Feeling Disssresspected.

I have recently left a group on Facebook due to thier disrespectful behaviour in regards to my BPs Home.. They first tell me that i should lose the red light i use cause it stresses them out and they want me to replace it with a CHE light. Even though every image i see of thier BPs they have a light on, how she shouldn't be in a 36 gallon tank cause it is way to big for her, which she is jus bought that length of it an they want me to put her in a 10 gallon tank with alot of cluster filling the tank, get a controlled heat pad even though the one I have is like a little square one that you get in those starter kits of them.. She has been doing absolutely fine for the past 5 years I've had her, she eats fine, gets drinks, I have aspen bedding which again they say i shouldnt use cause it doesn't hold humidity, and i have alittle cactus in tjier to help her when she starts shedding to help her out, its not a live one of course, an they went on to joke about that an jus called her living home a Death Box... Sorry to rant like this, but it was just upsetting

I don't like facebook but I don't think many here are going to agree much with your husbandry either. They may be a little more polite. An unregulated heat source is just an accident waiting to happen.

Not sure if I should respond.

Its jus the way that they presented themselves about the information, calling it a death box and wanting people to reply to thier care sheet they have versus actually trying to kindly help, they say no red or blue lights cause any light stresses them, I should get the smaller tank an jus fill it completely with cludder to the point where I can't even see her, an im jus worried that if i try to do a drastic change like that, then that adjustment could stress her out. i dont know, maybe im jus overthinking it.

First it would help a bit if you gave us some details, and hopefully we can lead you in the right direction. I’ve used red lights for years, but unregulated heat source is a big No No. Like I stated, tell us more, and we’ll be glad to help.

You likely have some things that could use improvement from what you describe (particularly if you have unregulated heat sources.. we see too many burns on here for any of us to be comfortable with not suggesting at least using a thermostat for them), but it sounds like they were being jerks about explaining and pushing things that don't make a lot of sense.

Also, if this snake is 5 years old... why on earth do they want you to use a 10 gallon?... that seems very weird to me. Most groups with rigid views like that seem to want people using the biggest possible tanks ASAP. (Which I also don't agree with as a general suggestion.. some snakes are too nervous/shy for that as juvies)

The only issue with red bulbs is if they're on 24/7, as it can disrupt their sleep cycles and cause stress (which may make them refuse food), but if this is just daytime heat then I don't think it is a big issue.

Calling anything a "death box" is just cruel and rude. Even the worst enclosure (not meaning yours, just generally for advising others) should be approached kindly and calmly to explain the issues and what improvements can be made. If money is an issue, there are many "not perfect" but better than nothing fixes that can be done short term while saving up for the true fix. And being rude only ever makes people less inclined to take advice on any issues that may exist.

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for alittle more context, I only use the little heat pad for the winter seasons, living in Northern New York the season tends to get bad some years, the red light is on 24/7 an its been like that for about a year (with replacements of course) and whenever I bring her home a couple mice, she scoops them up with no hesitation lol. The tank size i dont think will be an issue for her cause once in a while in the later hours ill see her jus out an about, maybe even to get a drink as well, an the would either proceed to sit on her hideaway or go back under it.

All of this (besides the regulated heat source) depends on the health of the snake. If this snake, with the emphasis on this snake, is thriving in its environment then there is no need to change much. Thriving in this context means eating well, being of a good size for its age, and shedding well. By the "standard" though it is very likely there are humidity issues. It would be good to see a picture of the animal and its enclosure.

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Originally Posted by grovyle111

for alittle more context, I only use the little heat pad for the winter seasons, living in Northern New York the season tends to get bad some years, the red light is on 24/7 an its been like that for about a year (with replacements of course) and whenever I bring her home a couple mice, she scoops them up with no hesitation lol. The tank size i dont think will be an issue for her cause once in a while in the later hours ill see her jus out an about, maybe even to get a drink as well, an the would either proceed to sit on her hideaway or go back under it.

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Here begins my disagreement. All of my females over a year old are eating medium rats. That is a big difference from a couple of mice. How big is this animal?

give me a couple minutes and I shall upload a few images of the setup

Red lights are not an issue if used properly, but that’s my personal opinion. I have never had any issues what so ever using them. In fact when coupled with a proper dimmer, bulbs can literally last years. But I digress, it would be nice to see pictures to offer proper help.

I'm not really sure how to go about posting images via mobile but here's an attempt, they are on my profile gallery as well..
yea didn't work lol, I put URLs but they didn't upload..
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery//sh...mageuser=64869

https://ball-pythons.net/gallery//sh...mageuser=64869

I think I have the exact same ceramic hide in with my adult male clown. Based on that, I'd say you have a 3 foot snake or so. Can't guess grams as I'm an Imperial guy (ounces only!).

