First-Time Snake Owner, Considering A Ball Python

Hey everyone, just joined, so if this is in the wrong place I apologize.

After convincing all the members of my family that it is physically impossible for a ball python to directly kill someone (Barring a nasty infection from a bite, I guess), They've agreed to let me get a Ball Python (Or other similarly-sized snake). There's a local pet shop near me that's been around for years and has great reviews (Although they don't have a lot of different morphs), so that's probably where I'll be buying from. The only problem is, I've been told so many different things about how to care for them, that I don't know which is right.

I've been told they need a heat lamp, because they don't feel belly heat and it won't be able to thermoregulate properly or will burn themselves with an UTH.

I've been told not to get heat lamps, they're nocturnal and hate bright lights, and to get an UTH.

I've been told to get both, because they like both, and it's impossible to make the hot end too hot, because my house AC will kick in and cool it down.

I've been told not to really worry about humidity unless they're shedding. I've been told to make sure it stays at 50-55%, etc.

I've been told 20 Gallon long tanks are the perfect size for adult BPs, and I've been told that 40s are perfect, 20's are too small, etc.

I've been told to get a glass tank because it's more natural for the snake, but then get told to get something called a vision case because the glass ones lose humidity.

I've gotten so many different temperature ranges, from 80 ambient with a 90 basking spot, to 78-82 on the cool side and 90-94 on the hot end, to 85 all around.

I really want a Ball Python (Or a Mexican black kingsnake, but no one sells them around here), but I don't want to get one until I know the best way to set up a tank for them and care for them. Can anyone help clear any of these things up for me?

Check out our care sheet.
A MBK will be a lot easier to keep.
Where are you located...... A reptile expo would be a better selection and pricing as well.
78 ambient is fine
90ish hot spot
A thermostat is a must for belly heat!!
One or both depends on your house, a properly regulated UTH does nothing for ambient temperatures so if your house is too cold you will also need a CHE.

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

Hey everyone, just joined, so if this is in the wrong place I apologize.

After convincing all the members of my family that it is physically impossible for a ball python to directly kill someone (Barring a nasty infection from a bite, I guess), They've agreed to let me get a Ball Python (Or other similarly-sized snake). There's a local pet shop near me that's been around for years and has great reviews (Although they don't have a lot of different morphs), so that's probably where I'll be buying from. The only problem is, I've been told so many different things about how to care for them, that I don't know which is right.

I've been told they need a heat lamp, because they don't feel belly heat and it won't be able to thermoregulate properly or will burn themselves with an UTH.

I've been told not to get heat lamps, they're nocturnal and hate bright lights, and to get an UTH.

I've been told to get both, because they like both, and it's impossible to make the hot end too hot, because my house AC will kick in and cool it down.

I've been told not to really worry about humidity unless they're shedding. I've been told to make sure it stays at 50-55%, etc.

I've been told 20 Gallon long tanks are the perfect size for adult BPs, and I've been told that 40s are perfect, 20's are too small, etc.

I've been told to get a glass tank because it's more natural for the snake, but then get told to get something called a vision case because the glass ones lose humidity.

I've gotten so many different temperature ranges, from 80 ambient with a 90 basking spot, to 78-82 on the cool side and 90-94 on the hot end, to 85 all around.

I really want a Ball Python (Or a Mexican black kingsnake, but no one sells them around here), but I don't want to get one until I know the best way to set up a tank for them and care for them. Can anyone help clear any of these things up for me?

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First of all, welcome! This is an extrmely helpful forum for me and hope it is for you too! Ok, for a lot of those things it can actually be the prefrence of your snake. The humidity and temps should all be well managed and consistent (and yes, it is important to keep humidity up around those levels regardless of weather or not your snake is shedding, and temps should be 70-85ish (although you will hear lots of variations of this, but you should have a heat gradient with a warm and cool side)) for the lamp situation just dont get a heat rock. Those can cause major burns. A UTH can as well if not properly monitored, but it could also be put on the side of the tank where it's less liekly to do that, esoecially if regulated properly. A lot of breeders will use uths/heat strips because they take up less space. But again, they need to be monitored. It can be helpful to purchase a thermo regulator with probes that can sense temperatures and adjust accordingly. I have one heat emitter and one lamp (and a UTH I dont use that often). I used to have a blacklight-type lamp but it died on me. Heat emitters are good because BPs dont really need light, but again, prefrence. I will turn on his light during the day and use the heat emitter at night to mimic days and nights passing but if you're already putting your tank in a naturally lit area thats not really necessary (its not really necessary at all, but its yet another option). As for tanks, I have a glass tank with a wire top and its a struggle to keep the humidity up (however, my humidifier is broken sooo that doesn't help). It's definitely possie to make the hot side too hot (or at least too dry), I've never had my ac kick in to regulate that so I wouldn't rely on it. If you get a glass tank you could pick up some fake moss at the pet store specifically for spraying with water to hold humidity. You could also tinfoil your tank and should mist it frequently with clean water. I also have a mist with vitamins and aloe specifically to hydrate my snake that I'll use especially when he's going to shed soon. But your snake may not like that, or you may not prefer a glass tank. Its up to you. Kudos to you for getting a snake from a real breeder and not a regular pet shop (often those reptiles are sick). Dont worry if you dont get a morph, i have a normal and hes beautiful. See which snake you connect with the best and get that one. Hope all this info helped!!!

