BP Not eaten in 4 weeks

Its been 4 weeks since my BP had a meal. Not too recently I moved her to a larger habitat because she was getting too big for her old one. After some time getting used to it she wouldnt eat. So I waited a few weeks and just recently I found that she had shed. So her shedding was mostly the cause of her not eating. But just last night I tried feeding her again and she wouldn't have it. I have not changed the way I feed her and she has the food right infront of her face. I'm at the end of my rope and have wasted 4 rats because of her.

Could it be that she doesn't feel secure in her upgraded enclosure? I don't know what your previous set up was like, but I think we need more info on your husbandry to help find clues here. Has there been any temp changes?

Not anything drastic or different from her previous setup. In fact her UTH temps are more controlled now. Ive just had to use a daylight lamp (which I turn off during the night) for extra heat in her tank since shes closer to the window this time. She's fully explored her tank multiple times. The only differences are the size and the new decor. I put some of her old decor in as well. Its been a good 5 weeks since shes been in her ner tank.

If she only stopped eating after moving to her new one, most likely she might not feel secure in her larger enclosure. There might be too much open space and not enough places for her to hide herself completely.

You can either fix her new enclosure by adding more hides, fake leaves, and general "clutter" to help her feel hidden. Or you can move her back to her old enclosure (with hides) and let her settle, and she may start eating again.

Well The space isnt too open. Her new tank is a lot larger than her old one, but Ive put enough stuff where it doesnt look too open. I can't put her back in her old tank because her new hide wont fit in it. She got too big for her old hide and she was too cramped in her old tank. I guess I could see if I could get something else to put in there but theres not much room honestly. She has a couple places to hide but she enjoys her new hide the most because its big enough for her and her UTH is under it.

I just honestly thought after 5 weeks and shedding she'd be hungry enough to take any food she got.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

Well The space isnt too open. Her new tank is a lot larger than her old one, but Ive put enough stuff where it doesnt look too open. I can't put her back in her old tank because her new hide wont fit in it. She got too big for her old hide and she was too cramped in her old tank. I guess I could see if I could get something else to put in there but theres not much room honestly. She has a couple places to hide but she enjoys her new hide the most because its big enough for her and her UTH is under it.

I just honestly thought after 5 weeks and shedding she'd be hungry enough to take any food she got.

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Forgot to mention, have you covered 3 sides with black paper? That tends to help as well.

Also, how much does she weigh and how often are you offering food? She might also just be getting to a size that she doesn't need to eat as often/will start fasting a bit.

This is her old tank.
https://imgur.com/a/HP34y

And this is her new tank.
https://imgur.com/a/JjH6a

And no I dont have any black paper, but I do have some left over craft paper I use to line her tank. Would that help?

I havent weighed her yet but she gets the same size rats she always got before I moved her.

Hi. You mentioned probable and obvious reasons that are causing her rejection of food, If she ate well before. Bigger space and shed, aldough should be eating now after shed.
Be sure that the temps are ok and as they were before you moved her as bigger tank needs more heating to keep warm. Also, is the tank in the same place, maybe its more light now or more people walking around, smthing is bothering her. Try and make more clutter it the tank and places to hide at least until she starts eating and try not to handle her until she does. If you freak out again try live or fresh pre killed rat and freeze it if she rejects..than you have it to try again, not wasting it.
One of my females just stopped eating f/t. Ignores them all of a sudden like they r not there. Queen wants pre killed now or live, she is a pain but u gotta do what you gotta do.
Hope she eats for you. Good luck.



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Oh yeah, she could definitely use more clutter. I like these flukers fake leaves you can buy off amazon.

What are you using to measure her temps?

What size rats is that?

I have a themostat to control her UTH and I have her old thermometer to check her air temp. The lowest Ive seen it go is around 77 at night when her daylight lamp is off. I havent had to use daylight lamp in her old tank cause she was on the opposite side of the room. Now shes closer to the window so Im thinking it would be a bit colder. She eats small rats right now, she has taken them even before moving.

