Pastel Clown Ball Python or not?

Hello,

I recently bought a female Pastel Clown Ball Python from a reputable seller. It is supposed to be a Pastel Clown, but even from the pictures he sent me before buying, I felt that it had no Pastel it. I told the seller that the head and eyes didn't look like a Pastel's, bu he insisted that it was 100% a Pastel Clown. I took some pictures after receiving the animal yesterday. Can you please give me some help here:

Thank you in advance.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...psf1bnljnv.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...psqktsyfgc.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...ps5034gnz1.jpg

Feathers if I know but WOW gorgeous noodle congratulations 😊 clown is a breathtaking morph 😍

Lovely snake!

I'm not qualified to answer either, but after having looked at a lot of examples of both on google id be questioning it too. Some pastels do have a lot more blushing than others it seems.

I'm not seeing a Pastel Clown BUT I am not thinking that is just a Clown either.....

Morphs are definitely not my strong suit, but don't pastels generally have green eyes?

The head stamp is completely different than any pastel clown I’ve ever seen not to mention the color of the whole snake doesn’t look pastel to me.

The thing is, if you saw it and still decided to buy it as what it was listed as, then there is not much you can do about it. The breeder may have made a mistake but that happens with identifying morphs sometimes, so you should really only purchase if the animal looks how you think it should, there really is no guarantee that ID is going to be correct and it gets harder the more combinations that are possible. I would trust some breeders more over others but I’m sure even the best have made some mistakes.

Now this is completely different than buying an animal that is sold as a 100% het because that is not a judgment, that is a known fact so if a breeder were to sell an animal that was not a het but guaranteed that it was, that is lying and they would lose all credibility and should be held responsible for giving you your money back.

i'm not sure about the Pastel; the eyes would be green and her head stamp does not match other Pastel Clowns. but there's definitely more than just Clown in her.

Do you know what the pairing was that produced this animal?

The blushing on that clown is nice but the head pattern (different clowns have very distinct head patter) and coloration are wrong for a Pastel Clown (not sure are a reputable breeder would miss that but I guess some do :rolleyes:)

Here are some pastel clown I produced for reference, see the head pattern

http://i67.tinypic.com/rtzyf5.jpg

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Originally Posted by C.Marie

Feathers if I know but WOW gorgeous noodle congratulations 😊 clown is a breathtaking morph 😍

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Thank you!

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Originally Posted by UKElliotSnake

Lovely snake!

I'm not qualified to answer either, but after having looked at a lot of examples of both on google id be questioning it too. Some pastels do have a lot more blushing than others it seems.

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Thank you, I’m guessing this has something, but no Pastel...

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

I'm not seeing a Pastel Clown BUT I am not thinking that is just a Clown either.....

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Same here, what would your guess be?

Absolutely. I still think the seller is responsible for selling something different. Though, in my case, I’m not looking for a refund or anything. I don’t like the Pastel gene anyway, I grabbed this for a very good price from an auction...

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

i'm not sure about the Pastel; the eyes would be green and her head stamp does not match other Pastel Clowns. but there's definitely more than just Clown in her.

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I am thinking the same, but what could the other gene be?

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Originally Posted by Deborah

The blushing on that clown is nice but the head pattern (different clowns have very distinct head patter) and coloration are wrong for a Pastel Clown (not sure are a reputable breeder would miss that but I guess some do :rolleyes:)

Here are some pastel clown I produced for reference, see the head pattern

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...com/rtzyf5.jpg

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Thank you for the input. Do you think this animal has some other gene maybe?

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Originally Posted by amok

Thank you for the input. Do you think this animal has some other gene maybe?

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I would say there is a good chance, I have never seen a single gene clown with that much blushing, the problem is those days there are so many different mutation that are subtle and that produce very similar results that it would be hard to guess.

When you purchase the snake were you told what the pairing was?

Could that be a Black Pastel Clown?

Sent from my LGL22C using Tapatalk

Beautiful snake! I see Clown, nothing else.

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Originally Posted by cchardwick

Beautiful snake! I see Clown, nothing else.

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Agreed, i can only see the clown. what was the pairing?

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Originally Posted by Deborah

I would say there is a good chance, I have never seen a single gene clown with that much blushing, the problem is those days there are so many different mutation that are subtle and that produce very similar results that it would be hard to guess.

When you purchase the snake were you told what the pairing was?

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Unfortunately, the seller I got this from bought it from some overseas breeder. So, the pairing is unknown.

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Originally Posted by NPE76

Could that be a Black Pastel Clown?

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What makes you think it may have Black Pastel

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Originally Posted by cchardwick

Beautiful snake! I see Clown, nothing else.

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Thank you. I guess it is infact just a Clown. So, no chance there is Pastel here?

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Originally Posted by dylan815

Agreed, i can only see the clown. what was the pairing?

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Unfortunately, the seller I got this from bought it from some overseas breeder. So, the pairing is unknown.

Pastel Clowns and Killer Clowns have what i like to refer to as muertes skull or sugar skull headstamps. also not Black Pastel Clown either - they have bald heads and the colors are off.

i think it's just a blushed Clown and there's nothing else at work (unless it's influenced by being het for another recessive gene).

I'm the last person to ask about bp morphs lol. But, IMO it reminds me of a fire clown..? With some dark shading, there might be something else as well. But then again I see plain ol clown not a problem with that! Gorgeous snake nonetheless!

