Jack the Russian Rat Snake/elaphe schrenckii (progression)

Officially the tiniest snake I have ever owned or held. I finally got my russian rat snake! Born 7/17/17 from Zerkle, and his name is Jack! :D I wanted one for quite awhile, so I jumped on the chance. He's a wild type elaphe schrenckii. I've been trying to call them Manchurian Black Water Snake, as I think this name makes more sense.

Not many pics yet as I want him to settle. And he is SO small, soft, and fragile! Amazing. I feel like if I breathe too hard, he would blow away. LOL

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And his current setup, just a 15qt sterilite. I'm afraid of putting him in anything larger, as you can see he is SO TINY in this tiny tub! I even lose track of where he is in here. I believe he would be able to live in this size for at least another 6 months. He's currently eating large mouse pinks.

He moves in this twitchy way and I already saw him come out to drink water and hang out near the bowl for awhile. That tiny water bowl is like a pond to him.

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I'm super excited to watch him grow up, though it will take a couple years! :D

Ahhh! What a little little noodle! I've been waiting anxiously for this lol I can't wait to watch him grow!

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my feelings right now:

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That it! I WANT ONE! Seriously, I was :reading:ing about Russian rat snakes for an hour yesterday, and now seeing your new baby has put me over the edge!!!!:love:

Precious boy!!!

i'm excited to watch his progress. congrats!!! i've always been jealous of your collection. [emoji7]

That is one adorable tiny noodle! I agree...don't breath too hard on it! Heehee

GASP! I love him! Now I'm totally regretting not giving them my address. ;)

I CANNOT WAIT to get one of my very own. Congratulations on your precious, tiny, Jack. I'm going to love watching him grow!

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Originally Posted by Starscream

my feelings right now:

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OMG this is great LOL!!

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Originally Posted by Godzilla78

That it! I WANT ONE! Seriously, I was :reading:ing about Russian rat snakes for an hour yesterday, and now seeing your new baby has put me over the edge!!!!:love:

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Seriously, better jump on it if you want one!! Apparently they will have more next spring and summer though. :D

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Originally Posted by tttaylorrr

i'm excited to watch his progress. congrats!!! i've always been jealous of your collection. [emoji7]

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Thanks taylor!! I love my various dudes!

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

Seriously, better jump on it if you want one!! Apparently they will have more next spring and summer though. :D

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I know a dude that breeds colubrids, he owns about 90 snakes. I will see if he can help me obtain one of these gems.

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Originally Posted by Godzilla78

I know a dude that breeds colubrids, he owns about 90 snakes. I will see if he can help me obtain one of these gems.

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What is his name? I don't think there are many people in the country breeding Russian Rat snakes right now, so the more the better LOL.

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

What is his name? I don't think there are many people in the country breeding Russian Rat snakes right now, so the more the better LOL.

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Yeah I have no idea if he has any, and if he does, I would bet he is not selling them.

Nice :D

He ate a large mouse pink today! Only his 3rd day home. And I even handled him yesterday too. I think it's sorta a testament to how hardy russian rat snakes are. I couldn't take any feeding pics though, since he's rather shy about me walking over to watch him, too bad!

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I found one hatchling for sale online, through a breeder on Kingsnake.com. Then I realized I have already spent my snake budget for the year, and I sobered up, lol. Definitely on my wish list though! Such an infamous reputation these critters have!

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Originally Posted by Godzilla78

I found one hatchling for sale online, through a breeder on Kingsnake.com. Then I realized I have already spent my snake budget for the year, and I sobered up, lol. Definitely on my wish list though! Such an infamous reputation these critters have!

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Oh yes, that one is from Ken Foose, like the only other person other than Zerkle who actively breeds them LOL.
I think you mean famous :D They have such a renown personable temperament.

Are you using a UTH with his tub? Is he ok with handling right away, or are they like BPs and need an acclimating period of being left alone?

Looks like he's doing ok with the attention so far!

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

Are you using a UTH with his tub? Is he ok with handling right away, or are they like BPs and need an acclimating period of being left alone?

Looks like he's doing ok with the attention so far!

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Yeah, I have a UTH set to 80.