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

Check out our care sheet.
A MBK will be a lot easier to keep.
Where are you located...... A reptile expo would be a better selection and pricing as well.
78 ambient is fine
90ish hot spot
A thermostat is a must for belly heat!!
One or both depends on your house, a properly regulated UTH does nothing for ambient temperatures so if your house is too cold you will also need a CHE.

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King snakes are easier to keep? I do like them quite a bit, especially the solid black ones, or the tiger stripe ones.
I'm close to Atlanta, Repticon is the biggest show around here, it's coming up this summer.
It'd be in the basement (Where my room is), it's fairly cold down here, especially in the winter. I'd probably need both then eventually. Especially if they're going to need a big tank.

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Originally Posted by spellbound04

First of all, welcome! This is an extrmely helpful forum for me and hope it is for you too! Ok, for a lot of those things it can actually be the prefrence of your snake. The humidity and temps should all be well managed and consistent (and yes, it is important to keep humidity up around those levels regardless of weather or not your snake is shedding, and temps should be 70-85ish (although you will hear lots of variations of this, but you should have a heat gradient with a warm and cool side)) for the lamp situation just dont get a heat rock. Those can cause major burns. A UTH can as well if not properly monitored, but it could also be put on the side of the tank where it's less liekly to do that, esoecially if regulated properly. A lot of breeders will use uths/heat strips because they take up less space. But again, they need to be monitored. It can be helpful to purchase a thermo regulator with probes that can sense temperatures and adjust accordingly. I have one heat emitter and one lamp (and a UTH I dont use that often). I used to have a blacklight-type lamp but it died on me. Heat emitters are good because BPs dont really need light, but again, prefrence. I will turn on his light during the day and use the heat emitter at night to mimic days and nights passing but if you're already putting your tank in a naturally lit area thats not really necessary (its not really necessary at all, but its yet another option). As for tanks, I have a glass tank with a wire top and its a struggle to keep the humidity up (however, my humidifier is broken sooo that doesn't help). It's definitely possie to make the hot side too hot (or at least too dry), I've never had my ac kick in to regulate that so I wouldn't rely on it. If you get a glass tank you could pick up some fake moss at the pet store specifically for spraying with water to hold humidity. You could also tinfoil your tank and should mist it frequently with clean water. I also have a mist with vitamins and aloe specifically to hydrate my snake that I'll use especially when he's going to shed soon. But your snake may not like that, or you may not prefer a glass tank. Its up to you. Kudos to you for getting a snake from a real breeder and not a regular pet shop (often those reptiles are sick). Dont worry if you dont get a morph, i have a normal and hes beautiful. See which snake you connect with the best and get that one. Hope all this info helped!!!

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Thanks for the welcome! I've already got one of those really nice thermometers with the probe and humidity guage (I've been buying all my snake stuff slowly as the budget comes in, saving the big stuff for until I've actually decided between a BP and a King snake), so monitoring the things won't be an issue, just figuring out what I need it to be. I'll also have to get a thermostat to actually control the UTH I get (They can supposedly reach temperatures significantly higher than what's required to crack glass).

I've also been warned about heat rocks. Apparently snakes don't have a very complex nervous system like us, and don't feel heat as a burn like we do when we touch hot things, only warmth.

The tinfoil thing would be a nice addition anyway, because I also have a cat. It would probably deter him from sitting on top/around the cage, and potentially crashing through and breaking the cage/killing the snake/getting killed by the snake.

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

Thanks for the welcome! I've already got one of those really nice thermometers with the probe and humidity guage (I've been buying all my snake stuff slowly as the budget comes in, saving the big stuff for until I've actually decided between a BP and a King snake), so monitoring the things won't be an issue, just figuring out what I need it to be. I'll also have to get a thermostat to actually control the UTH I get (They can supposedly reach temperatures significantly higher than what's required to crack glass).

I've also been warned about heat rocks. Apparently snakes don't have a very complex nervous system like us, and don't feel heat as a burn like we do when we touch hot things, only warmth.

The tinfoil thing would be a nice addition anyway, because I also have a cat. It would probably deter him from sitting on top/around the cage, and potentially crashing through and breaking the cage/killing the snake/getting killed by the snake.

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That's a really good way to do it, buy a bit at a time so its all prepped beforehand. I have two cats and they rarely even go near the tank, but yeah the tinfoil can be a helpful addition 👍

Read over this ball python caresheet thoroughly and follow it, and you won't go wrong! https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...s%29-Caresheet

All heat sources can burn or kill snakes, not just UTH. Which is why you need a thermostat to plug your heat source into, and regulate the temps. Thermostats are REQUIRED equipment.

