First time owner - How is my setup?

Hey everyone, I'd like to start off by saying I have zero experience with ball pythons (all snakes, really), but I am fascinated and eager to learn. I tend to go a bit over the top with things that interest me. As an example, I have been researching ball pythons for about a month now - reading as much as I can on forums, watching videos, talking to owners, and visiting my local reptile stores. There is an expo in Denver next month and I'd like to pick up my first snake. I want to ensure that I have everything I need and enough knowledge to give the snake proper husbandry. I am going to list my equipment and give some of my thoughts as well as list some questions/concerns that I have regarding each. Before you all castrate me and burn me at the stake, I have done the research and I understand many of these concerns have been addressed numerous times. I would like a second opinion given my specific situation as well as a single repository, if you will, of information applicable to me. Many thanks in advance.

Enclosure: Animal Plastics T8 (4 x 2 x 1), sliding glass door w/ lock, divider, pre-installed white LEDs

I wanted the T10, but shipping would have been almost x3 longer. Personally, I think the T10 would look better on display with the extra height. I am impatient - won't deny it. It seems *most* people recommend the T8 or similarly sized plastic enclosure for BPs. From what I understand, the plastic enclosures are much better for holding in necessary heat and humidity. Speaking of heat, I am opting to go for a single heat source, a radiant heat panel from Pro-Products. Bob over at Pro-Products is recommending the appropriate size RHP based on the questionnaire so I feel confident that this aspect of the setup is good to go. How many of you are just using an RHP? There seems to be a big debate on whether or not a second heat source is required such as an UTH. A UTH under the hide on the hot side of the tank is mainly to aid in digestion? A major argument I've come across that supports the idea of skipping the UTH is that they are not efficient enough to heat through various substrate - people are often having to "crank up" the heat in which case could do a lot of harm to the snake if he/she decides to burrow. I'd like to get some opinions on this. The snake will be small when I get it so I've opted for the cage divider. I can remove the divider as the snake gets larger to accommodate it or, if I fall in love with them, get a second snake for the other side. If I decided to house two snakes in the T8, I would purchase two smaller RHPs and mount them in the middle of the tank in order to still be able to provide a temperature gradient. Bob over at Pro-Products said this is a viable option that people tend to do. What are your thoughts? Is the enclosure large enough to support two BPs or is it necessary to purchase an additional T8?

RHP: Pro-Products (waiting on Bob's recommendation for size/wattage)
UTH: In case I do want/need to add this heat source, what would you recommend and why?
Temp gun: I'll pick up one of the highly recommended models most snake owners use to measure a proper temperature gradient.

Thermostat: Herpstat 4

Pricey, but in the event I want to get a second BP, I think this is a smart choice. For a single BP, I plan on controlling the RHP, humidity, and lights. I would still have the option to control a second heat source as well. Has anyone used the humidity probe on the Herpstat? This was one thing I didn't find a lot of info on. Would it be better to just purchase a standalone AcuRite hygrometer? I live in Colorado and humidity is pretty low, but I don't think I'd use a misting system. I'd rely on the radiant heat and a water bowl, spraying the substrate, as needed, to accomplish acceptable humidity levels.

Substrate: I think I am going to go with some type of coconut substrate. I'd get the larger stuff so the smaller snake has less of a chance of digesting it. With my low levels of humidity, I am thinking this is my best option to aid in increasing humidity. Can anyone chime in here and recommend something else or let me know if my logic is somewhat correct in selecting this substrate?

Hides: I want two identical hides, one on the hot side of the enclosure and one of the cool side of the enclosure. No open log type stuff; snake will feel more secure in something that is closed all around and is just large enough to comfortably fit inside. Seems like a lot of people get some dollar store bowls and cut out a small hole for the snake it enter/exit. I'm not much of a DIYer and I don't mind spending the money on something professional. With that being said, can anyone recommend a hide?

General decor: A lot of BP owners that I know and have talked to don't really keep anything inside their enclosures. Some substrate and a couple of hides. Why? I want my enclosure to be a good show piece but also simulate a somewhat natural environment. These snakes are generally shy so having a larger enclosure is not typically recommended unless there is plenty of coverage for the snake to hide and feel secure, right? So why not add some plants, sticks, decor, etc? Is this to minimize cleaning efforts? Just personal opinion? Your thoughts are welcome on this subject.