He's okay with it quite apparently, since he ate ;) I was sort of testing the russian rat snake's good rep as a hardy snake, and I was not wrong. They are possibly THE most adaptable and hardiest snake of all snake species lol!

What are you thinking for long-term enclosure, once he's grown?

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

What are you thinking for long-term enclosure, once he's grown?

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They won't reach closer to adult size until 2-3 years down the line, but I'm currently thinking a 4x4x2 foot AP cage! So 4 feet length and 4 feet tall. Or a custom glass cage around that size.

For now, he can live in this 15qt for at least 6 months, and I'll just upgrade tub size. The biggest sterilite tub is the 110qt and that would also fit an older one comfortable for quite awhile.

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

They won't reach closer to adult size until 2-3 years down the line, but I'm currently thinking a 4x4x2 foot AP cage! So 4 feet length and 4 feet tall. Or a custom glass cage around that size.

For now, he can live in this 15qt for at least 6 months, and I'll just upgrade tub size. The biggest sterilite tub is the 110qt and that would also fit an older one comfortable for quite awhile.

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Sterlite also has 50 gallon tubs. I don't know what the footprint difference is, but I couldn't find this size on their website for some reason? They sell it through Walmart, though, which is where I got mine. It's pretty tall so if you wanted a more arboreal temp cage when he gets older/before you get the 4x4 that might work.

Such a neat little guy! Jealous!


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Well, how did I miss this !!!!!!!!!

I kept checking the Ratsnake forum, LOL

He is SOO cute. You will be surprised how fast they grow, though !!

Mine used to rattle their tails when "hunting", and then smash the food around. Very dramatic !! hehe...

Unless a house is quite cold, these snakes do not need heat. Maybe a light bulb on a large cage to give a bit of a warmer spot. The only time mine were upset, is when I lost AC and my house got to warm.

They are from a rather coolish climate..

Beyond excited...I couldn't stand the wait and just ordered a little russian dude from Zerkles. Perhaps Jack's clutch-mate???
He'll be here Friday. :taz:

If you've got updates on Jack, I'd love to hear them!! Are you using a UTH for a little belly heat? Zerkles advised just for an 80 degree hot spot, but not sure if they need it. Our ambients in his room are between 74-76 in the summer and 69-72 in the winters...

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

Beyond excited...I couldn't stand the wait and just ordered a little russian dude from Zerkles. Perhaps Jack's clutch-mate???
He'll be here Friday. :taz:

If you've got updates on Jack, I'd love to hear them!! Are you using a UTH for a little belly heat? Zerkles advised just for an 80 degree hot spot, but not sure if they need it. Our ambients in his room are between 74-76 in the summer and 69-72 in the winters...

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Aw man...I'm jealous !!!

I never gave a "hotspot" per say (UTH) but I used a cage and it had a light above it and branches under the light, so they could climb up there if they wanted it "warmer". They did occasionally, but they seemed more bothered if the house got to hot, rather then being cooler.

But I would go by the breeders recommendations, esp. while they are so small. To make the transition easier.

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Originally Posted by zina10

Aw man...I'm jealous !!!

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I totally have you and redshepherd to blame (or thank!) for this as it was your past threads singing the praises of these that turned me on to them. I've never heard of them before and thought I was destined for a bp since i am a "beginner". But everything about the Russians appealed to me, whereas I wrestled with some of the beep's known habits. This just feels right. :)

So THANK YOU both!!

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Originally Posted by Starscream

Sterlite also has 50 gallon tubs. I don't know what the footprint difference is, but I couldn't find this size on their website for some reason? They sell it through Walmart, though, which is where I got mine. It's pretty tall so if you wanted a more arboreal temp cage when he gets older/before you get the 4x4 that might work.

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For some reason I totally wrote up a reply to this but somehow it didn't submit! Anyway, thanks, I found the 50gal online! I haven't seen it in stores though, but that will definitely work for quite awhile or even permanently for one of these guys. :D

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Originally Posted by zina10

Well, how did I miss this !!!!!!!!!

I kept checking the Ratsnake forum, LOL

He is SOO cute. You will be surprised how fast they grow, though !!

Mine used to rattle their tails when "hunting", and then smash the food around. Very dramatic !! hehe...

