Week two of having her. Still striking. Normal?

She still strikes when I put my hand in to move stuff around, or want to take her out. Any tips on reducing the amount that she strikes? I read a pillow case then putting her on your belly is good. A friend said let her bite you (with a glove on so you don't flinch) then pick her up and hold her to your body and kind of protect her / keep her warm. Anyone heard of this?

81g female
~90°
~80~
60% humidity (I feel a shed coming, but she doesn't have pale eyes at all.)
24x18x12 exo terra cage.
Starting f/t Small mice tomorrow.
2 hides, bushes, good size water bowl.http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...07dcac613d.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...4542d218d7.jpg

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She's just little. My little banana boy was randomly snappy when he was little if I did anything inside his viv while he was in it. He never actually got me, it was just warning shots. He calmed all the way down after about a month and now that he's close to 600g he never does it at all anymore.

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I followed this guy's method and my little BP calmed down quickly. He advises against letting it bite you.

https://youtu.be/f-TjNKrsQEQ

It's totally normal. All babies are fearful. Some are more fearful than others. Sometimes, you just have to wait for them to grow out of it.

But, in the meantime . . .
Has she eaten for you yet? If not, I'd say, don't worry about handling. It's more important to start them eating. Handling and moving items in the cage are secondary to establishing a feeding routine. Even then, a good rule of thumb is to wait for a new baby to eat three consecutive meals before beginning regular, non-maintenance handling. That's kind of a good barometer for determining whether or not they're comfortable and settling in well.

In the future, it may also help to not move things around while she's in her home, but wait until she's out in her holding cage/clean shift to rearrange anything that needs to be fixed -- messing around with the cage while she's in it is predator stuff. Way less scary to do it when she's not trapped inside with the Hand Monster rattling around. (Unless you're just talking about removing and replacing the water bowl for cleaning. That makes sense. In this case, to minimize activity for very nervous snakes, duplicate bowls really come in handy.)

Speaking of the cage . . . That may rather large cage for a little snake, even with all the clutter. Might work, might need to temporarily downsize for her. I see the half log, which many BPs feel very insecure in. What is the other hide?

Hopefully, more folks will chime in.

Well the first wrong thing is that the snake is "aggressive". Snakes aren't aggressive, they are defensive. To them you look like a giant who is going to eat them or kill them. They are simply protecting themselves. An aggressive snake would be like a mamba who actually will chase you lol. My best advice is just go about doing daily stuff like changing water, spot cleaning, feeding etc. Then once the snake is eating good and feeling more comfortable, then you can work with earning trust.

Lol I want to see that guy in the video try and handle my JCP on one of her bad days. I bet he would cry and take his toys home lol. Anyways, like I said before, just let him settle in and get used to the surroundings. First and foremost, you want to get them eating good and strong.

As for letting them bite you, that's how I got my JCP semi tamed down. When I got her, she was a TERROR. She would strike from across the cage and even struck at the tv. First I got her eating good. Then I just let her bite me. Easiest way is to make a fist and let them strike the back of your hand. Usually small guys cant get a bite on you. After a while most will quit if they see it provides no reaction and doesn't scare "the monster" away. Then my JCP went to head butts. Those didn't work. She then got went to mock strikes. During that time I just did water changes and daily stuff and she eventually more or less learned my hand wasn't going to eat her. She is still weary and I still get bit a fair share but she is calming down. Some snakes just are nervous. My dumerils is a slug. She doesn't care how you pick her up. She fine with it and actually will curl up on my hand and sit for hours. Just take it slow and let both of you guys get to know each other.

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Originally Posted by Sallos

I followed this guy's method and my little BP calmed down quickly. He advises against letting it bite you.

https://youtu.be/f-TjNKrsQEQ

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I really like HLH's videos too! He's actually a wild life biologist so he knows quite a bit more about reptiles than most people.

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Originally Posted by Alicia

It's totally normal. All babies are fearful. Some are more fearful than others. Sometimes, you just have to wait for them to grow out of it.