Alright, I just crudely put up some of the spare craft paper around the two ends of her tank. Hopefully thatll help.

I mean, shes gotta get used to her tank at some point right? She's not just gonna starve herself.

Do you offer the rat cold or is it warmed up ??


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For one you're using a daylight bulb for her enclosure in the day right? I would go and replace that with a nighttime bulb, the ones with the blue/purple light and just leave it on 24/7. Bright light on them like that for extended periods of time is stressful and the nighttime temp drop just isn't necessary. Also you could for sure use some more clutter in there. Ball Pythons don't like big open spaces, they like to hide and feel secure so they need to be able to feel hidden when going from one end of the tank to the other and going to their water bowl and such.

And no she won't just get used to it if something is wrong. Ball Pythons are picky and if they feel stressed or not secure enough then they won't eat. Your problems are easy fixes though, just change the bulb and add a little clutter. It doesn't have to be anything fancy, it can be as simple as a few paper towel tubes and some wadded up paper. Also I do t know if it was just the proportions were off but it looked to me like your hides would fit in the old tank, so that may still be an option.

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Originally Posted by Zincubus

Do you offer the rat cold or is it warmed up ??


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I warm it up first, same as I always have.

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Originally Posted by BluuWolf

For one you're using a daylight bulb for her enclosure in the day right? I would go and replace that with a nighttime bulb, the ones with the blue/purple light and just leave it on 24/7. Bright light on them like that for extended periods of time is stressful and the nighttime temp drop just isn't necessary. Also you could for sure use some more clutter in there. Ball Pythons don't like big open spaces, they like to hide and feel secure so they need to be able to feel hidden when going from one end of the tank to the other and going to their water bowl and such.

And no she won't just get used to it if something is wrong. Ball Pythons are picky and if they feel stressed or not secure enough then they won't eat. Your problems are easy fixes though, just change the bulb and add a little clutter. It doesn't have to be anything fancy, it can be as simple as a few paper towel tubes and some wadded up paper. Also I do t know if it was just the proportions were off but it looked to me like your hides would fit in the old tank, so that may still be an option.

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Well she has a nighttime bulb too that I leave on 24/7. I just turn on the daylight one during the day for extra heat and light because her new tank is in an area of the room that didnt get as much light as her old one.
I guess i could find some stuff to put in there. Theres not a lot of area left in her tank but I can fit a few more things. Her old hide could fit in her old tank but shes way too big for it. Her new hide is too big for her old tank but she fits in it perfectly.

Another thought - how old and how big is she? A lot of people report that their snakes go on fasts around the 1000-gram mark. And 4 weeks isn't really a long time (even if you're annoyed at wasting four rats).
I would not be surprised if at least some of the fasts people see in snakes that are just approaching adulthood happen because while the snake is young and growing quickly, it has a big appetite and gets fed every week. As it grows up, its growth rate slows and it really doesn't need to eat as often. But keepers still keep offering every week, like clockwork. So at a certain point, the appetite drops basically because the snake just doesn't need as frequent meals as when it was a baby.

Obviously I don't know for sure that that's the reason, but given how often very similar posts come up, I think it's at least plausible.

Also, if she's been in shed for a lot of the time she's been in the new enclosure, she actually hasn't as much time to get used to it as you think - since while in shed, she's probably been mostly just holed up and not coming out to look around. If as you say there are plenty of hiding places and clutter and stuff, and temperatures and humidity are good, you could just leave her alone for awhile longer and offer her another rat in a couple of weeks. Maybe even put her old hide(s) into the new cage in addition to everything else, but otherwise let her be for awhile. If things are really wrong, it's true - she won't just get used to it. But if you keep changing things around constantly, she won't get used to that either.

I'm making assumptions about her size/age based on the fact that you felt the need to upgrade her enclosure, so correct me if I'm wrong. But if she's healthy and has some size on her, a month or two is really not a long time for a ball python to fast. Just wait longer before offering again, so that you don't waste as many rats.

