Pictures of new girl

Here are a couple pictures from tonight of the new girl I picked up 2 weeks ago. She is an 03 and needs some weight on her. Since arriving at the Glass house, she has eaten 2 small rats in 2 weeks and had a shed. She already looks fatter! Now she needs a name...

http://www.glassreptiles.com/pictures/newgirl1.jpg

http://www.glassreptiles.com/pictures/newgirl2.jpg

nice blushing and color :) how old(what month) & what weight??

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Originally Posted by daniel1983

nice blushing and color :) how old(what month) & what weight??

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She weighed at 334 empty when I got her. Sorry, I said she is 2, she was born 6/2004. She is a little over 1. She is still a bit light for sure. She was only fed a mouse per week. No more of that! She has some amazing color and possibly by next season she may be ready to go.

she could definately use some more food :) my girl is a 7/2004 and is 1100g+ ....get her on a good feeding schedule and she should be able to go next season...about how long is she?

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Originally Posted by daniel1983

she could definately use some more food :) my girl is a 7/2004 and is 1100g+ ....get her on a good feeding schedule and she should be able to go next season...about how long is she?

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And she will get some. All rats all the time in this house! :)

She is about 2.5 feet.

Not bad for $50...

Kyna is a late 03 (best we can figure October 03), 33 inches long, 500 grams as of last week empty. She also never had more than one small mouse every week or so. Until we switched her over to multiple mice and now rat weans...man that chicka can eat!


~~Jo~~

At that size you should be able to give her a small rat weekly. If my 350 gram girl is taking small rats with ease, it shouldnt be an issue.

good catch jamie! just get her feeding weekly she'll pick up the weight. those rats will pack it on. a couple a week and she plump up!


vaughn

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Originally Posted by kavmon

good catch jamie! just get her feeding weekly she'll pick up the weight. those rats will pack it on. a couple a week and she plump up!


vaughn

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A couple dude? Maybe that is why I dont have any 3000 gram snakes. I never feed any of them more than 1 small rat per week. From the biggest adult to the smallest, they all get the same.

i have 2 girls that have been eating 3 a week for the past 4 months! they have both gained about 900 grams this year. they are 2300+ and 2400+ grams now. if they are breeder girls and they will eat 2 a week i'll feed them.
if they start to get too thick or the skin shows between the scales i'll back them off a bit. most of mine eat 1 rat but sometimes they will take 2, when they want 2 i do it.


vaughn

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Originally Posted by kavmon

i have 2 girls that have been eating 3 a week for the past 4 months! they have both gained about 900 grams this year. they are 2300+ and 2400+ grams now. if they are breeder girls and they will eat 2 a week i'll feed them.
if they start to get too thick or the skin shows between the scales i'll back them off a bit. most of mine eat 1 rat but sometimes they will take 2, when they want 2 i do it.


vaughn

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That is good stuff. I would like to see Adam's opinion on the whole thing. Sometimes I feel like they are hungry right after one small rat. Maybe its time to go back to mediums for the bigger ones.

i can't speak for adam, but i know he can raise up some big yearlings! i've seen some his yearlings at 1200 grams plus. he feeds small rats no bigger and the main thing is that they feed steady every week.


vaughn

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Originally Posted by kavmon

i can't speak for adam, but i know he can raise up some big yearlings! i've seen some his yearlings at 1200 grams plus. he feeds small rats no bigger and the main thing is that they feed steady every week.


vaughn

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I do the same. So why am I not getting the gains that he is? Mine eat every week no fail.

he feeds multiples on the ones that will eat more, but only once a week . alot of people will feed there snakes alot like 3-4 times a week to get them big. i think feeding multiples only once a week is enough and it gives the snake time in between digesting.


vaughn

This week the youngest one Rionach will get one nice fat wean as it was obviously a good meal for her last time (took her awhile to get it down)....the next oldest Kyna will go to two rat weans or a small rat as it was obviously not a good meal for her (she continued to look for more but since it was the first rat feeding we wanted to go slow)....Saoirse will start very small (when she's ready) as her digestion has been shut down for months and I'm scared of a regurg if I push her too large, too fast.