I know this is a lot of information. I just want to make sure I am able to provide my snake with the best possible environment. I understand this is a long term commitment and I want to start off on the right foot. Please understand I am asking these questions for the betterment of the snake. Okay, no go ahead and roast me lol.

Just my opinions based on what has worked for me.

I use only RHPs, and I buy them from Pro-Products, as they are the best. No secondary heat sources for me. I tried that when I was first starting out and found that the UTH was a total waste. It never went on as the RHP supplied all the heat needed.

Its smart going with the divided T8. I have a divided PVC enclosure heated with RHPs now and it works fantastic.

ISSUE: It's great that you're thinking ahead about that second snake and that you can just place them into the other half. Now, this could work, but you will be breaking quarantine by doing so. After a thermostat, quarantine is probably the second most important rule. You don't want to learn the hard way.

A divided T8 with sliding glass shares plenty of gas exchange with both sides. Any airborne illness or mite will easily pass from one side to the other. That plus every time you slide the glass, it will slide into the space of the other half, creating another avenue for contamination.

It sounds like you're ready to hit the ground running with your first snake. You don't want to get a second animal several months down the road and find that you've created, ah, unpleasantness for your first animal, with whom you've bonded. I've had a bad experience and can tell you that there are unscrupulous people in this hobby that will knowingly sell you a sick animal. Not many, but it only takes one.

That's one thing I'll point out. I'm interested to hear what the rest of the community has to say.

Thank you for the information. I completely overlooked the need for proper quarantine. I wouldn't get a second ball python until I am competent and comfortable enough to manage a second snake so hopefully that is some knowledge I would have gained between now and then. Would you say it would be a better idea to have two separate hinged doors that come down instead of a sliding glass door when using the T8 to house two snakes? I did a little reading on the mite problem - how to spot them and whatnot. Is this generally an issue when perusing a reptile expo? I could see this being a problem at some of the bigger pet stores that don't really have experienced personnel taking care of the snakes, but I would hope an actual breeder would not have this problem. Thanks again for the info!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tptad

I did a little reading on the mite problem - how to spot them and whatnot. Is this generally an issue when perusing a reptile expo? I could see this being a problem at some of the bigger pet stores that don't really have experienced personnel taking care of the snakes, but I would hope an actual breeder would not have this problem.

---

Mites can be an issue at expos. I don't think the problem is so much the breeders as the re-sellers, but I really shouldn't speculate.

I think there is less of an issue with separate hinged doors. But, to be perfectly frank, newly acquired animals should be kept in different rooms altogether or at least far apart. With only two snakes, it's less of a concern, especially if you buy them both from the same breeder. Make your own call.

I say stick with the divided T8. You want a hatchling? Well the divided T8 will serve you life long. You can start in just the half. When ready you can move them up to the full. Plus a divided enclosure will give you flexibility in the future.

Since nobody else has chimed in, substrate. Expect to need to experiment with this before you pick up your first noodle. PVC enclosures hold humidity really well. I use aspen and find that I can regulate humidity with water bowl placement. I tried coconut (Eco-Earth) and Forrest floor, but it was WAY too humid. Within hours it was practically raining inside the enclosure. For a few days, during a shed cycle, that'd be great. But everyday? No, you'd be asking for an RI or scale rot. But you may find things are different in your area. Try different ones for a few days before hand and see what works.

If the point of the divider is to house two snakes that’s not going to work with the rhp as the sole heat source. I don’t think a 2 ft wide enclosure will give enough space for a proper gradient.

I house my single yearling ball python in a T10 with a pro product rhp as the only heat source. I have the herpstat set to 88 with the probe dangling under the rhp. The thermometer near the hide reads 88-90 degrees and the cool end reads 78-80 degrees. This time of year my humidity naturally sits around 50% under the rhp and about 65% on the cool end without misting.

Your set up sounds very similar to mine including the use of a herpstat 4. I’d recommend one snake to the T8 and get another to stack on top if you want an additional snake.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jmarshall

If the point of the divider is to house two snakes that’s not going to work with the rhp as the sole heat source. I don’t think a 2 ft wide enclosure will give enough space for a proper gradient.

