Vitamins for Freddi (ball python)?

Our local Reptile store is now selling and advertising vitamins and supplements for reptiles including snakes. My question is are these needed? Is this something we should be sprinkling on the rats before we feed them to Freddi? I have seen vitamins for lizards that you sprinkle or feed to crickets or insects but I have never seen or heard of vitamins for snakes so I am really curious as to others experiences and thoughts. Thank you in advance!!!

they are unnecessary; your snake does not need supplements. :)

I figured as much. They were telling me that he needs Calcium and Vitamins due to his lack of getting natural sunlight. I wanted to check with you guys before I bought anything. Why would a snake need vitamins? or are there certain snakes that do?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PandaBurrr

I figured as much. They were telling me that he needs Calcium and Vitamins due to his lack of getting natural sunlight. I wanted to check with you guys before I bought anything. Why would a snake need vitamins? or are there certain snakes that do?

---

"they" obviously don't know what they're talking about. ball pythons don't need sunlight to survive/thrive. i do not know of any pet snakes that need supplements or require sunlight.

Amazing!!! Just puts my mind at ease. I trust the owner and a couple of the employees working there but not the store manager. I am aware that the employees are pushed to sell items by the store manager and these being new item i can see that being the case. But thank you from the bottom of my heart as I thought I had been doing our Freddi a diservice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PandaBurrr

Amazing!!! Just puts my mind at ease. I trust the owner and a couple of the employees working there but not the store manager. I am aware that the employees are pushed to sell items by the store manager and these being new item i can see that being the case. But thank you from the bottom of my heart as I thought I had been doing our Freddi a diservice.

---

you're very welcome. :)

Some reptiles do need supplements in captivity, but rarely snakes. Lizards usually do; bearded dragons, leopard geckos, skinks, etc.

However, snakes like your BP, eat whole food items. They get everything they need from their prey. Remember, they ingest the entire animal, bones, fur, muscle, etc.

Also, as already pointed out, nocturnal animals do not need UVB either.

Remember, not all reptiles are created equal. There is a big variance between types, species, localities, etc. What works for one does not necessarily work for another.

The biggest thing all reptiles in captivity have in common is that they need heat and need their keepers to create and maintain a proper environment for them.

Good to ask the question though. If I was told X should be done and I didn't do it, I would be worried too. However, here you have nothing to worry about!

Y'all really are amazing!!! Thanks so much!!!

So long as you give him a whole rodent diet of proper size he will get everything he needs from the bones of the rodent. A recent study was even done on ball pythons and it was found that they do not produce and or synthesize vitamin D3 from UVB exposure so they have even less reason to get supplements. Some snakes do benefit from UVB but ball pythons are not one of those snakes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PandaBurrr

Our local Reptile store is now selling and advertising vitamins and supplements for reptiles including snakes. My question is are these needed? ....

---

I've done some reading and thinking and a tiny bit of experimentation on this question. This is all IMO, and YMMV.

Mostly I agree with those who write that no extra supplements are needed for snakes eating a whole rodent diet. Exceptions are breeder females (usually), fast growing babies (sometimes) and snakes mostly eating obese rodents.

Pregnant human females need extra vitamins in the diet. So do females of domestic animals from trout to chickens. So why not snakes, too? We know of congenital defects in captive bred snakes, such as vertebral kinks and eye problems. Similar congenital defects have been diagnosed in domestic animals on vitamin deficient diets.

Boa constrictors have developed steatitis, a vitamin deficiency disease, after a steady high fat diet of obese rats.

To add vitamin D3 to a snake's diet, expose a live or fresh killed rodent to the UV rays in raw sunlight for 10-15 minutes. Window glass will not pass UV light.

The calcium in rodent bones is all that is needed, even bones of pinkie rodents. Calcium supplements may pass through a snake's gut unabsorbed (a waste of money). If absorbed, the calcium is likely to get deposited in various tissues causing gout (both injurious and a waste of money).

IMO, most of the supplements on the market of snakes were originally for lizards and mammals, where they may do some good. For snakes, the major benefit is to the marketers' wallets.

I have used liquid multiple vitamins for birds (the stuff used in bird drinking water) to supplement snake diets. One drop inserted in a dead rodent's belly once or twice in a two month period seems to do no harm to a baby corn snake. This was a 10 inch long runt from my breeding. She grew up and produced healthy babies for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

"they" obviously don't know what they're talking about. ball pythons don't need sunlight to survive/thrive. i do not know of any pet snakes that need supplements or require sunlight.

