My gorgeous new Bob Clark, tiger, fluffy line part 2, it grows.

Appetite insatiable. Only I can handle her now as she went evil like my ATB. What do you think of her size? It's nearly doubled in seems in 2 weeks.

http://i.imgur.com/cobysO5.jpg
http://imgur.com/6uAbNvf.jpg
http://imgur.com/GoKOpPd.jpg
http://imgur.com/N2gjwTV.jpg
http://imgur.com/a2CnCSH.jpg

I'm not a man who believes is faith, but I believe we're seeing Fluffy reborn.

For some reason the pictures have a broken icon for me. I can't view them. Might be a problem on my end, who knows. Very excited to see the progression of her!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Sauron had no true gender as a minor god so a female retic is fine. Her eyes are Sauron's own and she went now. Food mad, wants daily food.


Appetite insatiable. Only I can handle her now as she went evil like my ATB. What do you think of her size? It's nearly doubled in seems in 2 weeks.

http://i.imgur.com/cobysO5.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/6uAbNvf.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/N2gjwTV.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/a2CnCSH.jpg
http://imgur.com/a2CnCSH.jpg

I'm not a man who believes is faith, but I believe we're seeing Fluffy reborn.

A female mainland? Should easily hit 10' in the first year.

My 37.5% SD, 31.5% dwarf, 31% mainland white tiger het snow male from Vital Exotics went from 2' at 5 months old to over 7' in 9 months. But he is a pig and wrecks his face if he isnt fed every 10 days at least. He went from small rats to 2XL guinea pigs.

And be prepared to ditch that tank in about 2 months haha. In the 9 months I had Caesar, he went from a AP T10 4x2 cage when I got him to now an AP T25 6x3 cage 9 months later. And possibly an AP T65 8x3 if he gets over 10'.
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...01a61bac_h.jpg

I'd be VERY interested in bringing WC mainland in for genetic diversity.

10 feet? No, she shows signs of the fluffy gene being active. She'll exceed 10 I think if fed.

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

10 feet? No, she shows signs of the fluffy gene being active. She'll exceed 10 I think if fed.

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I said 10' in the first year. A mainland female well fed can get 18'+. I hope you have a friend/wife/girlfriend to help you handle it when it's that large.

It's the main reason I really don't want anything over 11-12' as I handle my reptiles alone.

Kind of the same reason I am debating backing out of getting a Gila Monster or Beaded Lizard which I had planned to get in a couple months. Everyone I've talked to has told me I should be fine with one but if I did get tagged, expect to wish you died for 24 hours and then spend the next couple weeks recovering from the side effects since there is no anti venom for Heloderma.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

I'd be VERY interested in bringing WC mainland in for genetic diversity.

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Why? Pretty much all the bad rep retics have gotten have been from WC ones years ago before people started breeding them like crazy. Now with all the generations of breeding, they have 'mellowed' out but you will still run into psycho ones. Imagine trying to control an 18'+ really pissed off snake. If you look at my post of "ouch', you will see what a male retic did to it's owner and that was a male, not a monster female.

Just make sure you have this snake for the right reasons.

If it's to brag about how big of snake you got, then find a new home for it now.

If it's because you truly like the animals, then make sure you are prepared for it. They need large housing, large food and lots of respect.

And be sure you can afford it. Caesar has cost me a nice chunk of change in the past 9 months. $700ish in his new cage and $45 a month for food, not to mention substrate etc. And like I said, if he needs a T65 cage, that will run me probably close to $1000 with shipping :(

Again, that's most of the reason I went with a SD. More manageable and cheaper kind of.

Guy that lives by me who is huge into BIG reptiles like monitors and retics as well as keeping wolves has a 16'+ female retic that he feeds goats to lol. But he also breeds Black Roughneck Monitors so he has the resources and land etc for it. He keeps his own goats and chickens and stuff lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sauzo

I said 10' in the first year. A mainland female well fed can get 18'+. I hope you have a friend/wife/girlfriend to help you handle it when it's that large.

It's the main reason I really don't want anything over 11-12' as I handle my reptiles alone.

