Super Dwarf Retic Breeders/Questions

Hey gang - I'm gathering information as to make an educated decision about the purchase of a super dwarf retic.

I've looked at posts in the "General Pythons (all pythons)" sub-forum and didn't find as much information about super dwarf retics as I have here in the "Giant Pythons (pythons over 10' long)" sub-forum. Am I misunderstood in that SD retics shouldn't get close to be over 10' long if even longer than 8'? I'm probably overthinking but wanted to be certain.

I've noticed a few breeders, Bob Clark, Prehistoric Pets, Vital Exotics, and Chase-n-Reptiles mentioned and was curious if you, as customers of these and other breeders, wouldn't mind tossing in your opinion about your experience to better help me with my decision.

I'm also concerned about the laws as I live in NY and reticulated pythons are considered "wild animals" and thereby banned from ownership based on size. I'm interested in a super dwarf retic that quite honestly is smaller than some red tails and dumerils can get and we can own without the need of a special license, again please correct me if I am wrong in my thinking.

I thank you all in advance for your time and knowledge to better help me make an educated decision when/IF I do so. (LOL IF - who are we kidding here, I've got an addictive personality...if I'm writing about it here, I'll get one eventually LOL)

Well, it all depends on the snakes and feeding to an extent as to how big it will get. Look at Gio's retic vs JM's retic vs my retic. JM's is pure SD, a female, moderately fed i believe and is 7'. Gio's is same SD % as mine but his has less mainland and more dwarf, is male and conservatively fed on small and medium rats every 14 days and is 5-6'. Caesar is more mainland and less dwarf, male and was more or less heavily fed on large and now jumbo rats every 7-10 days and he's 7'.

You can see there is a big difference in food intake between Gio and I for our retics but only about 1-2' difference in size. So it really depends on the snake. If you want smaller, definitely get a male.

As for the breeders, last time i talked to Kris at Vital Exotics, he was focusing on his bison business and not doing anything with retics this year. Bob Clark is ok but from a few people I've talked to, he doesnt seem to keep very meticulous records on his SD %. Same with Prehistoric Pets. Never dealt with Chase-n-reptiles. Someone i would add would be Daniel Solis. I have heard great stuff from him and i believe thats who JM got his Kalatoa from. Also talk to Shannon Roepke. She keeps very good records on her SD stuff and i have heard great stuff. I was going to buy a SD Platinum tiger from her but i ended up getting Caesar from Vital Exotics.

As for NY laws, i have no idea. You would have check your county or city codes. If you checked your laws and it says they are banned citywide, then you might be sol.

I agree with the feeding, that will really influence the size. Also, most SD retics are a blend of Super Dwarf, Dwarf, and Mainland, that's the only way you can get morphs into SD unless you want just normal coloration. For smaller snakes try to keep the SD and dwarf percentages high and the Mainland low. I have a purple albino male that's 37.5% SD, 50% D, and 12.5% Mainland. He is staying pretty small, I'd say about the size and growth rate of a boa.

I tend to feed my females more since I want eggs eventually but try to keep my males on the smaller size, for this male I feed 1-2 medium rats per week. This boy seems to fast more than my female retic, especially around shedding time where he can go a couple weeks hiding in the back of the enclosure. The way I feed my retics is that if they don't move around or come up to the front of the cage I don't feed them at all. I've tried to feed my male when he is coiled up in the back and sometimes he just aggressively strikes at the rodent, so I don't do that anymore. I try to follow their mood swings LOL.

Read this thread thoroughly if you haven't already. https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...nd-Information
Also check out Cody's retic videos on YouTube. Very informative and helpful.
I will say that I absolutely adore my super dwarves. Phyllis, my kalatoa gal, is 17 months old this week and is a touch over 7' already. I imagine 9' is a possibility for her, though she is slowing down on length and getting a bit thicker and heavier now. At three weeks old she was 22" and 56 grams, about a year and a half later she is now about 3000 grams +/-. She just took her first two jumbo rats the last couple weeks at 10 day intervals and honestly she'd probably be fine on larges every 7-8 days. I have a progression thread for her on here too. I got her from Daniel Solis of reptile avenue and he was great to work with. I think he's probably out of SD stuff for the year, he cleaned house before he went on a herping trip to Indonesia last week.
I've also got a Bob Clark 2016 50% SD male ultra ivory. He's 16 months old on Saturday and is maybe 5' at the most. He was fed fairly conservative for his first year at bobs facility and has put on some decent growth in the last 4 months I've had him and bumped him up to med rats recently. He's grown probably around 12" or more in the four months I've had him and I think he'll top out around 6-7' likely. His dad was 6' ultra anery and mom was 11' platinum het anery. I don't know their respective SD percentages but I'd guess they were both 50%. Bob was quick to answer my questions about his background genetics and such so asking is worthwhile.
Advice I'd give is to plan for a bigger snake than you expect and be pleasantly surprised when it's not the monster you thought it could turn out to be. And like Sauzo said, if size is a big concern go with a male and the highest SD% you can get.
As for NY laws... are you in NYC or just New York State? I think the city is no retics or other large constrictors but I could be wrong. Do some research before taking the plunge