---

Pro-Products sells appropriately sized RHPs for a 2x2. They're 50w and are 12x10 (or so, I might be a bit off). I'm using one now for my boa and the gradient is perfect. 90 directly under and 77 at the edges of the cool side.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JRLongton

Pro-Products sells appropriately sized RHPs for a 2x2. They're 50w and are 12x10 (or so, I might be a bit off). I'm using one now for my boa and the gradient is perfect. 90 directly under and 77 at the edges of the cool side.

---

But if you removed the divider at a later time as the snake grew would it output enough power to keep proper temps?

And I know they make rhps in different sizes.. good to know a 2 foot length would be big enough for a proper gradient. I assumed it would be too small considering the temps In my 4 ft enclosure are perfect.

Edit: typos


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, you would need a new RHP for the full T8. A 50w would never do it.

So you're right, there is that drawback. It's good you pointed that out as I over looked it.

In my dealings with Bob at Pro-Products, the guy really knows his stuff. You tell him what you want to heat and to what temp, and he has the exact thing you need.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JRLongton

Yeah, you would need a new RHP for the full T8. A 50w would never do it.

So you're right, there is that drawback. It's good you pointed that out as I over looked it.

In my dealings with Bob at Pro-Products, the guy really knows his stuff. You tell him what you want to heat and to what temp, and he has the exact thing you need.

---

Yeah, I had the exact same experience with him. I definitely recommend his products with full confidence. He makes it so easy! Stand up guy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JRLongton

I say stick with the divided T8. You want a hatchling? Well the divided T8 will serve you life long. You can start in just the half. When ready you can move them up to the full. Plus a divided enclosure will give you flexibility in the future.

Since nobody else has chimed in, substrate. Expect to need to experiment with this before you pick up your first noodle. PVC enclosures hold humidity really well. I use aspen and find that I can regulate humidity with water bowl placement. I tried coconut (Eco-Earth) and Forrest floor, but it was WAY too humid. Within hours it was practically raining inside the enclosure. For a few days, during a shed cycle, that'd be great. But everyday? No, you'd be asking for an RI or scale rot. But you may find things are different in your area. Try different ones for a few days before hand and see what works.

---

I'd like to start with a hatchling. I feel like the T8 is too large for a hatchling so that's why I opted for the divider. The plan is to house the adult snake in a full T8 or similarly sized enclosure (perhaps with more height).

Good point about needing to experiment with different substrates. I'll see what the general consensus is locally - we'll share the need for similar adjustments based on local conditions. A co-worker of mine uses aspen, but she says she has to change it out a lot because it gets moldy. She has to spray it a lot to keep up the humidity. I should also note that she is using a fish aquarium with a screen top and a moist towel covering about 80% of the mesh. Due to this setup, she likely has to wet the substrate more frequently than in a plastic enclosure. Have you personally experienced any issues like this when using aspen? Humidity inside my home is usually around 15-20% in the colder months and anywhere from 25-50% in the warmer months. It may be necessary for me to use a substrate that can easily boost my humidity levels inside the enclosure. Hopefully someone from Colorado can chime in!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tptad

I'd like to start with a hatchling. I feel like the T8 is too large for a hatchling so that's why I opted for the divider. The plan is to house the adult snake in a full T8 or similarly sized enclosure (perhaps with more height).

Good point about needing to experiment with different substrates. I'll see what the general consensus is locally - we'll share the need for similar adjustments based on local conditions. A co-worker of mine uses aspen, but she says she has to change it out a lot because it gets moldy. She has to spray it a lot to keep up the humidity. I should also note that she is using a fish aquarium with a screen top and a moist towel covering about 80% of the mesh. Due to this setup, she likely has to wet the substrate more frequently than in a plastic enclosure. Have you personally experienced any issues like this when using aspen? Humidity inside my home is usually around 15-20% in the colder months and anywhere from 25-50% in the warmer months. It may be necessary for me to use a substrate that can easily boost my humidity levels inside the enclosure. Hopefully someone from Colorado can chime in!

