A leash for my snake (hear me out)

I have a friendly ball python that I purchased as a future emotional support animal. Basically he can go out in public with me if I have the appropriate paperwork (let's not get into that). I don't want the leash to take my snake for a walk (slither?), but to lend some legitimacy to his career as a service animal. That, and it would probably comfort people to have the "scary snake" look "under control", even though I'm carrying him.

Unsurprisingly, they don't really make leashes for snakes. Other reptiles yes, snakes no. Do you think this might work as a harness of sorts? And of course if he absolutely hates it I would never force him to wear it, but he's a pretty chill snake.

http://www.petmountain.com/photos/pr...table-lead.jpg

Am I insane?

If he's a service animal and having the leash on him makes you better and others more comfortable, I say go for it. :gj:

Edit: no you're not insane :)

Ummmm


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yeah that's kind of the reaction I was expecting

Makes sense if you think it will help ease any discomfort others may have. I don't really think a harness of any sorts would stay on, I could see how it wouldn't go past a certain point on the snake, but I feel like it would still slip off the way it came on, if you know what I'm talking about.

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Yes, I have some concerns about that. Luckily it's only $4... someone needs to invent this!

It's a good Idea as a comfort animal, I say go for it! It'll get a bunch of heads turning.

This, maybe?

http://ep.yimg.com/ay/pet-guys/hagen...d-medium-3.jpg

I feel as though a legitimate harness would look quite strange, the leg holes would mess it up a little and mess with the fit. Perhaps you could make something yourself? I've seen a photo or two of a ball python in a 'sweater'. Lol If you learn to knit or crochet, you could make a little tube sweater, the "bottom" would be a little wider and the "top" would be smaller so it doesn't slide too far down the snake.

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Oh yes, my friends are making him a variety of sweaters, too! OH. WHAT IF I PUT THE LEASH OVER THE SWEATER. The friction might keep it from sliding off.

Part of me feels kind of bad, but another part of me feels like "if the worst part of your well-decorated, well-fed, well-loved life is wearing a sweater for an hour, well, you're doing pretty good."

Earn your keep, snake. ;)

I hate to be a downer :(. But Emotional Support Animals do not get full public access. Only Service Animals do. And only dogs (and mini horses in special circumstances) can be Service Animals. ESAs only are allowed in no-pets housing, and can fly in the cabin with their owners. Here's a site that explains the difference: https://www.nsarco.com/pop-esa.html

But, I was thinking of a leash too so if you figure anything out I wanna see it! :D

http://66.media.tumblr.com/5b289e7d1...9xjo2_1280.jpg

Snakes on a plane

I'm curious about how you plan to make this work. Will the snake be with you often enough that you'll have to find an "on-the-go" way of providing heat and humidity for him? Some kind of portable enclosure or climate-controlled hide? A reptile support animal seems like an unusual challenge.

Im just pondering other avenues, and piggybacking onto the above question about providing heat, you could always sow a pouch of sorts into a shirt/jacket/sweater. The pouch could be largish and have a safe way of "sealing" it.

I sometimes carry mine around in my hoodie pouch. And it's nice and dark in there too.

Edit idea : or just sow half of a hoodie pouch shut.

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Originally Posted by Alexio

Im just pondering other avenues, and piggybacking onto the above question about providing heat, you could always sow a pouch of sorts into a shirt/jacket/sweater. The pouch could be largish and have a safe way of "sealing" it.

I sometimes carry mine around in my hoodie pouch. And it's nice and dark in there too.

Edit idea : or just sow half of a hoodie pouch shut.

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Just have a seal-able pouch that can be hung around the neck, like those kid-carriers that look like a backpack worn on the chest - something like that. Easy access, secure, it's up where nothing's likely to bump into it and possibly hurt the snake... setting it up to be climate controlled to keep the snake from getting too hot or too cold would be more difficult. But the pouch itself could have a 'working animal' sign. I've carried mine around in shipping bags tucked inside the chest of my coat before, between my shirt and coat, to let my body heat regulate the temperature and make sure they didn't get too cold while transporting them or after picking one up from FedEx to bring it home.