Kind of the same reason I am debating backing out of getting a Gila Monster or Beaded Lizard which I had planned to get in a couple months. Everyone I've talked to has told me I should be fine with one but if I did get tagged, expect to wish you died for 24 hours and then spend the next couple weeks recovering from the side effects since there is no anti venom for Heloderma.

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I know you said 10, she's going to surpass it.

I'm a bodybuilder so I feel okay at 15' but yes I have help.

In negotiations for a 20 foot female now.

Get your gila, don't fear jumping into the cold water. I did, these snakes can kill me...you just need gloves. Never allow fear to interfere with dreams if you can handle the species then take the jump.

I assure you I got this. 20 years in the game and the two biggest names in retics have agreed to be consultants as I build my breeding location.

VA business load and will power. I can't expose it all but a new type of retic is coming.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

I know you said 10, she's going to surpass it.

I'm a bodybuilder so I feel okay at 15' but yes I have help.

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I would not rely on "bodybuilding" to get you out of a bad situation with a 15 foot retic that has made a mistake.

That would be a false sense of security and irresponsible. I don't ever overestimate my abilities even with the smaller 7 foot boa here. I still pay attention. My retic has me on my toes a lot but is still young. I'm sure you will be aware and cautious too. All it takes is a distracting bite and a coil or two from a big animal and you are in trouble.

I'm glad you have help as that is a requirement for the big ones.

Most folks are leaning toward the dwarf and SD packages these days for manageability and lesser feeding costs.

Still think your tiger is beautiful.

Be safe and good luck.

I honestly am disgusted they dwarfed an animal of sheer magnificence. I dislike them a lot.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gio

I would not rely on "bodybuilding" to get you out of a bad situation with a 15 foot retic that has made a mistake.

That would be a false sense of security and irresponsible. I don't ever overestimate my abilities even with the smaller 7 foot boa here. I still pay attention. My retic has me on my toes a lot but is still young. I'm sure you will be aware and cautious too. All it takes is a distracting bite and a coil or two from a big animal and you are in trouble.

I'm glad you have help as that is a requirement for the big ones.

Most folks are leaning toward the dwarf and SD packages these days for manageability and lesser feeding costs.

Still think your tiger is beautiful.

Be safe and good luck.

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I've additional safety measures as well.

He is in negotiations for a 20 ft retic but can't afford a keyboard? A 20 ft retic combined with whatever drugs he is taking is a recipe for disaster. I hope no one reads this stuff and thinks this guy is anyone to emulate.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

I honestly am disgusted they dwarfed an animal of sheer magnificence. I dislike them a lot.

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"They" did not dwarf anything. These dwarves are locality animals found on certain islands. Humans had nothing to do with that, it is natural selection and survival due to smaller prey and only seasonal availability. People found them easier to keep over a large animals and decided to breed them in captivity that is why they are around now and more popular.

Technically what happened is the dwarf population animals were bred to the mainland animals for colors but the actual dwarf population is a real thing. They were not created. Scientific studies even found differences in scale patterns and separate species recognition is pending for some populations. There is more to it but that's the gist.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

He is in negotiations for a 20 ft retic but can't afford a keyboard? A 20 ft retic combined with whatever drugs he is taking is a recipe for disaster. I hope no one reads this stuff and thinks this guy is anyone to emulate.

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If this is true,

I'm very concerned!

More of a concern is has he had experience with such a large constrictor. I mean working with a snake since it was a baby and 'growing' together with it is a LOT different than buying a 20' snake that you meet for the first time. Unless you have lots of experience and not just blowing smoke to sound cool, i would start with a small one and like i said, 'grow' with it.

And also i hope you have a source for goats and pigs available as something that size is not going to be happy either a couple jumbo rats or a couple rabbits lol. Guy i know with i believe she is a 18' female feeds it goats and stuff but like i said, he has his own farm and raises wolves, breeds Black Roughneck monitors and has large constrictors so he has chickens and goats and very capable of meeting the snakes' needs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sauzo

More of a concern is has he had experience with such a large constrictor. I mean working with a snake since it was a baby and 'growing' together with it is a LOT different than buying a 20' snake that you meet for the first time. Unless you have lots of experience and not just blowing smoke to sound cool, i would start with a small one and like i said, 'grow' with it.