Here's a tub setup guide, if you're willing to use a tub. I pretty much followed these two things when I started out, and it cleared up a lot. Also tubs are much better at maintaining heat and humidity than a glass tank. https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...e-Basics-*DUW*

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Originally Posted by redshepherd

Read over this ball python caresheet thoroughly and follow it, and you won't go wrong! https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...s%29-Caresheet

All heat sources can burn or kill snakes, not just UTH. Which is why you need a thermostat to plug your heat source into, and regulate the temps. Thermostats are REQUIRED equipment.

Here's a tub setup guide, if you're willing to use a tub. I pretty much followed these two things when I started out, and it cleared up a lot. Also tubs are much better at maintaining heat and humidity than a glass tank. https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...e-Basics-*DUW*

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Okay, so thermostat for any heat source. Got it.

I would do a tub if I can't get a glass one to work for the BP/MBK, but I'd rather not, just because I don't think they look as nice, and it's harder to view the snake in one.

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

Okay, so thermostat for any heat source. Got it.

I would do a tub if I can't get a glass one to work for the BP/MBK, but I'd rather not, just because I don't think they look as nice, and it's harder to view the snake in one.

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I have my BP in a tub currently and it's really easy to see inside just as it would be in a glass tank. Just have to find the clear tubs. The other option is a cage from Animal Plastics. They combine the best of both worlds of a display and tub. You can get a glass tank to work it just takes a bit more tweaking but as others have said read up on the care sheets and the stickies of the forums. I've followed them and have had no issues with mine.

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Originally Posted by Bmocken

I have my BP in a tub currently and it's really easy to see inside just as it would be in a glass tank. Just have to find the clear tubs. The other option is a cage from Animal Plastics. They combine the best of both worlds of a display and tub. You can get a glass tank to work it just takes a bit more tweaking but as others have said read up on the care sheets and the stickies of the forums. I've followed them and have had no issues with mine.

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I've looked at AP cages. Really nice, but very expensive. I can pick up a used 36x18x12 (That's a 30 gallon, if I remember my geometry well enough) glass terrarium from the pet store I mentioned for $30.

A clear tub would work pretty well though. Fairly escape-proof, too, right? Is there any issue with the plastic melting from the UTH? Or is 90 not hot enough to do that?

Screen top conversion:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...tment-Tutorial

Setting up a glass tank:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...-With-Pictures!

My two cents: you can't go wrong with a BP or a King. I keep both and both have pros and cons.
Do your research, do your homework and decide which animal is better for you. You and only you will be responsible for this animal for 20+ years.

Have you handled both species? As juveniles and adults?

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

I've looked at AP cages. Really nice, but very expensive. I can pick up a used 36x18x12 (That's a 30 gallon, if I remember my geometry well enough) glass terrarium from the pet store I mentioned for $30.

A clear tub would work pretty well though. Fairly escape-proof, too, right? Is there any issue with the plastic melting from the UTH? Or is 90 not hot enough to do that?

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I would highly recommend using a tub. I have mine in a tub that has locks for the lid on either end and no the uth if controlled correctly with a thermostat will not melt the plastic. Your hotspot should only be 90 and that can't melt plastic. While glass is tempting price wise it is much more difficult to control humidity and temps. A tub is even cheaper then a glass tank and is a lot easier to maintain the correct environment.
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...psmbrmaors.jpg

Dagger, I sent you a pm. Check your inbox.

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

Is there any issue with the plastic melting from the UTH? Or is 90 not hot enough to do that?

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Think about it....... Does it melt while you are holding it?

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

My two cents: you can't go wrong with a BP or a King. I keep both and both have pros and cons.
Do your research, do your homework and decide which animal is better for you. You and only you will be responsible for this animal for 20+ years.

Have you handled both species? As juveniles and adults?

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I've researched them both quite a bit, which (I'm assuming) is why I've gotten so many different answers to the same questions. They're both pretty hardy snakes, and I guess different people just get different setups that work for them and their snakes.

As for handling BPs, I've only handled young ones, loved how relaxed they are. King snakes (Colubrids in general really) I've handled quite a bit, of varying sizes, but only wild caught ones. They're native here (I've personally watched a common kingsnake fight a water moccasin slightly larger than it and win), I grab them any time I can, just to show my younger brother, who also loves snakes.

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Originally Posted by Bmocken

I would highly recommend using a tub. I have mine in a tub that has locks for the lid on either end and no the uth if controlled correctly with a thermostat will not melt the plastic. Your hotspot should only be 90 and that can't melt plastic. While glass is tempting price wise it is much more difficult to control humidity and temps. A tub is even cheaper then a glass tank and is a lot easier to maintain the correct environment.
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...psmbrmaors.jpg

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By "Tubs" you mean those giant rubbermaid things you use to store clothes so moths won't eat them, right? And locking lids? Like the clasps on the side?

