Kitty the BP progression thread!

I wanted to start a progression thread for my baby girl, as well as show you her new tank setup! I've had her for about two months now and I'm stoked. She hatched in October. I don't have her weight or length, but I need to start tracking it. Advice on good scales / how to measure your BPs?!

As some of you may know from my husbandry post about setting up an exo-terra, I was looking to get my BP out of her awful depressing ten-gallon set up they sent me home with (d'oh - my naivety) and into something much more suitable. I couldn't fit a hot side hide, and a cool side hide, and a water dish in her ten gallon. Once I started doing research I realized how depressing her home was. SO! Over the past few weeks I've been gathering info - and saving money lets be honest haha - and today her new home is (almost) done! I need to get some aquarium backing for the sides of her tank, and I want to fill in the tank with a few more plant-like items or decor but I'm waiting for inspiration and to see what feels right. But for now this is her new home!!

• She is now in a medium-low exo-terra at 24” x 18” x 12”
• For substrate I'm using jungle floor for humidity and I like it so far. We'll see how it holds up!
• I have the top three quarters of the screen top covered with perfectly-fit cardboard wrapped in tinfoil that fit snugly into the frame for humidity and temp control with her heat lamp on the hot side (I want a CHE eventually but this was an investment in and of itself so it'll be a bit haha [also any opinions or advice for if I should control the heat of my bulb/CHE?]).
• She has the largest zoo-med heating mat the store had under her tank with a zoo-med one hundred watt thermostat controlling it.
• Got two digital thermometer/hygrometers in her tank, one on each side, set low at substrate level so I can see what she's feeling. ( I also now have them thumb-tacked to the wall above each side and I love how easy it is to monitor!)
• Two identical hides on each side (which she's been gone back and forth once or twice since she's been in her new home today and it's so cute to see!) and of course her branch and water and plants.
• Her hot side is 89-90 degrees and 56% humidity, and her cooler side is 79 and about 63% humidity. It has been leaning more on the more humid side because it doesn't have as many heat sources on it. Is this bad? I can adjust. :)

And today for the first time, too, I tried to feed her outside of her enclosure in what was her old ten-gallon and she did wonderfully eating out of her home. She made the switch to rats three feedings ago with zero issue whatsoever and doesn't care what color they are either. I lucked out! Question, how to know when to move your snake back into their home after they eat in a separate tank? I waited until after she wiggled it down into her belly and had started to wander around the ten-gallon on her own and moved her immediately into her home and left her alone. Is this correct or should I do something else? :) I'm feeding her separate because the little weanling rat babies are amazing2 at hiding around in her plants and behind her hide and making themselves so hard to see, and also feeding live I like to be able to make sure that I can get a chopstick in the rats mouth if need be because her aim is pathetic and she often gets their lower halves and the prey is getting big enough that I'm worried it'd do damage. I've been bitten by a rat before and that is horrific.

Anyways here's her and her new home!!! :P

Her name is Gladys but I always call her Kitty because she lets me rub her chin and I love how she nuzzles her face on things after she eats to adjust her skull and jaw. :)


https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...n/IMG_2252.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...r/IMG_2251.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...n/IMG_2248.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...n/IMG_2261.jpg



And here are photos of her in chronological order over the past two months. I don't have any other than her cute little face in her hide from the past two weeks because I have been so busy and she just moved and ate so I'm not gonna bug her.


https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...b/IMG_1748.jpg


https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...7/IMG_1764.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...j/IMG_1833.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...r/IMG_1948.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...z/IMG_2109.jpg



She has most definitely grown in length and thickness since I got her and I can't wait to start keeping track.

All looks good, congrats!!

Except....the feeding in a seperate enclosure. Nobody puts them in a little empty box to help them find prey in nature, and, yup, they find it.

Feeding in a separate feeding tub is old school and proven counter productive. You're just increasing the risk of the snake regurgitating it's meal or getting yourself tagged.

There is still some debate over feeding tubs, but you'll find the staggering majority of experienced keepers feed within the enclosure.


Other than that it appears you're doing a great job!!

She is beautiful! <3 You have a great set up too.

Correct me if I am wrong but do you only have one thermostat? On the UTH?

im not sure if you were asking how to control the lamp or if you should.

Either way the answer is YES. If you don’t have a thermostat for the Heat lamp you should unplug it and go get one ASAP. Heat lamps get insanely hot. And yes your snake could move away from it but Oran not ideal and could really close off that new big tank you just got or worse yet harm burn or cause a plethora of other issues.

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

All looks good, congrats!!

Except....the feeding in a seperate enclosure. Nobody puts them in a little empty box to help them find prey in nature, and, yup, they find it.

Feeding in a separate feeding tub is old school and proven counter productive. You're just increasing the risk of the snake regurgitating it's meal or getting yourself tagged.

