New to BP have a few questions

Hi,
I am not new to the reptile world, but new to snakes. It took a while to convince my husband. We have a lovely bearded dragon named Gimli, a leopard gecko named Merlin, and a crested gecko I call Mr. Lizard (pun on the old Mr. Wizard show). We love keeping reptiles and strive to give them the best environments possible. My beardie is in a custom 4x2x2 wooden enclosure we built, the other two are in exoterra's. The crestie is completely bioactive. I want to make usre i am doing the same for our newest addition.

I purchased a baby ball python at a reptile show this weekend. I am not sure of sex, but I am currently calling her Astrid. She is a normal, but is a bit lighter than typical with more yellow. She was 67 g when I brought her home. I just want to make sure I am doing everything right. I have her set up in a tub, heat mat with thermostat running 89-91 when checked with a temp gun. Air temps running about 80, humidity about 70%. I have her on forest floor bedding, 2 identical small hides, one hot side one cold side. I have not handled her since Sunday. I had a little trouble getting temps exactly where I wanted it and had to move the heat mat so I had to take her out to fix it. I had the setup running for about a week before we got her, but I had to switch to smaller hides because of her size and it threw it off a bit.

When I purchased the breeder said that she had eaten on Tuesday, but I plan to wait until this weekend to attempt to feed. It was a show hosted by a local independent pet store, and the ONLY show that comes to our town all year, so it was crazy busy and I really didn't get to ask all the questions I wanted to of the breeder. The kid that checked me out suggested 2 fuzzy mice as a first meal at home, but I am concerned after reading here that they are too small. Should I just try it with the smaller prey and see how it goes or go get a hopper to try? I think my biggest fear is not being able to get her to eat. I have been through that with a baby bearded dragon and it is not fun!

First of all: Welcome :D

It's sounds like your setup is great and good to go. Your surely did a lot of research.
I'd still like to add a few things:

1. Humidity:
I think your humidity is too high. Unless your BP is in shed, humidity should be around 50% to 60%. Personally I also like to keep it at the higher end and I know that there are some people that will disagree with me but I think 70% is too much. Too much or too little humidity can cause a respiratory infection.

2. Handling:
I know that it's exciting to get a snake baby but I suggest you don't handle her until she has eaten at least three times in a row.

3. Feeding:
Feed the small baby a week after you got her. She needs to settle down first.
Concerning the size: There's this great chart everyone on this platform shares. In your case a small mouse should be doable.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...121e0fcb56.png

4. Have fun with your new family member and share some photos! :D

Thanks so much for the advice. I do try to do my research before getting anything. I will look at adjusting the humidity, but I don't know how much I am going to be able to do.

I am in the deep south, where it is 100% humidity outside all summer. It is 50-60% in my house most of the summer. I keep it down for my beardie with his basking light and the leopard has a CHE, but I have no idea how i would even do something like that with this size tub. Should I try a smaller water dish maybe?

I am definitely not handling her. I didn't want to Sunday but felt like I had to shift things to get it right.

thanks for the feeding chart, its very helpful! Saturday will be a week since I got her. I will attempt to feed then. Fingers crossed she takes it!

She seems to be settling in ok. I saw her shifting from the hot hide to the cool hide last night so at least she isn't afraid to come out at all.

I plan to feed her in her tub. Based on what I read it seems like not moving anything and using togs to place the mouse at the entrance of her hide, moving it a little to simulate life is the best course??

Thanks so much for the advice. I do try to do my research before getting anything. I will look at adjusting the humidity, but I don't know how much I am going to be able to do.

I am in the deep south, where it is 100% humidity outside all summer. It is 50-60% in my house most of the summer. I keep it down for my beardie with his basking light and the leopard has a CHE, but I have no idea how i would even do something like that with this size tub. Should I try a smaller water dish maybe?

I am definitely not handling her. I didn't want to Sunday but felt like I had to shift things to get it right.

thanks for the feeding chart, its very helpful! Saturday will be a week since I got her. I will attempt to feed then. Fingers crossed she takes it!

She seems to be settling in ok. I saw her shifting from the hot hide to the cool hide last night so at least she isn't afraid to come out at all.

I plan to feed her in her tub. Based on what I read it seems like not moving anything and using togs to place the mouse at the entrance of her hide, moving it a little to simulate life is the best course??

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Caali

First of all: Welcome :D

It's sounds like your setup is great and good to go. Your surely did a lot of research.
I'd still like to add a few things:

1. Humidity:
I think your humidity is too high. Unless your BP is in shed, humidity should be around 50% to 60%. Personally I also like to keep it at the higher end and I know that there are some people that will disagree with me but I think 70% is too much. Too much or too little humidity can cause a respiratory infection.