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Originally Posted by GpBp

I'm the last person to ask about bp morphs lol. But, IMO it reminds me of a fire clown..? With some dark shading, there might be something else as well. But then again I see plain ol clown not a problem with that! Gorgeous snake nonetheless!

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It's definitely not a fire clown. The fire would make it much brighter and at a young age also much more contrasting. Without knowing what the parents were it's impossible to ID with any certainty so I would go with clown with nice blushing.

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Originally Posted by Ax01

Pastel Clowns and Killer Clowns have what i like to refer to as muertes skull or sugar skull headstamps. also not Black Pastel Clown either - they have bald heads and the colors are off.

i think it's just a blushed Clown and there's nothing else at work (unless it's influenced by being het for another recessive gene).

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Thank you. I am pretty happy with a Clown without Pastel actually, I don’t like what Pastel does to Clown, especially as the animal ages. What I can’t accept is the seller’s ignorance, he still tells me that this is indeed a Pastel Clown, unbelieveable :)

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Originally Posted by rufretic

It's definitely not a fire clown. The fire would make it much brighter and at a young age also much more contrasting. Without knowing what the parents were it's impossible to ID with any certainty so I would go with clown with nice blushing.

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Thanks. I guess the seller made a mistake or was decieved by the breeder he got the animal from, the seller still insists that this is a Pastel Clown :) I am almost sure that it isn’t now.

I have a baby clown and a older pastel clown the first is a normal clown and the second and third are a pastel clown. I’d say a clown with possibly something else but not pastel https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...05971ff01e.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...edc3a64f00.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...6580f41e19.jpg


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Originally Posted by Ellis.brown01

I have a baby clown and a older pastel clown the first is a normal clown and the second and third are a pastel clown. I’d say a clown with possibly something else but not pastel https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...05971ff01e.jpghttps://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...edc3a64f00.jpghttps://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...6580f41e19.jpg


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Wow, your clown looks so clean and beautiful. Thank you for the pics, I guess mine is just a plain old Clown.

By the way, which Clown would you prefer, a clean or a blushed one?

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Originally Posted by amok

Wow, your clown looks so clean and beautiful. Thank you for the pics, I guess mine is just a plain old Clown.

By the way, which Clown would you prefer, a clean or a blushed one?

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I love all clowns and you cant beat a normal clown in my opinion.

So, case closed then? This is just a normal Clown? :)

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Originally Posted by Ellis.brown01

I love all clowns and you cant beat a normal clown in my opinion.

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I love them all too and a regular clown is beautiful but I wouldn’t say you can’t beat it, there are some amazing combos out there. I do like the look of a regular clown over pastel clown and a few other clown combos though. But once you start adding fire, leopard, spotnose, butter/lesser, desert ghost, etc, etc, lol, there are a lot that blow the regular clowns away, at least imho and it’s good everyone has their own opinion either way. ;)

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Originally Posted by amok

So, case closed then? This is just a normal Clown? :)

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Not really, you’ll just probably never know for sure lol. She is definitely not your average regular clown, but she isn’t different enough to be able to ID an additional morph either. This is why it’s important to know what the parents were, at least if you want to know what the combo is, otherwise it’s just a guess. Without knowing it’s best to just call her clown but if you decide to breed her, then you may be able to prove otherwise.

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Originally Posted by rufretic

I love them all too and a regular clown is beautiful but I wouldn’t say you can’t beat it, there are some amazing combos out there. I do like the look of a regular clown over pastel clown and a few other clown combos though. But once you start adding fire, leopard, spotnose, butter/lesser, desert ghost, etc, etc, lol, there are a lot that blow the regular clowns away, at least imho and it’s good everyone has their own opinion either way. ;)




Not really, you’ll just probably never know for sure lol. She is definitely not your average regular clown, but she isn’t different enough to be able to ID an additional morph either. This is why it’s important to know what the parents were, at least if you want to know what the combo is, otherwise it’s just a guess. Without knowing it’s best to just call her clown but if you decide to breed her, then you may be able to prove otherwise.

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I didn’t really mean you can’t beat it because like you say there are so many amazing clown combos out there. I should’ve said you can’t fault it. But I like the simplicity of it and it will always be one on my favourites.


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Originally Posted by rufretic

Not really, you’ll just probably never know for sure lol. She is definitely not your average regular clown, but she isn’t different enough to be able to ID an additional morph either. This is why it’s important to know what the parents were, at least if you want to know what the combo is, otherwise it’s just a guess. Without knowing it’s best to just call her clown but if you decide to breed her, then you may be able to prove otherwise.

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I would love to know what other gene she has, if she has any. But, I guess I'll be calling her Clown for the timebeing.

It would be a waste but you would have to break her down with a normal......

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Originally Posted by Ellis.brown01

I love all clowns and you cant beat a normal clown in my opinion.

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I don’t particularly like the clown morph at all. The head stamp and the weird colors just doesn’t do it for me.
However I have to agree with you, that that “plain old clown” looks nicer than a lot of the weird clown combos.
Just my little, unimportant opinion.


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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

It would be a waste but you would have to break her down with a normal......

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I am not into breeding, in the near future at least :)

Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Godzilla78

I don’t particularly like the clown morph at all. The head stamp and the weird colors just doesn’t do it for me.
However I have to agree with you, that that “plain old clown” looks nicer than a lot of the weird clown combos.
Just my little, unimportant opinion.


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Same here, though Fire or Enchi or OD or YB or Leopard clowns are awesome :)