» Site Navigation
0 members and 697 guests
No Members online
Most users ever online was 47,180, 07-16-2025 at 05:30 PM.
» Today's Birthdays
» Stats
Members: 75,905
Threads: 249,103
Posts: 2,572,095
Top Poster: JLC (31,651)
|
-
Help With Morph Identification
Hello! This is my first post, so I’m hoping I’m doing everything correctly here. I’d like to get some clarification on the morphs of two of my Ball Pythons. I wasn’t sure if I was allowed to make separate posts, so I lumped the two together to be safe.
For the first snake, I purchased him as a Vanilla Clown, though the breeder believes him to be Yellow Belly as well. I was hoping to see if anyone here saw indication of that as well? He has nice flames along the sides, but his belly is a bit “dirty.” I’m not certain if every YB has a pure white belly though. When he’s old enough, I have a Pastel Yellow Belly female I plan to breed him to in order to prove him out. That may be the only way to be sure, but I thought I’d get other’s opinions as well.
As for the second snake, she was sold to me as a “Something Special” Het Clown. My first impression was in the vein of Leopard. When I inquired about this “special” trait, the breeder was very vague and even after purchasing her, never actually told me what he believed her to be. I purchased her regardless at an excellent price and won’t regret the decision even if she’s a fancy Normal. I do believe she’s something more though. She’s pretty dark, more so in person than in the pictures, and her pattern seems different to a Normal’s. Does she look like one of the established morphs? A possible Dinker project? Or simply a nicer than most Normal?
Either way, I’m very happy with both snakes, I would just like to have a better understanding of what they are. Thank you all in advance, it’s much appreciated. I apologize for the post being longer than intended!
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...5f19c5ff4c.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...0779c5fdca.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...92709f3c3f.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...62b68bc62c.jpg
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
i'm very inclined to say that u just have a regular Clown. if he had Vanilla, he would be lighter and if there was YB, much brighter. i still hope he proves out for u tho. that "Something Special" het Clown kinda looks GHI'ish to me. the breeder u got them from seems unnecessarily unsure, vague and secretive. u should just pair that Clown boy to both your Pastel YB and the "Something Special" het Clown to see what hatches.
Edit: also don't worry about how many posts or threads u make. post fearlessly.
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
Thank you for your input, it’s much appreciated! I hadn’t considered the possibility that the Clown wasn’t Vanilla; the breeder seems reputable and his pattern seemed too reduced for just a normal Clown. I’ll post a better picture of him for reference. When he’s breed ready, I already have two females chosen for him, the Pastel YB as well as a SuperFly 66% Het Clown. I was hoping for some possible Vanilla Scream Clowns, but if there is doubt on the Vanilla part, I guess I’ll be proving this male out for two possible genes. If he seems up to it in the future, I may pair the “special” one to him as well, if it doesn’t seem overwhelming for him to breed three females at one time.
Just to clarify, these two snakes came from different breeders. I’m only uncertain about the integrity of the unidentified snake’s breeder, because he was so vague about her genetics. I haven’t been given reason to doubt the Clown’s breeder. I should have probably said that from the get go, my apologies.
GHI is an interesting guess! I hadn’t considered it, because I didn’t think her pattern matched the usual look of it. I’m excited to eventually breed her and see what she produces!
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...ebe8e94f82.jpg
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
^ i don't see anything in your Clown's colors - lightness or brightness. the flames u are referring to are also called tear drops and seem within the variation. i just see a nice, reduced pattern Clown but that is my opinion and i could be wrong. maybe others will chime in. how does he compare to the rest of his clutch?
the neck dorsal and skinny high pattern your 2nd snake reminds me of GHI. i looks too clean tho and even tho it is a dark snake, the colors still seem kinda off. i'm sure it's the het influence and this is just a cool dinker.
either way, it sounds like u have great plans and projects.
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
Compared to one of his YB Clown siblings, they share the same overall color and brightness. The only difference is mine has a much more reduced pattern. Another of his siblings was a Pastel Vanilla Clown, which had an extremely similar reduced pattern, but a more dramatic head stamp. I don’t feel comfortable posting the breeder’s photos, but I have compared the clutch mates to one another.
I’m just hoping whatever she’s got going on passes to her offspring, I adore her dark color. She’s stumped me from the get go haha.
Thank you, I’m hoping to produce some cool combos one of these days!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
I agree with everything Ax said. I looked at the pics before anyone responded and literally was going to say the same thing, cool that I'm not the only one that your drinker reminds of ghi, I don't think the color is right for ghi, but I love the pattern and instantly thought ghi. Really cool dinker project in my opinion, she's really different and beautiful.
As for the clown, I'm not good at spotting yb in combos but I see nothing but a reduced clown. I've seen a lot of reduced clowns, some were blade clown but I've seen many straight clowns that were just as reduced as blade clowns.
Both are nice additions imo, congrats!
-
Could the "special" be a special?
Special is a morph in BPs (I cannot ID it though, sorry)
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
I'm sorry, this is completely unrelated but, I'm new to this site and I can't figure out how to post a thread lol. Do you need a paid subscription to do so or am I just having a difficult time finding the add thread button?
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
Thank you, rufretic! She is a beautiful girl and I’m excited to see what her offspring will look like when I’m able to breed her. So far it seems she’s just a cool Dinker project, but I’m very happy with that.
I don’t think her morph is Special, since she’s so dark and her pattern doesn’t match up, but that was a good idea to look into, AbsoluteApril. Thank you for the suggestion!