And also i hope you have a source for goats and pigs available as something that size is not going to be happy either a couple jumbo rats or a couple rabbits lol. Guy i know with i believe she is a 18' female feeds it goats and stuff but like i said, he has his own farm and raises wolves, breeds Black Roughneck monitors and has large constrictors so he has chickens and goats and very capable of meeting the snakes' needs.

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I agree with that Sauzo.

An example near me is, Chase Delles (Chasin Reptiles) he's the son of the Bruce Delles, the guy that owns Twin Cities Reptiles here. I bought my son's royal there.
Anyhow, Bruce has an 18 foot, male retic named Oscar. At that size I could simply not care for any snake. He's too big for me and not the size I'd enjoy as a pet snake here. Bruce placed Oscar with Chase as I believe Oscar was a lot of extra work at the reptile shop.

Oscar eats very large meals and is very placid, however if things were to get out of hand, he's a 3 person snake minimum for sure. He is as big as an average sized female mainland retic.

The O/P coming into a 20' retic, cold, after several years of being out of the hobby is rather daring IMO.

The new tiger posted here is very pretty. I personally don't find much satisfaction in "world record" sizes and would think that, that Fluffy line would not be in demand if you were to breed and sell for size.

If size is your bag, enjoy it. I support good keepers, no matter the type of snake they keep. That said, I have no tolerance for keepers that are trying to elevate their image based on another living thing's shape, size or temperament, especially when proper care may not be a priority.

O/P,

That's a very pretty tiger, actually its my favorite pattern in the snake world that can maybe considered somewhat natural or fairly non-morphish. I hope you enjoy it and are in a good position to care for it for many, many years.

Getting a 20 footer in a short time with thoughts of breeding it and placing offspring that are genetically predisposed for size, probably won't be very lucrative.

You may not like the dwarf populations, but they are typically more sought after these days.

Best of luck and be safe.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

He is in negotiations for a 20 ft retic but can't afford a keyboard? A 20 ft retic combined with whatever drugs he is taking is a recipe for disaster. I hope no one reads this stuff and thinks this guy is anyone to emulate.

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Not on drugs punk. And yeah let me go get a keyboard for a damn laptop. I'd rather have it professionally fixed.

Secured my goat provider an hour before seeing this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

Not on drugs punk. And yeah let me go get a keyboard for a damn laptop. I'd rather have it professionally fixed.

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You should have just let it go. You are going to get another post quarantined.

Been out of snake keeping for half a year out of 21yrs total. Lucrative maybe not. I have another business I just began that can sustain it.

I'm not trying to create 5,000$ snakes. I in fact plan on making them scarcely available. I want to create a super giant the world will want to see.

I've already made calls to genetics labs in hopes to isolate a giant gene and removing the dice roll.

If I succeed I invite you to see my facility, I plan on making it available to the public often. My buddy owns a zoo as well and he'd want one for people to see.



I'm not a novice. It's been this way since the dawn on time, people who own giant pythons sit there and lecture those wanting in.

Kind of off topic but you arent some guy named Roland Deschain(a character from Stephen Kings Dark Tower) who was arguing with me today about how my BCL isnt a true BCL as it doesnt have a cross head stamp on its head and how only true BCL have the cross head even though the parents of my snake come from Vin Russo and Joel Diaz at Legacy reptiles and the fact i proves him wrong on pretty much excuse he came up with and was backed up by quite a few BCL breeders.

And also called Vin Russo and Legacy reptiles BS companies that dont produce pure stuff.

And that he is the only one who has a real BCL which he has paperwork for but doesnt know who bred it.....

And i even invited him to join the Boa Constrictor Longicauda group and Pure Locality Boas group and he didnt want to cause he said they were all full of it and didnt know anything....