For a 1000 gram and over ball python fasting for a month is no big deal. Some of my ball pythons have fasted for as long as six months, didn't even lose any weight hardly at all. I wouldn't sweat it, just keep offering weekly. If you are worried about wasted rats you can get another snake that will always eat, like a dwarf retic. That's what actually got me in to the dwarf retics LOL. If I change the ambient temp in my room I'll have a few ball pythons go into a fast, doesn't matter if it's hotter or colder. I'd say after 2-3 months of not eating you could offer a fresh killed adult mouse, or a small live rat, that usually does the trick.

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Originally Posted by Coluber42

Another thought - how old and how big is she? A lot of people report that their snakes go on fasts around the 1000-gram mark. And 4 weeks isn't really a long time (even if you're annoyed at wasting four rats).
I would not be surprised if at least some of the fasts people see in snakes that are just approaching adulthood happen because while the snake is young and growing quickly, it has a big appetite and gets fed every week. As it grows up, its growth rate slows and it really doesn't need to eat as often. But keepers still keep offering every week, like clockwork. So at a certain point, the appetite drops basically because the snake just doesn't need as frequent meals as when it was a baby.

Obviously I don't know for sure that that's the reason, but given how often very similar posts come up, I think it's at least plausible.

Also, if she's been in shed for a lot of the time she's been in the new enclosure, she actually hasn't as much time to get used to it as you think - since while in shed, she's probably been mostly just holed up and not coming out to look around. If as you say there are plenty of hiding places and clutter and stuff, and temperatures and humidity are good, you could just leave her alone for awhile longer and offer her another rat in a couple of weeks. Maybe even put her old hide(s) into the new cage in addition to everything else, but otherwise let her be for awhile. If things are really wrong, it's true - she won't just get used to it. But if you keep changing things around constantly, she won't get used to that either.

I'm making assumptions about her size/age based on the fact that you felt the need to upgrade her enclosure, so correct me if I'm wrong. But if she's healthy and has some size on her, a month or two is really not a long time for a ball python to fast. Just wait longer before offering again, so that you don't waste as many rats.

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Shes around maybe 2 and a half years old, maybe even 3. And about just over a foot long, maybe 2. Her tank pretty much stays the same, I mean it might change if Im gonna add another hide or some plants, but I dont see how that would bother her. She got used to her old tank when it was new I dont know why she wouldnt get used to this one.

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Originally Posted by cchardwick

For a 1000 gram and over ball python fasting for a month is no big deal. Some of my ball pythons have fasted for as long as six months, didn't even lose any weight hardly at all. I wouldn't sweat it, just keep offering weekly. If you are worried about wasted rats you can get another snake that will always eat, like a dwarf retic. That's what actually got me in to the dwarf retics LOL. If I change the ambient temp in my room I'll have a few ball pythons go into a fast, doesn't matter if it's hotter or colder. I'd say after 2-3 months of not eating you could offer a fresh killed adult mouse, or a small live rat, that usually does the trick.

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If shes fasting then I guess thats not a problem. I just always assumed at some point she'll get hungry enough and take the food no matter what, like just animal instincts. I can't get another snake unforunately, one is enough.

You could get a TON more into her tank. It's pretty bare right now. Beeps don't eat when stressed and they absolutely will starve themselves.

Can you weigh her? If she does go on a fast, that's good to know so that if she does start losing weight, you can at least tell. A postage scale or kitchen scale isn't expensive and will tell you.

Are you sure about her size? 1-2 feet is a pretty big range, and also pretty small for a 2-3 year old ball python; 12" is like hatchling size. Length isn't necessarily that useful of a number, but if you want to find out you can try www.serpwidgets.com to measure. You take a photo of the snake next to a ruler and then follow the instructions. :)

Alright well what I can do is get some more things for her tank and then post the results here if that'll help anyone.

Ill try measuring her sometime, thank you.

Photos would be best tbh ..