You need to 1: lose that cactus; 2 get a second hide on the cool side; and 3 get a smaller hide on the warm side. That ceramic one is too big for him. He'll feel more comfortable in something tighter.

You can get something at Walmart or even the dollar store. Any opaque plastic container (I use Tupperware) will work.

I have a log hide, now the people, (pardon but no other way to describe the people in that Facebook group) where saying that those can mold overtime an can be a home to mites, also I manually mist her everyday.

I am going to agree with others here that you have some husbandry issues. So did I when I began this journey. I am fairly new to the hobby, I have had my first BP almost a year. I have gotten some really good advice here, have taken it, and my snakes are thriving as a result. Here are some of the things I am seeing that could be a potential issue.

1. I think that the red light is ok, but a CHE would be better. It should be on a thermostat or dimmer

2. The heat pad HAS to have a thermostat.

3. What do your temps and humidity look like and how are you measuring them? Are you holding a basking spot of 88-90 and cool side ambient of 80 year round with just the red bulb? Is you humidity staying at 50-60%

4. An adult female definitely needs to be on bigger food. My girl is almost 400g and eating small rats at this point. I would think at 4 your snake would be minimum twice that size? If so 2 mice is not enough food. If that is all she has been getting all along she may not be growing as she should.

5. ETA: aspen bedding is ok, but I hove found it impossible to get the humidity up where I need it with aspen.

6. You need 2 smaller hides, one for the cool side and one for the hot side.

I appreciate all the helpful information and tips from you all. I plan on doing a checkup with her with my local expert in general as I've done every year now that it's finally warming up here in NY.. An i will do what i can to help improve the home an i shall give updates when i can

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Originally Posted by grovyle111

I have a log hide, now the people, (pardon but no other way to describe the people in that Facebook group) where saying that those can mold overtime an can be a home to mites, also I manually mist her everyday.

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This is true. Many things sold for the keeping of reptiles are sold because they "look" like a good idea, but in reality best case is they are just junk. Worst case they can hurt the animal. Stick on humidity gauges are one of the biggest offenders in that category.

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Originally Posted by grovyle111

I appreciate all the helpful information and tips from you all. I plan on doing a checkup with her with my local expert in general as I've done every year now that it's finally warming up here in NY.. An i will do what i can to help improve the home an i shall give updates when i can

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Please keep in mind that there are no experts. I have around 100 BPs and have been keeping reptiles for the majority of my life, but there are still things I don't know. The combined knowledge of the people on this board is very, very extensive. It is absolutely the best resource on ball pythons available however many of us long time keepers and breeders come here to discriminate knowledge because there is always something going on that has not been discussed.

I don't know about anything else since you do not post any details or pictures but that right here

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get a controlled heat pad even though the one I have is like a little square one that you get in those starter kits of them

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is a BIG issue, if your UTH is not controlled not matter what the size it MUST be even if you were lucky until now you will at some point run out of luck.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

I don't know about anything else since you do not post any details or pictures but that right here is a BIG issue, if your UTH is not controlled not matter what the size it MUST be even if you were lucky until now you will at some point run out of luck.

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I've used that same pad on her since I've had the tank, it's a very low heat output, like absolute bare minimum, she doesnt have any burns on her sides or belly at all.

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Originally Posted by grovyle111

I've used that same pad on her since I've had the tank, it's a very low heat output, like absolute bare minimum, she doesnt have any burns on her sides or belly at all.

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You have been very lucky. They can and do get too hot during normal operation and can short and when they do the get really hot very quickly. It is unsafe to have any kind of unregulated heat source for a reptile. That is the FIRST thing I learned when picking up the hobby. My advice to you is to spend the $30 for a jumpstart thermostat rather than risking hundreds in vet bills or worse, the life of your pet. It really is that serious. YOU NEED to get a thermostat and 2 digital thermometer/ hygrometers asap. The probe for the thermostat needs to go between the heat pad and glass. It needs to be set at 90. You need to place one thermometer/hygrometer on each side of the cage and monitor temps and humidity. 88-90 hot side and 80 cold side. 50-60 % humidity. If you aren't getting this, there are people on this forum that can help get you there.

I honestly don't mean to sound harsh, I am only trying to help. But things do need to change with your setup. There is a reason your snake is so small and it is improper husbandry. If it is not getting the right food and the correct temps to metabolize it, it will not grow appropriately. A female tht age should be well over 100g and longer than 3 feet. We all have to go through a learning process to do what is best for our pets.

Just because something has been that way for a long time and nothing "bad" happened doesn't meant it is safe or best for the animal.

