Snake tricks

Recently, I've been working with my two boys on polishing natural wrapping behaviors. Harvey (a little over 1 year old) will wrap my neck right away, and Mikey (6 months old) will wrap my wrist right away. Harvey doesn't like wrists, and Mikey doesn't like necks. Oh, well.
Mikey is the superstar. He will come to my hand when I open his enclosure and call him. It takes a while, but he comes. Also, when I set him on my chest and make kissy noises, he will come to my lips, then my nose, and sometimes he actually climbs up on my nose around my face! My boyfriend really laughs when he does that. My boyfriend David noticed last week when he leaned down to say good morning to Mikey, he actually stood straight up and put his nose to the mesh right next to David! I was thrilled, because David was not initially thrilled about these guys, but now he's liking them more.
Anyway, does anyone have any suggestions for other cool things to teach my snakes?

Wow! How did you train them? My BP Flynn always comes up to me when I get close to his vivarium, but it's not something I trained him to do. I used to have a friend who taught his corn snake to nod its head before feeding. It was pretty cool.

Mine are REAL good at making rats disappear. Now you see it, now you don't

TADAA!!

:)

Well, Mikey loves to be handled anyway, and I do rub him on top and his belly as well (I'm a massage therapist, so I give my snakes the same gentle loving!). But, I just open up the top and start calling him when he's awake, and he will eventually make his way up to the place where I hold my hand. It sometimes happens in a minute, sometimes 5 minutes. He's learning to come faster and faster each time because he knows that he gets a good rub. Yesterday he wrapped my right arm and refused to let go for 1 hour and 20 minutes. I made BBQ sauce while he was holding on!
I forgot to add to the snake tricks, they both allow me to pet their heads. They don't even move!

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Originally Posted by Merriah

Recently, I've been working with my two boys on polishing natural wrapping behaviors. Harvey (a little over 1 year old) will wrap my neck right away, and Mikey (6 months old) will wrap my wrist right away. Harvey doesn't like wrists, and Mikey doesn't like necks. Oh, well.
Mikey is the superstar. He will come to my hand when I open his enclosure and call him. It takes a while, but he comes. Also, when I set him on my chest and make kissy noises, he will come to my lips, then my nose, and sometimes he actually climbs up on my nose around my face! My boyfriend really laughs when he does that. My boyfriend David noticed last week when he leaned down to say good morning to Mikey, he actually stood straight up and put his nose to the mesh right next to David! I was thrilled, because David was not initially thrilled about these guys, but now he's liking them more.
Anyway, does anyone have any suggestions for other cool things to teach my snakes?

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that's a neat tricks...how do you do that?

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Originally Posted by zina10

Mine are REAL good at making rats disappear. Now you see it, now you don't

TADAA!!

:)

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:rofl::rofl::rofl:

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Originally Posted by zina10

mine are real good at making rats disappear. Now you see it, now you don't

tadaa!!

:)

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funny!

Ooh you should open up a snake-massage business. Flynn would be your first customer but I'm afraid he would ditch me to live with you...:rofl:

Repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat, reward. Repeat, repeat, repeat, reward. Repeat, repeat, reward. Repeat, reward. Patience. It takes a long time, but it's really cool when they figure out what behavior you want.

All animals like to get rubbed the right way! I've actually rehabbed a few dogs and cats from injuries.

How do you reward them though?

None of this sounds like out of the ordinary "trained" ball python behavior.

In fact, I'd say almost all ball pythons exhibit similar behavior.

Also... you know they can't hear you right?

Sorry. I'm just extremely skeptical of a ball python being trained.


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They don't hear the way we do, but they do process the vibrations in the air created by sounds.

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Originally Posted by DLena

They don't hear the way we do, but they do process the vibrations in the air created by sounds.

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Sure but they don't respond to sounds like a dog or cat. As in, you can't call them to you. They might see you, smell you, or detect your heat, but they can't really "hear" you.

Just sayin.


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Originally Posted by DLena

They don't hear the way we do, but they do process the vibrations in the air created by sounds.

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You'd have to holler quite loudly to create sound waves they could "feel" while sitting in their hides, though.

Mine is really good at flipping her hides. She makes me crazy.

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Originally Posted by cayley

How do you reward them though?

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x2. Do you use food or just massage them?

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

Sure but they don't respond to sounds like a dog or cat. As in, you can't call them to you. They might see you, smell you, or detect your heat, but they can't really "hear" you.