2. Handling:
I know that it's exciting to get a snake baby but I suggest you don't handle her until she has eaten at least three times in a row.

3. Feeding:
Feed the small baby a week after you got her. She needs to settle down first.
Concerning the size: There's this great chart everyone on this platform shares. In your case a small mouse should be doable.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...121e0fcb56.png

4. Have fun with your new family member and share some photos! :D

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^ THIS^


Oh and welcome !


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

I am in the deep south, where it is 100% humidity outside all summer. It is 50-60% in my house most of the summer. I keep it down for my beardie with his basking light and the leopard has a CHE, but I have no idea how i would even do something like that with this size tub. Should I try a smaller water dish maybe?

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Yes that can help or maybe you can move the water dish to a cooler spot. In an extreme case (yours is not extreme yet) you can also change to Aspen bedding.
I used to have the same problem with humidity until I got CHEs (I don't use heat mats) which are humidity killers. I've gone from trying to lower the humidity to struggling to keep it high enough.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

I am definitely not handling her. I didn't want to Sunday but felt like I had to shift things to get it right.

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Ok :)
I get your point and since you don't handle her, things should be fine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

thanks for the feeding chart, its very helpful! Saturday will be a week since I got her. I will attempt to feed then. Fingers crossed she takes it!

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No problem! :D
Don't worry too much. Even if she doesn't take it the first time, you don't have to worry. It can happen.
My boy just finished his first fast of two months (I've had him for a year) and I would lie if I said that I didn't feel anxious because of his refusal to eat or even look at the food. Most of the time it's just a waiting game.
But I hope she eats for you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

I plan to feed her in her tub. Based on what I read it seems like not moving anything and using togs to place the mouse at the entrance of her hide, moving it a little to simulate life is the best course??

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Everyone has their own feeding ritual. You have to see what works for you and your snake.
99% of snake owners (including myself) will tell you to use tongs and to feed the snake in it's enclosure. So that's definitely a good start. By the way I would also feed at night.
If she in her hide, I'd start wiggling the mouse 4 to 6 inches from her hide. Be sure to make gentle movements. If she smells the mouse, she should come out. She will go into striking position (the S form) and will slowly get closer to the mouse before striking and wrapping around it. Some people suggest to tug the mouse a bit to add realism but I never found that to be helpful. If you do that, your snake will tighten her grasp.
One thing that I wish someone would have told me when I fed my BP for the first time (he was also only 100g and tiny) is that young BPs do not always have the best aim. So your BP might miss the mouse a few times before she finally gets it. But if she is willing to try again, it's fine even if she misses.

Welcome to the forum and the wonderful world of snake keeping!!
I'm glad to see you did your research and had your enclosure set up before bringing your snake home.

That feeding chart is a great guideline. Follow that and you'll be well on your way :gj:

ok, so I woke up this morning to temp problems and I cannot decide what's going on. I thought I had it stable but suddenly I get up this morning and it is 96 on the floor of the hot side when I moved substrate aside and measured with a temp gun, the digital readout on the thermostat is 93, and I have it set to 90. Light is off on the thermostat so supposedly not heating. Astrid was out in the tub. I moved her hot hide so that it was just off the heat so she wouldn't be harmed. I have the probe for the thermostat (jump start type) between the heat mat and the bottom of the tub. It is a Flukers heat mat and I have the probe fully on the black part of the mat that heats. I don't get what's going on. Do you guys think I have an equipment failure or could it be a setup issue?

I went ahead and ordered some flexwatt (they will be wiring) and a herpstat ez1. I was planning to eventually get one anyway, when I got ready to move her to a bigger enclosure. Any suggestions on what to do in the meantime? I have another heat mat I can try, but unfortunately I don't have a spare thermostat or anywhere locally that sells them. Could I try a lamp dimmer switch, or can you use those with heat mats?

Could I possibly set up a CHE? I have a spare one of those with a stand.

Got home at lunch and temp is now 88 erasures with the gun?? Maybe the gun just went weird this morning? I took multiple readings in different places though and they were all high this morning and 88-89 this afternoon.