There is still some debate over feeding tubs, but you'll find the staggering majority of experienced keepers feed within the enclosure.


Other than that it appears you're doing a great job!!

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Okay good to know! Thanks! Should I do anything like remove hides or anything when feeding? My concern being her either getting the fake plants or substrate caught when she strikes, or me not being able to block the rats mouth if she aims poorly.

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Originally Posted by Phillydubs

Correct me if I am wrong but do you only have one thermostat? On the UTH?

im not sure if you were asking how to control the lamp or if you should.

Either way the answer is YES. If you don’t have a thermostat for the Heat lamp you should unplug it and go get one ASAP. Heat lamps get insanely hot. And yes your snake could move away from it but Oran not ideal and could really close off that new big tank you just got or worse yet harm burn or cause a plethora of other issues.

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Yes I only have the thermostat on the uth. The only thing I saw about heat lamps is haunt a lamp dimmer on it so I wasn’t sure. I believe the light is a 50 watt right now and isn’t too strong. I have the thermostat measuring the uth under where I placed her hide so I can see how hot it gets inside and a thermometer there as well. My digital laser thermometer arrives tomorrow to check all over the tank.

How ow do I use a thermostat with a heat lamp?

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Originally Posted by littlemaxbigworld

Okay good to know! Thanks! Should I do anything like remove hides or anything when feeding? My concern being her either getting the fake plants or substrate caught when she strikes, or me not being able to block the rats mouth if she aims poorly.

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Nope, you don't want to move the hides, especially if the snake is in the hide. I wouldn't worry about the other stuff either. Your snake will be fine.

All perfectly good questions to ask, though. It shows you're thinking ahead and a concerned new snake parent.

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

Nope, you don't want to move the hides, especially if the snake is in the hide. I wouldn't worry about the other stuff either. Your snake will be fine.

All perfectly good questions to ask, though. It shows you're thinking ahead and a concerned new snake parent.

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Okay cool thanks! I appreciate it. I really want to give her the best life for the next twenty plus years and there’s so much to learn! Do you have any input on putting thermostats on heat lamps or CHEs?

Measured Kitty today and she is officially twenty-five inches long :D She hatched last october. Is this average growth for a six/seven months BP girl? Gonna get a scale next week. Heres recent photos :)

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...f/IMG_2279.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...3/IMG_2275.jpg

That seems pretty similar to my girl. She was about 22 inches at 6 months. She's 3 feet now at a year. Oh how time flies :').

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Originally Posted by Starscream

That seems pretty similar to my girl. She was about 22 inches at 6 months. She's 3 feet now at a year. Oh how time flies :').

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Awww I'm so excited to watch her grow. I hope she grows to be a big snake at the higher end of her growth possibilities. Monster Kitty :)

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Originally Posted by littlemaxbigworld

Awww I'm so excited to watch her grow. I hope she grows to be a big snake at the higher end of her growth possibilities. Monster Kitty :)

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I hope she grows to a healthy size and weight. To much or little is unhealthy and can shorten their lives.

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Originally Posted by Skyrivers

I hope she grows to a healthy size and weight. To much or little is unhealthy and can shorten their lives.

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Very true. But isn’t five feet still normal for a female BP?

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Originally Posted by littlemaxbigworld

Very true. But isn’t five feet still normal for a female BP?

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Is there a normal for a BP? Just kidding. I think 4-5 feet is average.

I wouldn't worry so much about length. Weight is more important, but even weight isn't as important as body structure.

And trying to compare BP growth rates is like comparing blades of grass. There are just way too many to compare, way too many variables and comparing to others will make you question whether yours is too skinny, too fat, too long, too short, etc...etc...etc...

Your snake looks to be in good health! Keep up the good work. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Skyrivers

Is there a normal for a BP? Just kidding. I think 4-5 feet is average.

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Okay yeah that’s what I’ve been reading. :) I definitely don’t mean I want an movese
or unhealthy noodle. My statement meant more ‘if she can hit five feet I hope she can!’ I want her to be big and strong! But I can love her very well at four feet just the same. ☺️

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Originally Posted by littlemaxbigworld

Okay yeah that’s what I’ve been reading. :) I definitely don’t mean I want an movese
or unhealthy noodle. My statement meant more ‘if she can hit five feet I hope she can!’ I want her to be big and strong! But I can love her very well at four feet just the same. ☺️

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Five feet is definitely the larger end of the spectrum. Don't be disappointed if she stays closer to four feet.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

I wouldn't worry so much about length. Weight is more important, but even weight isn't as important as body structure.

And trying to compare BP growth rates is like comparing blades of grass. There are just way too many to compare, way too many variables and comparing to others will make you question whether yours is too skinny, too fat, too long, too short, etc...etc...etc...