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Originally Posted by grovyle111

I've used that same pad on her since I've had the tank, it's a very low heat output, like absolute bare minimum, she doesnt have any burns on her sides or belly at all.

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You are not going to get any support from people here with this line of thought. They have seen too many instances of badly burned animals. Heat pads fail. When they do they can burn a snake to the point of 100's of dollars in vet bills if not death. Ball pythons are stupid when it comes to heat. They do not act like a lizard who will move off of something that is too hot. If only cold options are available, they will cook themselves rather than be cold.

You can listen or not, but you are basically disagreeing with people who do know. Kind of like telling your mechanic how to fix your car when you don't even know how to change a tire.

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Originally Posted by grovyle111

I've used that same pad on her since I've had the tank, it's a very low heat output, like absolute bare minimum, she doesnt have any burns on her sides or belly at all.

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And this is what I hear all the time from people with animals that suffer thermal burns "but it's been like that for year or it's low wattage" :rolleyes:

You can listen or not listen, ultimately it's YOUR animal and that's also YOUR animal that will pay the price of having an uncontrolled heat source (not an if a when) and sadly thermal burns are preventable.

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Originally Posted by grovyle111

I've used that same pad on her since I've had the tank, it's a very low heat output, like absolute bare minimum, she doesnt have any burns on her sides or belly at all.

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I’m a little confused, I thought you came here to get help. I hate to say this but maybe some of your previous experiences have been of your own bringing. As mentioned the collective group of knowledge here is vast, along with many experienced keepers always willing to learn and share. There are many ways to successfully keep. At this point I’m starting to think your not open to what others tell you, but what you want to hear. Sorry, and sorry to the mods if I got outta line.

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

You are not going to get any support from people here with this line of thought. They have seen too many instances of badly burned animals. Heat pads fail. When they do they can burn a snake to the point of 100's of dollars in vet bills if not death. Ball pythons are stupid when it comes to heat. They do not act like a lizard who will move off of something that is too hot. If only cold options are available, they will cook themselves rather than be cold.

You can listen or not, but you are basically disagreeing with people who do know. Kind of like telling your mechanic how to fix your car when you don't even know how to change a tire.

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When I get off work, I think I'm going to make us a resource to link people to...

Grab all of my not in use heat mats/heat tape, plug them into a surge protector without any regulator, and video with a clock visible turning them on, then 5 minutes later reading surface temps with a temp gun. Maybe do a 2nd round where I stick them under piece of glass and read that surface... I've done it before for my own curiosity and the temps get absurdly high.

I have one of the zoomed 6"×8" mats, "40 gal" zoomed mat, and at least 1 ultratherm, plus a piece of 6" heat tape I can test.

Maybe seeing actual proof like that would help convince folks that we aren't saying this just because we want them to waste money on equipment that isn't actually needed.

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Originally Posted by Skyrivers

Not sure if I should respond.

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sky I seriously loled on this one!!

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Originally Posted by pretends2bnormal

When I get off work, I think I'm going to make us a resource to link people to...

Grab all of my not in use heat mats/heat tape, plug them into a surge protector without any regulator, and video with a clock visible turning them on, then 5 minutes later reading surface temps with a temp gun. Maybe do a 2nd round where I stick them under piece of glass and read that surface... I've done it before for my own curiosity and the temps get absurdly high.

I have one of the zoomed 6"×8" mats, "40 gal" zoomed mat, and at least 1 ultratherm, plus a piece of 6" heat tape I can test.

Maybe seeing actual proof like that would help convince folks that we aren't saying this just because we want them to waste money on equipment that isn't actually needed.

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i did this for myself to see how high they went. It got to 120 really quick. I was just curious and i already had a thermostat.

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Originally Posted by Danger noodles

i did this for myself to see how high they went. It got to 120 really quick. I was just curious and i already had a thermostat.

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Yep. One of mine I think hit 140+F directly on the surface of it. I forget which one that was, but I'm sure I'll find out. I say it is prfectly fine to try it out as an experiment when not exposing an animal to it. It is truly amazing how hot things can get using high resistances & electricity

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Originally Posted by Danger noodles

sky I seriously loled on this one!!

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You know me is all I can say.

This forum is full of wonderful very helpful people and I read posts on here for months before I got my python and I still learn something new everyday on here and everyone is just looking out for the well being of your snake so their advice is worth your time (and your snakes) to read and listen to. No one knows everything but I think all the great owners on here collectively come pretty damn close


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Not only can the unregulated UTH burn your animal but it can actually crack the glass in your tank. I know first hand, trust me. We got my son a 30 gal tank set up with his first snake and it came with the squareb stick on, rubber heat mat. The pet store said everything we needed was in the kit and it didn't come with a thermostat. A week later, the whole bottom was cracked.

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