But, in the meantime . . .
Has she eaten for you yet? If not, I'd say, don't worry about handling. It's more important to start them eating. Handling and moving items in the cage are secondary to establishing a feeding routine. Even then, a good rule of thumb is to wait for a new baby to eat three consecutive meals before beginning regular, non-maintenance handling. That's kind of a good barometer for determining whether or not they're comfortable and settling in well.

In the future, it may also help to not move things around while she's in her home, but wait until she's out in her holding cage/clean shift to rearrange anything that needs to be fixed -- messing around with the cage while she's in it is predator stuff. Way less scary to do it when she's not trapped inside with the Hand Monster rattling around. (Unless you're just talking about removing and replacing the water bowl for cleaning. That makes sense. In this case, to minimize activity for very nervous snakes, duplicate bowls really come in handy.)

Speaking of the cage . . . That may rather large cage for a little snake, even with all the clutter. Might work, might need to temporarily downsize for her. I see the half log, which many BPs feel very insecure in. What is the other hide?

Hopefully, more folks will chime in.

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She's eaten 3 times and she has a log cave in the warm sidehttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...13e389572e.jpg

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Are the two hides log hides? If they are you should consider changing them out for hides with only one opening where they can feel safe. I also recommend leaving it alone for awhile and keep handling to a minimum.

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Originally Posted by mdb730

Are the two hides log hides? If they are you should consider changing them out for hides with only one opening where they can feel safe. I also recommend leaving it alone for awhile and keep handling to a minimum.

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Adding to this, they should be identical hides so your snake does not choose security over thermoregulation.

While the tank LOOKS nice, I just can't help but think that that is just TOO MUCH for an 86 g baby ball. I would downsize it to something smaller and less intimidating. Just my opinion though.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by mdb730

Are the two hides log hides? If they are you should consider changing them out for hides with only one opening where they can feel safe. I also recommend leaving it alone for awhile and keep handling to a minimum.

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One is a log hide caves, so they have one opening. The other is a half log, which She goes to the half log with no issue. But I understand what you're saying. I've gotta go get substrate today and I've heard that alot.

So you're (and everyone else is) saying there is a correlation between striking and not having two of the exact same hides? She goes to her half log when she wants to thermoregulate

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mangiapane85

While the tank LOOKS nice, I just can't help but think that that is just TOO MUCH for an 86 g baby ball. I would downsize it to something smaller and less intimidating. Just my opinion though.


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I've honestly spent a butt ton of money on this cage, so going to a Tupperware box would just like be super poopy lol. The cage, thermometers, light fixtures, hides, plants, uth, controllers, humidifier etc. To just go to a plastic box would beat me up emotionally, I know it reduces stress, but I got her to have her on display and not breed. If she can over come anything, it should be living in this cage with three sides covered and the ceiling. She's explored alot and should know she's safe.

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While young animals that size are usually defensive, stress and husbandry issue can increase the issue.

The key is to address the husbandry and limit stress which also mean limiting handling as well.

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Originally Posted by Ptshay

I've honestly spent a butt ton of money on this cage, so going to a Tupperware box would just like be super poopy lol.
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The setup will still be there when your BP is the proper size to go in it, right now it does not matter if you spend a lot of money or not, the priority is to limit stress, obviously your BP is stressed there is no doubt about it.

So you can

A/ Do nothing and keep having the issue

B/ Try to remedy to the issue by providing an optimal setup for an animal that size and age. https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...-hatchling-101 (This is a TEMPORARY measure that is proven)

Ultimately YOUR call but you are misreading your animal, exploring a lot does not mean the animal feels safe. If you chose aesthetic and money over the well being and need of your animal it's on you, YOU are the one having the issue and asking for advice.

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Originally Posted by Ptshay

I've honestly spent a butt ton of money on this cage, so going to a Tupperware box would just like be super poopy lol. The cage, thermometers, light fixtures, hides, plants, uth, controllers, humidifier etc. To just go to a plastic box would beat me up emotionally, I know it reduces stress, but I got her to have her on display and not breed. If she can over come anything, it should be living in this cage with three sides covered and the ceiling. She's explored alot and should know she's safe.

