In shedding process.

So my guy is going through his first pre shed signs. Here's my question...

is is it alright to handle him during the time between when his eyes return to black ( they are white at the moment) and his actual shed?

Could it it actually help him shed because he likes to wrap around my neck and "message" his body or in other words flex and relax himself repeatedly against my neck...( he was only seems to do this when around my neck).

He is not a timid snake and seems to enjoy hanging out and having back and cheek rubs( I know, I know, they just tolerate it is what everyone says) and does not ever show sign of stress from being handled. I do handle him daily, sometimes two or three times a day. He doesn't ball up, is active, and regularly eats so don't tell me it's bad to handle him that much. If he shows signs of stress or that he wants to hide I put him away immediately. Sorry I got off topic....

his feed day day is this weekend so as long as his eyes clear up I am going to try and stick to his regular feeding and see if he's open to it.

basically, when his eyes get back to normal is it usually okay to handle between then and shed if he seems comfortable?

It is generally not recommended to handle a snake during the shedding process. It can possibly cause a bad shed and a lot stress to the animal. However, it is your snake, so do whatever you wish. I just know if that were my snake, I would not be handling during the shedding process period.

mine always eats and handles well during shed but i guess it differs :)

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Originally Posted by gplegend11

So my guy is going through his first pre shed signs. Here's my question...

is is it alright to handle him during the time between when his eyes return to black ( they are white at the moment) and his actual shed?

I have handled my snakes while in blue but only for short periods of time and if they seemed panicky (flighty), I didn't bother. Actual shed? Usually a short process but I would leave them be while actually shedding their skin off.
Could it it actually help him shed because he likes to wrap around my neck and "message" his body or in other words flex and relax himself repeatedly against my neck...( he was only seems to do this when around my neck).

Again, I'd leave them be while shedding. They shouldn't need help while shedding.

He doesn't ball up, is active, and regularly eats so don't tell me it's bad to handle him that much. If he shows signs of stress or that he wants to hide I put him away immediately.

Too much handling can lead to stress. While it is okay for a Ball Python to roam and explore, usually a balled up Ball is a happy Ball (also goes "A hiding Ball is a happy Ball). If they are moving fast and away from you, they are stressed and I'd put them back. They aren't really exploring snakes unless out hunting or looking for a new place to hide.

his feed day day is this weekend so as long as his eyes clear up I am going to try and stick to his regular feeding and see if he's open to it.

Feed if they'll take it. If they don't and usually do, I would no longer feed during sheds. Mine seem to take prey items fine.

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Originally Posted by ballpythonluvr

It is generally not recommended to handle a snake during the shedding process. It can possibly cause a bad shed and a lot stress to the animal. However, it is your snake, so do whatever you wish. I just know if that were my snake, I would not be handling during the shedding process period.

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Are you meaning during the white eyes and then the actually process of shedding? Or the 10-14 day period from start to finish. I cannot go that long without handling him. I get not to handle him when his eyes change and when his skin is coming off. But a lot say that there is anywhere from 1-5 days between the eye change and the actual shed. That's the time period I am wondering about?

Also to pokey the ninja, thanks for the answers. I do handle him a lot but when I take him out I put him somewhere warm and secure like my sweater pocket or something like that and let him decide when to come out. Every time, wether it's right away or five minutes, he will either poke his head out and chill or come out and slowly wander around for a bit untill he finds another place to hang out. If he is moving too much or stays hidden too long I put him away pronto.

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Originally Posted by gplegend11

Are you meaning during the white eyes and then the actually process of shedding? Or the 10-14 day period from start to finish. I cannot go that long without handling him. I get not to handle him when his eyes change and when his skin is coming off. But a lot say that there is anywhere from 1-5 days between the eye change and the actual shed. That's the time period I am wondering about?

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This is a very strong reason for people getting more than one snake. You are better equipped to accommodate your desire to handle one and their desire to be undisturbed. Stressed snakes eventually become sick snakes.

Then you have no snakes.