That said, I also took one of my snakes into town the other day to let the daughter of a co-worker play with him. She goes in for brain surgery at the end of the month, and was really wanting to pet a snake, since she never had. She fell in love - Zyali's an amazingly mellow guy. After that, I realized that I needed to go shopping, and didn't have anything to put him in that wouldn't be too hot - it was a hot day. I live a half hour outside of town, so running home to drop him off was inconvenient, but I certainly wasn't going to leave him to bake in the car. I got permission to take him into the store, once the staff saw how mellow he was, but had mixed reactions - adults that looked horrified and hurried away, at first. Then when I went to leave, I got swarmed by kids dragging reluctant parents along to give their permission for them to touch the 'snakey'. People tend to understand dogs as service animals, and look for the sign saying they are, but snakes are more of a curiosity - there always seem to be people that want to touch. In that situation, I was perfectly happy to have Zyali play snake ambassador, and by the time I left, the parents were curious instead of disapproving and the kids were all giggling about how soft and smooth his scales are. Having the snake in a pouch, where it isn't immediately visible, might be better than having it out in public view in the case of a service animal. Not to mention make it much easier to get things done without being swarmed!

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Originally Posted by m1lkhoney

I have a friendly ball python that I purchased as a future emotional support animal. Basically he can go out in public with me if I have the appropriate paperwork (let's not get into that). I don't want the leash to take my snake for a walk (slither?), but to lend some legitimacy to his career as a service animal. That, and it would probably comfort people to have the "scary snake" look "under control", even though I'm carrying him

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I think you have some bad information about service animals.

I'm afraid your snake cannot be granted public access or classified as a service animal. Also there isn't any paperwork for service animals for public access. No registry. No licensing. There usually has to be written documentation for housing though. A note on your doctor's letterhead will suffice. ESA animals are protected when it comes to housing, but only bona-fide service animals are allowed public access.

https://www.ada.gov/service_animals_2010.htm

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Service animals are defined as dogs that are individually trained to do work or perform tasks for people with disabilities. Examples of such work or tasks include guiding people who are blind, alerting people who are deaf, pulling a wheelchair, alerting and protecting a person who is having a seizure, reminding a person with mental illness to take prescribed medications, calming a person with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD) during an anxiety attack, or performing other duties. Service animals are working animals, not pets. The work or task a dog has been trained to provide must be directly related to the person’s disability. Dogs whose sole function is to provide comfort or emotional support do not qualify as service animals under the ADA.

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I am very happy you get comfort from your snake as an ESA. But please, please, please do not try to pass your snake off as a service animal or demand entrance to pet free public places with it.

My youngest dog is showing promise as a medical alert dog for a condition I have, and a very dear friend of mine has a guide dog. It is very hard to be part of a working service animal team. Illegitimate "service animals" lead to a lot of legit teams getting harrassed.

Besides being carried all the time really isn't good for your snake. They aren't exactly creatures that like to be out and about :)

I fully support you bringing your snake out in public. I wouldn't even worry about the support part. Just look at your local statures. I take my ball wrapped around my neck out often. Just stay clear or food establishments and you're usually good. Be respectful. If a store ask you to leave or not return with the animal. Obey. Don't be a [jerk] about it. I've never had an issue otherwise. Also, remember not everyone likes snakes but some are terrified. Respect their fears.

My biggest concern with this Leash thing is the idea of the snake on the ground. One jess exposed to stuff I wouldn't want him to be. But even a fully grown ball isn't that big. I'd be scared that he'd get stepped on. Whether by accident or not. I'd opt to never put my animals in that potential danger and just settle on letting them stay around your neck. My .02

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To piggy back on what Snake Judy said about heat, have you considered that you will be creating a stressful environment for your snake? Regardless of what people think snakes tolerate us, they don't enjoy us, they don't love us. The reason the animal is "chill" is because its a BP. Second "emotional support" animals are being cracked down on and are not true Service Animals. It drives me absolutely insane when I see people with little toy dogs in stores, because they are an "emotional support" animal with zero training. Service Animals require extensive training and testing, even if they are truly to help with an emotional problem.

I'm sorry, I cannot stop myself. Obviously everyone on here likes snakes, but a snake as some kind of service animal? Please. This smells like nothing more than abuse of the system. And just like another topic that is on the political agenda right now, please keep in mind that not everyone shares your views. Snake lovers are a minority. My neighbors don't even know I have snakes. I do not take them outside. Whether we like it or not there are a lot of misinformed people that are scared to death of snakes. Some with outright phobias. I wouldn't in a million years walk into a store where I live carrying a snake. I am likely to give some old lady a heart attack. I do my best to respect other people and generally I get respect back. Carrying a snake around in public is nothing more than a grab for attention.