---

Garters and diamond pythons do better when provided with UVB -- and I think some people (at least in this garter FB group I'm in) add calcium supplements to their garter food. That might only be if/when they're feeding worms, though. Garters are weird lol. Most snakes seem to bask more when provided UVB, but that's mostly anecdotal. Corn snakes have scientifically shown a rise in D3 levels with given access to UVB. So, I wouldn't say they don't 'require' sunlight... just that it's possible for them to survive without it, if that makes any sense.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Starscream

Garters and diamond pythons do better when provided with UVB -- and I think some people (at least in this garter FB group I'm in) add calcium supplements to their garter food. That might only be if/when they're feeding worms, though. Garters are weird lol. Most snakes seem to bask more when provided UVB, but that's mostly anecdotal. Corn snakes have scientifically shown a rise in D3 levels with given access to UVB. So, I wouldn't say they don't 'require' sunlight... just that it's possible for them to survive without it, if that makes any sense.

---

interesting! i learn something new every day here. your input is much appreciated!!! [emoji4]

I am appreciating everyone's feedback sooo much. Everyone of you is amazing!!! I was, however, unaware that people kept garter snakes as pets. My apologies but, they eat worms??? Just so everyone is aware Freddi is outside a lot with my kids and I so he gets ample 🌞. I have learned so much with this thread. Thanks to everyone!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PandaBurrr

I was, however, unaware that people kept garter snakes as pets. My apologies but, they eat worms???

---

Some garters can -- some won't eat worms if their lives depended on it. It depends on the locality, but garters generally have an extremely varied diet that makes up for any deficiencies, like worms have. It's usually advised to upgrade them to mice as soon as they're able, or at least feed them pieces of mice pinkies within their diet. They're smol babs. And garters come in lots of colorful varieties, and have lots of interesting social behaviors that most other snakes don't typically display, and therefore make interesting pets.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SDA

So long as you give him a whole rodent diet of proper size he will get everything he needs from the bones of the rodent. A recent study was even done on ball pythons and it was found that they do not produce and or synthesize vitamin D3 from UVB exposure so they have even less reason to get supplements. Some snakes do benefit from UVB but ball pythons are not one of those snakes.

---

Could you post the link to that study, sounds rather interesting.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Starscream

Garters and diamond pythons do better when provided with UVB -- and I think some people (at least in this garter FB group I'm in) add calcium supplements to their garter food. That might only be if/when they're feeding worms, though. Garters are weird lol. Most snakes seem to bask more when provided UVB, but that's mostly anecdotal. Corn snakes have scientifically shown a rise in D3 levels with given access to UVB. So, I wouldn't say they don't 'require' sunlight... just that it's possible for them to survive without it, if that makes any sense.

---

Is there a study or anything on that for Diamond Pythons? I've been looking into them, the cooling and the price of entry is a bit daunting but it's always cool to read about them.
Edit: While anecdotal, I did hear that Bredli's showed brighter coloration when exposed to UVB. I have one of of those Zoo Med double domes on my IJ's tank so I may throw a UVB on a timer and see if it affects her behavior.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MD_Pythons

Is there a study or anything on that for Diamond Pythons? I've been looking into them, the cooling and the price of entry is a bit daunting but it's always cool to read about them.
Edit: While anecdotal, I did hear that Bredli's showed brighter coloration when exposed to UVB. I have one of of those Zoo Med double domes on my IJ's tank so I may throw a UVB on a timer and see if it affects her behavior.

---

Not so far as I'm aware, but they are highly susceptible to MBD, which leads me to believe that UVB can only benefit them, as well as general proper care and wintertime cooling.

This is the only thing I could find regarding UVB and diamond pythons: https://www.facebook.com/permalink.p...52353484849652

Also, if that BP study is the one I'm thinking of, they only used 6 female adult ball pythons for their UVB group.... and to quote Frances Baines:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Frances Baines

All the females in the experimental group (a batch from one owner) had extremely high 25(OH)D3 levels initially, compared to the control group (a batch from another owner) so the groups were not comparable from the start. Also, the females in both groups had far higher 25(OH)D3 levels than the males, both at the start and the end... the authors discuss the possibility of egg production stimulating raised serum 25(OH)D3 levels in these females. This surely raises the question as to whether, if vitamin D3 synthesis was indeed occurring in the females given UVB, any extra produced could have been transferred to developing eggs - which require high levels of vitamin D for embryonic development.

---