---

Just an idea.. when I got my guy as a hatchling, I set him up in a temporary tub that worked extremely well until he was of size. I’ve also heard of individuals using larger enclosures for younger snakes as long as they are cluttered, lots of cover, lots of hides. Essentially you don’t want any wide open spaces for a young snake as that will stress them. From research that I’ve done, as long as you have plenty to break up their lines of sight they should be good in a larger enclosure. I think I moved my BP to his T10 at around 6 months old and just made sure to have lots and lots of fake plants, hides etc. as he’s grown I’ve removed some of it. Now he has two hides a couple logs and some fake ivy to crawl through. For what it’s worth, he’s never missed a meal outside of shedding since moving into the T10.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I hear that most dry-climate folks prefer coco fiber (eco earth, reptile prime, etc.), coco chips (like reptichip), or a mix of both or one or the other with sphagnum moss.

All of those take misting just fine and would take a lot to mold, unlike aspen. It will be something to experiment with, buy 2 or 3 possible options in small bags and set up the cage for a few weeks before getting the snake. Try out each one for a week or so and see how it performs.

In your climate, I'd advise against aspen.. I could get away with it in mine, but I have quite a few aquariums in the house that boost my household humidity higher than most in my area have it and makes it less necessary. I just use fully dry coco products for the aesthetic rather than for humidity.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jmarshall

If the point of the divider is to house two snakes that’s not going to work with the rhp as the sole heat source. I don’t think a 2 ft wide enclosure will give enough space for a proper gradient.

I house my single yearling ball python in a T10 with a pro product rhp as the only heat source. I have the herpstat set to 88 with the probe dangling under the rhp. The thermometer near the hide reads 88-90 degrees and the cool end reads 78-80 degrees. This time of year my humidity naturally sits around 50% under the rhp and about 65% on the cool end without misting.

Your set up sounds very similar to mine including the use of a herpstat 4. I’d recommend one snake to the T8 and get another to stack on top if you want an additional snake.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

---

Thanks for the reply. The real point of the divider is to provide a smaller space to make the smaller snake feel more secure. For a full-sized BP I plan on having at least a T8-sized enclosure (per snake). I was just toying around with the idea of housing two smaller snakes in the divided T8 and then purchasing an additional enclosure, when needed, to house both snakes comfortably. Honestly, I have no current plans to purchase an additional snake because I am so inexperienced and don't feel like I am fit to care for more than one. Although I am gathering as much knowledge as I can beforehand, this is still a trial run for me.

In regards to the temperature gradient, do you think I will have an issue trying to provide the proper gradient on one side of the enclosure using a smaller RHP? I think that is what you are saying, but let me try to clarify by asking another question. Do you think I need to utilize the entire T8 from the beginning to provide the proper temp gradient?

Do you feel the additional 3 inches in height makes a big difference? Aesthetically? Ease of cleaning?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tptad

Have you personally experienced any issues like this when using aspen? Humidity inside my home is usually around 15-20% in the colder months and anywhere from 25-50% in the warmer months. It may be necessary for me to use a substrate that can easily boost my humidity levels inside the enclosure. Hopefully someone from Colorado can chime in!

---

I've had no issues with aspen, but am always open to new things. I'm actually getting another RHP in the coming days that I'll use in the vacant side of my divided enclosure. The plan is to experiment with all kinds of substrates and mixes to see what results I get.

25-50% in Summer. That's my Winter range. Yeah, take what I say on substrate with a grain of salt...

Oh, you might want to get a couple of these also: https://www.amazon.com/AcuRite-Humid...gateway&sr=8-1

I have two in each of my enclosures.

I have a T8 and ventilation is a problem unless you drill extra holes. And substrate like coco fiber and cypress mulch will give you lots of humidity, like dripping wet on the hides and things. Some keepers don't mind because the humidity will go down but it will take several days, or longer, due to lack of holes for ventilation. Scale rot occurs with bacterial growth on wet substrate and feces/urine which can take awhile to accumulate so spot cleaning daily helps prevent it. Imo fungi is the bigger threat but that too depends on what you have inside the enclosure to allow such growth. Personally, I prefer a dry tank over a wet one so I used aspen with a large water bowl. It is whatever that works for you and your snake.

When you are picking out your snake, make sure to ask if it ate, what type of prey, live or f/t, when it last ate, how many times and when it was last shed. There are breeders out there selling babies that had not eaten yet so while they may eat, it is better to avoid them as a beginner. Those who already have the experience working with picky eaters are more suitable for snakes like that.