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

I'm sorry, I cannot stop myself. Obviously everyone on here likes snakes, but a snake as some kind of service animal? Please. This smells like nothing more than abuse of the system. And just like another topic that is on the political agenda right now, please keep in mind that not everyone shares your views. Snake lovers are a minority. My neighbors don't even know I have snakes. I do not take them outside. Whether we like it or not there are a lot of misinformed people that are scared to death of snakes. Some with outright phobias. I wouldn't in a million years walk into a store where I live carrying a snake. I am likely to give some old lady a heart attack. I do my best to respect other people and generally I get respect back. Carrying a snake around in public is nothing more than a grab for attention.

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+1


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Ouch. That was not my intention AT ALL.

- - - Updated - - -

Well, this conversation seems to be heading in an unpleasant direction so I will just thank you all for the advice, and I will take it into consideration. I appreciate it.

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

I'm sorry, I cannot stop myself. Obviously everyone on here likes snakes, but a snake as some kind of service animal? Please. This smells like nothing more than abuse of the system. And just like another topic that is on the political agenda right now, please keep in mind that not everyone shares your views. Snake lovers are a minority. My neighbors don't even know I have snakes. I do not take them outside. Whether we like it or not there are a lot of misinformed people that are scared to death of snakes. Some with outright phobias. I wouldn't in a million years walk into a store where I live carrying a snake. I am likely to give some old lady a heart attack. I do my best to respect other people and generally I get respect back. Carrying a snake around in public is nothing more than a grab for attention.

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Agree

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Okay, I understand! I'm sort of crying so you guys can stop now. I won't do it.

I should specify i dont agree with the grab for attention part. I agree with the part about phobias. about 1/10th of my friends like my snakes enough to even try to hold them (and my main snake i would give them was the breeder and resident snake at a local petstore and has never bitten anyone). I think it can be a fine thing to do to carry it outside, and even at a park that isnt too crowded (some people bring burms and boa constrictors to the park around me). I agree that taking it into a store is a lot more trouble than it is worth and i dont think the snake would enjoy that at all. The abuse of the support animal im on the fence about. I think if people got a support animal it should be a service animal sans extremely special cases because i have seen people in stores that have loud animals that let people play with them and that arent behaved at all. I realize that your snake is mellow and such but you cant truly tame reptiles and you can only train them on some things i would not consider them trainable animals. even the most docile snakes can strike out if the conditions are right.

Also, correct me if im wrong, people can deny entry to you and an emotional support animal anywhere except housing and flights right? I thought you still couldnt take them ANYWHERE because they arent a service animal.

Not intending to hurt your feelings or upset you. We all have an opinion and some more pleasant than others. So let me say this....it is your snake ! Love it , feed it, play with it, enjoy it ! As long as you make a decision that doesn't bring a negative outcome upon the snake or yourself then I say do what you want to do ! I have to be honest and say that I don't like to grab for attention but I have thought about occasionally walking around the block as I usually do but only I'd like to carry ziggy's with me. Will people stop and stare or want to come check him out??? Possibly....will others be outright petrified or have something negative to say ??? Absolutely. Ultimately the decision is yours to make. Hope you can find a way to make it work with a leash just maybe try to carry him around without playing the "companion" or "service" animal card is what everyone is saying. Hope this helps as I would never want anyone here or anywhere else to feel bad or offended on my account ! Cheers [emoji1303][emoji216]


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Instead of taking something negative away from this conversation, take something positive. You have gotten an honest view from a bunch of people. This information is valuable. The things people have said here are some of the possibilities of what would be going through people's mind when they see you. This should be a positive from your viewpoint. Free advice. Some people on here are short, to the point and blunt. There is no one here that is mean that I am aware of. The mean ones get booted off here pretty quick. Everyone is going to tell you the truth as they see it. Take it for what its worth. At the end of the day you evaluate the data and make your own decisions.

Thank you; I'm sorry if I overreacted. The emotional support part was suggested by a therapist; I have a pretty annoyingly severe mental illness and I have a hard time telling the difference between neutrality and negativity sometimes. I apologize if I took your comments the wrong way. :)

I suppose I just trusted my therapist and figured if she said I would benefit from an ESA, and my emotional support is my snake... well, you can see where it went from there. But I see now that it might not be the best idea. I just have a hard time going outside alone sometimes. Maybe a few times I can take him to a park if it's warm and there aren't many people around. It would be nice if I could go to a park and not be scared. :)

Thank you for clarifying.

This is possible:

http://m.imgur.com/7hMsbW1

There's nothing wrong with your snake being your ESA, there's nothing wrong with it at all. You simply have to be prepared for the fact that not everyone else feels the same way about your snake as you do, in fact you're probably more likely to come across people who are fearful or phobic.

