Feeling defeated - the famous "feeding" topic - again.

So, I got my bp on 5/13 (Mother's Day, a Sunday). She's approx. 2 1/2 yrs old and weighs 1189 grams. She had been eating regularly, f/t once a week. I was told she was a good feeder.

I didn't feed her the day I got her, to let her "settle", but I've been trying every Sunday since. Last night was try # 4. She has rejected each and every one.

I've been reading all the feeding threads I can find, to try to figure this out.

UTH is kept @ ~90. Cool side and ambient temps are ~80. 2 identical hides, one on each side of tank. Tank has 3 sides completely covered. Top is completely covered, with exception of holes for the CHE and "emergency" heat lamp (never used - it's a "just in case CHE fails" option). At the moment, I am using Repti Bark.

Humidity is an issue – usually high 30’s/low 40’s (having trouble getting to and maintaining 50% +). Still working on trying to get this resolved.

Her favourite is the warm side hide - this is where she has parked herself every single day, since I got her, during daytime. At night, as soon as lights go out, she's all over the enclosure, exploring. I've only handled her twice - for cleaning and weighing purposes only. She's shed once while in my care on May 25th overnight. I found her skin in the morning. It was a clean shed, thank goodness!

She previously came from a rack system using tubs. So she lived, and was fed in her tub by the previous owner.

QUESTION 1: would the humidity issue be causing her to refuse her food?

QUESTION 2: should I try to put her in her travel tub for feeding? I know it's recommended to feed them in their enclosures - and that is definitely my preference! - but if she's lived in a tub and been fed in a tub for over 2 years, could that be the reason she's not eating? Just not comfortable enough in a glass terrarium?

QUESTION 3: should I just keep hanging tight, and hope for the best?

I've been trying not to worry about it, since I know BP's can go for up to a year without eating, with no issues. However, since she was a good eater before I got her, and won't feed for me since I got her, I am concerned that this is stress-related fasting, and if there is anything I can do to break the fast, I would like to try. Except feeding her a live rat. That thought is stressing me out in a big way! I mean, what if she won't take the live rat either? What if the rat hurts her? How am I supposed to catch the rat, if Alice won't eat it? I've read to remove live rats with 1/2 hour of feeding if snake won't take it, but how do you catch it? Honesty disclosure - rats scare me! :weirdface But if it's what I have to do, I will do it.

I keep telling myself she's ok and happy, since she stays in her hide every day during the day and only comes out at night. I just want to see Alice eat. :(

Any input, thoughts, opinions, suggestions, emotional support would be appreciated. I hope my post makes sense. Thank you! :)

P.S. She is going to see a vet on Wednesday, just for a wellness check. I will talk to the vet about my concerns also. But I just think there's a whole world of knowledge & experience in these forums that even vets may not necessarily be aware of.

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QUESTION 2: should I try to put her in her travel tub for feeding? I know it's recommended to feed them in their enclosures - and that is definitely my preference! - but if she's lived in a tub and been fed in a tub for over 2 years, could that be the reason she's not eating? Just not comfortable enough in a glass terrarium?

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Complitely counter productive and will only lead to more stress, which means more refusal.

The truth be told the issue you are experiencing is pretty typical with adults, I have purchased and received adults on loans and more than 50% of them will go on food strike anywhere between a month to a year.

So what can you do.

1# Try to emulate the setup she used to be in prior to you acquiring her (same temps, same type of enclosure, same substrate).

2# Limit your handling to maintenance.

3# Offer less often.

4# Be patient.

If she was eating F/T do not offer live, unless you are willing to do so for months or years to come, usually an alternative prey is not the answer.

As for mentioning this to a vet be careful many vet are lacking the hands on experience and understanding when it comes to this species and will suggest all kind of crazy things such as assisting, force feeding, tube feeding, x-ray to see if there is an internal issue etc, if that is the case walk away.

How are you prepping the rat? Pic of your setup?

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Originally Posted by Deborah

1# Try to emulate the setup she used to be in prior to you acquiring her (same temps, same type of enclosure, same substrate).

2# Limit your handling to maintenance.

3# Offer less often.

4# Be patient.

If she was eating F/T do not offer live, unless you are willing to do so for months or years to come, usually an alternative prey is not the answer.

As for mentioning this to a vet be careful many vet are lacking the hands on experience and understanding when it comes to this species and will suggest all kind of crazy things such as assisting, force feeding, tube feeding, x-ray to see if there is an internal issue etc, if that is the case walk away.

