Another noob coming out of his hide.

Hello everyone!

My son has been begging for a snake for over a year now. Frankly I've never been much of a snake guy, (quite the opposite actually.. ;) ) and have successfully avoided the purchase, instead we compromised and got him a leopard gecko earlier this year. Well he's done such a great job looking after his gecko that my wife and I decided to sign off on the snake.

We have been using an Exo Terra with great success for the gecko so I purchased the large wide model for the ball python. After much research on this site, we quickly learned that this was not the best of ideas due to humidity and temperature concerns so I've returned that and will be placing my order for an Animal Plastics PVC enclosure later this week along with a 65w RHP based on Bob's recommendation from ProProducts, trying to decide on the T8 and T10. In the meantime, we setup a 10 Gallon glass tank with a heating pad and a CHE each on a different thermostat and have foiled off about 1/4 of the screened lid to help maintain humidity. Temps and humidity seemed to be on point for several days, so last night we picked up an Orange Dream Leopard male ball python for his 10th Birthday. Got him from Outback Reptiles which just happens to be down the road from our home.

He seems to be adapting well to his new environment, even though it's killing the boy not to be able to handle him during this transition period.

Just wanted to introduce myself and thank you all for the invaluable information I've learned from lurking on this forum for the past few weeks. I would have been completely lost without this wonderful resource and all of you!

Just watching him for a few hours last night and briefly handling/inspecting him at the time of sale, I can already tell this little guy is going to change my opinion (and maybe even a little fear ;) ) of snakes in general.

Here's a quick shot of him exploring his new digs..

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...4dc544b7_b.jpg


Thanks again!
-David

T10 is much better. That 3 extra inches of height makes all the difference in cleaning, space to put decor, and just better heating with the RHP (it eases any concerns with having things too close to it)

welcome to the forum!!!
:welcome:

wonderful, wonderful read! i'm so happy to hear you've given your kid some wiggle-room on keeping a pet snake. you seem like you've done plenty of research and are already off to a great start. i promise your little noodle will change everything you've ever known about snakes. ;)

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Originally Posted by SDA

T10 is much better. That 3 extra inches of height makes all the difference in cleaning, space to put decor, and just better heating with the RHP (it eases any concerns with having things too close to it)

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Thanks! That's the direction I've been leaning as well, especially for ease of cleaning. While it's nice that the T8 is on quick ship, thankfully the build/ship times for a T10 are not really an issue since at his size he's probably better off in the smaller 10 gallon for a while.

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

welcome to the forum!!!
:welcome:

wonderful, wonderful read! i'm so happy to hear you've given your kid some wiggle-room on keeping a pet snake. you seem like you've done plenty of research and are already off to a great start. i promise your little noodle will change everything you've ever known about snakes. ;)

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Thank you! Yeah, lots of forum reading and of course the University of YouTube. ;)

Welcome!!! Glad you found the forum and glad you were willing to green-light the snake based on your son doing so well with his leopard gecko.

We are happy to help with any questions you may have and great job with the research so far!!

Based on what I know of the AP enclosures, most people who go with the T10 are happy they opted for the extra height.

Good luck and keep us posted :gj:

Welcome!
Thats an awesome combo you picked, especially for a first time owner. Nice job and congrats on the new pet, before you know it you’ll wonder what you ever had against snakes in the first place, ball pythons make wonderful pets :)

Welcome! I am a new snake mom, too, thanks to my kid wearing me down. ;) This was a battle I'm happy I lost though! I think our kids will grow tremendously from the responsibility of keeping a special animal of their own, and we earn major cool-parent-cred points for letting our kids have a snake. LOL.

What's your new guy's name?

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

Welcome! I am a new snake mom, too, thanks to my kid wearing me down. ;) This was a battle I'm happy I lost though! I think our kids will grow tremendously from the responsibility of keeping a special animal of their own, and we earn major cool-parent-cred points for letting our kids have a snake. LOL.

What's your new guy's name?

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Thanks! I believe he's going to be Leo, playing off the leopard part.

:welcome:

you're off to a great start! stay, learn, help each other out and have fun! also post more pix when u can. :)

Congrats and welcome!!! You guys have really done your research, and it's amazing to start out properly right off the bat!