Check for any mucous around the nose and mouth. Feel for any bumps from head to the tip of the tail. It would be loud around you but try to listen for any clicking or odd noises as it breathes.

A good seller is someone who would spend the time answering your questions or even offer additional info without asking. If he or she is getting impatient with you because you want to know when it last ate, skip that vendor. If they don't know something and they are not the breeder, they should be transparent about it and tell you that they don't know. Try to avoid the third party suppliers who are more concerned about making a sale. If something sounds too good to be true (Ie Really low price for a usually expensive morph), it probably is.

I had a great experience with Dynasty Reptiles if you come across them at the expo.

Be patient. Don't appear desperate or impatient. Take your time to pick out a healthy snake from a good breeder. If you don't feel comfortable who you are buying it from, skip them. While one can still buy from them and still do just fine, you want your first experience to be a great one, not one to start with worries and potential problems.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JRLongton

Pro-Products sells appropriately sized RHPs for a 2x2. They're 50w and are 12x10 (or so, I might be a bit off). I'm using one now for my boa and the gradient is perfect. 90 directly under and 77 at the edges of the cool side.

---

I am still waiting to hear back from Bob as to what size he recommends. I asked him to recommend the size for heating the divided T8 as well as the size for heating the full enclosure once the divider is removed. He had additional questions for me. I provided the information yesterday morning so I am hoping to hear back sometime today. Some folks have mentioned that it does take a while to receive the RHPs from Pro-Products. Can anyone comment on the length of time it took to receive theirs?

I didn't want to have to wait longer than necessary to receive the T8 from Animal Plastics so I didn't choose the option to have my Pro-Products RHP shipped to them for installation. Is the necessary modifications pretty simple to mount one of these things? If anyone could post a picture of the mods needed for it that would be great! Maybe I am just overthinking it? Thanks!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tptad

I am still waiting to hear back from Bob as to what size he recommends. I asked him to recommend the size for heating the divided T8 as well as the size for heating the full enclosure once the divider is removed. He had additional questions for me. I provided the information yesterday morning so I am hoping to hear back sometime today. Some folks have mentioned that it does take a while to receive the RHPs from Pro-Products. Can anyone comment on the length of time it took to receive theirs?

I didn't want to have to wait longer than necessary to receive the T8 from Animal Plastics so I didn't choose the option to have my Pro-Products RHP shipped to them for installation. Is the necessary modifications pretty simple to mount one of these things? If anyone could post a picture of the mods needed for it that would be great! Maybe I am just overthinking it? Thanks!

---

Honestly, what I would do is get a hold of Bob and explain exactly what you want to do with the enclosure (heat half with rhp, remove divider and heat the whole thing) and follow his advice. My experience is limited and I would hate to give you wrong information. I’m more or less just providing you some things to think about. Bob may have a rhp perfect for your need.

I can’t comment on how long the rhp took to be delivered as I placed my order for AP to install when they were done w T10. I got mine several months later.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jmarshall

Just an idea.. when I got my guy as a hatchling, I set him up in a temporary tub that worked extremely well until he was of size. I’ve also heard of individuals using larger enclosures for younger snakes as long as they are cluttered, lots of cover, lots of hides. Essentially you don’t want any wide open spaces for a young snake as that will stress them. From research that I’ve done, as long as you have plenty to break up their lines of sight they should be good in a larger enclosure. I think I moved my BP to his T10 at around 6 months old and just made sure to have lots and lots of fake plants, hides etc. as he’s grown I’ve removed some of it. Now he has two hides a couple logs and some fake ivy to crawl through. For what it’s worth, he’s never missed a meal outside of shedding since moving into the T10.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

---

This recommendation does come a lot! I am trying to future-proof my build as much as possible. If using a modified Sterlite tub/bin I'd have to provide a different heating source and such. I feel more comfortable just setting up the T8 and providing enough cover. If this becomes a huge passion of mine I'll purchase a rack system (which is pretty similar to just using a tub, right?) that can accommodate a lot of snakes. How did you provide the proper husbandry for your hatchling when using the tub? Perhaps I am just ignorant and perhaps this is a route that I would want to consider. Thanks!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pretends2bnormal

I hear that most dry-climate folks prefer coco fiber (eco earth, reptile prime, etc.), coco chips (like reptichip), or a mix of both or one or the other with sphagnum moss.

