Pairing/breeding Experience

So I have decided to breed my male Banana Coral Glow Butter Pastel with either a Queen Bee or a Queen Spin. I would like to know if anyone has done this pairing, or something close, and what was their experience? Or what do people think of this pairing.

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I think you're going to produce more snakes that the market is flooded with already and have a tough time selling them if you're planning to do so.
Go see how many banana combos dynasty reptiles has for cheap money, it's all banana spider/butter/pastel combos.

Sorry I'm just trying to be realistic, if I were you I'd breed to a higher end codom gene like ghi, bamboo, or something that not a lot of people are producing/selling. If you're not planning on selling most of the offspring then produce whatever catches your eye.


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Actually it comes down to supply and demand. Just go onto Morphmarket and look at all the snakes that have sold. Most of them are sub $500 snakes. If you want to sell a lot more snakes I'd suggest selling cheaper snakes, the combo you mention is good. Not many people can shell out hundreds or thousands of dollars for higher end stuff. Most people want a pet snake and banana / spider / pastel is a good place to start in my opinion. That's the 'bread and butter' of the ball python pet market. Not many people produce higher end stuff because I think it's harder to sell. Actually my ideal pet snake on the lower end would be a banana spider. If you look at the big breeders they produce babies to satisfy the market. They have most low end stuff, some stuff in the middle, and just a few high end snakes. That mirrors the demand. Don't get discouraged that big breeders that have thousands of snakes for sale, they do sell them every year or they wouldn't be in business!

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Originally Posted by cchardwick

Actually it comes down to supply and demand. Just go onto Morphmarket and look at all the snakes that have sold. Most of them are sub $500 snakes. If you want to sell a lot more snakes I'd suggest selling cheaper snakes, the combo you mention is good. Not many people can shell out hundreds or thousands of dollars for higher end stuff. Most people want a pet snake and banana / spider / pastel is a good place to start in my opinion. That's the 'bread and butter' of the ball python pet market. Not many people produce higher end stuff because I think it's harder to sell. Actually my ideal pet snake on the lower end would be a banana spider. If you look at the big breeders they produce babies to satisfy the market. They have most low end stuff, some stuff in the middle, and just a few high end snakes. That mirrors the demand. Don't get discouraged that big breeders that have thousands of snakes for sale, they do sell them every year or they wouldn't be in business!

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I somewhat agree with you and like your positive outlook but I’m not sure how many babies you’ve sold but they don’t sell near as easily as some think, cheap or expensive. I have not started selling mine yet but I have a good friend that breeds quite a few and the thing is, you better be ready to feed all your babies for at least a few months because they just don’t sell as fast as people think. My main limiting factor on how many I produce is based on how many rats I can produce. If your not breeding your own rats I would not plan on breeding ball pythons to make money. The cost to feed them will eat up your profits before you can even sell them. IMO, I’d rather produce less quantity and higher quality. I won’t sell as many as fast but it allows me to make what I want and not have hundreds of mouths to feed.

Not the smartest pairing IMO, there are snakes that will be hard if not impossible to tell what they are which means you will have to undersell them (talking about any Supers that may have something else in it), I would also not recommend anything that may produce a Super Butter or Super Lesser or the combination of both.

As someone who has produced and sold animals for a little over 10 years now I can tell you that when it comes to Spiders there has been a shift over the last several years, one because it's over used two because more and more people have decided that a wobbly snake was not for them, based on those I actually have moved away from Spiders all together for at least 3 years and I have no regrets.

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Originally Posted by rufretic

If your not breeding your own rats I would not plan on breeding ball pythons to make money. The cost to feed them will eat up your profits before you can even sell them.

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While I agree with a lot of what you said. If you look around you can find quality feeders at reasonable prices. I buy my rats and feed over 50 adult balls plus holdbacks. And I buy simply because I pay less per rat that it cost me to raise them ( after you factor in my time, almost the same per actual cost. I only pay $1.50 per medium rat)
Back to the op. I would try to find a nice recessive project for your male if it were me

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Originally Posted by StillBP

While I agree with a lot of what you said. If you look around you can find quality feeders at reasonable prices. I buy my rats and feed over 50 adult balls plus holdbacks. And I buy simply because I pay less per rat that it cost me to raise them ( after you factor in my time, almost the same per actual cost. I only pay $1.50 per medium rat)
Back to the op. I would try to find a nice recessive project for your male if it were me

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Financially there is really no comparison, I produce 100s of rats and a smaller number of mice for the new hatchlings and it only cost me $30 a month for bedding and food plus one hour a week labor. So unless you consider your hourly labor rate in the $100s, it is much much cheaper to produce your own feeders. Now with that said, I agree it can be done, I just think it would be a lot harder to turn a profit with the higher overhead of purchasing feeders.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Not the smartest pairing IMO, there are snakes that will be hard if not impossible to tell what they are which means you will have to undersell them (talking about any Supers that may have something else in it), I would also not recommend anything that may produce a Super Butter or Super Lesser or the combination of both.

As someone who has produced and sold animals for a little over 10 years now I can tell you that when it comes to Spiders there has been a shift over the last several years, one because it's over used two because more and more people have decided that a wobbly snake was not for them, based on those I actually have moved away from Spiders all together for at least 3 years and I have no regrets.