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Originally Posted by gplegend11

Are you meaning during the white eyes and then the actually process of shedding? Or the 10-14 day period from start to finish. I cannot go that long without handling him. I get not to handle him when his eyes change and when his skin is coming off. But a lot say that there is anywhere from 1-5 days between the eye change and the actual shed. That's the time period I am wondering about?

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From start of the shed process to finish it is advised not to handle the snake more than you absolutely have to. Needing to move the animal for spot cleaning or something is fine, but handling just to handle can lead to stress, bad sheds, etc...

You can't go 10-14 days (all of my snakes shed in under 10 days, and my BP sheds 4-5 days after his belly turns pink and his eyes go opaque) without holding your snake? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this your first snake? in it's first shed? So I'm guessing you went a lot longer than 10-14 days without handling a snake up until now. Please take the snake's well-being into consideration. Handling just to handle when you are being advised by people who have years of experience is selfish. And frankly, why ask questions if you aren't going to listen to the answers? You basically said in the original thread that you are going to handle him as much as you want regardless of what people say. So why ask?

You're going to have your snake for many years IF you learn from the experienced, knowledgeable people on here and apply what you learn. You care about your snake? Then think about your snake's needs and put your selfish desire to handle the animal on hold for a few days. You'll be ok and the snake will be better off.

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Originally Posted by craigafrechette

From start of the shed process to finish it is advised not to handle the snake more than you absolutely have to.[\QUOTE]"............

what is considered the start? The opaque eyes and pink belly? The color dimming before the white eyes? Explain please. I read that the dimming can happen a week before the eyes. Then the eyes change for a few days. Then go back to normal for a time frame. Then the skin comes off. So when do I leVe it alone and increase humidity?

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Handling just to handle when you are being advised by people who have years of experience is selfish. And frankly, why ask questions if you aren't going to listen to the answers? You basically said in the original thread that you are going to handle him as much as you want regardless of what people say. So why ask?[\QUOTE].............

I said I will handle him as much as I want as long as it does not induce stress, hence the question of the timeline during shed when he should be left alone, because that is something I do not know.

[/QUOTE] You're going to have your snake for many years IF you learn from the experienced, knowledgeable people on here and apply what you learn. You care about your snake? Then think about your snake's needs and put your selfish desire to handle the animal on hold for a few days. You'll be ok and the snake will be better off.[/QUOTE]...........

I ask very detailed questions and the problem is that, "experienced and knowledgable" people like you respond with a single statement that either does not answer the question, only answers a part of it which leaves more questions, or leaves a rude comment that accomplishes nothing because you feel entitled due to having more experience.

If the "experienced and knowledgeable" members of this forum really care then give me a full detailed answer, an explanation why, and what to expect. Otherwise what experience and knowledge are you really bringing to the table besides making yourself feel smarter than others.

I have made multiple threads with lots of very detailed questions, hoping someone would care enough to give detailed answers with explanations, and have never had a memeber give me a full answer, or an explanation as to the why behind their statement. Also realize that I get opposite info from multiple members and every site I visit. So don't unsult me or treat me like I am ignorant when I have put every moment of my free time to learn more and ask questions, only to find nothing but contradictory info, veterans of this forum who look down on beginners and don't care to instruct and teach but mostly throw around insults, and then the rare response that is actually helpful, but still doesn't explain the whole thing.

If if your so good then teach. Explain. Use detail. Share your knowledge to the full extent that it will help in each situation. That's why you are here correct? Or is it to make yourself feel cool because you can look at other people's questions and think they are silly because they haven't learned yet.?

this goes out to all you "veterans" of this site..... stop judging, educate, be helpful, explain, share wisdom, share knowledge, encourage, answers people's questions to the fullest of your knowledge. They ask specific things for a reason. Most importantly, realize you have influence and can make a difference IF you actually educate people in the subject of their question. That's the whole point of this forum no?

welcome to this site. i have learned this same thing you are saying. i stopped asking questions also because of this situation a lot of sarcastic people who think a beginner who is asking questions are either stupid or dont comprehend because we are new to the hobby. but i guarantee that i have asked questions and i received multiple different answers from multiple people so i just wing it the best i can.. so far reese is doing well and thriving.. hope all is well.