Hard to say what's going on...the temp gun I used to have would read inconsistently, I always had to take multiple readings & hope which one was right. :(

I love & have used Flexwatt for literally decades... You can use a lamp dimmer (aka rheostat) with some heat mats better than others...some heat mats
won't dim & just go off, others just take a light touch & practice to dial in...by all mean try it. If you use your CHE temporarily, by all means regulate that
with a dimmer for now....that will work too. Thermostats make it easier & safer...especially for people who lead busy lives & aren't home a lot. Don't worry,
you'll get this all sorted out...;)

Thanks! I am settling down and feeling better about it. I really don’t think it’s too hot, which is my biggest concern. I just think temps aren’t agreeing between things. New equipment will be here Saturday.

I have a puc pic I snapped while she was out this morning, but I can’t figure out how to post it? Does it have to be uploaded somewhere first?

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...cd55227567.jpg


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That's a pretty baby you've got there. :wuv:

Thanks! I think so.


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Got home this afternoon and Astrid is hanging out outside her hide, stretched out on the hot side. Hopefully that means she is getting comfortable in her new home.


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Just wanted to update. Got my herpstat and it fixed my temp issues! I offered a frozen thawed fuzzy Saturday evening, but she refused it. She shied away like she was scared of it. I will try again next week with a live fuzzy and see how that goes. She seems to be settling in well. i am leaving her alone except for water changes, and she is out cursing the tub every evening.

Are you talking rat fuzzy or mouse fuzzy?

And if you want to feed F/T I wouldn't offer live yet. I'd offer F/T weekly until she takes it (obviously within reason). If weeks turn into months then maybe re-address it.
That's my two cents anyway.

It was a fuzzy mouse, at the suggestion of the kid checking me out. It was definitely smaller than her girth, but he said the babies were getting 2 pinky mice per feed. Should I try a larger one? Also, how many weeks is too many for a baby to go without eating? She was just 67g when I got her.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

It was a fuzzy mouse, at the suggestion of the kid checking me out. It was definitely smaller than her girth, but he said the babies were getting 2 pinky mice per feed. Should I try a larger one? Also, how many weeks is too many for a baby to go without eating? She was just 67g when I got her.

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Personally I would try a bigger one instead of two small ones and I would not try to feed life just yet. From my experience it can be very difficult (in rare cases even impossible?) to change to F/T afterwards.
You can feed young ball pythons every five days if you want to. I know a lot of people do that and personally I did it myself until my little snake reached the 500g mark. So, in my opinion, can try feeding again on Sunday.
How old is your snake? In your photo she looked fine and, unless she is loosing a lot of weight, she will be able to go for some time without food. For now you don't need to worry.
But I have three more questions:

How did you prepare the mice?
Did the breeder tell you how he prepared the food and what she ate (frozen or life)?
Did she seem interested at least or was she ignoring you (or was she even defensive)?

She is young. 67g

I thawed the mouse in tepid water then warmed it in hot until warm to the tough. I checked to make sure it was thawed all the way. She just shied away from the mouse. The reptile show was crazy, and I didn’t get to ask all the questions I wanted.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

She is young. 67g

I thawed the mouse in tepid water then warmed it in hot until warm to the tough. I checked to make sure it was thawed all the way. She just shied away from the mouse. The reptile show was crazy, and I didn’t get to ask all the questions I wanted.


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I know she is young but 67g is normally what hatchlings (hatchling weigh from 40g to 90g) or snakes that are a bit older than hatchlings weigh BUT weight can vary A LOT. For example I got my ball python when he was 4 months old and he only weighed 100g (which is definitely on the smaller side) but he looked fine. It took him 2 weeks to start eating. Now he weighs 800g even after fasting for 2 months and he is just 1 year and 4 months old. Personally I think the food the breeder has been offering to her might have been a little too little for her body.
And I also asked because I was wondering if she has eaten a lot of meals before. Young ball pythons can be like divas. Some just don't want to eat but from what it looks like to me your ball python is simply still stressed. Give her some more time.
Also be sure to use warm not hot water. I learned this on this forum as well but hot water is not a good idea. Take it from someone who accidentally boiled a rat once. The rodent should be warm to the touch just like your skin.

By the way, so am I right if I assume that you don't know whether she ate live or frozen mice?

Refer to the feeding chart on page 1 of this thread.