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Thank you so much. :) And I am now in tears of laughter over the therapy turkey. Amazing.

While I think it's awesome that you enjoy your snake and can find emotional support in it, I just do not think taking it everywhere with you will be good for the snake. While you may love your ball python, your ball python tolerates you. And I don't mean to sound disheartening. This may just stress the snake out and may not meet it's needs. Constant warmth (knowing how Portland is..), hiding place, humidity, and dealing with societies perception of snakes. These aren't hardy animals (nor are they domesticated) to pack around for your benefit. I would look into other ways to deal with your differences or find another animal that can be trained and doesn't have specific, down to the dot needs. Best of wishes and good luck. :)

It makes me sad that he just tolerates me. :( But then again, so does my parents' cat. Barely. Jerk.

I know he'll never love me (lol) but I wish he would like me a little. Although I guess it's not like I can ask his opinion either way and, unlike the cat, he does not actively try to kill me. Thoughtful of him.

And thank you!

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Originally Posted by m1lkhoney

It makes me sad that he just tolerates me. :( But then again, so does my parents' cat. Barely. Jerk.

I know he'll never love me (lol) but I wish he would like me a little. Although I guess it's not like I can ask his opinion either way and, unlike the cat, he does not actively try to kill me. Thoughtful of him.

And thank you!

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"Experts aren’t exactly sure if reptiles have the ability to bond with humans or not. Dr. Denish believes reptiles show emotion—but in a limited form. 'Most of their life is about basic necessities like drinking, eating, breeding, and surviving,' he says.
Snakes have been known to show excitement and curiosity, too. 'At the zoo,' says Dr. Denish, “we see snakes that are interested in new forms of enrichment like bedding, housing, or a new scent.'
Actual love for a human, though? That, says Dr. Denish, is difficult to prove.

But as long as you feel a connection with your pet, that’s all that matters. The more time you spend nurturing your pet, the better it’ll be for both of you. You’ll be more comfortable around one another, leading to a greater chance that a “bond” will form—whatever that bond may be."

Source: Can Your Reptile Bond with You?

One of the benefits of a dog as an aid animal is that they tend to be very emotionally oriented and emotionally sensitive. Snakes, while beautiful, really aren't - at least, not that I've seen evidence of.

That said, they can become used to a specific person, I think. I had one of my snakes at a local college to show the bio class, at the professor's request. After watching several individuals handle it, the professor remarked that he did not think it was possible for a snake previously - but after watching the snake's body language and orientation, he could not question that it not only knew where I was at all times, but would consistently travel in my direction, even though I was moving around the room talking to people. I was never more than five feet from the snake. I can't really say that it wasn't just a fluke, but it is normal for an animal in an unfamiliar environment to seek out what it regards as familiar.


In regards to the remark about anyone taking their pet out in public just seeking attention - fortunately, not everyone shares that opinion, or no one would ever have the opportunity of learning how wrong their misconceptions are by having the chance to meet a pet snake in person.

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Originally Posted by m1lkhoney

Thank you; I'm sorry if I overreacted. The emotional support part was suggested by a therapist; I have a pretty annoyingly severe mental illness and I have a hard time telling the difference between neutrality and negativity sometimes. I apologize if I took your comments the wrong way. :)

I suppose I just trusted my therapist and figured if she said I would benefit from an ESA, and my emotional support is my snake... well, you can see where it went from there. But I see now that it might not be the best idea. I just have a hard time going outside alone sometimes. Maybe a few times I can take him to a park if it's warm and there aren't many people around. It would be nice if I could go to a park and not be scared. :)

Thank you for clarifying.

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Your snake absolutely can be your emotional support animal.

But there is a big difference between ESAs and Service animals.

Service dogs are dogs that have been specifically trained for specific tasks to help with a disability. I have severe diabilitating migraines. My dog can sense when they are about to hit well before my first warning symptoms. He gets my attention and alerts me to it. He can turn off lights and fetch both medication and bottled water from the fridge for me. He's still in training but those are all specifically trained tasks, tasks that he does for me when I physically cannot. At this time only dogs and mini horses can legally be considered service animals. Service animals must be granted access anywhere the public can be, except for very special circumstances. They are to be viewed much the way you would view a cane, crutches or a wheelchair. There are no laws requiring service dogs to be identified in any way. Business owners are only allowed to ask two questions to determine if an animal is a service animal "is that a service dog?" And "what task has it been trained to complete" even though my dog will legally meet the requirements as a service dog I really won't be doing much if any public access work as his specific tasks are more suited for home.