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Thank you for the quick reply Deborah. I am dong # 2 already, and am trying very hard to maintain my patience (point # 4). :D Regarding # 3 - I can definitely reduce feedings to every 2 wks for now. That's a great idea. Thanks. :)

As far as point # 1 - I'd really prefer to not have to keep her in a tub. I do have one, which I use for travel and while doing maintenance. But if I made that her permanent residence, I'd see her even less than I do now. In the end, I will absolutely do what ever the best thing is for Alice. But before resorting to changing her home to a tub, I think I'll try practicing # 4 for a while longer. ;)

Oh, and thank you very much for the warning about the vet! If he/she mentions any of the stuff you said above, I will definitely walk away. I might not even mention the hunger strike at all, depending on the read I get from the vet.

Ok, I've taken a deep breath. Thanks again. I needed that. :)

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Originally Posted by Indy

How are you prepping the rat? Pic of your setup?

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I am putting him in hot water (in ziplock bag) for 20 minutes. Then I blow dry him for a bit. He sees/smells it, because he does appear to show interest. I try to dangle it, zombie walk it, (I do reheat in between) - in the end I leave it and walk away, and in the morning, into the garbage it goes. :(

I haven't quite figured out how to post pics yet. Once I figure it out, I will share my set up. :)

Try feeding at midnight, switching off all the lights in the room while you thaw it (and don't switch them on until he takes the rat) and then pre-scent for 30 minutes right before using the hairdryer. Doing this all in the dark is hard, but as long as you know where everything is. This is how I got my new BP to switch from live to f/t, as well as eat for the first time for me! I also found it important to stay hidden behind one of his covered tank walls. You wouldn't want to eat while a giant is looming above you!

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Originally Posted by 55fingers

Try feeding at midnight, switching off all the lights in the room while you thaw it (and don't switch them on until he takes the rat) and then pre-scent for 30 minutes right before using the hairdryer. Doing this all in the dark is hard, but as long as you know where everything is. This is how I got my new BP to switch from live to f/t, as well as eat for the first time for me! I also found it important to stay hidden behind one of his covered tank walls. You wouldn't want to eat while a giant is looming above you!

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^This^
I'd leave it for a week to settle back down again then try this :-


I feed evenings as they're nocturnal, dim lighting , leave to thaw near the viv , wait until he's under his hide , then with viv doors open , hold the mouse in tongs and heat with hairdryer 10 to 15 seconds then INSTANTLY dangle it in front of the hide entrance. They usually grab it and drag it inside to eat . You mentioned he's shows interest which is a very positive thing .. just keep warming then offering IMMEDIATELY whilst it's still warm ..

Good luck !!


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Originally Posted by rottn

I am putting him in hot water (in ziplock bag) for 20 minutes. Then I blow dry him for a bit. He sees/smells it, because he does appear to show interest. I try to dangle it, zombie walk it, (I do reheat in between) - in the end I leave it and walk away, and in the morning, into the garbage it goes. :(

I haven't quite figured out how to post pics yet. Once I figure it out, I will share my set up. :)

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Here is an alternative way that helps entice snakes to eat, pre-scent the room for a few hours by letting the rat thaw at room temp, once done use your hair dryer however when offering do not dangle the prey, hold it from behind it's head, and move it around in the enclosure as if it was alive.

Take a deep breath, and welcome to ball pythons. No doubt some of the refusal is stress related - remember they can smell sooooo much better than we can, so even the ambient scents in your house are something to get used to. So is sounds / vibrations / your waking habits etc.

For feeding, do what the others have said. Give her time off. Offing too often can also lead to refusal. My male is just over 1000 grams and only eats every 14-20 days in the summer and every 60ish in the winter - so a few weeks should not matter in the long run.

I can hopefully help with the humidity issues. Repti-bark isn't the best for humidity, but if that is what she is used to - leave it for now. I use two methods for keeping my humidity up (they work well in a cover tank too). First, moist sphagnum moss - put it in shallow dishes in the corners of the aquarium. The dishes are to keep the bedding from molding. Second, get a terr-cotta pot. She's a big girl so you might need a 12-16 inch pot and get the terra cotta drip pan that is the same or 1 size larger. Cut a larger hole in the bottom of the pot (I have even used a hammer and broken out the bottom then sanded the edges with a metal file - its loud and screechy). You can soak the pot in HOT water for an hour or so, and when it has cooled to below ~90 then you stick it back in the cage. The pot will dry out over the next 3-5 days and boost the humidity as it does so. You can even line the inside with damp moss too. I think there is still a picture in my gallery.

You can alsp but a warm damp towel over the screen (not touching the lights), then cover that and most of the lid in foil. This will also really help humidity. Hope this helps

I will try the prescenting idea. And the late feeding idea. I do wait till the main tank lights go out, and she becomes active - but even still, it's pretty early. Like 8ish or so. And the moonlights are on. So next feeding, I will wait till lights are out completely (11:00 I believe) and I'll prescent the room, and try feeding her in darkness. Maybe that'll be the trick to get things going. I will wait for a couple weeks before trying again.

