Provent-a-Mite too much or too little? How do you know?

I got Provent-a-Mite for my Ball Python who has mites.... I sprayed my tub in my rack, but I am worried I sprayed too much. I see like a white film in the tub and wood. I have seen some horrid videos of snakes convulsing and what not from PAM being sprayed too much. I am scared to move my ball back to his tub because of the film. Anyone have opinions/ideas on this one? I am new to Ball Pythons and mites.

First of all: Read all the instructions.

Second of all: You need to treat the entire rack and every snake. Discard all old substrate. Freeze future substrate before giving it to your snakes (72 hours should do it). Clean the entire room really well. Consider using diatomaceous earth in the room (don't inhale it, don't get it on your snakes or any of their bedding, don't use so much you're kicking up clouds when you walk), as well as treating the area surrounding your rack.

Anything loose in the room I'd either bleach or freeze or treat with PAM.

Mites are like ringworm. Unless you get them early or go all out, they'll come back.

Third, read all directions, try to read between the lines on them too.

Also, one of thr best parts about provent a mite is that it's pretty easy to NOT mess up. Even the one video I saw of someone using too much said "let it air out completely". I never even had snake mites but when I had my first snake I was using PAM proventatively and chlorohexadine to clean the enclosure. Never had issues with it. I let it dry for like an hour and then did a touch test

Everyone says the instructions are clear, but they aren't exactly clear on how long to spray the product or how much. I see a little white film on the sides of the bin the snake was in. It wasn't a full blown infestation by the way. I don't want to throw him in if I sprayed too much.

1 second to coat 1 square foot.

Again, the biggest thing is it being dry after, fully dry

Can you take pictures of your enclosure and everything else you sprayed with PAM, upload them (2 or 3 should be more than enough) somewhere like Imageshack, and post them here?

Once it is dry, as long as it is not in the water bowl it is ok. For me, it takes about a half hour. Depends on humidity and temp as to how long it takes to dry.

Do you have a box fan, standing fan, or some other fan you can use to blow it out?

I'm fairly sure it's water based so I'd definitely suggest avoid the enclosure building up condensation (although I honestly used to spray my 40gal tank within 3 days of putting PAM on, sooo). You can also increase the heat (if you have a clamp lamp handy have it pointed at the enclosure, or increase any heat you have in or to the room). It would also be very very wise to have done the PAM outdoors, or open your windows

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...%2FJqpBm2p.jpghttp://i.imgur.com/kMjSiP5.jpghttps://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...%2F6GFbTIX.jpg

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The whitish looking specs are the spray residue on the wood.

That doesn't look problematic. Is that a flash from the camera in the tub above the pasta sauce?

That paper wasn't in there when you sprayed, was it?

Yes it was in there; is that bad? I saw that guy on SnakeBytes spray his paper, and thought it was okay. Is that a bad idea?

If he wants to spray his substrate, let him. But he isn't paranoid about using too much.

You could also take that paper out, and spray the new paper LIGHTLY with PAM. Let it air dry before putting it back in.

Would what I've done so far hurt it though?

How dry is it? Is it very very dry? If so, add a clean water dish you should be fine.

Check all the paper, though.

I am gonna leave it set for a couple more hours then put it back. I did it at 8pm. You and I are in the same time zone.

Do a touch test on everything. Do a sniff test on the whole area.

If there is spray residue from the pam then i think you used to much. Is it dangerous to your bp? i can't say for sure but i won't put one of mine in a over sprayed tub. I'd wipe down the inside of the tub slot and clean the tub get a fresh start. As for the spraying all you need to do is a quick left to right spraying of the tub. Keep the can a good two foot or one and half foot distance from the tub while doing the quick left to right and that's it. Its been a long time since i've needed to use pam. Whenever a bp did their business i would clean out the quarantine tub throw away the paper put new paper in then give it a quick spray and they go away no problem. Of course you need to give it some time. Getting rid of mites with pam isn't a one day thing. Also i'd leave the water bowl out of the tub for a bit whenever you spray it. At the most a couple hours or a least a half hour like jordan said its up to you. That's about it. I assume you separated him from the rest if you got others just keep him separated and you should eventually beat the mites pam does work. Also with respect to what others are saying you don't need to spray things in your house just spray the tub.

I woke up and saw that there is condensation from water in its bin thatI sprayed. It isn't displaying signs of toxicity to the chemicals; it's acting completely normal. I have problems with the bin he lives in condensing like that. I thought it was his water dish, but I didn't put the water dish in last night! I touch tested the whole thing before putting it in and there was no wet or dampness anywhere, now it is condensed all over.

PAM says you can straight wash and mist it. You'll be fine.

So it regularly builds up humidity like that? On my own rack each tub has 4 holes in it on one of the two short sides. In the winter the holes point in, in the summer they point out. It controls my humidity perfectly

Yeah, I drilled some holes and since it pooped last night I put new paper down and sprayed. I moved it to a different bin for the next few hours.
Also, when I retreated I think I may have breathed a little of the PAM vapor......Is that going to be a problem for me?

