Temp Regulation Question

So I am very new to snake keeping and I absolutely love my about 4 month old Ball. Great Temper, good eater, etc.

On one side of my 40 gallon tank (yes I know this is big for a young ball, I have a lot of hides and plants for comfort), the hot side is regulated by an under tank heater and a thermostat, the ground temperature being about 95 degrees. I also have a dome lamp with a ceramic heater overhead to warm the air to what is a bit over 80.

However, my real problem is the cold side. It stays around 70-75 degrees which from what I read isn't appropriate. Sometimes the snake will stay around the cold side but moves back and fourth as it pleases (unsure of the gender right now). I don't think it is too uncomfortable because it still eats once a week and doesn't appear reckless in its tank. It just chills in hides.

Should I be worried? Is there anything I can do to fix this problem? It is also the winter time in NYC.

move the dome lamp closer to the cool side? 70-75° F is too low and i would be concerned; you need to get to at least 77° F.

also, 95° F is entirely too hot. the hot spot inside the enclosure shouldn't go above 92° F and i try to keep my hot spots around 90° F.

EDIT: welcome to the forum!!! :)
:welcome:

Got it!!! I'll give it a try. :)

Where are you taking the temp on the cool side? Against the glass will be cold unless you insulate that glass. If it is above 75 around the cool hide you are safe. Also remember stable temps are the most important thing you can provide. So long as the swing stays within say 3-5 degrees throughout a 24 hour period you aren't going to harm your snake.

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Originally Posted by SDA

Where are you taking the temp on the cool side? Against the glass will be cold unless you insulate that glass. If it is above 75 around the cool hide you are safe. Also remember stable temps are the most important thing you can provide. So long as the swing stays within say 3-5 degrees throughout a 24 hour period you aren't going to harm your snake.

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I use a probe to determine temp on the cold side. It usually stays bellow 75 though. I will be trying to move my CHE to above that area when I get home.

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Originally Posted by jadekris00

I use a probe to determine temp on the cold side. It usually stays bellow 75 though. I will be trying to move my CHE to above that area when I get home.

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do you have a probe thermometer for your hot spot as well?

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

do you have a probe thermometer for your hot spot as well?

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No. Should I? The thermometer has a probe attached to it that I usually look to.

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Originally Posted by jadekris00

No. Should I? The thermometer has a probe attached to it that I usually look to.

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i would move the probe over the hot spot below the substrate as you will always need to know this temperature. in all my enclosure i use one probed thermometer/hygrometer for the hot spot and one stand-alone thermometer/hygrometer for the cool side. you need to be measuring the hottest temperature your snake can touch, which would be below the substrate over the hot spot.

where were you taking your hot spot temperature readings before? above the substrate?

EDIT: here's a diagram that shows the standard way to set up a UTH, thermostat and probe thermometer:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...9edbeefb34.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

i would move the probe over the hot spot below the substrate as you will always need to know this temperature. in all my enclosure i use one probed thermometer/hygrometer for the hot spot and one stand-alone thermometer/hygrometer for the cool side. you need to be measuring the hottest temperature your snake can touch, which would be below the substrate over the hot spot.

where were you taking your hot spot temperature readings before? above the substrate?

EDIT: here's a diagram that shows the standard way to set up a UTH, thermostat and probe thermometer:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...9edbeefb34.jpg

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Great information as always. Wondering if you could reduce the need for two thermometer / hygrometer units and just get something like this:

https://www.acurite.com/digital-indo...r-00891a2.html

This way you could measure the hot side surface temp w/ your probe and sit the unit on the cool side to read both your ambients and humidity.

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Originally Posted by ckuhn003

Great information as always. Wondering if you could reduce the need for two thermometer / hygrometer units and just get something like this:

https://www.acurite.com/digital-indo...r-00891a2.html

This way you could measure the hot side surface temp w/ your probe and sit the unit on the cool side to read both your ambients and humidity.

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you're totally right! 2 is kind of over-kill, but for me, i like having more than one reading from different sources. it eases my anxiety. :)

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

you're totally right! 2 is kind of over-kill, but for me, i like having more than one reading from different sources. it eases my anxiety. :)

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Phew! Taking care of these creatures can be a little overwhelming at 1st so I was worried I might be forgetting to measure a certain area of the cage ;)

I would avoid placing the digital LCD readout portion of any acurite inside a cage that requires moderate to high humidity. They are not water resistant and the LCD screen can often fault. The cost for these items are so nominal that getting two distinct thermometer or hygrometers with remote or cabled probes is far better.

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Originally Posted by ckuhn003

Phew! Taking care of these creatures can be a little overwhelming at 1st so I was worried I might be forgetting to measure a certain area of the cage ;)

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no no no i'm just a spaz. :P
:taz:

- delete -

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Originally Posted by SDA

I would avoid placing the digital LCD readout portion of any acurite inside a cage that requires moderate to high humidity. They are not water resistant and the LCD screen can often fault. The cost for these items are so nominal that getting two distinct thermometer or hygrometers with remote or cabled probes is far better.

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While this is true, if you take it out while misting then put it back in, it will be fine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SDA

I would avoid placing the digital LCD readout portion of any acurite inside a cage that requires moderate to high humidity. They are not water resistant and the LCD screen can often fault. The cost for these items are so nominal that getting two distinct thermometer or hygrometers with remote or cabled probes is far better.