Sent from my SM-J700P using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by gplegend11

Are you meaning during the white eyes and then the actually process of shedding? Or the 10-14 day period from start to finish. I cannot go that long without handling him. I get not to handle him when his eyes change and when his skin is coming off. But a lot say that there is anywhere from 1-5 days between the eye change and the actual shed. That's the time period I am wondering about?

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Yes, I do mean the 10-14 day period from start to finish. You can handle if you want but I don't handle my ball pythons at all when in shed. I like to leave them alone and let them have time to rest up for the final process of when the skin comes off. I have tried handling in the past during the shed cycle when the eyes are opaque and did not have good results. The snake was very easily scared and timid and hissed at me a lot. I did not want to stress the animal out.

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Originally Posted by gplegend11

Handling just to handle when you are being advised by people who have years of experience is selfish. And frankly, why ask questions if you aren't going to listen to the answers? You basically said in the original thread that you are going to handle him as much as you want regardless of what people say. So why ask?[\QUOTE].............

I said I will handle him as much as I want as long as it does not induce stress, hence the question of the timeline during shed when he should be left alone, because that is something I do not know.

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You're going to have your snake for many years IF you learn from the experienced, knowledgeable people on here and apply what you learn. You care about your snake? Then think about your snake's needs and put your selfish desire to handle the animal on hold for a few days. You'll be ok and the snake will be better off.

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...........

I ask very detailed questions and the problem is that, "experienced and knowledgable" people like you respond with a single statement that either does not answer the question, only answers a part of it which leaves more questions, or leaves a rude comment that accomplishes nothing because you feel entitled due to having more experience.

If the "experienced and knowledgeable" members of this forum really care then give me a full detailed answer, an explanation why, and what to expect. Otherwise what experience and knowledge are you really bringing to the table besides making yourself feel smarter than others.

I have made multiple threads with lots of very detailed questions, hoping someone would care enough to give detailed answers with explanations, and have never had a memeber give me a full answer, or an explanation as to the why behind their statement. Also realize that I get opposite info from multiple members and every site I visit. So don't unsult me or treat me like I am ignorant when I have put every moment of my free time to learn more and ask questions, only to find nothing but contradictory info, veterans of this forum who look down on beginners and don't care to instruct and teach but mostly throw around insults, and then the rare response that is actually helpful, but still doesn't explain the whole thing.

If if your so good then teach. Explain. Use detail. Share your knowledge to the full extent that it will help in each situation. That's why you are here correct? Or is it to make yourself feel cool because you can look at other people's questions and think they are silly because they haven't learned yet.?

this goes out to all you "veterans" of this site..... stop judging, educate, be helpful, explain, share wisdom, share knowledge, encourage, answers people's questions to the fullest of your knowledge. They ask specific things for a reason. Most importantly, realize you have influence and can make a difference IF you actually educate people in the subject of their question. That's the whole point of this forum no?

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Lets be honest, that's starting to sound a lot like an excuse to not listen at all. Snakes in shed like to be left alone, its stressful for them and a time when their eyesight gets worse than it already is and their bodies are focused on removing the shed. If you need a detailed, cited and thoroughly researched scientific reason-it stresses them out. When in blue they have a tougher time seeing and therefore are more nervous, I would be too if all of a sudden my contact lenses were smeared with grease and a giant heat-emitted tree was grabbing for me. Secondly the snakes are producing the lymphatic fluid to separate the old skin from the new...handling would surely have an effect on this if done too much right? After blue and the fluid is reabsorbed, they have to focus on getting all of the old skin off which is a task on its own without being picked up and distracted from being able to do that.

Just don't hold your snake during shed, its going to cause more harm than good.

As a side note to the veteran call out, you can certainly expect much more cynical answers or no answers at all if you continue to be as defensive as you are. I've received quite a bit of advice from people doing this longer than I've been alive and even though sometimes the answers come back harsh in text form, I take the advice and USE IT. I don't get angry or butthurt over a response I took as harsh or cynical...that's just silly.

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Originally Posted by gplegend11

So my guy is going through his first pre shed signs. Here's my question...