All of those take misting just fine and would take a lot to mold, unlike aspen. It will be something to experiment with, buy 2 or 3 possible options in small bags and set up the cage for a few weeks before getting the snake. Try out each one for a week or so and see how it performs.

In your climate, I'd advise against aspen.. I could get away with it in mine, but I have quite a few aquariums in the house that boost my household humidity higher than most in my area have it and makes it less necessary. I just use fully dry coco products for the aesthetic rather than for humidity.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

---

Thanks! I do have a co-worker that has expressed the mold concern so I think I will stay away from this substrate when experimenting. I also like the aesthetics of the coconut stuff! This is what I'll likely start with.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tptad

This recommendation does come a lot! I am trying to future-proof my build as much as possible. If using a modified Sterlite tub/bin I'd have to provide a different heating source and such. I feel more comfortable just setting up the T8 and providing enough cover. If this becomes a huge passion of mine I'll purchase a rack system (which is pretty similar to just using a tub, right?) that can accommodate a lot of snakes. How did you provide the proper husbandry for your hatchling when using the tub? Perhaps I am just ignorant and perhaps this is a route that I would want to consider. Thanks!

---

Super simple.. just a “shoebox” sized tub, a hide, some tiny fake plants for enrichment, heat tape and thermostat. It’s pretty cheap to set up.. the only thing I’ve seen people struggle with is ambient temps. I kept him in my closet with a space heater set to 80 degrees (on a thermostat).


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tptad

This recommendation does come a lot! I am trying to future-proof my build as much as possible. If using a modified Sterlite tub/bin I'd have to provide a different heating source and such. I feel more comfortable just setting up the T8 and providing enough cover. If this becomes a huge passion of mine I'll purchase a rack system (which is pretty similar to just using a tub, right?) that can accommodate a lot of snakes. How did you provide the proper husbandry for your hatchling when using the tub? Perhaps I am just ignorant and perhaps this is a route that I would want to consider. Thanks!

---

Here is another thought. You can always place a smaller tub enclosure inside an un-divided T8, use the full sized RHP, and just place the tub where it gets an appropriate gradient. (Obviously some experimenting needed)

For ventilation I'd leave the doors open/removed on the PVC while using the inner tub, but this will give you time to see how ready of an eater your snake is and let you get a feel for if he would be more or less comfortable in the full cage. (Some are just very shy and this will be closer to what it is used to to gradually acclimate the snake to a new environment) A 28qt sized tub would be a good middle ground so he gets a bigger space, but not huge. And would save you from possibly needing 2 RHPs or buying different heat stuff for a stand alone tub.

This may only be needed for a few months and would be cheap. The RHP would do a good job heating it and save you from having to spend extra on heat equipment.

I've done this with a new BP before to good success.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pretends2bnormal

Here is another thought. You can always place a smaller tub enclosure inside an un-divided T8, use the full sized RHP, and just place the tub where it gets an appropriate gradient. (Obviously some experimenting needed)

For ventilation I'd leave the doors open/removed on the PVC while using the inner tub, but this will give you time to see how ready of an eater your snake is and let you get a feel for if he would be more or less comfortable in the full cage. (Some are just very shy and this will be closer to what it is used to to gradually acclimate the snake to a new environmen) A 28qt sized tub would be a good middle ground si he gets a bigger space, but not huge. And would save you from possibly needing 2 RHPs or buying different heat stuff for a stand alone tub.

This may only be needed for a few months and would be cheap. The RHP would do a good job heating it and save you from having to spend extra on heat equipment.

I've done this with a new BP before to good success.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

---

Excellent idea


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pretends2bnormal

Here is another thought. You can always place a smaller tub enclosure inside an un-divided T8, use the full sized RHP, and just place the tub where it gets an appropriate gradient. (Obviously some experimenting needed) ...

This may only be needed for a few months and would be cheap. The RHP would do a good job heating it and save you from having to spend extra on heat equipment.

I've done this with a new BP before to good success.

---

Now that is a great idea! I may steal that one myself.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JRLongton

I've had no issues with aspen, but am always open to new things. I'm actually getting another RHP in the coming days that I'll use in the vacant side of my divided enclosure. The plan is to experiment with all kinds of substrates and mixes to see what results I get.