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I had both my ball pythons in a tank and I hardly ever saw them. They like to stay in their hides 95% of the time. A hiding snake is a happy snake. If you wanted a display snake, a BP was not a great choice, a GTP would be more up your alley.

Check your numbers and temps (gauge seems low for hot side) cover up the sides and listen to the advice that's been given. A tank can work- but you have to lose the idea of making it pretty for you and instead setup for your animal.
Here's what I put together (we'll see opinions)
http://i1260.photobucket.com/albums/...pseqzwzv21.jpg

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Originally Posted by Rikoku

I had both my ball pythons in a tank and I hardly ever saw them. They like to stay in their hides 95% of the time. A hiding snake is a happy snake. If you wanted a display snake, a BP was not a great choice, a GTP would be more up your alley.

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Yeah she hides during the day all day then comes out at night for like 30 min, checks out the water bowl, and climbs on a tree typically. I'm not saying she's out 24/7 lol

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rikoku

I had both my ball pythons in a tank and I hardly ever saw them. They like to stay in their hides 95% of the time. A hiding snake is a happy snake. If you wanted a display snake, a BP was not a great choice, a GTP would be more up your alley.

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Or a king snake. I have an adult Florida. They LOVE to cruise.

But to the OP. Spending money is just part of this. But as was already mentioned, Ball pythons are happiest when they are HIDDEN. If she's exploring ALOT, especially during the daytime, she's probably trying to find a way out. Sorry, but that's how I view them as animals. I keep all mine in tubs. They NEVER strike, ALWAYS eat and when I take them out they love to crawl all over the place.... my first rack is on the way from C serpents (can't wait!!), but just because I plan on breeding doesn't mean I treat my snakes as prisoners. I take them out every other day at least for playtime. But I keep them in small, simplistic tubs because I know as CAPTIVE BRED animals, that's what they are most comfortable with. Now if they were a wild caught, it may be different. .. nevertheless, it's your call, your choice.


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And to further my point. Both of these tanks I'm about to show is what I spent hundreds of dollars on when I first started with this Ball Python thing. But I'll be honest, I didn't know much about them. Now I do. But here's the first one I bought for my first BP. Obviously now being occupied by a Hypo Florida kingsnake :

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...75211311d0.jpg

And now I have this second one that just sits, EMPTY. But at least I know my balls are happier now in their tubs. Maybe (probably not), but maybe when they're older I'll put them in a display tank. I know I make people mad when I say this, but they just seem to thrive in a small enclosure. I think a lot of people don't realize that these animals are captive born, so their "natural" instincts and desires are slightly skewed.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...34332be641.jpg

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You need to check your temps and humidity first, then i'd change those log hides out for 2 of the rock hides with only 1 hole. I use the exo-terra rock cave and my guys love them. When they get too small i just buy the next size up, and always buy them in pairs, so they are the same. You have a baby, so i would not handle much until she feels secure. Once you get the hides changed give her another few weeks of settlingin and eating, then start short 5 min. sessions. BPs are like any other pet, each are different. My boy has been a sweetiy since i got him as a baby, but my girl is easily stressed so she is not handled as much or as long. Niether strike at us but we also handle them differently, according to their stress tolerance. Just have a little patience and it will all work out.

Check out these vids to see her and how she acts. First one is the enclosure second is her roaming. She's never done this!!! Usually she stays balled up. So I think I've made progress. And she only striked once and that was because of a fast movement. In front of her face on accident. Let me know what you guys think.


She honestly seems happy to me...

(In the video i say 85° but it's 80.4° and 85% humidity. I know it's alot but to get it up on the hot side that's kinda what I gotta do, I do think she's about to shed)

https://youtu.be/yC64kYiKIoc
https://youtu.be/hRihyeJprnI


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Yes, moving your hatchling to a tub setup temporarily (just for a few months until she grows up a bit) will help remedy the striking issue. =) Not putting the glass tank to waste, just save it until she is a sub-adult/adult.

Some babies are more easygoing, some babies just need to feel more secure in a small cluttered spot. It's your call in the end, since she's eating anyway- nothing disastrous is happening.

If you do end up trying the temporary tub, follow Deborah's link.