~~Jo~~

Oh and Jamie, that's an awful oooooooogly girl, you really should send her to my house (Franchino's Home for Wayward Snakes aka Camp Hiss & Slither) LOL.

Seriously tho, she's a sweetheart. Great find! I hope she'll do well for you and make some lovely babies one day.


~~Jo~~

She's gorgeous!!! Nice find!

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Originally Posted by frankykeno

Oh and Jamie, that's an awful oooooooogly girl, you really should send her to my house (Franchino's Home for Wayward Snakes aka Camp Hiss & Slither) LOL.

Seriously tho, she's a sweetheart. Great find! I hope she'll do well for you and make some lovely babies one day.


~~Jo~~

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Ill send her right over! not!!! hehehe....She rocks..

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Originally Posted by rabernet

She's gorgeous!!! Nice find!

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Thanks!!

well I see that every body is talking about feeding sow I have a Q I feed my female 2 mice peer week shes on 300g and I dont weigh her wen I bot her


these is a pic wen she first came like this:
http://tinypic.com/dnk1l2.jpg
http://tinypic.com/dnk2gk.jpg
and now shes like these:
http://tinypic.com/dnk2sz.jpg
http://tinypic.com/dnk301.jpg
and shes has ben only a moth with me, sow she has gorwn, what do you guys think?:D

if she is eating every week, i don't see a problem. if she slows down or gets picky and doesn't eat one week, i'd go back to 1 mouse a week. the big thing is that she eats steady all year long if possible. alot will take 2-3 rodents then they might take a week or so off, or start a fast. if you can keep them eating weekly you will see more growth.


vaughn

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Originally Posted by jglass38

That is good stuff. I would like to see Adam's opinion on the whole thing. Sometimes I feel like they are hungry right after one small rat. Maybe its time to go back to mediums for the bigger ones.

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For me, multiple smaller meals work out much better than single large meals. I just weighed some 04 girls this morning and I have a bunch that are 1700 grams. They've been fed once a week all year. Once they hit 600 - 700 grams they get bumped up from chubs to what I can "small small" rats. 40-50 gram range. They always take 1 per week and sometimes 2 but usually never more. That's 400 grams of rats per month. If they can retain 100 grams of that, then I'm cooking with gas!! .... 100 grams growth per month should be doable. It doesn't always work out (I've got some 03 girls that are 900 grams because they like to eat the chubs still), but if you work with enough animals, you'll be able to identify the ones that are going to grow like nuts within a couple of feedings.

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

For me, multiple smaller meals work out much better than single large meals. I just weighed some 04 girls this morning and I have a bunch that are 1700 grams. They've been fed once a week all year. Once they hit 600 - 700 grams they get bumped up from chubs to what I can "small small" rats. 40-50 gram range. They always take 1 per week and sometimes 2 but usually never more. That's 400 grams of rats per month. If they can retain 100 grams of that, then I'm cooking with gas!! .... 100 grams growth per month should be doable. It doesn't always work out (I've got some 03 girls that are 900 grams because they like to eat the chubs still), but if you work with enough animals, you'll be able to identify the ones that are going to grow like nuts within a couple of feedings.

-adam

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That would involve weighing the rats considering that all vendors seems to sell a small rat at different sizes. I am trying to stick with Rodent Pro though which is usually pretty consistent in size.

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Originally Posted by jglass38

That would involve weighing the rats considering that all vendors seems to sell a small rat at different sizes. I am trying to stick with Rodent Pro though which is usually pretty consistent in size.

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With all of the feeding I do, I've just learned how to look at a rat and tell how much it weighs. I'm not percise, but close enough. If you want the growth, ya gotta do the do!

I wonder if the difference in feeder types accounts for some of the difference in weight gain? (I tried to word that delicately so as to not start WWIII).

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

With all of the feeding I do, I've just learned how to look at a rat and tell how much it weighs. I'm not percise, but close enough. If you want the growth, ya gotta do the do!