Your snake looks to be in good health! Keep up the good work. :gj:

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Okay good to know! :D I’m getting a scale next weekend after I get paid. I’m so excited to start weighing her. It’s amaxjng once I got her home and switched her to rats after a few feedings how quickly she started to bulk up! Looks happier and healthier and less ravenous near feeding day too.

Thank you! :D when I get her weight I’ll share it!! I won’t be disappointed no matter what. I love her so much!

I got to weigh her today :D I couldn't wait to get a scale. I think about it every day. So I gave in early hehehe

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...j/IMG_2358.jpg

and of course I remembered to tare the scale :P For having hatched in October, is twenty five/six inches and three hundred twenty grams right on track for a female BP? :)


Also fed her later on today too. What a beast.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...3/IMG_2361.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach..._E03195874.jpg


She she is getting so good at being handled! Much less jumpy and skittish, her muscles are super relaxed when she explores as crawls around, and her cute little tongue is taste happy. I love her so much!!! I’ve even started keeping a ‘snake diary’ of how much she weighs, her length, her eating, shedding, etc. Which I’m sure when she goes on a food strike eventually will help me lots too.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by littlemaxbigworld

I got to weigh her today :D I couldn't wait to get a scale. I think about it every day. So I gave in early hehehe

and of course I remembered to tare the scale :P For having hatched in October, is twenty five/six inches and three hundred twenty grams right on track for a female BP? :)

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All BPs grow at different rates, depending on genetics and feeding regimen. My girl was 340g and 29 inches at 9 months, and it was around that time I started to notice some chunky rolls on her sides. As I'm not aiming to breed or "get her up to size" quickly and trying to err on the side that will lead to longevity (greater space between feeding times reduces the stress put upon their organs. BP organs can remain expanded for about 10 days after feeding! wow!), I elected to cut her back a little bit on feeding frequency.

I'm not saying that you or anyone else should do this, this is just my thoughts on things. I want my kiddo to be around as long as possible, and if that means feeding her less and having a more "slow-grown" approach, so be it. She'll be a big girl eventually, but not before she's ready :).

On that note, though, making sure body condition is good is more important (to me) than ensuring that Maze is a certain weight at a particular age. She is a year old, and while I cut back her feeding, she still managed to grow very quickly in length! She's 36 inches, and 444g. Dang, girl. lol. That's still 7 inches in 3 months with reduced feedings.

Anyways, I think your girl is beautiful, and I'm one of those nuts that has a google spreadsheet to keep track of her data, kind of like your diary! it's color coded and has a line graph following her weight gain and everything. i'm losing it i swear lmao.

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Originally Posted by Starscream

All BPs grow at different rates, depending on genetics and feeding regimen. My girl was 340g and 29 inches at 9 months, and it was around that time I started to notice some chunky rolls on her sides. As I'm not aiming to breed or "get her up to size" quickly and trying to err on the side that will lead to longevity (greater space between feeding times reduces the stress put upon their organs. BP organs can remain expanded for about 10 days after feeding! wow!), I elected to cut her back a little bit on feeding frequency.

I'm not saying that you or anyone else should do this, this is just my thoughts on things. I want my kiddo to be around as long as possible, and if that means feeding her less and having a more "slow-grown" approach, so be it. She'll be a big girl eventually, but not before she's ready :).

On that note, though, making sure body condition is good is more important (to me) than ensuring that Maze is a certain weight at a particular age. She is a year old, and while I cut back her feeding, she still managed to grow very quickly in length! She's 36 inches, and 444g. Dang, girl. lol. That's still 7 inches in 3 months with reduced feedings.

Anyways, I think your girl is beautiful, and I'm one of those nuts that has a google spreadsheet to keep track of her data, kind of like your diary! it's color coded and has a line graph following her weight gain and everything. i'm losing it i swear lmao.

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Okay good to know! I saw a chart someone posted on a different form about snake weight and at what range they should be eating what thing and how often. I believe for her it said 7-10 days until she hits 350 grams then 10-14 if I remember correctly? It just seems so loooong haha. Also when I weigh her should it be like three or five days after feeding to get an accurate weight of just her? Because the day before eating she was 320 and just over 50 hours after eating she was like 360 or so. Which would I go by?

thanks! Hahaha I like the spreadsheet idea a lot! That’s awesome. Now if only I had the proper time and funds to learn breeding but that’ll never happen haha

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Starscream

My girl was 340g and 29 inches at 9 months, and it was around that time I started to notice some chunky rolls on her sides. As I'm not aiming to breed or "get her up to size" quickly and trying to err on the side that will lead to longevity (greater space between feeding times reduces the stress put upon their organs. BP organs can remain expanded for about 10 days after feeding! wow!), I elected to cut her back a little bit on feeding frequency.

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Thought I'd input that it's not that greater space between feedings leads to longevity in itself. Some people might take that the wrong way and under-feed or "maintenance feed" their snake (the nicer way to put under-feeding), which may even result in stunted growth.