You arent the same guy are you? lol

But regardless, good luck on your endeavors. Hope I don't read about a guy who was eaten by a 20' retic lol. And even more luck on trying to ID this 'giant' gene which I couldn't imagine hasn't been thought of before. But anyways, good luck.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gio

I would not rely on "bodybuilding" to get you out of a bad situation with a 15 foot retic that has made a mistake.

That would be a false sense of security and irresponsible. I don't ever overestimate my abilities even with the smaller 7 foot boa here. I still pay attention. My retic has me on my toes a lot but is still young. I'm sure you will be aware and cautious too. All it takes is a distracting bite and a coil or two from a big animal and you are in trouble.

I'm glad you have help as that is a requirement for the big ones.

Most folks are leaning toward the dwarf and SD packages these days for manageability and lesser feeding costs.

Still think your tiger is beautiful.

Be safe and good luck.

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Thank you, she is amazing. No camera phone can capture her beauty. She's really something to see in sunlight. Rainbow oil slick shining scales. And seeing how small she is and knowing soon she'll be in control boggles my mind.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sauzo

Kind of off topic but you arent some guy named Roland Deschain(a character from Stephen Kings Dark Tower) who was arguing with me today about how my BCL isnt a true BCL as it doesnt have a cross head stamp on its head and how only true BCL have the cross head even though the parents of my snake come from Vin Russo and Joel Diaz at Legacy reptiles and the fact i proves him wrong on pretty much excuse he came up with and was backed up by quite a few BCL breeders.

And also called Vin Russo and Legacy reptiles BS companies that dont produce pure stuff.

And that he is the only one who has a real BCL which he has paperwork for but doesnt know who bred it.....

And i even invited him to join the Boa Constrictor Longicauda group and Pure Locality Boas group and he didnt want to cause he said they were all full of it and didnt know anything....

You arent the same guy are you? lol

But regardless, good luck on your endeavors. Hope I don't read about a guy who was eaten by a 20' retic lol. And even more luck on trying to ID this 'giant' gene which I couldn't imagine hasn't been thought of before. But anyways, good luck.

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Do you know a lot about animal genetic testing? Because it almost doesn't exist in reptiles. Can you please hold a decent conversation without adding subtle insults. I'm in the keepers area now, not site info and suggestions. I'm here to discuss keeping and breeding snakes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sauzo

Kind of off topic but you arent some guy named Roland Deschain(a character from Stephen Kings Dark Tower) who was arguing with me today about how my BCL isnt a true BCL as it doesnt have a cross head stamp on its head and how only true BCL have the cross head even though the parents of my snake come from Vin Russo and Joel Diaz at Legacy reptiles and the fact i proves him wrong on pretty much excuse he came up with and was backed up by quite a few BCL breeders.

And also called Vin Russo and Legacy reptiles BS companies that dont produce pure stuff.

And that he is the only one who has a real BCL which he has paperwork for but doesnt know who bred it.....

And i even invited him to join the Boa Constrictor Longicauda group and Pure Locality Boas group and he didnt want to cause he said they were all full of it and didnt know anything....

You arent the same guy are you? lol

But regardless, good luck on your endeavors. Hope I don't read about a guy who was eaten by a 20' retic lol. And even more luck on trying to ID this 'giant' gene which I couldn't imagine hasn't been thought of before. But anyways, good luck.

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I'm confused if you're saying I'm lying about her being a Bob's Fluffy line. Bob is mailing me paperwork and here she is still on his page. Notice is says inquire? He simply hasn't pulled it down. Bob just got back from Japan today he's getting me my paperwork verifying her as Fluffy line.

I'm not that dude at all. I only keep pythons now and forevermore.

Dude BCLs look like black and white red tails to me, nothing special I see there. You won't hear me speak on anything but BCIs and ATBs because I kept some. Pythons bring me a special feeling of wonder and amazement boas just don't. Except tree boas, they share in that elegant look. A well colored ATB..... amazing creatures.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

Do you know a lot about animal genetic testing? Because it almost doesn't exist in reptiles. Can you please hold a decent conversation without adding subtle insults. I'm in the keepers area now, not site info and suggestions. I'm here to discuss keeping and breeding snakes.