I wonder if the difference in feeder types accounts for some of the difference in weight gain? (I tried to word that delicately so as to not start WWIII).

-adam

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I feed a small every week but I am might bump the females up to 2 if they are hungry.

What kind of war would that start?

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Originally Posted by jglass38

What kind of war would that start?

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The whole F/T vs. live thing.

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

The whole F/T vs. live thing.

-adam

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Those are fun debates!! :0

I nearly got myself banned from another forum for starting a war on that subject. But it was more because I just didn't like the attitude this guy had about the whole thing.

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Originally Posted by jglass38

Those are fun debates!! :0

I nearly got myself banned from another forum for starting a war on that subject. But it was more because I just didn't like the attitude this guy had about the whole thing.

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Well sadly, while ball python growth on a diet of F/T vs. a diet of live is certainly a topic that should be discussed, the myths about live feeding and the attitudes of people that are anti-live feeding probably make it way too much of a hot button issue for that to ever happen on a message board anywhere.

If feeding F/T weren't so much of a PIA for me, I might actually take the time to do some actual research on the subject. I've done it for mice vs. rats with fantastic results! ... Personally, I'd be curious from a scientific standpoint.

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Well sadly, while ball python growth on a diet of F/T vs. a diet of live is certainly a topic that should be discussed, the myths about live feeding and the attitudes of people that are anti-live feeding probably make it way too much of a hot button issue for that to ever happen on a message board anywhere.

If feeding F/T weren't so much of a PIA for me, I might actually take the time to do some actual research on the subject. I've done it for mice vs. rats with fantastic results! ... Personally, I'd be curious from a scientific standpoint.

-adam

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I am not anti live feeding when done properly but I also feel for myself that I would rather feed FT if possible. Its a personal opinion and I try hard not to impose my feelings on others. Although sometimes I fail there. I would be curious too to see the difference. I can understand the rat vs mouse thing as they are physically different and contain different protein/fat values but how would there be a difference between live and ft?

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Originally Posted by jglass38

I am not anti live feeding when done properly but I also feel for myself that I would rather feed FT if possible. Its a personal opinion and I try hard not to impose my feelings on others. Although sometimes I fail there. I would be curious too to see the difference. I can understand the rat vs mouse thing as they are physically different and contain different protein/fat values but how would there be a difference between live and ft?

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I feed both F/T and Live -
To tell you the truth, it's a bit irritating defrosting the rats everytime and it doesn't smell that good inside either.
Dealing with live is much easier, and to tell you the truth, I see better feeding responses with live, but then again that's just me.
Other's might have better feeding responses with Frozen.

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Originally Posted by Leon

I feed both F/T and Live -
To tell you the truth, it's a bit irritating defrosting the rats everytime and it doesn't smell that good inside either.
Dealing with live is much easier, and to tell you the truth, I see better feeding responses with live, but then again that's just me.
Other's might have better feeding responses with Frozen.

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I can't say I notice a smell when defrosting. I leave them in the sink in a piece of tupperware and run hot water continuously for about 10 minutes and theyre ready. As far as live, for me, it would be much more difficult to get it. I would have to go out every week to buy. I dont want to breed or keep any rodents in the house. Too much smell and trouble. As far as feeding response, its spectacular every time. Thats just my opinion and experiences though!

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Originally Posted by jglass38

I can understand the rat vs mouse thing as they are physically different and contain different protein/fat values but how would there be a difference between live and ft?

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Well, contrary to popular belief, I've found that rats and mice really work the same for putting weight on a ball python. I have 2 pairs of sisters that I produced and for each pair raised one on mice and the other on rats and in both cases the sisters are within 30-40 grams of each other.