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

Think about it....... Does it melt while you are holding it?

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Good point, our external body temperature is probably close to 90.

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

I've researched them both quite a bit, which (I'm assuming) is why I've gotten so many different answers to the same questions. They're both pretty hardy snakes, and I guess different people just get different setups that work for them and their snakes.

As for handling BPs, I've only handled young ones, loved how relaxed they are. King snakes (Colubrids in general really) I've handled quite a bit, of varying sizes, but only wild caught ones. They're native here (I've personally watched a common kingsnake fight a water moccasin slightly larger than it and win), I grab them any time I can, just to show my younger brother, who also loves snakes.

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Ok, awesome. So then it's just up to what animal works best for you. Good luck! Keep us posted.

Yes Rubbermaid or Hefty storage containers work great. It's what I've been using as I saved up for an Animal Plastics enclosure. He could stay in the tub longer but I wanted to change over from a UTH to a radiant heat panel. Once I had the tub set up and dialed in the temps it stayed dialed in and my BP has ate every time I've fed him.

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

Ok, awesome. So then it's just up to what animal works best for you. Good luck! Keep us posted.

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So far I'm still undecided.

BPs IMO look cooler than Calis (especially if you're comparing the normal ones without special morphs), but I love the black kingsnakes.

BPs are also easier to handle, or maybe that's because I've only ever handled wild (And therefore stressed by human contact) kings.

BPs also get a lot bigger as far as weight goes, but they're not as energetic as kings (Again, may just be because I've never handled a CB King, and wild ones are just hyper), so they're probably still a little bit easier to handle, despite the added girth.

Kingsnakes are easier to set a tank up for, since humidity in my state is a non-issue for them. It wouldn't be overly difficult to get a BP tank going either though, so this isn't really a massive consideration.

I've heard kings are better eaters, but I've never tried to feed a snake, so I wouldn't know.

They're both very long-lived, so no matter which one I get, it's going to be a commitment well into my 40's at least. I've considered this several times (especially the fact that I'll not be living in this house for all of those 20+ years, so It'll have to move with me), and I'm willing to take care of it for that long.

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Originally Posted by Bmocken

Yes Rubbermaid or Hefty storage containers work great. It's what I've been using as I saved up for an Animal Plastics enclosure. He could stay in the tub longer but I wanted to change over from a UTH to a radiant heat panel. Once I had the tub set up and dialed in the temps it stayed dialed in and my BP has ate every time I've fed him.

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You feed them in their cage? I was told to put them in a different one, because substrate can cause impaction and they could associate opening their cage with feeding time. I thought that was weird though, because if you feed it, then handle it, you could make it regurgitate the food back up.

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

So far I'm still undecided.

BPs IMO look cooler than Calis (especially if you're comparing the normal ones without special morphs), but I love the black kingsnakes.

BPs are also easier to handle, or maybe that's because I've only ever handled wild (And therefore stressed by human contact) kings.

BPs also get a lot bigger as far as weight goes, but they're not as energetic as kings (Again, may just be because I've never handled a CB King, and wild ones are just hyper), so they're probably still a little bit easier to handle, despite the added girth.

Kingsnakes are easier to set a tank up for, since humidity in my state is a non-issue for them. It wouldn't be overly difficult to get a BP tank going either though, so this isn't really a massive consideration.

I've heard kings are better eaters, but I've never tried to feed a snake, so I wouldn't know.

They're both very long-lived, so no matter which one I get, it's going to be a commitment well into my 40's at least. I've considered this several times (especially the fact that I'll not be living in this house for all of those 20+ years, so It'll have to move with me), and I'm willing to take care of it for that long.



You feed them in their cage? I was told to put them in a different one, because substrate can cause impaction and they could associate opening their cage with feeding time. I thought that was weird though, because if you feed it, then handle it, you could make it regurgitate the food back up.

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Each snake prefers it a different way, mine (since it's a baby) struggled to get his food in his tank. He would get his mouse in the substrate and then when it got dirty refuse to eat it! You may have to experiment the first couple weeks to see what is the most effective method.

Just to touch on a few things you mentioned...

I've never handled wild Kings, unfortunately. Yet to see one in MA. CB Kings are awesome for handling. As you know, the juveniles are very quick and flighty, even CB. They do mellow pretty easily with handling. My adult is super chill and super easy to handle. Still more on-the-go than BPs though.

BPs are super easy to handle.

Kings generally are garbage disposals. Mine gets the leftovers my BP doesn't eat and has never refused a scheduled meal or leftovers.
However, I've had good luck with my BP too. He refused for 3 weeks and has since been back to eating every 5-7 days.

Once you've got temps and humidity dialed in it's pretty simple regular maintenance, either way you choose.