Any problems get the free app TapaTalk which is the easier way of uploading photos in my experience.


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Alright, Ill post an update photo of her tank within the next few weeks.

Hi,

I'd cover the back and sides and then add some insulation over that - it might mean you don't need the daylight bulb to keep the temps up.

I was never convinced night time temp drops were a good idea as it effectively tells the BP the climate/ season is changing.

Ive applied some of my spare craft paper to the sides of the tank. The back I dont think I need to do cause well its right up to the wall so she wont see anything.

The daylight bulb I use more for light than heat because her tank is in the part of the room that doesnt get much sunlight as her old tank use to do. Without it her tank is much darker so I really only turn it off during the night show she knows when its night time.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

Ive applied some of my spare craft paper to the sides of the tank. The back I dont think I need to do cause well its right up to the wall so she wont see anything.

The daylight bulb I use more for light than heat because her tank is in the part of the room that doesnt get much sunlight as her old tank use to do. Without it her tank is much darker so I really only turn it off during the night show she knows when its night time.

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This might be at least part of why she's been refusing, because ball pythons are nocturnal and actually prefer darkness/low light. Just the ambient light in your room is ideal and is what most people do for their ball pythons. It's worth a shot removing the light for a few weeks. They don't need light like we do.

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

This might be at least part of why she's been refusing, because ball pythons are nocturnal and actually prefer darkness/low light. Just the ambient light in your room is ideal and is what most people do for their ball pythons. It's worth a shot removing the light for a few weeks. They don't need light like we do.

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THat makes sense when I think about it, since she never had it in her old tank. But without it on, the part of her tank she stays in gets dark because its in a corner where theres no light. Would that still be okay though? It wont mess up her day/night cycle?

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

THat makes sense when I think about it, since she never had it in her old tank. But without it on, the part of her tank she stays in gets dark because its in a corner where theres no light. Would that still be okay though? It wont mess up her day/night cycle?

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Ball Pythons don't really need a day/night cycle. Too much light is stressful for them and honestly she would probably be happier in the dark space. My current bedroom actually has no overhead light and the window is constantly covered with dark curtains so the only light they ever really get is when I turn on the lamp near them which isn't very often lol

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Alright Ill take off her daylight lamp and just have her red one going. Hopefully itll make a bit of a difference.

Ive also ordered some more plants to put up in her tank as well as bringing home a few spare cardboard pieces from work which Im gonna try to use to make a little hide/ climbing thing out of.

Alright, so I bought some more plants and made a few makeshift hides to clutter up her tank a bit. Is it suitable now?

https://imgur.com/a/L9dgm

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

Alright, so I bought some more plants and made a few makeshift hides to clutter up her tank a bit. Is it suitable now?

https://imgur.com/a/L9dgm

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It's an improvement but I admit I'm having a hard time telling what's what. The leopard print box(?)on the left, I can't tell if that's tape on it or sewn in fabric? If tape please remove immediately as it's dangerous.

What Ive added is two new large plants and two makshift hides to take up space. If you see the before picture you'll notice the different.

One of the hides has a bit of ducktape around it (which is what that pattern is). Don't worry though it's not coming off, stuff sticks on like super glue. She probably wont even go inside the hide its mostly just there to take up space.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

Don't worry though it's not coming off

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Famous last words followed by snake death or huge vet bill. I am tired of participating in threads where snakes are severely injured by tape. Please just get it out of there.

Never, ever, ever put tape in a snake's enclosure.

If there is anything to be learned from today's posts, and the top stickies, and the horror stories - NO TAPE EVER. NOTHING W/ STICKY ADHESIVE OF ANY SORT INSIDE ENCLOSURE. No matter how minimal. If you can pull the tape back (which you can), so can your snake.

Totally not worth it based on the damage that can be done. I don't have my snake yet, but I basically have the no tape rule tattooed on my forehead after hanging out here for a couple of months.