First off, I would keep the humidity to just house humidity until you are done treatments. Mites need humidity. So leaving your tubs a little on the dry side wont hurt the snake for a couple months but will aid in killing the mites. Second, you can spray it inside the tub. I personally would recommend it but the key is to spray lightly. Don't soak the tub, a little goes a long way. Remember PAM is a poison. I personally use paper towels as it makes it easier to see any dead mites. I just lay paper towel down in the QT tank and lightly spray it. I try to avoid direct spray on the glass and hides as it seems the stuff takes forever to dry on those surfaces. Cover the top of the tub after you spray to let the fumes settle on the walls and stuff. After about 15 mins, uncover it and let it dry. Also what you can do is spray it on a rag and wipe down your rack and the outside and rims of the other tubs. That will put up a barrier. I do that around the bases of all my cage stacks once a month as preventative. And finally I would leave the water bowl out of the cage for the night just incase you miss a spot and it didn't completely dry. If the snake crawls across it and then somehow into his water bowl, you will have a problem.

As for breathing PAM, I have done it accidently. Not fun lol. My chest tightened a little for about 20 mins but otherwise I was fine. Avoid breathing in fumes.

Oh and another thing, you need to do this every week for about 2 months to make sure you get rid of them. Then for the next 6 months as preventative, like I mentioned, I would wipe down the outside of the rack, tubs and rims with PAM on a rag every month. That way if you did have any loose in the house and they try and get to the snakes, they will die before they reach them.

It is toxic in its spray form. But that depends how much you inhaled. When you kill an animal with it, you are puttinf them in an enclosure where most of the air is fumes, which kills them. Same would go with a human being, if you were in a room where most of it was toxic fumes, you'd likely die.

Now, inhaling some of the fumes is bad for you. But it is highly unlikely you inhaled so much you'll have serious issues.

If your tub is coated in it (in other words, under the paper as well), don't bother respraying the tub for a month, unless you have to scrub it out really well. Then just lightly spray any substrate (or don't spray it at all, up to you), let it dry, and then put it in the tub. Personally I feel that if your substrate is something thin like paper, you shouldn't even need to spray it, the mites will come in contact with the poison.

Yeah; I left the water out last night myself, and plan on doing tonight with retreat. I drilled holes in the bin to control humidity. Glad I am not going to have too many issues with breathing it also.

Thanks for the help everyone! I would say you answered all my concerns. It wasn't a big infestation IMO. I only saw like 3 mites on my snake. I have seen some horror videos of some people's infestations. I will never buy a snake from my local pet shop anymore though. Only reputable breeders from here on out.

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Originally Posted by DustinS85

Thanks for the help everyone! I would say you answered all my concerns. It wasn't a big infestation IMO. I only saw like 3 mites on my snake. I have seen some horror videos of some people's infestations. I will never buy a snake from my local pet shop anymore though. Only reputable breeders from here on out.

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I guarantee there is more. The thing is mites are almost invisible to see really until they are adults who have fed. Then they get the that black/red color because of the blood they fed on. Otherwise they are kind of translucent. Like I said, I would treat for 2 months as the life cycle and eggs are generally a month to month and a half. I talked to Bob at Pro Products and he told me that the eggs can last for months depending on the environment which is why he recommends wiping down the outside of the cages for 6-10 months after you have killed the mites. Much easier imo to just wipe down the outsides once a month to stem any reinfestations than it is to have to put everyone on paper towels and treat them all over again. I got 7 snakes in 2 cage stack, a T10 stack and a T8 stack. I definitely don't want to have to treat everyone so that's why I spray the bases of both my AP cage stacks once a month. I also wipe down any kind of wiring like probe wires, heat tape wires, light wires as that could be a way for them to get in too.

And even breeders can have mite outbreaks. Best advice is quarantine all new snakes in a separate cage in a separate room. I always prep the QT tank by treating it with PAM before the snake arrives. Then put him in there and see if you see any dead mites on the paper towels or in the water bowl.

My issue is that I have a 2nd snake and there is only 1 setup I own. I am gonna treat my corn snake as if it had them, even though I have seen no signs on her.

On a side note; the pet store said they get Balls in with mites often. Kinda annoyed that they didn't tell me until I found them on my snake 3 weeks later. My Aspen bedding for corn snake...can I bake it in oven? if so; how long and what temp?

Freeze everything for 72 hours that you get from that pet store (obviously not live animals). This should kill the mites and their eggs

What if all you have is a standard fridge/freezer with no extra room for bedding? Also, it probably isn't sanitary for my food to be with bedding I assume.

I throw fresh bags of bedding right into my freezer and it's a standard size refrigerator. Just don't keep so much stuff in your freezer XD.

About sanitary: First of all, keep things in the fridge covered in general. Second, don't just put loose substrate in your freezer, doesn't it come in bags when you get it?

As a snake keeper I highly recommend a small freezer on the side to keep frozen rodents in.