ESAs on the other hand are pets that provide a therapeutic benefit for a disabled person. Relieving stress, enabling more social interaction, providing motivation, etc. Any animal can be an ESA as long as it meets the above. There are laws that protect a person's right to have ESAs in regards to housing but they are not granted public access. ESAs generally need

I would get 3 copies of a letter from your therapist on their letterhead explaining their recommendation that you have an Emotional Support Snake. One for travel. One for housing. And one for your new Dr. If you have to change for some reason.

That said, depending on the specifics of you invisible disability, there are many tasks a bona-fide service animal can be trained to perform if you need more assistance in out of home excursions. The dog will perform tasks and be an ESA at the same time.

I saw a guy at the park with 2 redtail boas and 2 carpet pythons :D. People are generally allowed to bring their pets into certain public spaces, this applies to snakes too. They don't need to have any special status for that. But you have to understand that a lot of people don't like snakes so you might have to put up with negative comments or people freaking out. Plus, they tend to attract a lot of attention (the guy I saw was wearing a local herp club t-shirt and was using it as an opportunity to educate), so if you have social anxiety it might be counterproductive to draw all that attention to yourself. But if pets are allowed in your park, go for it!

An ESA just means that your doctor thinks it's good for your mental health to have a pet to care for. So that's why they're allowed in no-pets housing.

Thank you all so much for the enlightenment! I have lots to think about now. Perhaps, and maybe this is a bonkers idea, but just perhaps I could try bringing my snake (his name is Henry) to my therapy sessions instead. I have a difficult time with it, Henry is comforting, her office is warm, the sessions aren't too long, the commute is short and she's not afraid of snakes. He could just sit on my lap. That might work! Then I get the benefit of an ESA without freaking people out. I will ask her about it.

Thanks again! :)

P.S. This is my beautiful baby. Apologies for the faceless photo; I caught him mid lap-slither. <3

https://scontent.fsnc1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...0f&oe=580C0B06

In the state of Florida, reptiles are by name forbidden to be ESA's.

And since ball pythons aren't exactly the most outgoing of creatures, who will be supplying emotional support to it while it's being trotted around town?

I do not trot, Slim. I frolic.

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Originally Posted by Willowy

I saw a guy at the park with 2 redtail boas and 2 carpet pythons :D. People are generally allowed to bring their pets into certain public spaces, this applies to snakes too. They don't need to have any special status for that. But you have to understand that a lot of people don't like snakes so you might have to put up with negative comments or people freaking out. Plus, they tend to attract a lot of attention (the guy I saw was wearing a local herp club t-shirt and was using it as an opportunity to educate), so if you have social anxiety it might be counterproductive to draw all that attention to yourself. But if pets are allowed in your park, go for it!

An ESA just means that your doctor thinks it's good for your mental health to have a pet to care for. So that's why they're allowed in no-pets housing.

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Yeah public spaces. I'm pretty sure it's 100% legal for stores and restaurants to kick them out

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Going inpatient at the hospital for a few days starting tomorrow. Pretty sure they won't let us share a room. :p

However, and I do not mean to draw attention to myself at all. Many others have it much, much worse, and I am very lucky considering my condition, which is mostly just annoying. But that's how bad it gets sometimes. I should perhaps look into a more suitable ESA, yeah?

Although if ANYTHING ever happens to Henry... :(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(

Can we go back to brainstorming that snake leash idea? I would totally get one, my danger noodle likes to slither away way too quickly.;)

The leash idea sounds really good however the only real problem I find with it is how would you keep the BP or any other snake from slithering right on out of it ? Can't have it too tight or too loose and I can't see how there could be a "perfect" fit.....I'm very new to this but just pondering some logic and theory here


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It depends on what you need from an ESA. Do you need an animal that is affectionate and loving? Or something really zen? What do your local laws say?

Personally I say you can't go wrong with a good dog for an ESA. I'd find a solid animal from good lines that have the chops for service dog work as you seemed keen on having a public access animal. You may or may not need a service animal but a lot of the service dog tasks can be trained into any dog that you may find very helpful like medication reminders, deep pressure therapy and the like.

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Originally Posted by m1lkhoney

I do not trot, Slim. I frolic.

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My bad, Boo...

:pinkele:

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Originally Posted by BlackOut

The leash idea sounds really good however the only real problem I find with it is how would you keep the BP or any other snake from slithering right on out of it ? Can't have it too tight or too loose and I can't see how there could be a "perfect" fit.....I'm very new to this but just pondering some logic and theory here


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Same here lol