Day/night cycle?

Hi! I've been researching this a bit lately but everything I've found so far is from 3+ years ago so I figured I'd see if I could get some more recent opinions. Sooo, in your opinion, do you think BPs can benefit from day/night cycles? And if so, do you think they're necessary?

As far as tempertures go, no you will have no benefit only issue, keep your temp steady 24/7 year round, now if you breed that's another story.

Light wise if the light come through the room that's all you need.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

As far as tempertures go, no you will have no benefit only issue, keep your temp steady 24/7 year round, now if you breed that's another story.

Light wise if the light come through the room that's all you need.

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What if there's no natural light in the room? Like near complete darkness. Or even different levels of light throughout the day?
And just for the record, this is all hypothetical, I'm not keeping my BP in complete darkness, just curious :)

I think a day/night light cycle is important. Constant light would probably stress a snake out. Not sure what the effects of constant, total darkness would be.... but I would imagine they benefit from knowing when is night and when is day, etc.

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Originally Posted by Ditto

What if there's no natural light in the room? Like near complete darkness. Or even different levels of light throughout the day?
And just for the record, this is all hypothetical, I'm not keeping my BP in complete darkness, just curious :)

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If there wasn't I would do something similar to daylight longer amount of light in the summer shorter in the winter.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

If there wasn't I would do something similar to daylight longer amount of light in the summer shorter in the winter.

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I'm not sure if that would be accurate for ball pythons, though? Where they're from, their photoperiod doesn't really change much. What does change is the seasons -- the dry and wet seasons, specifically. Here's a site that has the sunlight hours for Accra, Ghana throughout the year: http://www.accra.climatemps.com/sunlight.php . Of course, that's only one area of their natural range, but as you can see it only fluctuates by about 30 minutes.

I personally do provide night temperature drops. It's certainly not necessary in captivity, but since I have the ability to do so with my Herpstat2, I figured I would experiment with it and see how my snake responds.

My lights turn off at 7PM, and then at 7:30PM the temperatures drop over a course of 30 minutes (I could probably extend that time but I don't know if it would make a difference) to be about 80F on the hot side and 78F on the cold. There's a rock under the heat panel that holds heat for a few hours after the heat goes down, so she still has access to heat at night for a period of time. Maze typically comes out to explore sometime after 8:30PM, and keeps going until after I've gone to bed, except after a feed or while in shed.

Lights turn back on at 7AM, and the heat ramps back up to 86F on the hot side by 8AM. I'm usually asleep when the lights turn back on, so I honestly couldn't tell you if she's active during that time on the regular. A few months back I did wake up a few hours early and she was still scooting around until closer to 9AM. That was an isolated incident, and I don't have cameras hooked up to prove if that's a regular thing for her, though.

Again, not necessary, this is just what I do.

To the OP: I wouldn't recommend what Starscream is doing with temp drops, unless you are literally breeding a female, because that's how you encourage your ball python to go off feed, especially in the fall or winter. Not all balls do, since some are total pigs haha. But it'll increase the chances that a bp will respond by fasting, especially if they are a sub-adult~adult individual.

Not everything should be emulated like "in the wild". If that were the case, we should add some predators and cold winter temps to their enclosure too (of course don't do that). It's better to stick to what people have found to keep the species consistently healthy in captivity.

In terms of providing day/night light cycle though, it's no harm done! Even if you don't specifically provide direct lighting, I believe they should still have a day/night cycle from ambient light in the room.

As stated, my post above is what I do, and not necessarily recommended for beginners. I do think equating lowering night temperatures by a few degrees with adding a predator to the enclosure is a slippery slope fallacy and a staw man. I would NEVER endorse adding something to an enclosure that would endanger your animal.

Anywho, have fun researching and don't be afraid to hit me up with a PM if you need anything! :)

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Originally Posted by Starscream

As stated, my post above is what I do, and not necessarily recommended for beginners. I do think equating lowering night temperatures by a few degrees with adding a predator to the enclosure is a slippery slope fallacy and a staw man. I would NEVER endorse adding something to an enclosure that would endanger your animal.

Anywho, have fun researching and don't be afraid to hit me up with a PM if you need anything! :)

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Obviously adding a predator is a joke lol, I'm surprised someone might take that literally. My point is that not everything emulated "like the wild" is necessarily beneficial to the snake. And starscream, you are a beginner too...