So my thoughts are: which do you like better for what you want? Chances are you'll end up like most of us and have multiple snakes anyway, but if you're looking for a thicker bodied, more chill snake, go BP. If you're looking for more slender and more active, go King. Or, just get one now and one later :gj:

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Originally Posted by spellbound04

Each snake prefers it a different way, mine (since it's a baby) struggled to get his food in his tank. He would get his mouse in the substrate and then when it got dirty refuse to eat it! You may have to experiment the first couple weeks to see what is the most effective method.

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Yes, feed in the snake's regular enclosure. Nobody cleans the snakes food for them in the wild. A little substrate won't hurt them.
This will help to avoid refusals and regurges from handling the snake before/after a meal.

Sent you another pm. I don't know why it isn't showing new notifications for me.

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

So far I'm still undecided.

BPs IMO look cooler than Calis (especially if you're comparing the normal ones without special morphs), but I love the black kingsnakes.

BPs are also easier to handle, or maybe that's because I've only ever handled wild (And therefore stressed by human contact) kings.

BPs also get a lot bigger as far as weight goes, but they're not as energetic as kings (Again, may just be because I've never handled a CB King, and wild ones are just hyper), so they're probably still a little bit easier to handle, despite the added girth.

Kingsnakes are easier to set a tank up for, since humidity in my state is a non-issue for them. It wouldn't be overly difficult to get a BP tank going either though, so this isn't really a massive consideration.

I've heard kings are better eaters, but I've never tried to feed a snake, so I wouldn't know.

They're both very long-lived, so no matter which one I get, it's going to be a commitment well into my 40's at least. I've considered this several times (especially the fact that I'll not be living in this house for all of those 20+ years, so It'll have to move with me), and I'm willing to take care of it for that long.



You feed them in their cage? I was told to put them in a different one, because substrate can cause impaction and they could associate opening their cage with feeding time. I thought that was weird though, because if you feed it, then handle it, you could make it regurgitate the food back up.

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Yep I feed him in his enclosure. It makes no sense to take him out of it to feed him. For BP's it's a myth that feeding them in their enclosure will cause them to bite you.

Corn snakes/king snakes are the #1 beginner snake in my opinion, no special humidity, and can be kept around 85-87 which is only slightly above room temp. Ive heard countless stories of people getting a ball python as their first snake and not being able to keep humidity up enough (mostly from using lights). But! If a ball python is what you want, And you are prepared. (You seem educated enough) then go for it!

Feeding outside of the enclosure is a myth. Infact it actually stresses the snake out more to feed it outside its enclosure because of the access handling after eating. Also, the "associating the enclosure with food" idea makes no sense. Because you are "associating" taking the snake out of its cage with eating when you remove it from its enclosure to feed it.

My snakes will know within the first 10 seconds I stick my hand into the cage if there is food or not, they usually will smell my hand, and once I touch them they know im not food.

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

Just to touch on a few things you mentioned...

I've never handled wild Kings, unfortunately. Yet to see one in MA. CB Kings are awesome for handling. As you know, the juveniles are very quick and flighty, even CB. They do mellow pretty easily with handling. My adult is super chill and super easy to handle. Still more on-the-go than BPs though.

BPs are super easy to handle.

Kings generally are garbage disposals. Mine gets the leftovers my BP doesn't eat and has never refused a scheduled meal or leftovers.
However, I've had good luck with my BP too. He refused for 3 weeks and has since been back to eating every 5-7 days.

Once you've got temps and humidity dialed in it's pretty simple regular maintenance, either way you choose.

So my thoughts are: which do you like better for what you want? Chances are you'll end up like most of us and have multiple snakes anyway, but if you're looking for a thicker bodied, more chill snake, go BP. If you're looking for more slender and more active, go King. Or, just get one now and one later :gj:

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Wild Kings are a treat. I would just keep one of them, but I've been told caught snakes require a lot more attention to things like mites and parasites than CBs.

I really do want a MBK, but they're just so hard to find (Hatchlings sell out quickly, I guess everyone wants them), but ball pythons are really cool, too. I love how calm they are, but I also love how active kings are compared to them.

Probably your best bet is to go to Repticon and see if there's anything there you just can go home without. Seeing them up close can really make your mind up fast!

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Originally Posted by KingNoFace

Corn snakes/king snakes are the #1 beginner snake in my opinion, no special humidity, and can be kept around 85-87 which is only slightly above room temp. Ive heard countless stories of people getting a ball python as their first snake and not being able to keep humidity up enough (mostly from using lights). But! If a ball python is what you want, And you are prepared. (You seem educated enough) then go for it!

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A MBK would do very well in my room, I know that much. The only reason I haven't got one of those is I can't find one, except for a site called Bigappleherp which has mixed reviews, and I don't want to buy from a place that can't reliably deliver healthy, active snakes. I also love reverse stripe kingsnakes, and the tiger pattern ones.

A Ball Python would be slightly harder to keep in my room (Kind of cold downstairs, especially in winter), but definitely not impossible, just more monitoring. They're easier to find, and the different morphs are really cool (There's more morphs of BPs I like than kings, but the kings I like, I like better than BPs).