As far as the difference made by freezing ... It's pretty common knowledge that freezing effects proteins (and other nutrients) on the cellular level. Since cells are mostly water, the freezing/thawing (ie. contraction/expansion) process damages the cellular walls. One common belief is that a F/T piece of meat is signifigantly lower in nutritional content than a fresh piece of meet (I've actually talked to some butchers that dropped some major knowledge on me about the topic). Of course without knowing the nutrional requirements of a ball python, no one can say for certain if a F/T rodent with a lower nutritonal content (even they even do have lower nutritional contents in the first place) than a live rodent would actually have an adverse effect, but it's certainly an interesting question. We still have so much to learn!

-adam

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Originally Posted by Leon

I feed both F/T and Live -
To tell you the truth, it's a bit irritating defrosting the rats everytime and it doesn't smell that good inside either.
Dealing with live is much easier, and to tell you the truth, I see better feeding responses with live, but then again that's just me.
Other's might have better feeding responses with Frozen.

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Really, lets not start doing this. Maybe if anyone comes along and wants to share they can jump on another thread that deals specifically with live vs. f/t ... This thread is really about ball python growth, and not how we choose to feed.

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Well, contrary to popular belief, I've found that rats and mice really work the same for putting weight on a ball python. I have 2 pairs of sisters that I produced and for each pair raised one on mice and the other on rats and in both cases the sisters are within 30-40 grams of each other.

As far as the difference made by freezing ... It's pretty common knowledge that freezing effects proteins (and other nutrients) on the cellular level. Since cells are mostly water, the freezing/thawing (ie. contraction/expansion) process damages the cellular walls. One common belief is that a F/T piece of meat is signifigantly lower in nutritional content than a fresh piece of meet (I've actually talked to some butchers that dropped some major knowledge on me about the topic). Of course without knowing the nutrional requirements of a ball python, no one can say for certain if a F/T rodent with a lower nutritonal content (even they even do have lower nutritional contents in the first place) than a live rodent would actually have an adverse effect, but it's certainly an interesting question. We still have so much to learn!

-adam

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That is some interesting stuff there!

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Really, lets not start doing this. Maybe if anyone comes along and wants to share they can jump on another thread that deals specifically with live vs. f/t ... This thread is really about ball python growth, and not how we choose to feed.

-adam

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Sorry for the thread hijacking. I'll leave it by saying that my balls are a nice size..muahaha...

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Originally Posted by jglass38

I'll leave it by saying that my balls are a nice size..muahaha...

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That's why I get so excited every time you email me! ;)

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

That's why I get so excited every time you email me! ;)

-adam

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Most people are excited by my balls. They are quite normal but still beautiful! Maybe in the future i'll have some more interesting ones to show the world! :)

I am such a two year old..

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Originally Posted by jglass38

I am such a two year old..

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That's why we all talk slow and avoid using big words around you. :D

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

That's why we all talk slow and avoid using big words around you. :D

-adam

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uhhh..mmm..uhh..duuuhhhh...errrrr...

boys......boys......boys

You know this just confirms my theory that the first person who had contact with these snakes and called them "ball" pythons was a guy. And he had a wife somewhere in the background going...

"for gawd's sakes George you can't seriously be thinking of calling them THAT!"

:P


~~Jo~~

P.S. Jamie, I typed this post r e a l l y s l o w l y so it would be easier for you to read dear.

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Originally Posted by frankykeno

boys......boys......boys


You know this just confirms my theory that the first person who had contact with these snakes and called them "ball" pythons was a guy. And he had a wife somewhere in the background going...

"for gawd's sakes George you can't seriously be thinking of calling them THAT!"

:P




~~Jo~~

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I dont doubt it. Women are ALWAYS trying to ruin our fun. :)

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Originally Posted by jglass38

I dont doubt it. Women are ALWAYS trying to ruin our fun. :)

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So you're saying you have more fun with dudes than women? (not that there's anything wrong with that).

:twisted:

I could get myself in soooo much trouble at this point ... I'll just stop. ;)

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

So you're saying you have more fun with dudes than women? (not that there's anything wrong with that).