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No I don't. And where did you get this insults idea from? I was insinuating that you are all over the place with your goals, of first getting this baby retic the paperwork from Bob. Now working on acquiring a 20' retic. Then paying for this genetic testing which I am quite sure isn't cheap.

If like others have said, you are having trouble getting a laptop keyboard fixed, genetic testing and pinpointing said gene is going to be a lot more expensive and time consuming I would think.

And I understand you are discussing keeping and breeding but like my statement above, you are all over the board.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

I'm confused if you're saying I'm lying about her being a Bob's Fluffy line. Bob is mailing me paperwork and here she is still on his page. Notice is says inquire? He simply hasn't pulled it down. Bob just got back from Japan today he's getting me my paperwork verifying her as Fluffy line.

I'm not that dude at all. I only keep pythons now and forevermore.

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And no I am saying you are lying about the fluffy line as I am familiar with it as I'm sure a lot of other keepers are too. Like I said, I was insinuating that you were all over the board with about 10 irons in the fire lol. It was more of a joke as I'm sure you aren't that guy but that guy was all over the place talking about Stockl stuff, then calling Vin Russo and other well known breeders fakes and producing not true BCL and how he had the only true BCL.

The best part was Vin Russo actually discovered the BCL subspecies back in like 1991 or something. So for this guy to say Vin was selling not pure BCL was rather entertaining lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

Dude BCLs look like black and white red tails to me, nothing special I see there. You won't hear me speak on anything but BCIs and ATBs because I kept some. Pythons bring me a special feeling of wonder and amazement boas just don't. Except tree boas, they share in that elegant look. A well colored ATB..... amazing creatures.

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And to each their own. I started out big into BCI morphs but the longer I've been in the hobby, the more I appreciate the stuff Mother Nature makes.

I personally like retics but to be honest, since the lift on Lacey Act and it seems even before that, everyone breeds or keeps retics. And the sad part is a lot of the people do it simply for the epeen factor. Go to Retic Nation FB page. You will see mostly loud mouthy guys who talk a lot of trash and are basically keyboard warriors. Even a few of the old timers from Retic Nation even voiced that. I had recently joined so I didn't really understand but after spending time there just reading, it is filled with lots of arrogant loud people. Not everyone mind you but more than I see on the boa pages.

But anyways, each to their own. I love the look of adult BCL. They are natures true IMG imo. And on top of that, they are a fairly rare subspecies. The breeders I've talked to have told me Meltzer/Lincoln which was one of the starting lines along with Gus Rentfro's Hauge line I believe and the Denton line. Well Meltzer/Lincoln line is all about extinct I was told. And to complicate problems, these boas come from the Tumbes Mountains who Ecuador and Peru government have been fighting over ownership for years so you cant even collect wild ones from there.

Retics offer the most morphs imo but boas offer the most subspecies which each is special and unique. Good god, I'm starting to sound like Gio!! Soon, I'll be doing the fancy natural setups :D

Anyways, sorry for the rambling. Don't take it the wrong way. I wish you the best of luck in whatever you are doing. Just to me, credibility to me is lost when people go in so many directions at once. I am more apt to believe the guy who says one thing and does it than a guy who says 15 things and doesn't follow through with a single one. Anyways, no hard feelings chief.

I'm upgrading to a better laptop in 2 weeks, I'll deal with it for now. It functions but when I get heated and type real fast its keys give me no mercy.

I don't know how much the genetic testing is, hence it's an area to check into. The science improves drastically fast.

My girlfriend does horses. They mapped the entire equine genome. Same with dogs. I'm only asking them to find 1 genetic marker. It might not be as bad as you think. Finding 1 marker is a lot less work than mapping the entire genes and known markers. My girl introduced me to the idea when breeding horses. There's no poss hets or hets, no diceroll.

It was worth calling a few labs today to see where the technology has progressed. Say it takes half my business loan money to do and it still pays off because every specimen will be needed.

And man look, lay off a bit.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sauzo

And to each their own. I started out big into BCI morphs but the longer I've been in the hobby, the more I appreciate the stuff Mother Nature makes.