You should post some more pics of his setup. :D It looks beautiful from the one pic

Welcome !!!


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that's probably about the best start up i've heard about. welcome, we look forward to seeing the noodle grow.

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Thanks for the warm welcome everyone!

Leo seems to be adapting well in his new home and based on everything I've been reading seems relatively stress free. Tonight we offered him his 1st meal, the breeder had him on live hopper mice and being a noob I wasn't exactly sure on what size that was so I picked up a pack of small and fuzzy frozen mice from Petsmart. I was surprised how small the fuzzies were but went ahead and offered one of those so I could get rid of them sooner and move on to the smalls. I put the frozen mouse in a zip lock bag and into the hot water for about 20 minutes. Heated it up a bit under the CHE and then did the zombie dance with some feeding thongs. He showed a little interest but once my son set the mouse down in front of the hide he was in he snatched him right up. Well aimed shot with zero substrate! I'll call that a win. Much easier than I was expecting!

Here's a shot of that..
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...51261369_c.jpgLeo's 1st feeding by David, on Flickr

Called Bob over at ProProducts and Ali over at Animal Plastics this afternoon and they were just as nice as everyone has stated before and a pleasure to speak with. Put in an order for a T10, glass sliding doors, locks and an LED light. Ordered the 80W RHP from ProProducts who is going to ship it directly to Animal Plastics for installation. Expected ship time looks to be early January but that should be fine considering his size now. If he out grows his temporary 10 Gallon setup, I'll move him up to a 20gal.

I'll get some better shots of our legless friend along with his setup once I have some better lighting. Figured I'd dim the lights and let him enjoy his night after that meal.

Thanks again!
David

You can definitely give him 2 or 3 of those at a time per feeding, those are way too small for a proper meal. It's always better to give them a full appropriately sized meal within a day, rather than feed frequent small meals. Just after he swallows one completely, wait a couple minutes and offer another.

A good rule of thumb for young ball pythons is their prey's width should be the same or slightly wider than the thickest part of their body. Usually it is around 15% of their weight.

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

You can definitely give him 2 or 3 of those at a time per feeding, those are way too small for a proper meal. It's always better to give them a full appropriately sized meal within a day, rather than feed frequent small meals. Just after he swallows one completely, wait a couple minutes and offer another.

A good rule of thumb for young ball pythons is their prey's width should be the same or slightly wider than the thickest part of their body. Usually it is around 15% of their weight.

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Thanks! I read about the size to weight ratio but I forgot to weigh him when we picked him up and have been letting him do his own thing while getting acclimated. Will do so at the next opportunity. Good to hear I can offer him a few more to get him a good sized meal.


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Originally Posted by DavidNDC

Thanks! I read about the size to weight ratio but I forgot to weigh him when we picked him up and have been letting him do his own thing while getting acclimated. Will do so at the next opportunity. Good to hear I can offer him a few more to get him a good sized meal.


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No prob! I've actually always eyeballed it, the exact ratio isn't that important (unless one isn't good at eyeballing haha). Also congrats on him eating!!

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

No prob! I've actually always eyeballed it, the exact ratio isn't that important (unless one isn't good at eyeballing haha). Also congrats on him eating!!

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Got another mouse in the hot tub right now! Yeah, I was really surprised how well he took it. Although I guess he just thought it was an appetizer and is waiting on the rest of his meal. [emoji6] Thanks again!


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I'm sorry, I saw 'coming out of his hide' and instantly Mr. Brightside by The Killers started playing in my head. Coming out of my hide and I've been doing just fine-- heh.

Anyways, welcome to the forum! You've got a pretty baby there :3.

He took the 2nd one immediately. Wow, so fascinating to watch.


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Welcome to the forum! Glad your lil' guy is doing so well!

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Originally Posted by DavidNDC

He took the 2nd one immediately. Wow, so fascinating to watch.


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Greetings from our crew!

We're a kid-induced herp house as well. Though, after we brought Evie home for Paisley, I slipped and fell and rescued a couple of snakes myself. Now my poor husband is all adorable and confused and wondering how we went from zero snakes to three...

This forum is absolutely invaluable in terms of advice. But it's also become another little addiction. Wake up, check Twitter, BP.net, Pinterest.... yes, it out-placed Pinterest.

