg
This is my red pastel boa. Although it’s not a morph, instead it’s a line bred trait. He’s only a year old but has held onto his color quite well. His blushing looks so much better in person but here are a few pics. Otherwise when you’re picking out a new snake ask the breeder for pictures of the parents. Usually they have a plethora of pictures of their breeders.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Really gorgeous snake, Mark! Such rosy colors. Thank you for sharing these photos.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pretends2bnormal

I'm not a boa expert, but I can chime in on the ones I know.

Kahl is the most common albino available. I'm told Sharp holds its colors the best as a single-gene, but I have seen kahl line animals do so as well. Either one will hold significantly more color as a Sunglow (hypo + albino).

Hypo does help retain color with age in albino, though I have not seen it in particular for other morphs. Maybe in the snow-type morphs (albino + anery + hypo vs without).

Aside from hypo, I think IMG improves with age in general and improves colors in albino combos. I.e. more and brighter oranges/yellows when you have both genes. I think adding hypo would improve from there as well.

I haven't learned much about leopard, but blood (not just het blood) do seem to hold a lot of red color from adults displayed at expos near me.

I've only got 2 boas with no breeding plans, but here's pics of them.

Cas, male Kahl line Sunglow yearling
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...8f51002ca2.jpg

(And his baby picture)
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...6f2461aabf.jpg

And Darcy, female hypo
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...d75cf1251c.jpg

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

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Thank you, that's a very helpful run-down. I do recall reading that Sunglows retain color better because of the addition of Hypo. I've seen some really spectacular Bloods and Hypo Bloods too, though I must admit some bias there since red is my favorite color. :D Both Cas and Darcy are just beautiful. Tell them they're making my boa itch a lot worse, haha!

Selective breeding is as important as the morph itself. Breeders who just throw animals together because of their morphs will generally have lackluster adults. You will have much more impressive animals buying an offspring from a selectively-bred project. If your goal is adult appearance, you'll need to sit and wait for good litters, or find nice subadults/adults.


Hypo in general will increase red and color retention when paired with albino, but this isn't always the case; hypos are incredibly variable. I've seen some sunglows fade out worse than most normal albinos, and some albinos turn out more color than than the average sunglow. It's all in the breeding, and to a certain extent, the hets. I hear hets like anery can also wash out color - which may explain why my girl is fading out.

Flash:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/QJIs6lu.jpg

Natural light (shade):
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/UZ0dPMp.jpg


Jungle is another great morph that will increase color, and jungles tend to get better with age. Color contrast increases, and they get brighter, though their general appearance will be much different than as babies. Despite their commonality and time in the market, jungles can be quite expensive, especially well-bred ones.

Breeder pics of my jungle as a baby:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/SVYTbuh.jpg

One of my most recent pics of her, at 11 years old:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/izEAkN5.jpg


Leopard and IMG depends on what other genes are at play. In general, they'll darken colors in pigmented animals, and brighten albino-type combos. Hypo IMG tend to retain much of their pattern, but get an interesting contrasted look. Anery and motley IMGs seem to get the darkest.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CloudtheBoa

Selective breeding is as important as the morph itself. Breeders who just throw animals together because of their morphs will generally have lackluster adults. You will have much more impressive animals buying an offspring from a selectively-bred project. If your goal is adult appearance, you'll need to sit and wait for good litters, or find nice subadults/adults.


Hypo in general will increase red and color retention when paired with albino, but this isn't always the case; hypos are incredibly variable. I've seen some sunglows fade out worse than most normal albinos, and some albinos turn out more color than than the average sunglow. It's all in the breeding, and to a certain extent, the hets. I hear hets like anery can also wash out color - which may explain why my girl is fading out.

Flash:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/QJIs6lu.jpg

Natural light (shade):
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/UZ0dPMp.jpg


Jungle is another great morph that will increase color, and jungles tend to get better with age. Color contrast increases, and they get brighter, though their general appearance will be much different than as babies. Despite their commonality and time in the market, jungles can be quite expensive, especially well-bred ones.

Breeder pics of my jungle as a baby:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/SVYTbuh.jpg

One of my most recent pics of her, at 11 years old:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/izEAkN5.jpg


Leopard and IMG depends on what other genes are at play. In general, they'll darken colors in pigmented animals, and brighten albino-type combos. Hypo IMG tend to retain much of their pattern, but get an interesting contrasted look. Anery and motley IMGs seem to get the darkest.

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Thank you, that's an excellent point. My snakes are beloved pets and "forever" commitments for me - so while that does mean that if the snake browns or fades, I'll love it regardless, it also means I am absolutely willing to pay more for a snake from a high quality line from a reputable breeder, and to wait on a promising clutch if needed. Also, thanks for the additional info on the general tendencies of particular genes. And your boas are real beauties! The fade actually makes for some lovely soft colors on your Sunglow, and your Jungle girl is just spectacularly bold.