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Originally Posted by KingNoFace

Feeding outside of the enclosure is a myth. Infact it actually stresses the snake out more to feed it outside its enclosure because of the access handling after eating. Also, the "associating the enclosure with food" idea makes no sense. Because you are "associating" taking the snake out of its cage with eating when you remove it from its enclosure to feed it.

My snakes will know within the first 10 seconds I stick my hand into the cage if there is food or not, they usually will smell my hand, and once I touch them they know im not food.

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Good to know, because I was definitely going to feed outside the tank before I read this and the other posts saying they feed inside.

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Originally Posted by Lizardlicks

Probably your best bet is to go to Repticon and see if there's anything there you just can go home without. Seeing them up close can really make your mind up fast!

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July's a little longer than I wanted to wait to pick one up, but if I can't find a nice MBK or a BP morph I want by then, I'll go there and look.

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Originally Posted by Lizardlicks

Probably your best bet is to go to Repticon and see if there's anything there you just can go home without. Seeing them up close can really make your mind up fast!

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Agreed.

I completely understand you not wanting to wait that long, I'm the same way. But, since it's easier said than done, my two cents is wait it out. A few weeks will go by pretty quickly and once you're there you'll find a snake that you fall in love with and you'll have for years to come.

I just bought:

The used 20gal long tank I mentioned.
A bag of cypress mulch (I can always get Aspen instead and use the mulch for gardening if I go for the kingsnake).
A 10-20 gal UTH (the 20-30 looked too big to me).
150 watt lamp for heat bulbs or CHEs.
75 watt incandescent bulb.
A half log hide.
A big water bowl (big enough for either snake to soak in, and it'd help raise humidity for a BP).

I still need:
A thermostat for the UTH.
A dimmer for the light if I use it.
Various supplies for cleaning the cage.

Anything I'm missing (besides the snake :P)?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dagger311

I just bought:

The used 20gal long tank I mentioned.
A bag of cypress mulch (I can always get Aspen instead and use the mulch for gardening if I go for the kingsnake).
A 10-20 gal UTH (the 20-30 looked too big to me).
150 watt lamp for heat bulbs or CHEs.
75 watt incandescent bulb.
A half log hide.
A big water bowl (big enough for either snake to soak in, and it'd help raise humidity for a BP).

I still need:
A thermostat for the UTH.
A dimmer for the light if I use it.
Various supplies for cleaning the cage.

Anything I'm missing (besides the snake :P)?

---

If you still can, I would return the half log hide and choose one with only one opening. Snakes prefer as much privacy as possible and the half logs are way too wide open. Some of the rock or cave looking ones work best if you want something natural looking, or the reptile basics are extremely popular with members on this forum. Also, grab two of them, one for the warm side and one for the cool side.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dagger311

I just bought:

The used 20gal long tank I mentioned.
A bag of cypress mulch (I can always get Aspen instead and use the mulch for gardening if I go for the kingsnake).
A 10-20 gal UTH (the 20-30 looked too big to me).
150 watt lamp for heat bulbs or CHEs.
75 watt incandescent bulb.
A half log hide.
A big water bowl (big enough for either snake to soak in, and it'd help raise humidity for a BP).

I still need:
A thermostat for the UTH.
A dimmer for the light if I use it.
Various supplies for cleaning the cage.

Anything I'm missing (besides the snake :P)?

---

A couple of thermometers with wired probes ( not a useless stick-on thermometer ) plus a Digital Temp gun ( eBay / Amazon for 10 dollars ) .


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zincubus

A couple of thermometers with wired probes ( not a useless stick-on thermometer ) plus a Digital Temp gun ( eBay / Amazon for 10 dollars ) .


Oh and some branches from the nearby woods/ forest ...

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

---

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by craigafrechette

If you still can, I would return the half log hide and choose one with only one opening. Snakes prefer as much privacy as possible and the half logs are way too wide open. Some of the rock or cave looking ones work best if you want something natural looking, or the reptile basics are extremely popular with members on this forum. Also, grab two of them, one for the warm side and one for the cool side.

---

I was gonna back it into the corner so that one end of it is against the glass that's going to be by the wall (Hard to describe, but it wouldn't be open on both ends).

I actually meant to buy a second hide, probably like a small cave. Put the log on the cool side and the cave on the hot side, maybe with some moss in there for humidity?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zincubus

A couple of thermometers with wired probes ( not a useless stick-on thermometer ) plus a Digital Temp gun ( eBay / Amazon for 10 dollars ) .

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zincubus

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

---

I have one of the probe thermometers already. I need two? And what's the gun for?

Also, the heat pad is only 7 watts, which seems really low compared to the bulb. Is that normal?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dagger311

I just bought:

The used 20gal long tank I mentioned.
A bag of cypress mulch (I can always get Aspen instead and use the mulch for gardening if I go for the kingsnake).
A 10-20 gal UTH (the 20-30 looked too big to me).
150 watt lamp for heat bulbs or CHEs.
75 watt incandescent bulb.
A half log hide.
A big water bowl (big enough for either snake to soak in, and it'd help raise humidity for a BP).