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Originally Posted by BR8080

Hey gang - I'm gathering information as to make an educated decision about the purchase of a super dwarf retic.

I've looked at posts in the "General Pythons (all pythons)" sub-forum and didn't find as much information about super dwarf retics as I have here in the "Giant Pythons (pythons over 10' long)" sub-forum. Am I misunderstood in that SD retics shouldn't get close to be over 10' long if even longer than 8'? I'm probably overthinking but wanted to be certain.

I've noticed a few breeders, Bob Clark, Prehistoric Pets, Vital Exotics, and Chase-n-Reptiles mentioned and was curious if you, as customers of these and other breeders, wouldn't mind tossing in your opinion about your experience to better help me with my decision.

I'm also concerned about the laws as I live in NY and reticulated pythons are considered "wild animals" and thereby banned from ownership based on size. I'm interested in a super dwarf retic that quite honestly is smaller than some red tails and dumerils can get and we can own without the need of a special license, again please correct me if I am wrong in my thinking.

I thank you all in advance for your time and knowledge to better help me make an educated decision when/IF I do so. (LOL IF - who are we kidding here, I've got an addictive personality...if I'm writing about it here, I'll get one eventually LOL)

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Hi..... I also have obsessive / addictive traits .. :)

Anyways my Super Dwarf Purple Albino Retic should top out at 6' ( ideally slightly less ) . He's a lovely , friendly yet inquisitive little guy . The dad was 5' and mum was only 7' .




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Mike Carty, over on Fauna Classified, has some beautiful snakes, at least 25%SD. Fantastic temperament, very inquisitive, good eaters. Mike is very informative about his babies, really cares about them, is fine with keeping in touch after the sale.

A permit is required in NY state to keep retics, whether SD or not. The permit is based on species not locality. Reputable sellers will ask to see a copy of yours before they ship you one.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bcr229

Some may not agree with me, but I'll own one eventually.

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https://ball-pythons.net/forums/images/smilies/mad.png https://ball-pythons.net/forums/images/smilies/mad.pngI literally just got off the phone with the NYS DEC and I'm FUMING!!!! https://ball-pythons.net/forums/images/smilies/mad.png https://ball-pythons.net/forums/images/smilies/mad.png

I was informed I cannot own a reticulated python because they are venomous. I responded, "With all due respect, may I speak with someone that knows and understands that the species is most certainly NOT venomous and can answer my questions properly." He then went on to say it's because of their size, I informed him that a SD will be smaller than a true red tail boa and then he hung up on me. NYS government at it's finest.

Some may not agree with me, but I'll own one eventually.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zincubus

Hi..... I also have obsessive / addictive traits .. :)

Anyways my Super Dwarf Purple Albino Retic should top out at 6' ( ideally slightly less ) . He's a lovely , friendly yet inquisitive little guy . The dad was 5' and mum was only 7' .




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalkhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...eddb2eef23.jpg

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https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...0b19cd48ef.jpg



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Quote:

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Originally Posted by BR8080

:mad: :mad:I literally just got off the phone with the NYS DEC and I'm FUMING!!!! :mad: :mad:

I was informed I cannot own a reticulated python because they are venomous. I responded, "With all due respect, may I speak with someone that knows and understands that the species is most certainly NOT venomous and can answer my questions properly." He then went on to say it's because of their size, I informed him that a SD will be smaller than a true red tail boa and then he hung up on me. NYS government at it's finest.

Some may not agree with me, but I'll own one eventually.

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When the government forgets that it serves the people, there is a big problem.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BR8080

:mad: :mad:I literally just got off the phone with the NYS DEC and I'm FUMING!!!! :mad: :mad:

I was informed I cannot own a reticulated python because they are venomous. I responded, "With all due respect, may I speak with someone that knows and understands that the species is most certainly NOT venomous and can answer my questions properly." He then went on to say it's because of their size, I informed him that a SD will be smaller than a true red tail boa and then he hung up on me. NYS government at it's finest.

