Snappy BP's...help!

Omg my BP's at work will NOT calm down! They are all snappy! All.of.them! What can I do to help them chill out? In three years this is my first batch that will NOT settle! Ugh! Help me!

They are are all eating fine.
All between 160-200g
shed fine

i even changed their enclosure to have a hit hide and a cool hide. Ambient temps I adjusted too so they have a hot side and a cool side. Added more plants. Went in today and snapped at me again. They are just being jerks!

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Originally Posted by Sunnieskys

Omg my BP's at work will NOT calm down! They are all snappy! All.of.them! What can I do to help them chill out? In three years this is my first batch that will NOT settle! Ugh! Help me!

They are are all eating fine.
All between 160-200g
shed fine

i even changed their enclosure to have a hit hide and a cool hide. Ambient temps I adjusted too so they have a hot side and a cool side. Added more plants. Went in today and snapped at me again. They are just being jerks!

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Changed to having two hides warm and cool .... what did they have before ??

Best give a quick breakdown of the setups ... a photo or two is also worth a thousand words sometimes


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My smaller ones calm down quite a bit if i totally stuff them full of food.

My Banana YB female that I got from Dynasty is the only snappy one. She’s been like that since I got her at 270g and is around 1200g now and still can be. I originally attributed it to Chun having such a large operation that the bp’s don’t really get handled. This is what I’ve done and it has seemed to help but still a work in progress.

Slightly more frequent handling sessions, but much shorter duration. This varies and is dependent upon her mood/ behavior on a given day. Some days she is handled 3-5mins and others she is cool for 10 mins or so. Don’t push it and see what they tolerate. Build trust by showing her she will not get hurt when handled.

If she snaps, I don’t put her right back in her tub. I set her on the carpet and when she snaps I cover her head from behind so she balls up and hold there until I feel her relax.

I always put her back when she is calm. End handling on a good/ positive note when they are relaxed.

Like the previous poster mentioned, she seems less prone to snap when she is given a larger meal.

She is the only one of my 4 who is like that and I’m not sure it will ever fully get out of her, but she has improved drastically. It just doesn’t happen overnight.


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Mine aren't very snappy at all, but I do have a few that are a bit overly eager about feeding, lol. I've found that if one snaps at me, the others all wake up and go into feeding mode, because they heard a strike and think it's dinner time.

Are they showing defensive behavior other than the striking? Being tense, puffing up, hissing, etc?

If it's just a feeding response, a light touch on the top or back of the head will almost always put a stop to it. I usually just use my hand, but a snake hook or empty paper towel roll will work just as well.

If they're truly defensive, they will probably need to be handled more. Might also help to offer them more hides if possible. Even adding some cage clutter, like clumps of sphagnum moss, may help them feel more secure and hopefully calm them down.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sunnieskys

Omg my BP's at work will NOT calm down! They are all snappy! All.of.them! What can I do to help them chill out? In three years this is my first batch that will NOT settle! Ugh! Help me!

They are are all eating fine.
All between 160-200g
shed fine

i even changed their enclosure to have a hit hide and a cool hide. Ambient temps I adjusted too so they have a hot side and a cool side. Added more plants. Went in today and snapped at me again. They are just being jerks!

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Are they housed together in one enclosure? If so,how many to an enclosure?

They could be competing for the most ideal spots and be defensive and grumpy from not being allowed to fully relax. Most snappy ones I've come across were either defensive little ones or overly hungry ones. Rarely have I seen a truly aggressive BP. I'm sure they exist, but if the entire group is acting that way, then its either 1. Husbandry 2. genetics?

If possible and if they are together, separate. Since they are eating well, start handling. Short but often. If they get into a striking position (huffy, tense, s-coil) then gently tap them on the head (GENTLY) with a empty paper towel roll or something like that. You can use your hand. Come from ABOVE if possible, not from the front. They should pull their head in and retreat from the crabbyness. Right then you just swoop in and pick them up. Don't hesitate, use deliberate but gentle movements. If they get tense and crabby again in the hand, cover their heads and body with your other hand and apply VERY GENTLE pressure, until you feel them relax, then remove the other hand and let them look around, explore, etc. Keep it SHORT AND SWEET and return them gently to the enclosure before they have a chance to get over stressed or crabby again. When returning, put your hand into the enclosure and let them slither off. Don't just "dump" them in quickly. Everything needs to be deliberate but calm and gentle.

The defensive ones give up that stink eye behavior really quickly. But you HAVE to give them the correct husbandry, that is a stress free environment, so that they can relax between handling sessions.