Yeah, the substrate comes in bags, but the bag is open now. I assume I can throw it in a grocery bag and put it in there. Now as for the extra freezer...yeah, when I can afford it I will.

That works fine for now. And yeah, save up for one and get one. It doesn't need to be big like a deep freeze, just find one that can fit your rodents in and hopefully some substrate. I think mine was like 100 bucks or something.

What I do with mine is keep it in my room, where my snakes are. Good place for ice cream if you aren't squeemish. I take rodents out of it, put them on a plate or plastic tub lid and leave them for like 4-8 hours to thaw, and warm them up with a clamp lamp I keep nearby by clamping it to the little groove on the door of the freezer. Works great because the snakes are always hungry by the time I warm the rodents up with the lamp.

Another perk of the mini freezer being near the snakes is that the freezer generates heat to keep things cold inside. End result is a slightly higher ambient temp in the room

Yes you can bake it. I think anything over like 135F will kill mites and eggs. Just throw the stuff on a cookie sheet and bake it for 150F for 5 mins. Watch it though so you don't start a fire.

This is why I don't usually suggest baking things, while freezing is nice and passive, it just takes time. With Eco Earth I add it to boiling water (which will kill everything, but you don't want to leave the burner on when you add the eco earth). Fine aspen shavings in an oven, even at a low temp, seems like asking for trouble.

And I dunno about 5 minutes. To successfully kill everything in it you would need all parts of the substrate to be 135 at least. So it may likely take longer at 150. Just don't go close to the burning point of the bedding.

With freezing it, while it takes a while, it also kills anything in the bag, saving you from mites still being in or on the bag by the time you give the bedding to the reptiles.

Well to be honest, I've never gotten mites from any substrate ever in over 10 years. Mites aren't going to want to lay eggs in a dry substrate especially if they have access to a nice warm, humid, dark cage with an easy supply of food. For them to be running around on bags of substrate, the place would need to be crawling with mites from head to toe and in that case, I would be more worried about bringing home a hitchhiker on your shoes or pants. Its the same as getting mites from feeders. I mean the chance is there but again, being mammals aren't their food source and again, comparing environments, the chances are pretty slim unless the mites are literally crawling on the walls lol. And for those types of pet shops, I avoid them.

Now the OP said the pet shop guy said they regularly get BPs with mites on them, that is a huge red flag and I would avoid that pet shop like the plague. Just going in there and looking around would put you at risk of bringing home an unwanted hitchhiker. That is the main reason I avoid most pet shops and all shows. I'm OCD about that stuff and I still managed to somehow get mites on my dumeril's. I think it was from a hitchhiker from when I did go to a reptile shop. Luckily none of my other snakes got them being in the same room but again, I wipe down the outside of all my cage stacks once a month with PAM. The dumeril's was in a glass tank waiting for her cage and I believe I forgot to wipe it back down after I washed her cage all out for a cleaning. Regardless though, I moved her to a separate room in the house and have been treating her for 2 months with PAM now. Only found a couple mites on her at the beginning and didn't find a single one in the cage after I threw out all the stuff and washed the cage out with soap and started PAM treatments. Was so weird. Figured after starting treatment I'd find at least 1 dead one on the paper or in the water bowl but nope, just the 2 or 3 in the water and 1 live on her at the very beginning.

And so far, been 2 months and not a single mite found and she had a good clean shed.

Bottom line is if you keep reptiles long enough, you will eventually have to deal with mites. They are a pain but not the end of the world.

Pet food gave me grain mites. They're sooo hard to kill, especially when they infest your bug room. Hence my original statement of handling EVERYTHING within the room. Kill them super dead.

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Originally Posted by Sauzo

Now the OP said the pet shop guy said they regularly get BPs with mites on them, that is a huge red flag and I would avoid that pet shop like the plague. Just going in there and looking around would put you at risk of bringing home an unwanted hitchhiker.

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Way ahead of you on that one! My issue is that I gotta figure out where to get my frozen rodents....sigh.....Any good online ideas?

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Originally Posted by DustinS85

Way ahead of you on that one! My issue is that I gotta figure out where to get my frozen rodents....sigh.....Any good online ideas?

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Unless you are ordering in bulk or got a few buddies to all throw in together, the shipping makes ordering just a few not worth it. Perfect Prey and Big Cheese Rodents are the two best that come to mind. I would say Layne Labs too but recently I've heard their packaging quality has gone downhill but I cant actually verify that. You can also look your local herp club or local reptile club on FB. I know a few guys in my area who breed rats and do weekly meets at places to fill orders for people in the area. Saves a ton on shipping and as long as you are getting it from a quality guy, they should be fine.

Well, it's been almost a week since treatment, and the snakes haven't went in their water also I haven't seen a single mite on their bodies since. I am remaining vigilant, and going to continue treatment for months (because I have to with those devil bugs). Also, my Ball Python is much more laid back and friendly than he was before. Little buggers were upsetting him bad. (Never sexed my ball, but since I am a guy I just say him LOL).