low white pieds

I'm wondering if low white pieds tend to produce low white offspring and vice versa?

The amount of pigmentation is 100% random, low white parents can produce high white offspring and vise versa and there is no predictability in it. However, there are some codominant/incomplete dominant genes that can affect pied coloration in ways that are very predictable; ex. Lesser/butter pieds are all white (same for champagne pieds), spider pieds are always extremely high white (some completely white), cinnamon/black pastel pieds tend to be very high white, and enchi pieds are almost always low white.

To my knowledge there are no recessive genes that affect pied in this manner.

Thanks for the great response Trisnake.

Here's an example of siblings one high white one low white that came from a mother that was 90% white. :)

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...ry-dahiish.jpg

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...ry-dahii8h.jpg

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Originally Posted by LuvBall81

Thanks for the great response Trisnake.

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Of course!:gj:

The mystery of it is part of what makes pied clutches so fun; no one snake is alike and you never know what you're gonna get until they crawl out of the egg. I personally am a huge fan of low to mid white pieds, and I'm a sucker for enchi combos, so I think an enchi pied is in my future:rolleyes: Would be interesting to see how black pastel and enchi react in the same pied animal-- I personally think the black pastel's tendency to increase white and decrease color would dominate how the animal is pigmented, and leave us with a very high white slightly oranger looking black pastel pied. Ah, just some thoughts, but it's late and I'm derailing the thread with my rambling...:P

Those are 2 very nice looking pieds pied lover. I like the mid range whites the best. I like the normal coloration too in btw the white of the snake.

I am interested in producing hypo pieds. I am about to purchase a female breeder hypo from a person close to where I live. Ill get her ready for next year but I also need a male pied of course. You guys think a 2016 male would most likely be ready to breed her next season or that pushing it?

Thanks everyone for good responses.

I was actually talking to someone at a reptile expo about this today. He had his pied mates there and their new ofspring. The parents were both pretty low white. Like 20%. But all of the hatchling were around 70-80%

Thanks! I think we are all suckers for the mid-white pieds particularly the ones that have even pattern. ;)

Ended up with one of those too in this clutch. Heehee. I would have held this one back if he had been a she.


https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...ry-dahihvs.jpg

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Originally Posted by piedlover79

Thanks! I think we are all suckers for the mid-white pieds particularly the ones that have even pattern. ;)

Ended up with one of those too in this clutch. Heehee. I would have held this one back if he had been a she.


https://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...ry-dahihvs.jpg

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Oh he's gorgeous, I love the yellow eyelets in his saddles!

Thank you!

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Originally Posted by LuvBall81

Those are 2 very nice looking pieds pied lover. I like the mid range whites the best. I like the normal coloration too in btw the white of the snake.

I am interested in producing hypo pieds. I am about to purchase a female breeder hypo from a person close to where I live. Ill get her ready for next year but I also need a male pied of course. You guys think a 2016 male would most likely be ready to breed her next season or that pushing it?

Thanks everyone for good responses.

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It's more his size and maturity than age tbh. A 2016 might be pushing it (depends on when 2016) but if he was fed and cared for well I can definitely see him hitting proper weight and being ready breed within several months if not now, again depends when they were born (aka how much time they've had to grow) and how they were cared for (growth is maximized in ideal husbandry conditions). And then there's the less predictable factor of individuality; some snakes will reach maturity early and some will take their time, just like humans and really any other animal out there. I've heard of 300 gram males breeding and I've heard of 1000 gram males not being mature enough-- of course those are extreme examples but you get my point. A safer bet would be a well-started 2015, as most should at least be up to size by now unless they had issues starting out.

Also-- breeding a pied to a hypo will give you all normal looking babies, no pieds or hypos or hypo pieds unless the parents are hets for each other's homozygous traits. They would all be double het for the traits pied and hypo though, so going that route you'd have to raise up and breed the double hets together to even get a 1 in 16 (or 0.0625%) chance per egg at hatching a hypo pied; it's likely you'd be trying for many years before you hit the odds. In my opinion it would be more economically productive (and less frustrating) to just buy a pair of visuals that also carry the hets you want, like a pied het hypo and hypo het pied, as it would speed up your project by literally years and exempt you from feeding and housing all of those double hets for however many years it takes you to hit your double recessive. Even just one parent carrying a het will speed up the project considerably.