He is not a timid snake and seems to enjoy hanging out and having back and cheek rubs( I know, I know, they just tolerate it is what everyone says) and does not ever show sign of stress from being handled. I do handle him daily, sometimes two or three times a day. He doesn't ball up, is active, and regularly eats so don't tell me it's bad to handle him that much. If he shows signs of stress or that he wants to hide I put him away immediately. Sorry I got off topic....

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I understand what you're saying, and was in no way calling you ignorant or putting you down. As a whole, this forum is EXTREMELY helpful. But the people who see the positives and benefits are the ones who APPLY what they learn. The bold print in the above original thread is why I said what I said. It's tough to want to help somebody when they say things like that. You have received advice and basically said you don't care about the advice and do your own thing.
And NOT to insult you, that was never my intent, but being so new are you even sure what you're looking for in terms of "signs of stress"? He is not a timid snake? Compared to what other snakes you have experience with?

[QUOTE=gplegend11;2527309]
I said I will handle him as much as I want as long as it does not induce stress, hence the question of the timeline during shed when he should be left alone, because that is something I do not know.

The bottom line is that it is in the best interest of the animal to be minimally handled throughout the entire shedding process. The primary reason is stress. Snakes go through a LOT during the shedding process and the least we can do is not further stress them out for our own needs.

I'm not here to feel smart, I don't claim to know everything, not even close!! I'm here to learn as well. Nor do I need validation from anybody online to feel "cool". That ship sailed long ago. I'm 38 years old and am WAY past needing to feel cool. Nor am I judging. I'm simply pointing out examples of your lack of experience and you choosing to do your own thing, despite what people are advising. I don't understand the point of an OP asking a question if they aren't willing to listen to what people are telling them. It's basically spitting in the face of those who have taken their time to try to help.

As far as full, detailed answers, there is a basically unlimited world of knowledge at your fingertips, dig in and read. Learn about the animal through research and due diligence. Many of us started in this hobby long before internet was readily available and forums like this even existed. We went to libraries, read books and magazines, etc... we were not spoon fed. You want answers, but you don't seem to want to listen if it's not what you want to hear. People are less likely to take the time to help when it falls on deaf ears. If you're asking questions and applying what you are learning people will be more inclined to dig deeper and give more thorough replies. Maybe show that you're learning and applying what you're learning rather than saying "I can't go 10-14 days without handling my snake." You went YEARS without handling a snake and you have YEARS to handle the snake you have now. So please put the snake's needs first.

I'm sorry if you were insulted by my reply, that was not my intent. It's just frustrating to see people asking for help but not willing to do what they are advised, especially for their own, personal, selfish reasons. If you wanted a pet you could handle all the time, a snake was the wrong choice.

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Originally Posted by predatorkeeper87

lets be honest, that's starting to sound a lot like an excuse to not listen at all. Snakes in shed like to be left alone, its stressful for them and a time when their eyesight gets worse than it already is and their bodies are focused on removing the shed. If you need a detailed, cited and thoroughly researched scientific reason-it stresses them out. When in blue they have a tougher time seeing and therefore are more nervous, i would be too if all of a sudden my contact lenses were smeared with grease and a giant heat-emitted tree was grabbing for me. Secondly the snakes are producing the lymphatic fluid to separate the old skin from the new...handling would surely have an effect on this if done too much right? After blue and the fluid is reabsorbed, they have to focus on getting all of the old skin off which is a task on its own without being picked up and distracted from being able to do that.

Just don't hold your snake during shed, its going to cause more harm than good.

As a side note to the veteran call out, you can certainly expect much more cynical answers or no answers at all if you continue to be as defensive as you are. I've received quite a bit of advice from people doing this longer than i've been alive and even though sometimes the answers come back harsh in text form, i take the advice and use it. I don't get angry or butthurt over a response i took as harsh or cynical...that's just silly.

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^^^^thank you^^^^

that is all I wanted was a clear, concise, and educated answer. When I notice he is showing signs of shed, until his skin is off, I will not handle him. Now I am comfortable doing that because of the clarification. You guys have to remember that much of what seems basic and obvious to you guys is not at all for begginers.