25-50% in Summer. That's my Winter range. Yeah, take what I say on substrate with a grain of salt...

Oh, you might want to get a couple of these also: https://www.amazon.com/AcuRite-Humid...gateway&sr=8-1

I have two in each of my enclosures.

---

It is super dry here. I've only lived here about a year and a half (moved from Alabama - what a difference!). I moved here in the middle of winter and couldn't figure out why my nose would bleed a lot at night and why seemingly impossible things around the house were shocking me. I purchased the same hygrometer you linked and found out it was due to the super low humidity. Purchased a portable humidifier and it made a world of difference! My snake enclosure will more than likely be kept in my bedroom as it'll receive virtually no traffic except in the mornings when getting ready for work and at night before going to bed. If low humidity is still an issue even with appropriate enclosure / substrate / misting /etc. I do have a sufficiently sized humidifier more than capable of manipulating the humidity of the room. Thanks for recommending the product! I'll have to pick up two more so I can use two and have one as a spare.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JRLongton

Now that is a great idea! I may steal that one myself.

---

My initial use of it was to just get the first 3 meals down for my 2nd BP & first baby, then have it and the cage set up with the lid off so he could choose to move to the bigger space or not as he preferred. But it was a 80g BP and a 30"×16" cage, so it wasn't as big of a space and he was a very confident little noodle.

For a full T8, I'd probably wait till the snake is 250-300g at least before opening up a 28qt to the full cage option or is clearly confident & a strong feeder if desired before that.

Side benefit is that the opaque walls on 5 sides, even if outside the tub, help with security compared to a stand alone tub since they can't see looming predators or people walking by except on 1 side.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tptad

I didn't want to have to wait longer than necessary to receive the T8 from Animal Plastics so I didn't choose the option to have my Pro-Products RHP shipped to them for installation. Is the necessary modifications pretty simple to mount one of these things? If anyone could post a picture of the mods needed for it that would be great! Maybe I am just overthinking it? Thanks!

---

In my experience, the RHP will arrive from Pro-Products LONG, LONG, before they even begin to process the order at AP. Lots of people like AP here, so I'll keep silent on the issue, but I don't buy from them anymore for just that reason.

As for installing the RHP yourself, it's easy a pie. Just two screws is all it takes. You can use self tapping screws and go directly into the PVC if you want. Or, if you're at least a little handy and have the tools, you can measure out and drill two holes and install blind nuts. Then run a pair of machine screws through the holes already provided in the RHP and thread them into the blind nuts. That's what they do at AP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JRLongton

In my experience, the RHP will arrive from Pro-Products LONG, LONG, before they even begin to process the order at AP. Lots of people like AP here, so I'll keep silent on the issue, but I don't buy from them anymore for just that reason.

As for installing the RHP yourself, it's easy a pie. Just two screws is all it takes. You can use self tapping screws and go directly into the PVC if you want. Or, if you're at least a little handy and have the tools, you can measure out and drill two holes and install blind nuts. Then run a pair of machine screws through the holes already provided in the RHP and thread them into the blind nuts. That's what they do at AP.

---

I know turn around time on APs is out of this world. I had read somewhere that they are opening a bigger shop (maybe?) which would cut down on production time. Can’t remember where I read it tho.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pretends2bnormal

Here is another thought. You can always place a smaller tub enclosure inside an un-divided T8, use the full sized RHP, and just place the tub where it gets an appropriate gradient. (Obviously some experimenting needed)

For ventilation I'd leave the doors open/removed on the PVC while using the inner tub, but this will give you time to see how ready of an eater your snake is and let you get a feel for if he would be more or less comfortable in the full cage. (Some are just very shy and this will be closer to what it is used to to gradually acclimate the snake to a new environment) A 28qt sized tub would be a good middle ground so he gets a bigger space, but not huge. And would save you from possibly needing 2 RHPs or buying different heat stuff for a stand alone tub.

This may only be needed for a few months and would be cheap. The RHP would do a good job heating it and save you from having to spend extra on heat equipment.