Jeezes, alright Ill take both hides out then. Well then thats all I can add, just the two plants. I dont have anything else that can take up space in those places so she'll just have to deal with it for now.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

What Ive added is two new large plants and two makshift hides to take up space. If you see the before picture you'll notice the different.

One of the hides has a bit of ducktape around it (which is what that pattern is). Don't worry though it's not coming off, stuff sticks on like super glue. She probably wont even go inside the hide its mostly just there to take up space.

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Funny enough I just made a post in another thread about the dangers of duct tape. Even if it's temporary it will, in time, come off as tape of any kind in humid environments are susceptible to peeling. If you don't believe it then please look at the linked examples in the following link. Bad bad times have happened with snakes and tape.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...03#post2571403

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

What Ive added is two new large plants and two makshift hides to take up space. If you see the before picture you'll notice the different.

One of the hides has a bit of ducktape around it (which is what that pattern is). Don't worry though it's not coming off, stuff sticks on like super glue. She probably wont even go inside the hide its mostly just there to take up space.

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Well I whole heartedly approve of you using a viv rather than one of those dreadful ( just my opinion) plastic RUBs and you've added hides and plants so you're going in the right direction ..

When you get time I'd get to a dollar shop and get hold of some more plastic plants / foliage and even collect a few branches from the local woods / parks .

They just don't seem to appreciate open spaces ..

I'd STRONGLY suggest removing all the ducktape IMMEDIATELY though!!

It can cause horrendous injuries and damage to your precious snake - seriously !!


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Arent dollar store plastic plants/etc toxic though? Because everyone else has told me that only reptile friendly non toxic ones can be used. The coating on general plastic plants they say can be toxic to most animals.

Same with branches and such from the outside, theyll probably have bugs to mites in them which is worse than any ducktape accident.

And the hides are gone, the ones I made anyway.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

Arent dollar store plastic plants/etc toxic though? Because everyone else has told me that only reptile friendly non toxic ones can be used. The coating on general plastic plants they say can be toxic to most animals.

Same with branches and such from the outside, theyll probably have bugs to mites in them which is worse than any ducktape accident.

And the hides are gone, the ones I made anyway.

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Stuff from the outside can be made safe if it is done properly. As far as the plastic plants go, I would worry more about entanglements then toxicity. I don't deal too much with this stuff for my snakes because I have quite of few of them. I deal more in function than form. There are a few on here who know how to safely decorate. Hopefully they will chime in.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

Jeezes, alright Ill take both hides out then. Well then thats all I can add, just the two plants. I dont have anything else that can take up space in those places so she'll just have to deal with it for now.

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Hi,

It's the humidity that makes the very edges/ corners of it lift inside the enclosures - then the snake rubs across it..... boom. major problem with a snake twisting and pulling more of the tape onto itself. :(

I know you think we are over-reacting but we have honestly seen it so many times it beggars belief.

No they are not. Last time I checked a ball python does not have an appetite for artificial plants. You simply want to avoid anything with spray coating that is fuzzy like or anything attached in a chain looking pattern since that can get the snake stuck in.

Branches from outside need not be anything soft wood or with phenols like evergreen branches. You can bake a branch for 3-4 hours at 250 degrees and kill anything living including spores. You also need to season wood before baking or boiling since unseasoned wood (green) can mold if put in a tank due to high moisture content and split in unwanted ways if baked. For that reason the vast majority of people should probably not grab anything from outside unless they are familiar with plant species and how to properly season and treat wood.

I'm seconding Zinc that maybe another plant of two, even the silk ones from dollar stores or craft stores are fantastic! Providing they are non-scented and no glitter. Something to sorta block our view of her hides so she feels more secretive, and/or a bit more shelter. There's a lot of 'unprotected' open air space so having something that makes it feel where she can't be attacked from above will help.

Ok well I can see if I can find some branches, but it would be really helpful if someone could give me instructions on exaclty what to do and what branches to use.

I can check at my job if we sell any plastic plants as well.