One quick piece of advise I have as a new snake parent, and also as a vet tech- find your herp vet now. You're gonna wanna know who that is before it actually becomes a need at 4:55 on a Sunday afternoon...

Anyway, congratulations on the gorgeous new addition! Can't wait for updates!

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...cd4153c0fe.jpg

(Anathema says "Ssssssssssssup?")


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Originally Posted by Tinyhounds

Greetings from our crew!

We're a kid-induced herp house as well. Though, after we brought Evie home for Paisley, I slipped and fell and rescued a couple of snakes myself. Now my poor husband is all adorable and confused and wondering how we went from zero snakes to three...

This forum is absolutely invaluable in terms of advice. But it's also become another little addiction. Wake up, check Twitter, BP.net, Pinterest.... yes, it out-placed Pinterest.

One quick piece of advise I have as a new snake parent, and also as a vet tech- find your herp vet now. You're gonna wanna know who that is before it actually becomes a need at 4:55 on a Sunday afternoon...

Anyway, congratulations on the gorgeous new addition! Can't wait for updates!

(Anathema says "Ssssssssssssup?")


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Thank you for the welcome and the great advice! Thankfully our vet has an exotics & reptile center and I was surprised to learn that they offer reptile boarding too in the event that becomes necessary. I was planning on taking him in for a wellness checkup once he get's settled in. It's funny that you mention your expanding collection as my son has already asked "So dad, once the new cage comes what are we going to do with this tank he's in now and all the gear you bought for it?" I can see the little gears spinning in his head, plotting. :)

After his feeding the other night, Leo's been spending a lot of time in his sauna/warm hide. I've setup a camera with IR LEDs for night vision so we can get alerts when he is out and about and see what he's up to in the middle of the night. Seems like right around 3:00am is when he likes to venture out and do a bit of exploring.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/WQDeue0.png

I have to say this is my new favorite thread. I love when people give their pets as much love as they can. Makes me all kinds of happy :D

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Originally Posted by DavidNDC

Thank you for the welcome and the great advice! Thankfully our vet has an exotics & reptile center and I was surprised to learn that they offer reptile boarding too in the event that becomes necessary. I was planning on taking him in for a wellness checkup once he get's settled in. It's funny that you mention your expending collection as my son has already asked "So dad, once the new cage comes what are we going to do with this tank he's in now and all the gear you bought for it?" I can see the little gears spinning in his head, plotting. :)

After his feeding the other night, Leo's been spending a lot of time in his sauna/warm hide. I've setup a camera with IR LEDs for night vision so we can get alerts when he is out and about and see what he's up to in the middle of the night. Seems like right around 3:00am is when he likes to venture out and do a bit of exploring.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...om/WQDeue0.png

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Bravo to your son!! I like the way he thinks!!! We moved Anathema into a 40 gallon tank recently, and then I'm sitting there staring at the 20L. My husband is like, "Now honey; just because we have an empty tank now, it doesn't mean we have to fill it..."

And I just looked at him, confused, "But it's like I have a big, empty, 20 gallon hole in my soul....."

I'm pretty sure he hurt himself rolling his eyes that hard. Never the less, I wore him down. We are going to be adding a male to our collection when the wedding expo comes to town in July.... [emoji16]


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me @ myself:

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Originally Posted by Tinyhounds

"Now honey; just because we have an empty tank now, it doesn't mean we have to fill it..."

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also me:

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Originally Posted by Tinyhounds

"But it's like I have a big, empty, 20 gallon hole in my soul....."

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literally, every time.
:taz:

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Originally Posted by Tinyhounds

I'm pretty sure he hurt himself rolling his eyes that hard. Never the less, I wore him down. We are going to be adding a male to our collection when the wedding expo comes to town in July.... [emoji16]


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Super curious about why my phone auto corrected "reptile" to "wedding"... totally NOT a Freudian slip... I swear... ::shifty eyes::


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Here are a few shots of Leo's current bachelor pad. As mentioned previously, this 10 Gallon tank is being used while we await his fancy Animal Plastics condo.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...a97bc4b2_b.jpgL29C1984 by David, on Flickr