Just sayin.


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Maybe the heat detection is what draws them out. I mean if the snake comes to you I guess it doesn't really matter how it knows you are there.

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Originally Posted by FlynnTheBP

Maybe the heat detection is what draws them out. I mean if the snake comes to you I guess it doesn't really matter how it knows you are there.

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This.

Your head is the warmest part of your body (that is normally left exposed) and is almost exactly the same temperature as a rat's body. Your hands are next on the warmth scale. Nearly every behavior you have described can be attributed to this. While it can be cute when they "kiss" you, keep it in the back of your mind that they give very similar kisses to rats just before making them disappear.

We all are having a little fun with this one, but honestly you can reinforce behaviors in just about any animal. I know that my snakes cannot hear in the way we do but they will respond to certain vibrations. I talk to my animals constantly which is hilarious because I know they cannot hear me. I think what really happens when people talk is they calm themselves. The animal can sense the calm and they will respond in kind.

I know that ball pythons can be trained to do things that they at least want to do though. This is evident in ways I have dealt with problem feeders. When I buy animals, I normally buy them as adults or sub-adults. If I have a project in mind I like to start immediately. It also allows me to have a good idea how the babies will look when they get older. Anyway, because of this, I have inherited quite a few problem feeders. A problem feeder to me is any animal that won't take FT within 30 seconds of it being offered. My most extreme case of training an animal to eat was an animal that was around three when I got her and had never had anything but live plus was already on a feeding strike when I bought her. She also refused to eat in her tub. It took about a year to get her eating FT in her tub. Step one put her in a tall covered tub. Let her smell the rat. Drop live rat in tub. Wait about a half hour for her to finally eat. Step two put rat in tub but hold by the tail. Step three, hold rat by tail and let it move against the side of the tub. Step four, put rat in and take back out about once every ten seconds until it was eaten. Once she was consistently striking within about ten seconds I switched to FT. I would wiggle the dead rat and bang it against the side of the tub. At this point she would strike so fast that she didn't notice it wasn't alive. Final step, feed in her own tub with the same method. She will now come half way out of the tub to eat just like most of my other breeders. I have never had to go to these ridiculous extremes with any other animal but she did learn and though I don't do it too often because I don't want to ruin my hard work I can make her "beg" for food by turning the lights out, partially opening the tub and knocking against the side with no rat.

I heard the other day people had conditioned honey bees to roll a ball. To the OP, keep training, its fun, the snakes can learn a little but they are not that bright so have patience.

People can joke around with me and call me crazy but its ok. I've trained all sorts of animals in my day. Ball pythons can be trained, maybe not to do anything impressive, but they can be trained.

Mine love to make poop or urates appear right after I give their enclosures a thorough clean :gj:

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

This.

Your head is the warmest part of your body (that is normally left exposed) and is almost exactly the same temperature as a rat's body. Your hands are next on the warmth scale. Nearly every behavior you have described can be attributed to this. While it can be cute when they "kiss" you, keep it in the back of your mind that they give very similar kisses to rats just before making them disappear.

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:rofl:It would stink to have your BP mistake your face for a rat's...That's when you know you messed up.

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

We all are having a little fun with this one, but honestly you can reinforce behaviors in just about any animal. I know that my snakes cannot hear in the way we do but they will respond to certain vibrations. I talk to my animals constantly which is hilarious because I know they cannot hear me. I think what really happens when people talk is they calm themselves. The animal can sense the calm and they will respond in kind.

I know that ball pythons can be trained to do things that they at least want to do though. This is evident in ways I have dealt with problem feeders. When I buy animals, I normally buy them as adults or sub-adults. If I have a project in mind I like to start immediately. It also allows me to have a good idea how the babies will look when they get older. Anyway, because of this, I have inherited quite a few problem feeders. A problem feeder to me is any animal that won't take FT within 30 seconds of it being offered. My most extreme case of training an animal to eat was an animal that was around three when I got her and had never had anything but live plus was already on a feeding strike when I bought her. She also refused to eat in her tub. It took about a year to get her eating FT in her tub. Step one put her in a tall covered tub. Let her smell the rat. Drop live rat in tub. Wait about a half hour for her to finally eat. Step two put rat in tub but hold by the tail. Step three, hold rat by tail and let it move against the side of the tub. Step four, put rat in and take back out about once every ten seconds until it was eaten. Once she was consistently striking within about ten seconds I switched to FT. I would wiggle the dead rat and bang it against the side of the tub. At this point she would strike so fast that she didn't notice it wasn't alive. Final step, feed in her own tub with the same method. She will now come half way out of the tub to eat just like most of my other breeders. I have never had to go to these ridiculous extremes with any other animal but she did learn and though I don't do it too often because I don't want to ruin my hard work I can make her "beg" for food by turning the lights out, partially opening the tub and knocking against the side with no rat.