Thanks for the reassurance everybody. And I know that I need to be patient. I've read this over and over again. And I really didn't want to post my worries. But being a first time snake-mom, my patience just kept wearing thinner, week after week. And I understand that 4 wks is nothing in the grand scheme of things for Alice, but I was just stressing (cuz 4 wks is an awful long time to me - a measly muggle :P) and just needed the reassurance you guys gave me. Thank you to all!

And Crowfingers - I like the terra cotta idea. But I don't have room unless I replace her cool hide, which she doesn't really use anyways. So I could actually try to do that. Thanks. :)

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Originally Posted by rottn

I will try the prescenting idea. And the late feeding idea. I do wait till the main tank lights go out, and she becomes active - but even still, it's pretty early. Like 8ish or so. And the moonlights are on. So next feeding, I will wait till lights are out completely (11:00 I believe) and I'll prescent the room, and try feeding her in darkness. Maybe that'll be the trick to get things going. I will wait for a couple weeks before trying again.

Thanks for the reassurance everybody. And I know that I need to be patient. I've read this over and over again. And I really didn't want to post my worries. But being a first time snake-mom, my patience just kept wearing thinner, week after week. And I understand that 4 wks is nothing in the grand scheme of things for Alice, but I was just stressing (cuz 4 wks is an awful long time to me - a measly muggle :P) and just needed the reassurance you guys gave me. Thank you to all!

And Crowfingers - I like the terra cotta idea. But I don't have room unless I replace her cool hide, which she doesn't really use anyways. So I could actually try to do that. Thanks. :)

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All my current Royals will only strike from their hides so it's worth trying to dangle a warm mouse in front of the entrance when he's in there .


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Originally Posted by rottn

I am putting him in hot water (in ziplock bag) for 20 minutes. Then I blow dry him for a bit. He sees/smells it, because he does appear to show interest. I try to dangle it, zombie walk it, (I do reheat in between) - in the end I leave it and walk away, and in the morning, into the garbage it goes. :(

I haven't quite figured out how to post pics yet. Once I figure it out, I will share my set up. :)

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Defrost in his room, don't seal the bag so the smell gets out. 30+ minutes to scent the room. Turn off the overhead lights while this is going on. Then open the cage before blow dryING so the scent gets nice and strong. Keep the food low, don't move it much, and hold it still nose to nose when the snake investigates.

From my experiences watching rodents and balls when feeding live to a difficult eater, this comes fairly close to what happened in the tub.
Scenting the room weakly tells the snake there is food somewhere in the area, catches his attention. The dryer gives some real heat and tells the snake food is close and its time to hunt. Small movents and nose to nose is pretty typical rodent behavior when presented with a pedator.

Balls will stay in their hide and ambush if possible, they feel secure and more likely to feed. I saw a lot of mice and rats wander around the tub with the snake barely peeking out of his hide. Eventually the rodent sticking his head into the hide to investigate, freezing, and then getting sucked in like a scene from a horror movie.

If it gets to be a realy long time you may need to resort to a hidden hide and some small live feed to get things moving.

Until then relax, keep him warm with 12 hours of daylight and let him get hungry. Don't leave the food if he doesn't eat, pull it and refereeze it. Balls aren't scavengers, generally won't eat a rotting carcass.

Another thing that works, when I have a BP go off feed, is to offer a fresh pre-killed rat. I drop feed it right next to them usually where they are "coiling". I check after 2-3 hours and it's usually gone. If it's an animal that has been in a breeding cycle I then follow up with a frozen thawed 3 days later; they usually start right up after the pre-killed and get back on feed - not all the time. Each animal is different and do change their behavior from time to time, so the key is to adapt with them and you will start to get a sense as to how to deal with situations that come up through your observations and interactions. My advice is to get something like Reptiscan or a diary and take notes of your observations, over time that becomes a valuable tool for you.
It's also usually nothing to really worry about but can be very stressful when it goes on along time. I once had a wild-caught BP that laid a clutch and didn't start feeding again until 15 months later, it was an extreme case for me, but we perservered...the way I got her to snap out of it, as a last resort, I offered a live ASF rat which she took and then I scented a frozen thawed rat with ASF and drop fed for a few offerings and then was able to offer an unscented normal frozen thawed rat which is what she takes to this day. She went from 2360g to 1230g during that time frame.

I would say the way you are prepping might be the issue . You should try leaving it in the ziploc bag frozen in cold water for two hours . Then after that pour the cold water out and put hot water for about ten minutes . Then when you are trying to feed them it will be warm and thawed correctly. If they haven’t taken it I would then dip it straight in the hot water and dab it on napkin and the heat from it will usually get them to strike if they are hungry.