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I have 4 of these Indoor/Outdoor Probe/Humidity Acurites going for years now. Not a single problem with Humidity at 58-72% and I wipe them down with F10 too. I love them.
https://www.acurite.com/digital-indo...5963_c10e488a5

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

i would move the probe over the hot spot below the substrate as you will always need to know this temperature. in all my enclosure i use one probed thermometer/hygrometer for the hot spot and one stand-alone thermometer/hygrometer for the cool side. you need to be measuring the hottest temperature your snake can touch, which would be below the substrate over the hot spot.

where were you taking your hot spot temperature readings before? above the substrate?

EDIT: here's a diagram that shows the standard way to set up a UTH, thermostat and probe thermometer:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...9edbeefb34.jpg

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Yes, I had my probes under the substrate as shown.

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Originally Posted by jadekris00

Yes, I had my probes under the substrate as shown.

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have you moved the lamp over? any luck raising your cool side temp and lowering your hot spot temp?

So i had my CHE over the cool side over night. It was about 73 degrees when i woke. This also happened to be over my humidity gauge so it made it seem as if the humidity was dangerously low, and had to move that over. Any other suggestions?

I also have another, smaller UTH attached to my tank. The day I set up I had gotten the Zoo Med UTH that was too small for my tank size and didn't want to remove it since I knew it would become damaged. I simple got a bigger, correctly sized one and attached it to the other side and unplugged the smaller one.

Is it time that I use this one as well? I would like to avoid buying a whole other thermometer.

Yes! There was not much change. I have also lowered my thermometer to 92.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jadekris00

So i had my CHE over the cool side over night. It was about 73 degrees when i woke. This also happened to be over my humidity gauge so it made it seem as if the humidity was dangerously low, and had to move that over. Any other suggestions?

I also have another, smaller UTH attached to my tank. The day I set up I had gotten the Zoo Med UTH that was too small for my tank size and didn't want to remove it since I knew it would become damaged. I simple got a bigger, correctly sized one and attached it to the other side and unplugged the smaller one.

Is it time that I use this one as well? I would like to avoid buying a whole other thermometer.

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lamps always cause lower humidity, but you can combat this a number of ways: sphagnum moss, a damp towel laid over a hide, regular misting, bigger water dish, water dish under the bulb, covering any mesh tops with plexiglass or a damp bath towel. and i don't think you need to use the second UTH; keep working with your bulb and regulation until you're hitting optimum temps.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jadekris00

Yes! There was not much change. I have also lowered my thermometer to 92.

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like i said above: keep adjusting it until you're hitting 77° F. is the bulb regulated by a rheostat/dimmer? or a thermostat?

also do you mean thermoSTAT instead of thermoMETER? they're two totally different things and the distinction is important in this hobby.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

lamps always cause lower humidity, but you can combat this a number of ways: sphagnum moss, a damp towel laid over a hide, regular misting, bigger water dish, water dish under the bulb, covering any mesh tops with plexiglass or a damp bath towel. and i don't think you need to use the second UTH; keep working with your bulb and regulation until you're hitting optimum temps.



like i said above: keep adjusting it until you're hitting 77° F. is the bulb regulated by a rheostat/dimmer? or a thermostat?

also do you mean thermoSTAT instead of thermoMETER? they're two totally different things and the distinction is important in this hobby.

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I meant thermostat. Brain fart. :P

The thermostat is plugged into the UTH. I don't have one for the CHE. I also keep humidity up in my tank with misting and moss sheets.

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Originally Posted by jadekris00

I meant thermostat. Brain fart. :P

The thermostat is plugged into the UTH. I don't have one for the CHE. I also keep humidity up in my tank with misting and moss sheets.

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sorry i HAD to clarify lol.

what wattage is the CHE? and what size is the enclosure? you might need a stronger bulb to reach optimum temps.

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

sorry i HAD to clarify lol.

what wattage is the CHE? and what size is the enclosure? you might need a stronger bulb to reach optimum temps.

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It is a 40 gallon tank with an 100w bulb. The box read that it was for 30-40 gallon tanks.

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Originally Posted by jadekris00

It is a 40 gallon tank with an 100w bulb. The box read that it was for 30-40 gallon tanks.

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that sounds right. i'd still get a little $10 lamp dimmer (rheostat) for it (all heat sources must be regulated) and see if you can dial it in. also, if your enclosure is a bit tall then of course the heat will have a harder time reaching the floor, which you can compensate for by using a higher wattage bulb.

it's all like a mini science experiment. testing, testing, failing, and more testing.

EDIT as an anecdote: i used a 100W CHE on a rheostat for my 20gal (24x12x12), but i only turned it up the tiiiiiiiniest bit to reach 77° F.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

that sounds right. i'd still get a little $10 lamp dimmer (rheostat) for it (all heat sources must be regulated) and see if you can dial it in. also, if your enclosure is a bit tall then of course the heat will have a harder time reaching the floor, which you can compensate for by using a higher wattage bulb.

it's all like a mini science experiment. testing, testing, failing, and more testing.

EDIT as an anecdote: i used a 100W CHE on a rheostat for my 20gal (24x12x12), but i only turned it up the tiiiiiiiniest bit to reach 77° F.

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Will do!! I a currently looking at a 150w CHE and a dimmer on amazon and will be purchasing that soon. In the summer months I can probably switch back to the 100 w since it gets hot in the house. Thanks so much!! Hope I can keep my baby comfortable.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jadekris00

Will do!! I a currently looking at a 150w CHE and a dimmer on amazon and will be purchasing that soon. In the summer months I can probably switch back to the 100 w since it gets hot in the house. Thanks so much!! Hope I can keep my baby comfortable.

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you're soooooo close to perfect. you'll get there. :)