What I dont get is her old tank was way more open (given it was smaller) and she still didnt mind it. The way her tank is now is a lot more crowded and her hide is big enough.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

Ok well I can see if I can find some branches, but it would be really helpful if someone could give me instructions on exaclty what to do and what branches to use.

I can check at my job if we sell any plastic plants as well.

What I dont get is her old tank was way more open (given it was smaller) and she still didnt mind it. The way her tank is now is a lot more crowded and her hide is big enough.

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They're all so different ..

I had one that ate every week but it had outgrown the viv so I moved her into a near identical viv with her own hides / branches : foliage and water dish .

She stopped eating for months !

Only thing that worked was to move her back into her old small viv - she ate again days later ..


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I cant move her back to her old tank, its way too small for her and her new hide wont fit in it. Plus her old UTH and temps in that tank werent the best.

This is seriously stressing me out to the point where I can't sleep. Cause Im worried if she doesnt eat she'll starve herself or I'm gonna have to give her up because she'll die.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

Ok well I can see if I can find some branches, but it would be really helpful if someone could give me instructions on exaclty what to do and what branches to use.

I can check at my job if we sell any plastic plants as well.

What I dont get is her old tank was way more open (given it was smaller) and she still didnt mind it. The way her tank is now is a lot more crowded and her hide is big enough.

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As far as wood goes, if you're not confident in identifying wood, I'd say go look for the woods offered at pet stores. Driftwood, Mopani wood, grape vine and cork bark are popular picks. Leaf litter (Oak leaves, Magnolia and Indian almond leaves) can also be an option to add for clutter. Basically avoid pine and cedar.

This may be me being paranoid but as a precaution but I usually like to pretreat/bake my wood (250-275 F for 2-3 hours) or spraying it with PAM (prevent a mite) before adding it to the enclosure because I'm not always sure what it's been exposed to at petstores. SDA also mentioned boiling as another method which is probably best for leaves (and maybe cork bark?) since I'm unsure if they'd burn if baked unless someone can clarify this? Up to you of course.

As a personal preference I also like to apply sealant to help make the wood last longer, easier to clean and less prone to molding. Just make sure the sealant is non toxic/low voc, water based and at least water resistant or water proof if possible.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

I cant move her back to her old tank, its way too small for her and her new hide wont fit in it. Plus her old UTH and temps in that tank werent the best.

This is seriously stressing me out to the point where I can't sleep. Cause Im worried if she doesnt eat she'll starve herself or I'm gonna have to give her up because she'll die.

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Hi ... at three years old there's no way she's gonna starve to death .... I had a female albino go 9 months with no food and she didn't even lose weight . Started eating again and hasn't stopped since .

As I understand it - the record for a Royal / Ball to fast then start eating again is 2 years 2 months !!!


Fear not !!


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I guess I could look for the wood they use in aquariums since they're meant to be underwater, keeps them from getting mold.

And thank you for reassuring me. It doesnt seem to me shes lost any weight. Last time I handled her she seemed just as much as before. She's not moving around or coming out of her hide very much anymore so I'm guessing shes trying to save her energy?

Im also gonna try feeding her tonight, its been about 10 or so days since my last attempt so Im hoping shell eat.

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Originally Posted by FeathersRuff

I guess I could look for the wood they use in aquariums since they're meant to be underwater, keeps them from getting mold.

And thank you for reassuring me. It doesnt seem to me shes lost any weight. Last time I handled her she seemed just as much as before. She's not moving around or coming out of her hide very much anymore so I'm guessing shes trying to save her energy?

Im also gonna try feeding her tonight, its been about 10 or so days since my last attempt so Im hoping shell eat.

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I know a guy who finds branches and ties them down in flowing streams for a few days or so . He reckons it cleans everything out of them and off them .. Seems a but extreme to me ...


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Ok well this time went better than the last. She didnt eat though. But she came out of her hide, looking ready like she always does when she used to eat. But she just licked the mouse with her tongue and then decided to go back into her hide. Like it was right infront of her face.