I personally like retics but to be honest, since the lift on Lacey Act and it seems even before that, everyone breeds or keeps retics. And the sad part is a lot of the people do it simply for the epeen factor. Go to Retic Nation FB page. You will see mostly loud mouthy guys who talk a lot of trash and are basically keyboard warriors. Even a few of the old timers from Retic Nation even voiced that. I had recently joined so I didn't really understand but after spending time there just reading, it is filled with lots of arrogant loud people. Not everyone mind you but more than I see on the boa pages.

But anyways, each to their own. I love the look of adult BCL. They are natures true IMG imo. And on top of that, they are a fairly rare subspecies. The breeders I've talked to have told me Meltzer/Lincoln which was one of the starting lines along with Gus Rentfro's Hauge line I believe and the Denton line. Well Meltzer/Lincoln line is all about extinct I was told. And to complicate problems, these boas come from the Tumbes Mountains who Ecuador and Peru government have been fighting over ownership for years so you cant even collect wild ones from there.

Retics offer the most morphs imo but boas offer the most subspecies which each is special and unique. Good god, I'm starting to sound like Gio!! Soon, I'll be doing the fancy natural setups :D

Anyways, sorry for the rambling. Don't take it the wrong way. I wish you the best of luck in whatever you are doing. Just to me, credibility to me is lost when people go in so many directions at once. I am more apt to believe the guy who says one thing and does it than a guy who says 15 things and doesn't follow through with a single one. Anyways, no hard feelings chief.

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Even retic normals are like mother nature wove a pattern of magnificence onto them.

Honestly this is currently my full time job. I have money to live better than most of people my age because of veteran benefits. So with all day to handle things and research, consult with retic experts, I'm just following the process. Because I can also get very valuable items direct from source for sale in America I can further prop this project up until it at least balances budget. I also was forced ahead of schedule by the 20 footer so it's day to night work getting ready.

My baby Fluffy line I adore. And she is going to be the biggest one in my collection and produce the finest babies for me. I never cared much for retics until I finally saw those orange gem stone eyes in person.


And no owning big snakes does in fact not make you cool. I makes your friends swear they will never visit your house.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The_Godfather

Even retic normals are like mother nature wove a pattern of magnificence onto them.

Honestly this is currently my full time job. I have money to live better than most of people my age because of veteran benefits. So with all day to handle things and research, consult with retic experts, I'm just following the process. Because I can also get very valuable items direct from source for sale in America I can further prop this project up until it at least balances budget. I also was forced ahead of schedule by the 20 footer so it's day to night work getting ready.

My baby Fluffy line I adore. And she is going to be the biggest one in my collection and produce the finest babies for me. I never cared much for retics until I finally saw those orange gem stone eyes in person.


And no owning big snakes does in fact not make you cool. I makes your friends swear they will never visit your house.

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Fancy natural setups ain't easy. I had to book a carpenter for the door before mines done. Wait for the vines to grow. Long process compared to just a terrestrial box.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sauzo

No I don't. And where did you get this insults idea from? I was insinuating that you are all over the place with your goals, of first getting this baby retic the paperwork from Bob. Now working on acquiring a 20' retic. Then paying for this genetic testing which I am quite sure isn't cheap.

If like others have said, you are having trouble getting a laptop keyboard fixed, genetic testing and pinpointing said gene is going to be a lot more expensive and time consuming I would think.

And I understand you are discussing keeping and breeding but like my statement above, you are all over the board.

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Okay so I got a company and it's gonna run me 5-10k$. It's not about finding one gene, it's about comparing the large ones dna samples to say a dwarfs and finding multiple markers that indicate genetic potential. It makes it far less of a gamble. The science is ready now and reduces the dice roll. It's quite complex and we're only mapping indicators but as with horses and dogs it could change the morph game as we know it. 5-10k isn't bad because without having a means to test I'd ultimately waste more on specimens who didn't reach potential and will not be bred. But I'm in legitimate talks about having this done. Thats my status as of now on the testing.