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...7fa4a84f_b.jpgL29C1986 by David, on Flickr

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...b609c72b_b.jpgL29C1988 by David, on Flickr

Ambient temps in the room are 72-75f, I'm providing supplemental heat with an UTH set to 92f positioned on the right hand side, the thermostat probe is sandwiched between the heating element and the glass, along with a 120watt CHE above on a dimmer with the thermostat probe running to the cold side set to 80f. I'm maintaining humidity with foil covering 3/4 of the top screen and daily misting sprays of water. Using Cypress for substrate, several pieces of cork bark and the plastic stump hide along with some silk & plastic plants. The background is just an image I grabbed off Google Images and printed on my inkjet printer.

He seems to be happy with his setup and I can remove or breakup some of the bark as he grows a bit more confident and doesn't require as much clutter.

I plan to hot glue those thermostat probes and the acu-rite thermometer this weekend now that I'm satisfied with their placement. Also sketching something up in Fusion 360 to print out on the 3D Printer to house a tiny IP camera for inside the tank so I don't have all the glares from shooting through the glass.

Someone came out to say hi!

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4528/...0e36371a_b.jpgL29C2001 by David, on Flickr

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4569/...b0f58b8d_b.jpgL29C1990 by David, on Flickr

The viv looks absolutely amazing !
Possibly the nicest I've ever seen !!https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...71a4c08f48.jpg


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Can I hire you to take decent pictures of my snake? You are amazing in your photography.

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Originally Posted by Zincubus

The viv looks absolutely amazing !
Possibly the nicest I've ever seen !!

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Wow! Thanks so much!! I know it's not exactly realistic given their native habitat but I kind of wanted to go for the forrest/jungle look since his Gecko is setup in a desertscape theme.

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Originally Posted by SDA

Can I hire you to take decent pictures of my snake? You are amazing in your photography.

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Thanks! I'm a hockey dad so I'm used to taking shots though dirty glass. ;) Can't wait until we can handle him a bit more so I can take him into my 'lil studio for some proper pics. These lights just don't do his coloring justice.

Gorgeous snake and viv and the story here is too sweet. He's got awesome parents!

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Originally Posted by DavidNDC

Wow! Thanks so much!! I know it's not exactly realistic given their native habitat but I kind of wanted to go for the forrest/jungle look since his Gecko is setup in a desertscape theme.



Thanks! I'm a hockey dad so I'm used to taking shots though dirty glass. ;) Can't wait until we can handle him a bit more so I can take him into my 'lil studio for some proper pics. These lights just don't do his coloring justice.

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Well I've 20 snakes /vivs and all landscaped with Orchid bark , branche and dried bark but in all my years I've not managed anything as nice as yours !!

Check out my snake collection / addiction thread sometime ;)


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Originally Posted by Zincubus

Well I've 20 snakes /vivs and all landscaped with Orchid bark , branche and dried bark but in all my years I've not managed anything as nice as yours !!

Check out my snake collection / addiction thread sometime ;)

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Just checked it out! Wow, that's an incredible collection you and quite a few others have!

I'm happy to report that Leo has been adapting very well in his new home. Hard to believe a whole week has gone by already, heck it's hard to believe it's already mid-November but I digress..

He seems to enjoy exploring his new environment and I've been enjoying watching him on the Nest camera and picking up on his routine. He seems to be most active around 3:30AM and then again in the early afternoon. Lots of back and forth to the various hides, spending some time coiled up on his stump and taking in plenty of water. I actually setup an extra monitor in my office and my colleagues have been enjoying stopping by for a peek at the "Leo Cam".

Still keeping handling to a minimum and he just had his 2nd meal last night, finished up the last of those fuzzy mice so we can move on to the next size up. My temperatures have been steady however now that it's getting a bit colder in the DC Metro area, I've had the gas furnace on a bit which just eats up any humidity in my house. I've added some damp moss to help provide a bit more moisture and tonight I'll dig out the room humidifier out of storage in the basement. I suspect that should do the trick until his AP cage arrives.