And to to clarify to you guys, I meant to not tell me it was bad to handle him on a regular basis when he is not in shed cycle, not during his shed cycle. Some people have said hold them no more than once or twice a week, others say as much as you want if they show no signs of stress. I will have many more snakes and I'm sure some will only be once a week handlers, whereas I am intuitive enough, even though he is my first, to see that this guy is relaxed when handled. Not to mention as my first python the initial excitement is still there.

So thanks for the clarification and actually explaining it to me. Now I understand, unlike before where I didn't see any issue with holding him between his eyes returning to normal and his skin coming off. Now I don't have to wonder and am left with no unanswered part of my question.

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Originally Posted by gplegend11

that is all I wanted was a clear, concise, and educated answer. When I notice he is showing signs of shed, until his skin is off, I will not handle him. Now I am comfortable doing that because of the clarification. You guys have to remember that much of what seems basic and obvious to you guys is not at all for begginers.

And to to clarify to you guys, I meant to not tell me it was bad to handle him on a regular basis when he is not in shed cycle, not during his shed cycle. Some people have said hold them no more than once or twice a week, others say as much as you want if they show no signs of stress. I will have many more snakes and I'm sure some will only be once a week handlers, whereas I am intuitive enough, even though he is my first, to see that this guy is relaxed when handled. Not to mention as my first python the initial excitement is still there.

So thanks for the clarification and actually explaining it to me. Now I understand, unlike before where I didn't see any issue with holding him between his eyes returning to normal and his skin coming off. Now I don't have to wonder and am left with no unanswered part of my question.

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I certainly see your point, and I hope you know that the vast majority of the community on this forum truly wants to help. I can't speak for everybody, and I know there are exceptions, but I can safely say most of us want to help because we are passionate about these animals. We want what's best for the animals AND their keepers. I personally love keeping snakes as pets for many reasons, but it can be tricky and a bit discouraging at first. This forum is great for getting people over that tricky/discouraging hump and to the point where they aren't stressing over their new animal and are enjoying the animal.

That being said, I also understand your initial excitement, believe me, I get it. But the reasons people advise letting new snakes settle in for a while is long-term. Trust me, I love having my snakes out so I can hang out with them and enjoy them, that's a big part of why I got back into keeping them. I need to show some restraint with new snakes though, for their benefit. It gets easier when it's not your first, but it's still tempting. And once you have a few, it's easier because when the temptation kicks in you can just grab another. This comes into play with shedding, feeding, etc...

I certainly didn't mean to get off on the wrong foot with helping you out. I honestly do care and want to see you enjoy your snake (snakes, when the time is right to add another, or three, or six...hahaha). You're doing fine and I think you're going to enjoy this hobby for many years to come.
Good luck, we're here to help if you need us.:gj:

Thanks, I will have many questions. In fact, starting a new thread now :gj:

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Originally Posted by gplegend11

that is all I wanted was a clear, concise, and educated answer. When I notice he is showing signs of shed, until his skin is off, I will not handle him. Now I am comfortable doing that because of the clarification. You guys have to remember that much of what seems basic and obvious to you guys is not at all for begginers.

And to to clarify to you guys, I meant to not tell me it was bad to handle him on a regular basis when he is not in shed cycle, not during his shed cycle. Some people have said hold them no more than once or twice a week, others say as much as you want if they show no signs of stress. I will have many more snakes and I'm sure some will only be once a week handlers, whereas I am intuitive enough, even though he is my first, to see that this guy is relaxed when handled. Not to mention as my first python the initial excitement is still there.

So thanks for the clarification and actually explaining it to me. Now I understand, unlike before where I didn't see any issue with holding him between his eyes returning to normal and his skin coming off. Now I don't have to wonder and am left with no unanswered part of my question.

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outside of shed or illness I generally advise 3-4 times a week handling at most. They learn to know you aren't going to eat them, however they never love the idea of being handled.

People get passionate about these animals as I believe was explained above, so always expect some extremely passionate answers when posing questions which will indefinitely come off as smug or rude, sift through the emotional parts and find the info. Glad to see this conversation was turned into something more productive by the way.