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Do you have any recommendations on what will pair well with my male BP? I am only looking into purchasing only two females, since I am not looking to really make this into a business but more of a hobby. But I do understand that I cannot keep all off the baby BPs I produce and I would need to sell what I don't intend on keeping for myself.

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Originally Posted by StillBP

While I agree with a lot of what you said. If you look around you can find quality feeders at reasonable prices. I buy my rats and feed over 50 adult balls plus holdbacks. And I buy simply because I pay less per rat that it cost me to raise them ( after you factor in my time, almost the same per actual cost. I only pay $1.50 per medium rat)
Back to the op. I would try to find a nice recessive project for your male if it were me

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Do you have any recommendations on recessive morphs that would would be fun to work with?

You need a pattern changer so you can tell them apart. If its not spider, I think i would go for a Super Enchi or an Enchi Pinstripe.

http://www.worldofballpythons.com/wi...2&female=57,84

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Originally Posted by Brownspidey

Do you have any recommendations on recessive morphs that would would be fun to work with?

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With your banana the best combinations would be clown and pied. But others that could be fun are ghost, desert ghost, genetic stripe or even tri-stripe. I always say think outside the box. So if something catches your eye try it.

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Maybe even puzzle if you want to drop some money on a newer project that's not being over bred yet

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

You need a pattern changer so you can tell them apart. If its not spider, I think i would go for a Super Enchi or an Enchi Pinstripe.

http://www.worldofballpythons.com/wi...2&female=57,84

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Thank you for the suggestion. I just looked into the King Spin Enchi and the Stinger Blast, those two catch my eye and will probably make it easier to distinguish between the babies.

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Originally Posted by Brownspidey

Thank you for the suggestion. I just looked into the King Spin Enchi and the Stinger Blast, those two catch my eye and will probably make it easier to distinguish between the babies.

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No problem. Good luck.

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

You need a pattern changer so you can tell them apart. If its not spider, I think i would go for a Super Enchi or an Enchi Pinstripe.

http://www.worldofballpythons.com/wi...2&female=57,84

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I agree with this and would add Leopard combo to that list.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

I agree with this and would add Leopard combo to that list.

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Definitely agree with leopard.

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Originally Posted by StillBP

With your banana the best combinations would be clown and pied. But others that could be fun are ghost, desert ghost, genetic stripe or even tri-stripe. I always say think outside the box. So if something catches your eye try it.

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Originally Posted by StillBP

While I agree with a lot of what you said. If you look around you can find quality feeders at reasonable prices. I buy my rats and feed over 50 adult balls plus holdbacks. And I buy simply because I pay less per rat that it cost me to raise them ( after you factor in my time, almost the same per actual cost. I only pay $1.50 per medium rat)
Back to the op. I would try to find a nice recessive project for your male if it were me

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I have a question hopefully you can help me answer. If I get a visual recessive female to breed with my male, is it ok to breed a male from their clutch back to the mother to get visual recessive snakes?

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Originally Posted by Brownspidey

I have a question hopefully you can help me answer. If I get a visual recessive female to breed with my male, is it ok to breed a male from their clutch back to the mother to get visual recessive snakes?

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Yes. People do this all the time. Without line Breeding we would not have any recessive morphs

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Originally Posted by Brownspidey

I have a question hopefully you can help me answer. If I get a visual recessive female to breed with my male, is it ok to breed a male from their clutch back to the mother to get visual recessive snakes?

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As long as there is not a genetic issue it is fine. I will inbreed for a couple generations then out cross. Always take into account other genes as well though. I do not breed spider to spider or lesser to lesser. There are other genes with issues as well where they are fine in the hetero form but problematic or even deadly in the homo form. You can see them here. http://www.owalreptiles.com/issues.php

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

As long as there is not a genetic issue it is fine. I will inbreed for a couple generations then out cross. Always take into account other genes as well though. I do not breed spider to spider or lesser to lesser. There are other genes with issues as well where they are fine in the hetero form but problematic or even deadly in the homo form. You can see them here. http://www.owalreptiles.com/issues.php

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So if I wanted to give my self a chance of BELs in my gene pool it would be safer, for example, to breed my male with the butter gene into a female that contains mojave or the lesser gene?

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Originally Posted by Brownspidey

So if I wanted to give my self a chance of BELs in my gene pool it would be safer, for example, to breed my male with the butter gene into a female that contains mojave or the lesser gene?

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Butter and lesser are the same gene but two different lines so it is not advisable to cross them. The offspring occasionally get "bug eyes". I would go with mojave x (lesser or butter) to make a white snake.

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

Butter and lesser are the same gene but two different lines so it is not advisable to cross them. The offspring occasionally get "bug eyes". I would go with mojave x (lesser or butter) to make a white snake.

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Thank you for answering all my questions. I have been doing my research to prepare myself for the next step. But I have found that no matter how much studying I do nothing beats knowledge you can obtain from people with experience.

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Originally Posted by StillBP

Yes. People do this all the time. Without line Breeding we would not have any recessive morphs

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Thank you for all the help!!

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Originally Posted by Brownspidey

Thank you for answering all my questions. I have been doing my research to prepare myself for the next step. But I have found that no matter how much studying I do nothing beats knowledge you can obtain from people with experience.

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No problem. After you are on the board for awhile you will figure out who to ask about what. All of us working at least slightly different things. I deal primarily with BEL's, Albino's, Lavender Albino's, Enchis and Gravels. Some on here are working some higher end genes most of which I have stayed away from other than Gravel.