They're all so beautiful...good luck choosing just one, RedRabbit! :D Now you see why so many of us end up with so many of them? :snake:

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

They're all so beautiful...good luck choosing just one, RedRabbit! :D Now you see why so many of us end up with so many of them? :snake:

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Nnngghh, don't doom me any more than I already am, Bogertophis! :please: An employee at my local reptile store did warn me that with ball pythons, exceeding 2 is the point of no return and then you jump straight to 10, which was why I put on the brakes after getting Iggy and Rae, lol. But she didn't give me any preparation for what to do when expanding to a new species! I started out just looking at the BCI morphs with strong reds in them -- I actually just emailed Vin Russo to inquire about current/upcoming availability for some of his Hypo Bloods -- but already my treacherous self is thinking about what another color boa that could complement that blood red! [facepalm]

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RedRabbit

Nnngghh, don't doom me any more than I already am, Bogertophis! :please: An employee at my local reptile store did warn me that with ball pythons, exceeding 2 is the point of no return and then you jump straight to 10, which was why I put on the brakes after getting Iggy and Rae, lol. But she didn't give me any preparation for what to do when expanding to a new species! I started out just looking at the BCI morphs with strong reds in them -- I actually just emailed Vin Russo to inquire about current/upcoming availability for some of his Hypo Bloods -- but already my treacherous self is thinking about what another color boa that could complement that blood red! [facepalm]

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I knew it! :rofl: Better leave some room for a few rat snakes too...have you seen FollowTheSun's "Noodle"? And you need a Bogertophis subocularis too, of course! ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

I knew it! :rofl: Better leave some room for a few rat snakes too...have you seen FollowTheSun's "Noodle"? And you need a Bogertophis subocularis too, of course! ;)

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Or even a nice Okeetee corn snake ;)

(Ironically also named Noodle)
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...899f22ea0e.jpg

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RedRabbit

Nnngghh, don't doom me any more than I already am, Bogertophis! :please: An employee at my local reptile store did warn me that with ball pythons, exceeding 2 is the point of no return and then you jump straight to 10, which was why I put on the brakes after getting Iggy and Rae, lol. But she didn't give me any preparation for what to do when expanding to a new species! I started out just looking at the BCI morphs with strong reds in them -- I actually just emailed Vin Russo to inquire about current/upcoming availability for some of his Hypo Bloods -- but already my treacherous self is thinking about what another color boa that could complement that blood red! [facepalm]

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He has a line of pastels that might tickle your fancy [emoji846] You can get the red without it drowning out the pattern and contrast. You can also throw the pastel into morphs as well, something to look into.


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Nooooo, you guys!! Don't you get me started on colubrids too; I have to draw the line somewhere! :rofl:Even though Noodle is a looker. Both of them. Argh.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MarkL1561

He has a line of pastels that might tickle your fancy [emoji846] You can get the red without it drowning out the pattern and contrast. You can also throw the pastel into morphs as well, something to look into.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Definitely will keep Pastels in mind. Some of his Salmon boas were also looking mighty fine. Decisions, decisions!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RedRabbit

... I have to draw the line somewhere! :rofl:...

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I don't see why? :snake:

This is my hypo red pastel when she was in with my male motley, she just gave me some stunning babies. My sunglow has faded a bit but the coral on her sides is mental
The img is great at making colours last , my hypo img has gone really black
Here's a few pics of my hypo red pastel and sunglow https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...7044cf2468.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...bde2df9d2b.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...79d40b5e2d.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...3e84ab45ca.jpg

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Enablers, unite! :rofl: But you know Red, there are far worse "habits" you could have...just sayin'. ;)

Hey, since you like red...how about a nice bull snake too? They're great pets, though a little more difficult to catch sitting still for photo ops...:snake:

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...phis-Goings-on

(scroll thru this thread ^ ^ ^ if you dare? -evil laugh...)

Richard, your hypo red pastel is just glorious! And Bogertophis, I do love the look of bull snakes a lot, especially their slightly hooded eyes. I remember first seeing them on the "Snake Discovery" Youtube channel and going "whoa, those are cool!"

... Honestly, I can't really think of a species of snake I don't like, haha. I remember I used to think hognoses and Kenyan sand boas were a little silly looking, but now I just think they're adorable.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RedRabbit

Richard, your hypo red pastel is just glorious! And Bogertophis, I do love the look of bull snakes a lot, especially their slightly hooded eyes. I remember first seeing them on the "Snake Discovery" Youtube channel and going "whoa, those are cool!"

... Honestly, I can't really think of a species of snake I don't like, haha. I remember I used to think hognoses and Kenyan sand boas were a little silly looking, but now I just think they're adorable.

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I knew it! You're "one of us" & there's NO turning back....bwaahahahah!