I still need:
A thermostat for the UTH.
A dimmer for the light if I use it.
Various supplies for cleaning the cage.

Anything I'm missing (besides the snake :P)?

---

I second the suggestion of another hide. You can make the half log secure by covering the back with a plant and part of the opening, I've had two logs the whole time I've had my nope rope. I just make it so you can't see inside unless you REALLY look and even then only see a little tiny part of his body. However, I only stuck with the logs because I know BPs like a small secure hide, and the alternative natural-looking ones were MASSIVE when I first got him at 100g.

Maybe also buy some plants? If you do go with the BP especially, they like to feel hidden when they move from hide to hide, which is huge when it comes to them getting accustomed upon arrival and ready to take food. BP's are picky as heck and won't eat unless they feel safe enough to. I'd keep in mind their picky nature. Plants you could get from a pet store in the fish decor area for cheaper with way more color options (at least where I shop lol). Or try fake plants from a hobby store (watch for wires), maybe get a bushy vine online? Make it pretty! Decorating my tank is my absolute favorite thing to do!

I also second branches. My BP perches on his almost every feeding day even though he struck at his rat last time and fell off into his water dish. Still ate his meal at least! If you use ones from outside, look up ways to sanitize them first!

Depending on which snake, the 75 watt miiiight be too much? In my insulated 40 gal it makes ambient a little too high depending on the season, I only use my 75watt for winter nighttime. Go ahead and pick up an infrared thermometer, it makes life so easy, is cheap, and will help you get your temps spot-on! It may take a couple tries to get the temps stable, it took me some trial and error before I got my nope rope. Glass tanks can be a pain to retain temps and humidity, but there are easy fixes to do it. Foam backing from Exo-terra, corkboard, cover the screen with foil or plexiglass, etc.

CHE's you normally shouldn't use with a normal hooded lamp fixture? I could be wrong, but I think the heat it emits builds up way too much and will be a little unsafe. There are wire cages for them available. Again, I could be wrong.

Yeah, heat pad will draw much less energy to heat up. also agree to get a more fully enclosed hide. The half logs are better used as tunnels for the snake to move around the enclosure in.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zincubus

Oh and some branches from the nearby woods/ forest ...

---

You will need to cure anything you bring in from outside to make sure you're not introducing pests, parasites or diseases if you're going to put it in your snake's enclosure.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ferrislongdog

I second the suggestion of another hide. You can make the half log secure by covering the back with a plant and part of the opening, I've had two logs the whole time I've had my nope rope. I just make it so you can't see inside unless you REALLY look and even then only see a little tiny part of his body. However, I only stuck with the logs because I know BPs like a small secure hide, and the alternative natural-looking ones were MASSIVE when I first got him at 100g.

Maybe also buy some plants? If you do go with the BP especially, they like to feel hidden when they move from hide to hide, which is huge when it comes to them getting accustomed upon arrival and ready to take food. BP's are picky as heck and won't eat unless they feel safe enough to. I'd keep in mind their picky nature. Plants you could get from a pet store in the fish decor area for cheaper with way more color options (at least where I shop lol). Or try fake plants from a hobby store (watch for wires), maybe get a bushy vine online? Make it pretty! Decorating my tank is my absolute favorite thing to do!

I also second branches. My BP perches on his almost every feeding day even though he struck at his rat last time and fell off into his water dish. Still ate his meal at least! If you use ones from outside, look up ways to sanitize them first!

Depending on which snake, the 75 watt miiiight be too much? In my insulated 40 gal it makes ambient a little too high depending on the season, I only use my 75watt for winter nighttime. Go ahead and pick up an infrared thermometer, it makes life so easy, is cheap, and will help you get your temps spot-on! It may take a couple tries to get the temps stable, it took me some trial and error before I got my nope rope. Glass tanks can be a pain to retain temps and humidity, but there are easy fixes to do it. Foam backing from Exo-terra, corkboard, cover the screen with foil or plexiglass, etc.

CHE's you normally shouldn't use with a normal hooded lamp fixture? I could be wrong, but I think the heat it emits builds up way too much and will be a little unsafe. There are wire cages for them available. Again, I could be wrong.

---

Decorations, good idea.

I can always get a less powerful bulb, or just run the UTH. I turn the light off at night, right? Will the UTH be enough at night?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lizardlicks

Yeah, heat pad will draw much less energy to heat up. also agree to get a more fully enclosed hide. The half logs are better used as tunnels for the snake to move around the enclosure in.



You will need to cure anything you bring in from outside to make sure you're not introducing pests, parasites or diseases if you're going to put it in your snake's enclosure.

---

I'll pick up a cave to go on the hot end, and put the water bowl kind of in front of the log to make it more secure, and use that as the cold hide. How's that?

The only stumbling block there is that if the hides are different, the snake may choose to occupy which ever one it feels more secure in over anything else, and it will fail to thermoregulate properly. It's preferable to have both hides the same type and size so they don't develop that kind of preference.