I’m disheartened to hear that the Clown seems to be only a single gene, albeit a nice one. After Ax gave their opinion on him, I sent a picture to a well trusted breeder who also said he didn’t believe him to be Vanilla. I’m concerned because I paid a good price for him, so I’m uncertain of how I should proceed contacting the person I purchased him from, or if I should at all? If he’s not Vanilla, I well overpaid for him. I genuinely believed he was as advertised, but now I wish I would have gotten more opinions before buying him. Hard lessons to learn, I suppose.
Thank you for your guys’ input, I really appreciate all of you replying to this thread. You’ve helped me a lot!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
jo_boyer, on the Tapatalk app you just hit the “New Topic” button in the top right hand corner. I’m not sure how you do so on the website itself, but the app is very useful, especially in sharing photos. You may looking into using it!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiss 'n Vinegar
I’m disheartened to hear that the Clown seems to be only a single gene, albeit a nice one. After Ax gave their opinion on him, I sent a picture to a well trusted breeder who also said he didn’t believe him to be Vanilla. I’m concerned because I paid a good price for him, so I’m uncertain of how I should proceed contacting the person I purchased him from, or if I should at all? If he’s not Vanilla, I well overpaid for him. I genuinely believed he was as advertised, but now I wish I would have gotten more opinions before buying him. Hard lessons to learn, I suppose.
the only way to guarantee he has Vanilla is if he came from a Super Vanilla Clown or Super Vanilla het Clown. the breeder can also guarantee that as part of their policy (like how they may guarantee other things like live arrival, health and sex) and if they did, u could hold them to it if he doesn't prove out. butt can u wait that long? do u want to try? how many times? maybe the breeder has a time limit of their sales and guarantee. maybe they might not be in business by the time u hatch some eggs. just know that u may hurt their ego and/or u may have to return the Clown boy as a possibility. or maybe u can work something else out. i don't have the best advice on this and these are just my rambling thoughts.
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiss 'n Vinegar
Thank you, rufretic! She is a beautiful girl and I’m excited to see what her offspring will look like when I’m able to breed her. So far it seems she’s just a cool Dinker project, but I’m very happy with that.
I don’t think her morph is Special, since she’s so dark and her pattern doesn’t match up, but that was a good idea to look into, AbsoluteApril. Thank you for the suggestion!
I’m disheartened to hear that the Clown seems to be only a single gene, albeit a nice one. After Ax gave their opinion on him, I sent a picture to a well trusted breeder who also said he didn’t believe him to be Vanilla. I’m concerned because I paid a good price for him, so I’m uncertain of how I should proceed contacting the person I purchased him from, or if I should at all? If he’s not Vanilla, I well overpaid for him. I genuinely believed he was as advertised, but now I wish I would have gotten more opinions before buying him. Hard lessons to learn, I suppose.
Thank you for your guys’ input, I really appreciate all of you replying to this thread. You’ve helped me a lot!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'll give you my opinion at least. This is a tough situation because imo, the breeder did nothing wrong, as long as you recieved the animal that you paid for, vanilla is a visual morph so if you looked at the animal, liked what you saw and agreed to pay for it, then it's a fair price if the animal has the vanilla or not. All a breeder can do is make their best judgment. They have the parents and siblings to make that judgment. Without having the siblings side by side I would not say it's a sure thing to be just clown and even with that comparison with some morphs it's just a judgement call. For example, my clown hatchlings were brighter than yours when they hatched but now after a year they have darkened so now they are darker than yours, depending on yours age, could that be an vanilla identifier or is yours just a brighter clown? Hard to say.
So imo you should trust the breeder rather than people online and don't buy something unless you trust your breeder and like what you see. I don't think there is any action to be taken now other than to breed him and prove it out or just be happy with a beautiful animal.
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
You guys both give solid advice, thank you. I’m not really certain what approach I’ll take, but I’ll check to see if the breeder guarantees the genetics either way. I absolutely see the validity behind your points, rufretic. It is a visual morph and I did have ample time to examine the photos of him before I made the purchase. So I can agree with why you’d think the price is fair regardless if he proves Vanilla or not. But in the same breath, I did trust the breeder to properly advertise the animals that were for sale, and if he doesn’t prove out to be what he was sold as, I didn’t really get what I paid for either. Which was more than I would have paid for a single gene Clown otherwise.
I suppose this is one of the downfalls to breeding; the uncertainty of the morphs the offspring actually carry. I’m certain the breeder had the best of intentions, and it’s also possible the snake I purchased actually is a Vanilla as claimed- possibly a lower expression one.
I’ll likely just end up breeding him to prove him out without contacting the breeder. I had plans for him, so I really hope he is what I bought him as. Though the person I got a second opinion from immediately said he did not believe him to be anything special, and that’s coming from a breeder who is very well established. We shall see.
I didn’t expect this thread to turn out as it has, but live and learn, I suppose haha! Thank you again Ax and rufretic! You are a tremendous help.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
I'd be the first to admit that I'm NOT good at morph id but the white lower markings of the dark one made me thing of a low white calico. Please don't laugh at me, Is that even a possibility? :)
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
I’ve never considered Calico before! I’m honestly so focused on her darker color, I don’t much think of her white sides. I’ll have to try and compare her to some Calicos and see if she matches any [emoji4]
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Re: Help With Morph Identification
Sorry I realize this is an older thread but I stumbled across it and I believe I have the clutch mate to your het clown you are trying to figure out. This is my male which I purchased as a female but things happen When I purchased I was told het clown but he thinks hidden gene woma and possible leopard https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...5422d72b75.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...f23acce42f.jpg
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
|