Simply don't OVER feed your snake- if you observe that the snake is chunky and has rolls, it's just been over-fed. Then adjust the feeding schedule.

It is the idea of some hopeful breeders overfeeding with the hope that the female will get "up to breeding size faster" and breeding a chunky female too young that results in poor body condition and poor breeding results. Feed your snake on a normal schedule that doesn't result in a fat snake, and it'll be fine. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

Thought I'd input that it's not that greater space between feedings leads to longevity in itself. Some people might take that the wrong way and under-feed or "maintenance feed" their snake (the nicer way to put under-feeding), which may even result in stunted growth.

Simply don't OVER feed your snake- if you observe that the snake is chunky and has rolls, it's just been over-fed. Then adjust the feeding schedule.

It is the idea of some hopeful breeders overfeeding with the hope that the female will get "up to breeding size faster" and breeding a chunky female too young that results in poor body condition and poor breeding results. Feed your snake on a normal schedule that doesn't result in a fat snake, and it'll be fine. :)

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Okay thank you! I just looked through so many threads about feeding and there’s so many opinions I’m overwhelmed haha but it seems like it’s a simple don’t power feed and don’t underfeed. My only question really is what is the age where her growth starts to slow quite a bit?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by littlemaxbigworld

Okay good to know! I saw a chart someone posted on a different form about snake weight and at what range they should be eating what thing and how often. I believe for her it said 7-10 days until she hits 350 grams then 10-14 if I remember correctly? It just seems so loooong haha. Also when I weigh her should it be like three or five days after feeding to get an accurate weight of just her? Because the day before eating she was 320 and just over 50 hours after eating she was like 360 or so. Which would I go by?

thanks! Hahaha I like the spreadsheet idea a lot! That’s awesome. Now if only I had the proper time and funds to learn breeding but that’ll never happen haha

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Feeding size and schedule isn't such an exact science, it really depends on the snake. What you said is a good guide people go by, but if you eventually see your snake is too fat or too skinny, then adjust your prey size or feeding schedule.

Most people weigh their snakes some time before feeding day.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

Thought I'd input that it's not that greater space between feedings leads to longevity in itself. Some people might take that the wrong way and under-feed or "maintenance feed" their snake (the nicer way to put under-feeding), which may even result in stunted growth.

Simply don't OVER feed your snake- if you observe that the snake is chunky and has rolls, it's just been over-fed. Then adjust the feeding schedule.

It is the idea of some hopeful breeders overfeeding with the hope that the female will get "up to breeding size faster" and breeding a chunky female too young that results in poor body condition and poor breeding results. Feed your snake on a normal schedule that doesn't result in a fat snake, and it'll be fine. :)

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That's what I meant, thank you for elaborating. My brain doesn't always follow through with the logic loops and apparently thinks other people will "just get it" lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by littlemaxbigworld

Okay good to know! I saw a chart someone posted on a different form about snake weight and at what range they should be eating what thing and how often. I believe for her it said 7-10 days until she hits 350 grams then 10-14 if I remember correctly? It just seems so loooong haha. Also when I weigh her should it be like three or five days after feeding to get an accurate weight of just her? Because the day before eating she was 320 and just over 50 hours after eating she was like 360 or so. Which would I go by?

thanks! Hahaha I like the spreadsheet idea a lot! That’s awesome. Now if only I had the proper time and funds to learn breeding but that’ll never happen haha

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And like Red said, most folks use the weight before a feeding. The most accurate is after a bowel movement, as they're considered "empty" and don't have extra waste weighing them down, but sometimes they don't go often enough for that be accurate. You kind of have to go 'well they weigh this, but they also have some poop weight in them so they don't weigh that exact amount, but close enough'.

I think I'm accidentally following the schedule you mentioned -- I kind of just wait until she's actively staring at me for food, maybe wait a day, and then offer. Usually it's around the 10-day mark, and that's what works for me. It might not work for your's, though. She could need more time, or she could need less. There's just a lot of factors; prey size, frequency, and activity level are just a few of them.

Okay cool thanks guys!! So far at the seven / right day mark she’s always been suuuper ready for her food. If a snake could
look like a kid in a candy store, she would. So for now I’ll keep her where she is and just lightly monitor her! :)

yeah she she is a approximately every two weeks pooper. So when I get a present oh boy is it a present hahah I’m like just waaaaiting for my next poop to clean up.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...CA539_B401.jpg

Someone decided they didn’t want their food last week and was so hungry the next feeding day that the rat didn’t last more then fifteen seconds and Kitty the BP didn’t even get her *head* out of her hide before she just took the rat the bleep down. Maybe next time don’t starve yourself scaly friend. :)

She didn’t eat and then was clearly regretting her decision about two days later lol