I've had a couple of really defensive hatchlings last year, they were also my best eaters. They gave up that behavior within a few days and turned out to be the BEST pet BP's you could ask for. One worker where I board my horse at has one of them, so I hear about Monty all the time. Monty was the least fearful BP of all my hatchlings, always exploring, you could touch his head and he never jerked back. To this day his owner is in love with him and tells me how great he is. That snake knows no fear or stress and eats every time. As chill a snake as a snake can be :) You just have to set them up right and take a bit of time. I by NO MEANS over handled my hatchlings, either. He calmed down simply from getting used to being taken out to do maintenance and a few times in between to get him to realize nothing bad is going to happen. The gentle "cupping" technique worked wonders and only had to be done two or three times.

The "bold" BP's can turn out to be the best ones, I feel that the shy, fearful ones need a LOT more time and patience. Unfortunately most people are drawn to the fearful/shy ones, because they appear "tame". Which can quickly turn into being handled way to much, then come the feeding problems, etc etc...

Good luck with the little dragons :D

I have a hunch it might be genetic, with all the selective breeding of BPs...especially since the OP has plenty of experience.
There are some others around like this: I remember reading about one in a rescue, but I think one of the morphs also has this tendency...wasn't it cinnamon?

Like zina10 just said, I don't mind snappy baby snakes as they're bold enough to feed & I sure don't fear taming them...unfortunately, the typical buyer is
a beginner that may not "enjoy" these little "snapdragons" as much as I would.

I have three in one enclosure. Yes...yes I know. They send three at a time, I have no choice or I would only order one.

"proper protocol" is to have one log hide (except it is stone) up against the front glass and only one one side. Water dish on the other side with one plant in the back middle. I have always hated this set up and the only time I do this is if I'm having an animal walk and then I change it when they leave.

I changed it to turning the hide so it is against the back wall opening facing the middle. Added another hide to the other side again facing the middle. That way people are not tapping the glass and sticking their faces up to the glass to bother them. I moved the water dish to the front middle. Added plants in the front of the glass next to the water bowl on each side for more privacy. Also a plant in the back middle between the hides. I lowered the temp on one side so they can thermoregulate.

They are are all on adult mice and eat well. I handle them often to try to calm them down. I have tried everything people have suggested. They are still snappy.

Like i said this is the first batch in three years like this. All my other snakes I could take out, give to people to hold, kiss their faces even. Not with these jerks. I can barely stick my hand in their cage. I have tried holding and covering. How the heck can I sell them as snappy things!

They also have a double enclosure so like a 20L roughly.

i know you know you're stuff so ill keep this simple:

short yet frequent handling sessions. >5 minute sessions like every other day, and always ending on a "positive" e.g. they've finally started trying to get away from you instead of staying in a defensive pose.

tell your customers this: snappy babies usually make the best feeders! [emoji6] keep us posted on them!!!

I've never known a feisty Royal just aggressive feeders !?!?


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Originally Posted by Zincubus

I've never known a feisty Royal just aggressive feeders !?!?....

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I've never personally had one like that, but I read about one a rescue had...young adult male that they said could ONLY be adopted by a very experienced owner due
to its persistent aggression, & they had an extensive application process w/ no shipping, only in person adoptions, etc. Don't know if it ever got adopted successfully.

It makes sense to me though: most snakes are bred only for appearance, not temperament, and with all the inbreeding for fancy morphs, I'm actually surprised
there aren't more of these around, though sadly they might be getting sold off as "feeders"? Pet stores are a very likely place for some to end up, as pet stores
don't pay a lot & buy "in bulk".

You have your work really cut out for you this time, Sunnieskys...:rolleyes:

I like zina10's suggestion to "cup" them....lets them feel safe, like back in the egg...:cool: I wonder if they'd improve if you kept them close for longer periods of time?
-Like in a zipped pocket, or a small snake bag inside your shirt for both warmth & to get used to "human scent"...you probably can't do that at work, but I'd try
that at home, personally, with snakes like these. The BCI that I took in years back was like this...she was a yearling that had changed hands multiple times before
being given to me. She scared off all previous owners, persistent biting/striking...pretty "hiss-terical" snake, but I knew she was just scared. Also read that Mexican
BCI's tended to be feisty like this (& that's what she appeared to be), but all it really took was some patience: I'd keep her on my lap for 30 minutes or more, in &
under a small towel, not letting her see out, while she got over the feeling of being held, gently touched, & got used to my scent. After about a month or so, I slowly
let her see out...she was nervous but never bit me...not even once in all the years I had her. She became a wonderful trust-worthy pet, face-to-face tame with me.

Most people suggest short handling sessions...I actually favor longer times...snakes feel the MOST threatened when being picked up or put down, so with a
short handling session, they never REALLY get relaxed. And they're getting our body warmth too, so that's no problem. I've also noticed that some snakes
get mellow if you sit in a hammock or rocking chair while doing this...I know, I know...that sounds crazy, but try it. It worked for me, and I'm NOT talking
about a ball python...