Okay. So what would be a good use for the log?

It was only $5, but I'd rather use it. Shedding aid? It could rub on it. Or should I leave it out and take the extra floorspace (It is only a 20gal, and the water bowl is really big).

I place mine between the hides long ways so it makes a kind of covered tunnel for them to explore. Very good to encourage potentially shy snakes to move about more.

Oh, I also spoke with the pet shop owner where I bought the stuff. He said good luck finding a MBK anywhere but online, and at any age other than a hatchling, for anywhere near the price of a ball python or a cool Cali King morph.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dagger311

Oh, I also spoke with the pet shop owner where I bought the stuff. He said good luck finding a MBK anywhere but online, and at any age other than a hatchling, for anywhere near the price of a ball python or a cool Cali King morph.

---

I would hold off and check out the expo first.
Maybe try and get a vendor list and check out their sites of contact them to know what you might find??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

I would hold off and check out the expo first.
Maybe try and get a vendor list and check out their sites of contact them to know what you might find??

---

I'm probably going to wait for the vendor.

I'm also leaning heavily towards a Kingsnake, after seeing his MBK. I like how slender they are.

Oh, and do you guys think this may be too big of a bowl for a 20 gallon?

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...BUaZPaKAWgJ%2F
https://www.instagram.com/p/BUaZPaKAWgJ/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dagger311

I'm probably going to wait for the vendor.

I'm also leaning heavily towards a Kingsnake, after seeing his MBK. I like how slender they are.

Oh, and do you guys think this may be too big of a bowl for a 20 gallon?

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...BUaZPaKAWgJ%2F
https://www.instagram.com/p/BUaZPaKAWgJ/

---

Kingsnake is not a bad idea, there are plenty of awesome patterns out there. Corn snakes are also pretty cheap and suuuper unique with patterns, they also are very slender if you are open to them. BPs have some cool variety, but MAN they can get pricey fast! BPs are also pretty beefy in general compared to a kingsnake. Especially females! I personally just love their super chill personalities and the little extra plump. And they have puppy faces!

I want to say the bowl-to-tank ratio might be tough. I don't know for sure with that picture, but you'll want to have ample room to place the hides in their respective temps. i.e. one side being 91 hot spot with the 85 degree ambient and the other a 75 degree ambient for a BP. It might get pretty crowded. You can totally hold onto it though and use assuming you upgrade tank sizes depending on the snake. Also keep the proper enclosure size for a snake in mind when they are fully grown. Everyone has varying opinions on what is right, so it's likely up to you. But I like to at least say it should end up being long enough for the noodle to stretch out completely when fully grown.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ferrislongdog

Kingsnake is not a bad idea, there are plenty of awesome patterns out there. Corn snakes are also pretty cheap and suuuper unique with patterns, they also are very slender if you are open to them. BPs have some cool variety, but MAN they can get pricey fast! BPs are also pretty beefy in general compared to a kingsnake. Especially females! I personally just love their super chill personalities and the little extra plump. And they have puppy faces!

I want to say the bowl-to-tank ratio might be tough. I don't know for sure with that picture, but you'll want to have ample room to place the hides in their respective temps. i.e. one side being 91 hot spot with the 85 degree ambient and the other a 75 degree ambient for a BP. It might get pretty crowded. You can totally hold onto it though and use assuming you upgrade tank sizes depending on the snake. Also keep the proper enclosure size for a snake in mind when they are fully grown. Everyone has varying opinions on what is right, so it's likely up to you. But I like to at least say it should end up being long enough for the noodle to stretch out completely when fully grown.

---

The bowl takes up a good 1/4 or 1/5 of the tank.

I'd love a corn snake, but my state has this weird law where you can't keep native nonvenomous snakes (Which corn snakes are), or non-native hots. Kingsnakes and milksnakes are the only CB Colubrid options for me, or I could go catch a rat/garter snake (Which I don't want to do).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dagger311

Okay. So what would be a good use for the log?

It was only $5, but I'd rather use it. Shedding aid? It could rub on it. Or should I leave it out and take the extra floorspace (It is only a 20gal, and the water bowl is really big).

---

Another alternate use is treating it like a bridge or turning it up vertically to lean against something so the snake can climb on. I myself was considering getting two, one larger/taller than the other to make "stairs" to access higher areas.

I decided on a kingsnake. I went back to where I bought the stuff, got store credit for the light fixture and bulb, got two cave hides, and a smaller water bowl.

My new question is: will a 6"x11" UTH alone be enough to keep a king snake in a 20 gallon?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dagger311

I decided on a kingsnake. I went back to where I bought the stuff, got store credit for the light fixture and bulb, got two cave hides, and a smaller water bowl.

My new question is: will a 6"x11" UTH alone be enough to keep a king snake in a 20 gallon?

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The UTH is strictly for creating a hot spot. It will depend on the ambient temps where the snake will be kept.