I've done this with a new BP before to good success.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

---

this is brilliant!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cheesenugget

I have a T8 and ventilation is a problem unless you drill extra holes. And substrate like coco fiber and cypress mulch will give you lots of humidity, like dripping wet on the hides and things. Some keepers don't mind because the humidity will go down but it will take several days, or longer, due to lack of holes for ventilation. Scale rot occurs with bacterial growth on wet substrate and feces/urine which can take awhile to accumulate so spot cleaning daily helps prevent it. Imo fungi is the bigger threat but that too depends on what you have inside the enclosure to allow such growth. Personally, I prefer a dry tank over a wet one so I used aspen with a large water bowl. It is whatever that works for you and your snake.

When you are picking out your snake, make sure to ask if it ate, what type of prey, live or f/t, when it last ate, how many times and when it was last shed. There are breeders out there selling babies that had not eaten yet so while they may eat, it is better to avoid them as a beginner. Those who already have the experience working with picky eaters are more suitable for snakes like that.

Check for any mucous around the nose and mouth. Feel for any bumps from head to the tip of the tail. It would be loud around you but try to listen for any clicking or odd noises as it breathes.

A good seller is someone who would spend the time answering your questions or even offer additional info without asking. If he or she is getting impatient with you because you want to know when it last ate, skip that vendor. If they don't know something and they are not the breeder, they should be transparent about it and tell you that they don't know. Try to avoid the third party suppliers who are more concerned about making a sale. If something sounds too good to be true (Ie Really low price for a usually expensive morph), it probably is.

I had a great experience with Dynasty Reptiles if you come across them at the expo.

Be patient. Don't appear desperate or impatient. Take your time to pick out a healthy snake from a good breeder. If you don't feel comfortable who you are buying it from, skip them. While one can still buy from them and still do just fine, you want your first experience to be a great one, not one to start with worries and potential problems.

---

It is sooo dry here I am not anticipating excess humidity being a problem. Drilling extra holes, if needed, isn't outside of my comfort zone. May I ask how many holes you drilled and where?

I appreciate all of the helpful information for the expo. I have a list of questions I have written out to make sure I am asking the right ones. If I don't walk away with a snake during the expo, no biggie. I will show some reservation here to make sure I am making an informed (rather than impulsive) buy. I am still learning about the many morphs that are available and still debating between a male or a female. I'm going with a friend of mine that has owned snakes for over 10 years so I am counting on her helping me out with directing me to the right vendors/breeders and to ensure I am asking all the right questions.

Speaking of morphs and prices. I've noticed that there is a pretty big discrepancy between pricing from vendor-to-vendor and breeder-to-breeder. I'm assuming this is normal? Supply and demand in different areas, reputation, things like that affecting price?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tptad

Speaking of morphs and prices. I've noticed that there is a pretty big discrepancy between pricing from vendor-to-vendor and breeder-to-breeder. I'm assuming this is normal? Supply and demand in different areas, reputation, things like that affecting price?

---

Quality of the animal and the gene expression plays into price as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jmarshall

I know turn around time on APs is out of this world. I had read somewhere that they are opening a bigger shop (maybe?) which would cut down on production time. Can’t remember where I read it tho.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

---

Yeah. For anything other than the Quick Ship items (basically just the T8) shipping times are extending passed the 3 month range. The quick ship items are supposed to be ready in about 21 days, although not guaranteed. I called to inquire about expected wait times and I was told they are currently pretty backed up even these items are taking about a month to process. It's not the end of the world. These enclosures are highly recommended and I could honestly use the extra time to research instead of just going out and buying a snake right away. The long wait times are actually good for someone like me!

There is a local guy in Castle Rock, Colorado that makes/sells ABS enclosures. Jungle Cages if anyone is interested. His turnaround is 10 days and a lot of people around here recommend him over AP essentially because of the super quick turnaround. He doesn't ship or deliver so you do have to pick up the full size item. A co-worker is purchasing a 5 x 2 x 3 enclosure with stand for her boa so I am curious to see how both enclosures compare.

Yeah, "quick ship". The last "quick ship" T8 I bought took 4 months to arrive. Last T8 I'll ever buy. It's just way too much money to pay up front and then not be told when to expect the product.

AP's enclosures do come highly recommended, but there are others that are just as good if not better.

Don't take my word for it though. Take your time, ask questions, and get other impressions. That way you can make the best choice for you.