A fuzzy mouse is WAY too small for a BP. They eat hoppers right out if the egg for 3-5 meals and are ready for small adult mice.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Caali

I know she is young but 67g is normally what hatchlings (hatchling weigh from 40g to 90g) or snakes that are a bit older than hatchlings weigh BUT weight can vary A LOT. For example I got my ball python when he was 4 months old and he only weighed 100g (which is definitely on the smaller side) but he looked fine. It took him 2 weeks to start eating. Now he weighs 800g even after fasting for 2 months and he is just 1 year and 4 months old. Personally I think the food the breeder has been offering to her might have been a little too little for her body.
And I also asked because I was wondering if she has eaten a lot of meals before. Young ball pythons can be like divas. Some just don't want to eat but from what it looks like to me your ball python is simply still stressed. Give her some more time.
Also be sure to use warm not hot water. I learned this on this forum as well but hot water is not a good idea. Take it from someone who accidentally boiled a rat once. The rodent should be warm to the touch just like your skin.

By the way, so am I right if I assume that you don't know whether she ate live or frozen mice?

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I was to,d frozen thawed by a pet store associate, didn’t get to ask the breeder. The breeder said they had been fed the Tuesday before I bought on Sunday.


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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

Refer to the feeding chart on page 1 of this thread.

A fuzzy mouse is WAY too small for a BP. They eat hoppers right out if the egg for 3-5 meals and are ready for small adult mice.

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I will get a hopper for her this weekend


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

I will get a hopper for her this weekend


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You can get a small mouse. Hoppers are already too small. Any decent breeder wouldn't have sold the snake before it had eaten 3-5 meals.

SHE ATE!!!! I went by the pet store today and they said they had been on live fuzzies. Brought one home and she took it right away! Will move to bigger next week!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

SHE ATE!!!! I went by the pet store today and they said they had been on live fuzzies. Brought one home and she took it right away! Will move to bigger next week!

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Nice! Fuzzy rat??

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

Nice! Fuzzy rat??

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No, fuzzy mouse, but a big one more like hoper size. It makes a noticeable bulge, but I still feel like it was a little small. Their shipment comes tomorrow and stock was low. The small mice they had were getting big and we were scared of a regurgitation.
At least she got a meal in her. I will definitely go bigger next time!

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

No, fuzzy mouse, but a big one more like hoper size. It makes a noticeable bulge, but I still feel like it was a little small. Their shipment comes tomorrow and stock was low. The small mice they had were getting big and we were scared of a regurgitation.
At least she got a meal in her. I will definitely go bigger next time!

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It's definitely too small. I'm not trying to be rude, but I think the people at the pet store aren't giving you quality info. The only reasons they would be feeding a BP any prey that size is A) cheaper to feed smaller prey and B) they stay smaller longer to look cute and increase sales.

People on here have shared that feeding chart, because it's tried and true. You're not doing your snake any favors feeding prey smaller than they can eat fresh out of the egg. Again, not trying to be a jerk, just trying to help you and your BP.

But, your snake, so do what you feel is best...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

It's definitely too small. I'm not trying to be rude, but I think the people at the pet store aren't giving you quality info. The only reasons they would be feeding a BP any prey that size is A) cheaper to feed smaller prey and B) they stay smaller longer to look cute and increase sales.

People on here have shared that feeding chart, because it's tried and true. You're not doing your snake any favors feeding prey smaller than they can eat fresh out of the egg. Again, not trying to be a jerk, just trying to help you and your BP.

But, your snake, so do what you feel is best...

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I totally get it and I will definitely be feeding bigger prey next time. I was sort of between a rock and a hard place today because it was all they had. Next time I will be better prepared. I know it was less than ideal but I’m just glad to have her eating something. I definitely want to do what’s right by her


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

I totally get it and I will definitely be feeding bigger prey next time. I was sort of between a rock and a hard place today because it was all they had. Next time I will be better prepared. I know it was less than ideal but I’m just glad to have her eating something. I definitely want to do what’s right by her


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Sounds good, thank you for understanding.
I know you want what's best for your pet, and so do we. Unfortunately, there is so much bad info out there, it's hard to know who to trust. You're in good hands here though. I always advise people to cross reference any info they receive to make sure it's accurate. If 3 out of 3 people from the forum are advising "choice a" vs one pet store saying "choice b" I would be inclined to listen to the 3.

Anyway, I'm super happy she ate for you. Keep reading and learning. The more we know about our pets the better we can care for them.
Please feel free to ask any questions you may have, we're happy to help. :gj:

Just thought I would update. She pooped yesterday, and was cruising today, looking like she wanted food. She took a frozen thawed small mouse!


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by reptilemom25

Just thought I would update. She pooped yesterday, and was cruising today, looking like she wanted food. She took a frozen thawed small mouse!


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Nice job!!!

Just wanted to update for anyone interested. Astrid is doing really well. She is eating like a champ. She had dropped to 64g when she wasn't eating, but was 74g yesterday, so she is gaining again!