I heard the other day people had conditioned honey bees to roll a ball. To the OP, keep training, its fun, the snakes can learn a little but they are not that bright so have patience.

People can joke around with me and call me crazy but its ok. I've trained all sorts of animals in my day. Ball pythons can be trained, maybe not to do anything impressive, but they can be trained.

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I also read about the honey bees "playing soccer". And they are certainly not as intelligent as a BP as far as we know.

I think it is all in the interpretation of the word "training" and "teaching".

Snakes have very primitive brains, mostly designed to follow their instincts. However, their learning capacity has not been studied, in part because it is difficult to figure out if they just follow their instincts in certain setups or if they actually "learned" and can apply that knowledge to different situations.

For example, if they seek out warmth, they might go to the warm body presented, and they might seek out the hottest part (head) instinctively.
But could you teach them that that warm body is behind door number 3? Or the red door ? And will they then go to the red door wherever it may be?

A lot of what they learn is "cause and effect". They smell food, they find it, they kill and eat it.
In a way it certainly IS "teaching" and "training" when you get them to eat FT food. Although they have been known to scavenge in the wild if the prey is still "warm".
You DO trick them. You get them into their "feeding mode" by scent. You trick them by warming up the food, you "wiggle" to make it appear live. So yes, because of what you did, that animal can learn to accept FT.
You manipulated their instincts. You condition their behavior.

But can you teach them to push the green button to make a rat appear ? I doubt it.

I have had all kinds of snakes, all kinds of Ball Pythons. Back in the day they were mostly wild caughts and captive bred. Some were rescues in rough shape that needed either oral meds or shots and all kinds of medical intervention. I got "close" to my snakes, I didn't breed, but I spent a lot of time with them. Observing, handling, having fun. I can say without a doubt that there is more to them that some might think. For example, I do believe that they can have all kinds of different personalities. Of course each species is different, but within a species, you can have different "temperaments". Most hatchlings or live born babies are defensive, for example. But even then..there are differences. Some are pissier, some are very shy. And some of those traits do carry over into adulthood. While you can make them ALL more comfortable, more trusting and they gain confidence with age and size, there are still differences. At least, that is my observation. So yes, there is "more" there then we know about, but I still think they are very primitive when it comes to actual intelligence. And I'm ok with that, I love them just the way they are.

I think its great when people have fun with their animals and are enthusiastic. That is FAR better then the many snakes that get neglected and end up passed around and eventually dead. If you want to try to teach them things, if you like to handle them, by all means.
And btw. certainly those snakes do feel "something" when rubbed the right way ;) I know how this sounds, but think about it. Males rub their bodies alongside the female, they "spur" them. I suppose it has to feel good or they wouldn't be doing it. ;) So who am I to say they can't enjoy a good rub ?? :D
As a matter of fact I used to have a normal wc Ball Python that actually turned her body sideways when you stroked her alongside the body. For all appearances, she liked it. She didn't try to get away, in any case.

I guess the only danger of reading to much into their instinctual behaviors is when people become disappointed that their snake doesn't do those things. There are new people to this hobby all the time. Some of them have a far higher expectation of what that relationship with this snake is going to be like, then what it will actually be. Especially once they figure out that their "active" Ball Python may just be a stressed one. That their snake would be happier in place that you don't get to see them most of the time (hidden). That this snake is actually more of a "pet rock" IF KEPT PROPERLY.

But that is just my opinion :)

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Originally Posted by zina10

And btw. certainly those snakes do feel "something" when rubbed the right way ;) I know how this sounds, but think about it. Males rub their bodies alongside the female, they "spur" them. I suppose it has to feel good or they wouldn't be doing it. ;) So who am I to say they can't enjoy a good rub ?? :D

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https://youtu.be/Md24m7Nk5Bc

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

https://youtu.be/Md24m7Nk5Bc

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I knew that was coming...LOL !!!