:twisted:

I could get myself in soooo much trouble at this point ... I'll just stop. ;)

-adam

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Wow! THATS what you got out of my statement? I was speaking more of alcohol and strippers...hahahah

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Originally Posted by jglass38

Wow! THATS what you got out of my statement? I was speaking more of alcohol and strippers...hahahah

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Women make alcohol and female strippers even better! ;)

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Women make alcohol and female strippers even better! ;)

-adam

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See what you've done to this thread? I can't take you anywhere!

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Women make alcohol and female strippers even better! ;)

-adam

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Wait, and you were telling me not to bring up Live and F/T, because this thread is about ball python growth?
Seems you need to listen to your own words, and stay on topic.

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Originally Posted by Leon

Wait, and you were telling me not to bring up Live and F/T, because this thread is about ball python growth?
Seems you need to listen to your own words, and stay on topic.

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Lighten up Francis ... I was asking everyone not to bring up live and F/T because it's a volatile topic that usually ends up in what the admins call "flaming" and threads being locked and nasty PM's getting sent. And guess who takes the heat for it??? .... yours truly. Try taking a look at the big picture before you go puffing your chest at me again. I'm not impressed.

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Listen up Francis ... I was asking everyone not to bring up live and F/T because it's a volatile topic that usually ends up in what the admins call "flaming" and threads being locked and nasty PM's getting sent. And guess who takes the heat for it??? .... Yours truly. Try taking a look at the big picture before you go puffing your chest at me again. I'm not impressed.

-adam

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I apologize if I started any of this. Just me having a good time and sparking some meaningful conversation. We tend to go off topic a bit around here for sure but I understand what Adam is saying. The topic is volatile and I am responsible for bringing it up and taking the entire thread off topic. Anyone want to talk about snack cakes :)

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Lighten up Francis ... I was asking everyone not to bring up live and F/T because it's a volatile topic that usually ends up in what the admins call "flaming" and threads being locked and nasty PM's getting sent. And guess who takes the heat for it??? .... yours truly. Try taking a look at the big picture before you go puffing your chest at me again. I'm not impressed.

-adam

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Actually Hernanadow, You specially quoted me.
And if you looked at the big picture, you'd realize my post on F/t and Live had to do with growth, so I wasn't going off topic.
I wasn't saying, "Feeding Live is bad, etc" -
I specially even said I do both live and f/t.

In my previous post I said "I get a better feeding response"
Better feeding response = Better Growth ....
I have had Morgan take down multiple live rats, yet she won't take another F/t Rat after the first.

Also, you'd think since you seem to be trying inforce staying on topic here, you'd do the same, instead of getting defensive, when I quote your own words back to you.

Personally, I don't care if you two have a conversation on here with eachother.
I just wanted to see what you had to say now, after you broke your own little no going off topic comment. :neener:

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Originally Posted by Leon

Actually Hernanadow, You specially quoted me.
And if you looked at the big picture, you'd realize my post on F/t and Live had to do with growth, so I wasn't going off topic.

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Your post mentioned NOTHING about growth. You just chimed in with your "I feed live this" and "F/T doesn't have a smell" and "live is easier" which served no purpose at all in the context of the general conversation other than you tooting your own horn ... I could go ahead and quote your post again if you want.

My response was not intended to keep the thread from going off topic in general, but to specifically keep the thread from going off topic and turning into a live vs. F/T feeding debate for the reasons I stated. You have no idea the heat I get for "flames" about live vs. F/T that I participate in and I'm not going to let a thread I am trying to share good information in get dragged in that direction by anyone.

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Originally Posted by Leon

Also, you'd think since you seem to be trying inforce staying on topic here, you'd do the same, instead of getting defensive, when I quote your own words back to you.

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Again, for whatever reason, you missed the point ... trolling maybe? I could not care less about the thread going off topic, what I do care about is preventing the thread from becoming a chest thumping contest for people to brag about how they like to feed their snakes. There are a ton of other threads on this site that might not be locked on that very subject ... you can easily find one of those and thump away.

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Originally Posted by Leon

Personally, I don't care if you two have a conversation on here with eachother.
I just wanted to see what you had to say now, after you broke your own little no going off topic comment. :neener:

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Well now that's mature.

-adam