Some may not agree with me, but I'll own one eventually.

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Maybe get some evidence and even photos together to prove your point ... I'm sure the breeders of SD Retics can help .


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Well that sucks :( And to add, just because the parents are small or it's got a decent amount of SD in it, doesnt mean it cant get big. Caesar is 37.5% SD, 31.5% dwarf and 31% mainland and his dad was 6' and mom was 8-9'. He's just over a year old and he's 7'. He has slowed down on growth but he still likes to eat.

Like JM said, plan for a 10' snake and you should be fine, assuming you can even get around your state laws. Face it Ron, you are gonna be the proud owner of a garter snake :snake: :P

Just following along here because i want to get a SD one day. Heres some pics i snagged of a SD snow yesterday, i have to stop and look at this one every time i go pick up my feeders. The breeder has 2, the 0.1 snow and 1.0 anery, which are littermates hatched in 2013. Its hard to tell from the pictures but id have to guess they are 6-7 feet long and really slender. I do believe he has them on a very conservative feeding schedule. He told me he tried to pair them this year but it didnt take, which is a bummer because ive asked before and he wasnt originally planning to try for any more.
http://i.imgur.com/3H0U998.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/bxNuBeW.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/qIBdcJz.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/zN5Ur9y.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BR8080

Some may not agree with me, but I'll own one eventually.

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Since you like large snakes and firearms, I'd suggest moving out of NY to a free state.

Move to Washington State!! You can keep pretty much anything except Crocodilea or venomous reptiles. And for firearms, you can buy just about anything.

And speaking of retics, Caesar is plenty pissed at me lol. He's been looking for food the past 2 days and i havent fed him. Today when i opened his cage door, he didnt even come out great me. I petted his head and he just sat there. I think he's pretty freakin pissed at me lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BR8080

:mad: :mad:I literally just got off the phone with the NYS DEC and I'm FUMING!!!! :mad: :mad:

I was informed I cannot own a reticulated python because they are venomous. I responded, "With all due respect, may I speak with someone that knows and understands that the species is most certainly NOT venomous and can answer my questions properly." He then went on to say it's because of their size, I informed him that a SD will be smaller than a true red tail boa and then he hung up on me. NYS government at it's finest.

Some may not agree with me, but I'll own one eventually.

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don't you hate it when after all this time in captivity that we just now find out retics are venomous.
typical government don't know diddily but funny as all, well you know

Or you could come to South Carolina. Where big guns and conciled carry is expected. As for snakes do what ever you like.

http://i772.photobucket.com/albums/y...tput_475d.jpeg

Well, well,,, I can post here from Photobucket after all.

Male 37.5% SD, 43.75% Dwarf, 18.75% Mainland is pictured above.
He's been slow grown, never starving, he has actually refused in shed and pushed his own cycle to 21 days. He's been eating small rats, with some larges now and then.

I will be giving him a large tomorrow.

I'd say he's maybe 6 feet long now at the 1 year 2 month mark.

Sauzo stated correctly, size is still somewhat of an individual snake thing. My fella (Wallace) has the tiger gene which is known for size and calmness. Apparently the calm part comes a bit later LOL, because he's sprayed me a few times and bitten once. However, it is true. He's settled into a wonderful captive.

One thing you won't typically find is a retic that is as thick and strong as a boa constrictor of equal length. That said my retic is possibly the same length as my boa but my boa is 5 years old. Not a great comparison but even still the species is relatively light bodied when compared to other large constrictors.

They are sensational snakes (retics) to work with.

Chase Delles is a mainland guy and lives here in my area.

Matthew Martin is a couple hours away from me. He is into SD stuff but asks a lot of $$ as he has a lot of newer morph stuff.

Read up, get a male if you are even able to get the city/county to allow it and don't feed for size.

So far so good with this guy!
http://i772.photobucket.com/albums/y...tput_4761.jpeg


By the way, even at 6 feet give or take,,, he is still a "one hander". If he's coiled up I hold him in one hand and he's easy.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dxw425

Just following along here because i want to get a SD one day. Heres some pics i snagged of a SD snow yesterday, i have to stop and look at this one every time i go pick up my feeders. The breeder has 2, the 0.1 snow and 1.0 anery, which are littermates hatched in 2013. Its hard to tell from the pictures but id have to guess they are 6-7 feet long and really slender. I do believe he has them on a very conservative feeding schedule. He told me he tried to pair them this year but it didnt take, which is a bummer because ive asked before and he wasnt originally planning to try for any more.
http://i.imgur.com/3H0U998.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/bxNuBeW.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/qIBdcJz.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/zN5Ur9y.jpg

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That's a truly stunningly beautiful snake !!