Unless a house is quite cold, these snakes do not need heat. Maybe a light bulb on a large cage to give a bit of a warmer spot. The only time mine were upset, is when I lost AC and my house got to warm.

They are from a rather coolish climate..

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Haha I was waiting for you to see him! :D That's good to know that they grow fast, because I really want him to grow up quick LOL. I saw someone on another site post a pic of their yearling russian rat snake, and it was still so small, so I was thinking they must grow pretty slowly... But maybe that one was just being underfed or weird.

Can't wait to see more feeding behaviors when he grows up! Right now, he's pretty shy, being so tiny.

And lol yeah, my house is currently 79 degrees so I see him chilling on his leaves on the cool side, probably trying hard to cool off!

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

Beyond excited...I couldn't stand the wait and just ordered a little russian dude from Zerkles. Perhaps Jack's clutch-mate???
He'll be here Friday. :taz:

If you've got updates on Jack, I'd love to hear them!! Are you using a UTH for a little belly heat? Zerkles advised just for an 80 degree hot spot, but not sure if they need it. Our ambients in his room are between 74-76 in the summer and 69-72 in the winters...

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Daaang congrats!!! You jumped on it!! :D Probably is Jack's clutch mate, since this was their last late clutch! Hatchlings tend to be shy, being SO small and prey for literally anything, so you won't see that outgoing nature until they're larger.

I used a UTH last week when it got cooler, but set to 80. So it only really turned on more overnight. I just removed it since it suddenly became so hot around here since yesterday.

Ok, this is now a whole 2 days without our Russian Ratsnake update...

*drums fingers on the desk*

:)

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Originally Posted by zina10

Ok, this is now a whole 2 days without our Russian Ratsnake update...

*drums fingers on the desk*

:)

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:rofl:YAY, here we are!!

Well, he's being a great little shy hatchling! I'm afraid of putting him anywhere for pictures, because he is so small and fast. I've been handling him daily or even twice a day, for 5-10 minutes each, and he seems to be calming down already with realizing I won't kill him every time I open his enclosure. He's very aware of what's going on around us though, it's pretty interesting. Sort of reminds me of the awareness my scrub python displays, except docile! LOL

I have his tub near my turtle tank, and as I was putting him back today, he looked up distinctly to watch my turtle (making a lot of movement in her tank) that was a couple feet away.

So far though, he still only eats if I leave the prey item in his tub, but he eats it right away. He hasn't struck at the prey when I offered yet. I think I'm still too big and scary right now.

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aw man, so cute , so cute !!!!
:)

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

So far though, he still only eats if I leave the prey item in his tub, but he eats it right away. He hasn't struck at the prey when I offered yet. I think I'm still too big and scary right now.

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My husband’s VBB and King Rat are the same way for feeding, and both are big boys. May be an Old World ratsnake thing, or a Zerkle-snake thing. [emoji6]


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So cute! I'm so jealous! Its crazy how you can already tell how inqusitive he is even at such a young age.

You say you've been holding him daily, is that typical to do to keep a colubrid tame? I'm only used to holding my BPs weekly but am for sure getting a old world colubrid soon hopefully (Although sadly not a Russian Rat) I would love to try and keep them tame as they get big as well.

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Originally Posted by Prognathodon

My husband’s VBB and King Rat are the same way for feeding, and both are big boys. May be an Old World ratsnake thing, or a Zerkle-snake thing. [emoji6]

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Interesting! I wonder if Zerkle leaves the prey in their enclosure, so that's what they're use to. LOL

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Originally Posted by BluuWolf

So cute! I'm so jealous! Its crazy how you can already tell how inqusitive he is even at such a young age.

You say you've been holding him daily, is that typical to do to keep a colubrid tame? I'm only used to holding my BPs weekly but am for sure getting a old world colubrid soon hopefully (Although sadly not a Russian Rat) I would love to try and keep them tame as they get big as well.

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It depends on the colubrid species, just like it depends on python/boa species. Russian Rat Snakes are known to be naturally docile and inquisitive, especially as they get older, but I'm just holding daily for now since my tiny one was so shy... and testing to see if it helps haha, which it does appear to be. Many other old worlds are more defensive, and just can't become docile/tame like a BP or russian rat snake would because it's not in their nature. Many tend to be require more "advanced" handling skills.