Anyway, I guess that's it for the one week update. Here's a quick clip from last night's feeding.

https://youtu.be/tav2RnCZhRg

TIL: Dead mice can detach their tails just like lizards. ;)

Finally took Leo downstairs to take some proper pictures while the boy did some housekeeping in his enclosure. He's quite the ham for the camera.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...07a2abbe_k.jpgLeo chilling in the studio by David, on Flickr

Absolutely terrific picture...awesome

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Originally Posted by DavidNDC

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...07a2abbe_k.jpg

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BEAUTIFUL photo!!! i need to do some mirror shoots!

I love how orange Leo is! Beautiful :)

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Originally Posted by The Night King

Absolutely terrific picture...awesome

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

BEAUTIFUL photo!!! i need to do some mirror shoots!

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Originally Posted by Ashley96

I love how orange Leo is! Beautiful :)

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Thanks so much for the kind words, much appreciated! :)

Leo had his 1st shed and unfortunately it wasn’t the best. But humidity adjustments have been made so the next one is hopefully better.

He was able to get most of it off on his own but I used the technique discussed in the sticky thread and it worked perfectly! Still just a tiny bit stuck on his head but his eyes are clear. I’ll help him out with that after he gets a chance to let this meal settle down. Like most snakes I’m assuming, he’s not a big fan of his head being messed with.

Really looking forward to that T10 to ship so I’m not battling winter humidity issues with a gas furnace. But I’m hopeful the damp moss I’ve added along with the larger water bowl will help things while we wait.

Overall he’s doing great, it’s fun watching him observe us as we observe him!


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...dc35753d92.jpg


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That's such an adorable photo of Leo! He looks ready for the holiday dinners :P

I'm sure you already have done this, but I have the top of my tank covered with aluminum foil (save for a circular hole for the UTH to sit) and it does wonders for the humidity. Additionally, I have sphagnum moss strewn randomly on top of the Eco Earth substrate. I fortunately only have to mist (minimally) whenever I open the tank! Otherwise, I could leave it alone for days and the humidity wouldn't fall below 55%, it's usually around 60% to 65% though.

Ah, and my water bowl has a lot of surface area. I believe it's 7.5 inches in diameter?

I'm sure Leo appreciates the help with getting off the extra shed though! He's looking great :snake:

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Originally Posted by savora

That's such an adorable photo of Leo! He looks ready for the holiday dinners :P

I'm sure you already have done this, but I have the top of my tank covered with aluminum foil (save for a circular hole for the UTH to sit) and it does wonders for the humidity. Additionally, I have sphagnum moss strewn randomly on top of the Eco Earth substrate. I fortunately only have to mist (minimally) whenever I open the tank! Otherwise, I could leave it alone for days and the humidity wouldn't fall below 55%, it's usually around 60% to 65% though.

Ah, and my water bowl has a lot of surface area. I believe it's 7.5 inches in diameter?

I'm sure Leo appreciates the help with getting off the extra shed though! He's looking great :snake:

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Thanks!

Yeah, for the 1st week or so everything was fine. Clearly that had a lot to do with the cypress mulch retaining a bit of the moisture from the bag. I've since added foil bubble insulation to the 3/4 of the top screen secured with foil HVAC tape and a bit of damp sphagnum moss. That along with the larger water bowl seem to be helping quite a bit. I've got some Eco Earth that we use for the Leopard Gecko that I'll mix in with the cypress if I run into any more issues. That stuff seems to retain moisture very well.

Other than that, things have been going great. Leo has turned into quite the celebrity in the neighborhood. My son has had a steady stream of friends over to check him out, many of which were deathly afraid of snakes prior to meeting Leo. I suspect there will be quite a few Ball Pythons asked for this Christmas within his circle of friends, I'm sure the other parents are thrilled. ;)

He's been eating like a champ, up to 94g from the 70g he was at when we welcomed him home.

Ah! My bad, I meant, CHE sits on top of my tank, not the UTH :rolleyes:

Aww! Good for them! Let those parents know that if they need any advice with keeping their new pet, they can use this website (or even you!)!

When I was younger, my dad kept a few small herps--garter snakes, anoles, and salamanders. (He even let me, as a seven-year-old, play with the garters unsupervised! :D) He'd done it since I was so young, I never even considered it a weird or awesome thing. Until I was bringing my friends over and they were amazed that we kept snakes!

Props to you for being the awesome dad of the neighborhood!