Can't help think it would look even better on some dark coloured substrate like orchid bark which would emphasise it's fantastic coloration , even dark branches as well ...


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Caesar wouldnt sit in one hand if his life depended on it lol. He loves to sprawl out when outside. The only time he sits curled up is in side his hide. This is about the best of a curl up you get from him.https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...5138a8fe_h.jpg

Gio is right though, retics are fun. Caesar has never sprayed or bit me but he has pissed on my foot when i had him out and let him roam. They are smart too. Caesar has finally learned he is long enough to hold the cage litter dam with his back 1/3 and stretch down to the floor and then let go and cruise around.

I personally say check out Daniel Solis like i mentioned. I talked to him a few months ago before i got Gina about picking up an ultra Ivory from him when/if he has a clutch. His stuff is nicely priced.

Just be aware Ron, retics are not lap snakes like boas. most of the time Caesar wants to gogogo. He's easy enough to stop though as i just scoop him up but he is easily 7' now. He is bigger than Rosey but a lot skinnier and lighter than Rosey. But anyways, he always wants to move, never really likes to sit still and LOVES being in his cage unless he can come out on his own lol. The boas are loungers. Heck Gina sat stretched out on my forearm with her face on the inside of my elbow for an hour. When i would look down at her, she would just flick her tongue at me and thats it lol. So know that going in. Retics are not loungers, at least not Caesar lol. And they love to poop and pee. I'm always spot cleaning while Caesar sits there with his head watching what I'm doing lol.

There is nothing quite like a retic.

They can get big (some) yet even with the larger specimens, you'll find they have incredible speed and an alertness not found in the typical heavy bodied constrictor.

If you can find the right one for YOU, I say go for it.

I really enjoy mine and don't expect him to break 9 feet.

OH,,,, the eyes are really something too!

http://i772.photobucket.com/albums/y...tput_475e.jpeg

Thanks to all for your comments. I guess I shouldn't be surprised the government that's here to help doesn't have all the facts and spreads a blanket rule over the land. Looks like I'll do what I have to do and be happy - I know a guy that has a friggin 5' american alligator and he certainly doesn't have a license.

Just buy one and hide it lol. I mean the only stickler part i see is if it needed to see a vet but even then who knows. I'm such a bad influence haha.

My purple albino SD retic is still pretty aggressive, there's nothing more frightening than a large aggressive snake to get your heart pumping! When I bought him he was super stressed out, stuck in a shed and would snap at anything that came close to him and when I first picked him up he was peeing and musking and trying to get away so fast I thought he was literally a wild caught snake. I'm guessing he was never really handled. I got him as a breeder for about half price so I didn't need him to be so tame. He has tamed down quite a bit, doesn't musk or pee, but is still a bit flighty. He is only snappy now when I try to feed him when he doesn't want to be fed, like when he is in shed. I'd say he probably weights about 10 pounds now and is probably 5-6 feet long at a year and a half old. Now when you pick him up he starts out a little flighty but then becomes more curious. You can only handle him for about five minutes max before he starts to panic a bit. Every time I clean his cage I try to hold him for about five minutes or so and that really helps to tame him down. So far I've avoided getting bit by either one of my retics!

Someone mentioned retics as being flighty, I'll have to say my 26 pound female dwarf is super lazy and never runs. I do feed her a lot, maybe that's why she is lazy, but I can put her on my picnic table and clean her cage and she just sits on the table waiting for me to finish. Sometimes she gets curious and I have to guide her back to the table but she never really runs like your classic retic. She acts more like a Burmese Python LOL. I'm pretty sure it comes down to feeding, if you feed them a bit heavy and they gain some weight they become a lot more chilled out.

Super dwarves tend to be flighty. Mainland and dwarves are usually pretty laid back once they get some size on them as they realize not much is going to eat them.

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Originally Posted by Sauzo

Just buy one and hide it lol. I mean the only stickler part i see is if it needed to see a vet but even then who knows. I'm such a bad influence haha.

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LOL - thanks - you know the influence your pics have had already...great help you are!!!

I've decided I was a bit hot when I wrote that and my career is more important than getting something banned by the state (for their lack of education for any other reason) and getting caught with it.