Sunnieskys, maybe you need to "take a BP to lunch" with you each day, if they'll let you? In a bag in your shirt...;) It's especially hard for snakes like these to
mellow out under the given conditions, group housing on display in a store. Poor things!

I can take them out whenever i want. They are mine lol. Im in charge and do what i want. Maybe i will take them to lunch with me.

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Also this is their current enclosure.

And yes i know i know.....those gauges. They are attached with silicone. They still suck and wish i could use digital ones. Im adding more plants today when i clean while they are bein fed in the back.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...c435b0d499.jpg

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I know you're doing ALL you can, with what you have to work with. Let us know how it goes, cuddling a BP thru lunch where no one will wonder what that
funny lump in your shirt is, lol...(or at least, the customers won't). You'll have to do them one at a time, but you wouldn't do this daily anyway, so they can
take turns....and if it helps them warm up to humans so they can get good homes, it will all be worth it. Keeping my fingers crossed for you & especially for
them. Your little 'snapdragons' would probably be the best survivors in the wild...it's too bad more owners can't appreciate this for what it is.

I have found over the years that the more you reach in the less you get bitten. :rofl:

If, everytime you are in the cage they get fed you are training them to bite on command - great in a velocoraptor less so with a bp. :P

Persevere, you will get there once they are stuffed full of rodent. :D

ETA ( note to self don't buy a velocoraptor)

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Originally Posted by dr del

I have found over the years that the more you reach in the less you get bitten. :rofl:

If, everytime you are in the cage they get fed you are training them to bite on command - great in a velocoraptor less so with a bp. :P

Persevere, you will get there once they are stuffed full of rodent. :D

ETA ( note to self don't buy a velocoraptor)

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they do not get fed in their enclosure. They get fed in the back and they know when they go into a box it's feeding time. I forgot to take one to lunch with me today.

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Originally Posted by Sunnieskys

they do not get fed in their enclosure. They get fed in the back and they know when they go into a box it's feeding time. I forgot to take one to lunch with me today.

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Feeding in a separate container is kinda old-school , old fashioned .

Why do you do that incidentally ?


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i know that pet shop setups are not ideal and they're setup to maximize space and to make the pet(s) visually available for the customers. it's the bittersweet part of the business but im glad that u are taking steps to make more comfortable and secure.

the other part is that i don't think alotta peeps realize that hatchlings are not handled very much at all 1) before they get to a comfortable size/weight and, in general, 2) sales. so it doesn't surprise me when an individual or store gets shipped a biter, after all it's their natural behavior when confronted w/ a large "predator." anyways i like the handling tips others already gave and the ones u have a nice sized sub-juveniles primed for short sessions.

lastly I wouldn't want (potential) customers or the public in general to develop an unnecessary fear of these snakes. use it as a teaching moment. Let those scaredy cats know that these lil sneks are not trying to eat them. they’re more scared of people, than most peeps are scared of them. let them know the difference between a defensive bite (strike and release) vs. feeding bite (strike and warp/coil) and give them husbandry and handling tips. also it might be worth it to mention that everything w/ a mouth and teeth can bite – from a BP to a dog to a Horse to a Hippo to a Velociraptor (per the Dr’s example).

Good luck and let us know how it goes!

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Originally Posted by Zincubus

Feeding in a separate container is kinda old-school , old fashioned .

Why do you do that incidentally ?


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Petco and Petsmart don't allow feedings for snakes in the floor habitats. Not all customers are fine with snakes eating mice, even if they are frozen thawed.

Also, in Sunnies case, she has multiple snakes in one habitat so feeding after closing or before opening is still a bit too risky when they aren't seperated.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zincubus

Feeding in a separate container is kinda old-school , old fashioned .

Why do you do that incidentally ?


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Because it's Petco and people would lose their crap if I fed on the floor. I already have people walk out in a Huff when they realize we sell live feeder mice. It is policy to feed off the floor or else I would feed in their enclosure.

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Originally Posted by Sunnieskys

Because it's Petco and people would lose their crap if I fed on the floor. I already have people walk out in a Huff when they realize we sell live feeder mice. It is policy to feed off the floor or else I would feed in their enclosure.

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I see ......


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Snake during lunch. This is a girl and she is #2 snake.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...b69330ebc3.jpg

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Gee, she doesn't appear to be very "snappy"? I figured you'd have her in a little cloth bag, but it appears that she was fine on your lap? Any bites?
Not seeing any blood...:rolleyes:

I can only imagine how frightening it is for snakes to be shipped & stuck in a retail cage...with people walking by all day + the scents of other animals wafting
thru the air...I think I'd be "snappy" too? Hopefully this is all they need, a little more "one on one" time to find out that humans won't eat them? Now if only
she could tell the others, lol.

No snaps while out. She was exploring. She went over my hands and even came up my chest to my face to check me out. We will see if they calm down this way.