The kid's already noticeably bigger than when I got him 3 weeks ago! It's noticeable in person probably more than photos. He doesn't feel quite as fragile of a mushy worm anymore. I'm glad to see him growing fairly quickly!

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I'm totally looking forward to his future color changes as he continues to grow! Curious how many grams he weighs lol Cutie as always!

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Originally Posted by MissterDog

I'm totally looking forward to his future color changes as he continues to grow! Curious how many grams he weighs lol Cutie as always!

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I’m curious too! Maybe I’ll weigh him today. I’m guessing 30g. LOL

So cute!

Bump :)

Want an update - how's Jack doing? Bonsai has taken to his hide for the last 1.5 weeks and we miss him very much. He went blue and his eyes are now clear, so I'm assuming he'll shed soon. We've been resisting the urge to pester him, but it's bumming us out not to see him.

Has Jack had a shed with you yet? If yes, did he disappear for days while he went thru the process? Any recent pics to share?

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

Bump :)

Want an update - how's Jack doing? Bonsai has taken to his hide for the last 1.5 weeks and we miss him very much. He went blue and his eyes are now clear, so I'm assuming he'll shed soon. We've been resisting the urge to pester him, but it's bumming us out not to see him.

Has Jack had a shed with you yet? If yes, did he disappear for days while he went thru the process? Any recent pics to share?

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Hey! Yeah, Jack also spends the majority of his time in the hide. :D Hatchlings are tiny and shy, so I'd guess they're going to be ball pythons for awhile until they gain some size. He's shed with me once, and he hid during shedding too.

Jack was also active for the first few days he arrived here, nervously checking out the new environment and making sure I won't eat him. LOL

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

Hey! Yeah, Jack also spends the majority of his time in the hide. :D Hatchlings are tiny and shy, so I'd guess they're going to be ball pythons for awhile until they gain some size. He's shed with me once, and he hid during shedding too.

Jack was also active for the first few days he arrived here, nervously checking out the new environment and making sure I won't eat him. LOL

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Ok, cool! Our little one was so active the first few days and then poof! he disappeared. Good to know it's normal. Did you have to bump your humidity up for his shed? Ours is around 60%-65% at the moment.

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

Ok, cool! Our little one was so active the first few days and then poof! he disappeared. Good to know it's normal. Did you have to bump your humidity up for his shed? Ours is around 60%-65% at the moment.

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That humidity is totally fine for russian rat snakes to shed :) I'll bet they would still shed well at 50% humidity.

Jack's snake mites are basically all gone since the last treatment, but I'm treating his enclosure and things around it tomorrow with PAM to be totally sure. So hopefully it's all good!

I'm glad I caught it early. The two adults I saw before were the only two, I killed them both myself, and I never found another.

I've fed him only twice for the past couple weeks since I found mites, to lessen the chance of poop so often LOL.

Good to hear! I was wondering how the little guy was fairing. And that the mites didn't touch his appetite lol.

So glad he's on the mend! What an ordeal, how are you recovering?

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Originally Posted by Starscream

Good to hear! I was wondering how the little guy was fairing. And that the mites didn't touch his appetite lol.

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Yeah! It wasn't much mites, thankfully.

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

So glad he's on the mend! What an ordeal, how are you recovering?

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Thanks! I'm dandy haha, I saw the last of the baby mites after spraying/cleaning everything with nix that day. I also covered my ball pythons and boa with frontline and sprayed the other pythons cages with nix, so I feel much safer.

Re-applied frontline to all my snakes again, just in case, and the place seems pretty mite-free to me!

And he's grown! His browns are obviously getting blacker, and his stripes are noticeably yellower. Also getting more chill as well.

Unfortunately just been posting a bunch of iphone pics LOL. I'll get nikon pics eventually!

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Size and color update- slightly blacker, especially near the tail. These guys don't grow too fast, don't they? LOL

9 months old now

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Sweet Jack!! I've been hoping for an update on him. 😊

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Originally Posted by hilabeans

Sweet Jack!! I've been hoping for an update on him. 😊

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He looks wonderful !!!

I do think he grew quite a bit :)