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Originally Posted by Starscream

I'm not sure if that would be accurate for ball pythons, though? Where they're from, their photoperiod doesn't really change much. What does change is the seasons -- the dry and wet seasons, specifically. Here's a site that has the sunlight hours for Accra, Ghana throughout the year: http://www.accra.climatemps.com/sunlight.php . Of course, that's only one area of their natural range, but as you can see it only fluctuates by about 30 minutes.

I personally do provide night temperature drops. It's certainly not necessary in captivity, but since I have the ability to do so with my Herpstat2, I figured I would experiment with it and see how my snake responds.

My lights turn off at 7PM, and then at 7:30PM the temperatures drop over a course of 30 minutes (I could probably extend that time but I don't know if it would make a difference) to be about 80F on the hot side and 78F on the cold. There's a rock under the heat panel that holds heat for a few hours after the heat goes down, so she still has access to heat at night for a period of time. Maze typically comes out to explore sometime after 8:30PM, and keeps going until after I've gone to bed, except after a feed or while in shed.

Lights turn back on at 7AM, and the heat ramps back up to 86F on the hot side by 8AM. I'm usually asleep when the lights turn back on, so I honestly couldn't tell you if she's active during that time on the regular. A few months back I did wake up a few hours early and she was still scooting around until closer to 9AM. That was an isolated incident, and I don't have cameras hooked up to prove if that's a regular thing for her, though.

Again, not necessary, this is just what I do.

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Just curious. I'm reminded of this thread
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...he-recommended

where you were originally unsure of night temp drops and decided against it after getting various opinions against the practice. You even thought it was counter-intuitive at the time so I'm wondering what made you decide to give it a go?

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Originally Posted by MissterDog

Just curious. I'm reminded of this thread
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...he-recommended

where you were originally unsure of night temp drops and decided against it after getting various opinions against the practice. You even thought it was counter-intuitive at the time so I'm wondering what made you decide to give it a go?

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I've since had a year to research things (verses the three month I'd had then), and I also have a larger enclosure now than I did then for my snake. I have elements that stay warm after the ambient temperatures drop for several hours, which Maze has access to. I apologize for not making that clear in my original post.

Observationally, Maze comes out more regularly at earlier times of the night if I drop the temperatures. I can't know what this specifically means, but since she doesn't come out until 5-7 days after a meal, or while she's in shed, I've made the assumption that the lowered temperatures make her think it's time to hunt, more so than just turning off the lights. Obviously I have no way of knowing if that's true, but even when let out of her enclosure and allowed to rest on a warm surface, she will choose to keep exploring over staying still. Her activity level means she gets exercise, and I do get to see her more often (which is a selfish motivation, I'm aware). As a species that is easily given to obesity in captivity, I find this exercise important.

It does mimic how things are in the wild; however, I'm not dropping these temperatures into dangerous ranges. They never fall below 78F, and are usually closer to 80F, especially on the hot side. I don't intend to cycle her temperatures annually as of yet; as you can see by my change in opinion from a year ago, I don't know what I may decide is best for my animal in the future, upon further research.

I recall the vet from that thread recommended I drop the temperatures down into the low 70s to mid 60s, which I think is pretty low, considering in their natural range, temperatures rarely ever drop below 72F (which is considered an extreme, and usually only happens at night).

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Originally Posted by Starscream

I've since had a year to research things (verses the three month I'd had then), and I also have a larger enclosure now than I did then for my snake. I have elements that stay warm after the ambient temperatures drop for several hours, which Maze has access to. I apologize for not making that clear in my original post.

Observationally, Maze comes out more regularly at earlier times of the night if I drop the temperatures. I can't know what this specifically means, but since she doesn't come out until 5-7 days after a meal, or while she's in shed, I've made the assumption that the lowered temperatures make her think it's time to hunt, more so than just turning off the lights. Obviously I have no way of knowing if that's true, but even when let out of her enclosure and allowed to rest on a warm surface, she will choose to keep exploring over staying still. Her activity level means she gets exercise, and I do get to see her more often (which is a selfish motivation, I'm aware). As a species that is easily given to obesity in captivity, I find this exercise important.

It does mimic how things are in the wild; however, I'm not dropping these temperatures into dangerous ranges. They never fall below 78F, and are usually closer to 80F, especially on the hot side. I don't intend to cycle her temperatures annually as of yet; as you can see by my change in opinion from a year ago, I don't know what I may decide is best for my animal in the future, upon further research.

I recall the vet from that thread recommended I drop the temperatures down into the low 70s to mid 60s, which I think is pretty low, considering in their natural range, temperatures rarely ever drop below 72F (which is considered an extreme, and usually only happens at night).

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Ah I see! Interesting!