Setting up a GLASS tank - question about lights and lids

Heya!
I'll be a first time danger noodle uncle (I hate the 'd' or 'f' word) and I just have a question;

I'll be using a glass tank. I've read the tub vs tank extensively, but I still prefer a tank to a tub ( I mean, I do have a clear tub, but it's full of fabric for costuming right now...).
I've read that BP's, due to being nocturnal and living in mounts, don't *need* lights, but still need a day/night cycle. I will be constructing a custom fit plexi-glass top for this tank.

Now, since they don't need any bright light lamp, but I will need one to probably heat the air in the tank (UTH don't change ambient temperature?), what kind of bulb would be best to use? Red, black, moonlight, ceramic? Should this lamp heat be on a 12-hour timer to simulate the night drops in the wild? There is a lamp-dome at PetSmart that has a built in dimmer I'll probably get for this, too.



Ah, as for the tank top, I drew you a diagram!

The lid I have planned fits snugly around the top of the tank and hangs down maybe 3 inches to give a good lip. The long sides will have hinges and velcro, and the short sides will be attached to the top piece and thus unmovable. (I mean, I can always switch it, too) My idea was, since I've read that BPs are escape artists, the velcro would help hold it down, and the hinges would make it easier to lift off of the tank thank shimmy it off if it were a bit tight.

If a loose-fitting plexi top would be heavy enough to thwart efforts, please tell me so I don't waste too much hardware, haha!

The other question would be is the holes in the middle enough to let the heat from the lamp in? Should there be another small area in the corner for air flow, rather than a central vent? Would bigger holes + screen over them be better than a lot of smaller holes (except for the air flow area)?

Thank you for reading :3

https://i.gyazo.com/f6a3c494ecb37cc6...d01c0bee49.png

Looks like you've done your homework. As for ambiant temps most people would suggest a radiant heating unit on a thermostat, as lights tend to make keeping humidity up an issue. If you go for a light my personal choice is a red light in a ceramic fixture. The red light isn't noticeable to the snake even at night so you can keep it on to make the ambient temp what you'd like. As far as the rest I'll let someone else answer as I'm still somewhat new at BPs. Congrats and welcome to the BP world

I have a lot of trouble keeping the humidity up in my glass tank, but I believe that's just because I went with a ceramic bulb. Also, BPs don't really need night time drops in temps to simulate the diurnal cycle, which is fine by me [emoji1305] (less work). I believe they just use the actual light of your room to tell what time of day or night it is.

If you're using the plexiglass just to prevent escaping I'm sure your danger noodle will be more secure with the Velcro than just a loose lid (those tricky bastards!), but also its going to be way easier to keep humidity.

As for the number and size of the holes, you got me there.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Be sure to post a pic of your snooter scooter when you get him/her! [emoji4]


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Unless you have trouble keeping cool side to 78-82 then I wouldn't use any kind of bulb that would give off heat. If you do have trouble then I would get a che and put it over the cool side hide and attach to a thermostat or at least a dimmer. Also make sure your uth is on a thermostat. I would use LEDs whether or not your cool side temps are good for light since they give off little heat. I would still use LED if they cool side temps are not good and use a che to keep the cool temp up. That way you don't have bulbs taking away your humidity.

Best choice IMO would be a PVC cage like a T8 with an rhp installed and led for light cycle on timer. Divider for the T8 and 40w rhp (80w without divider) from reptile basics on a thermostat if the snake is young. All I use is PVC, never used glass tanks and I'm glad I haven't with all the trouble I hear with humidity from others. Plus PVC just looks nicer.

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I have a glass tank with mesh top and I avoid aspen as that is no good for humidity in my opinion, unless you really wet it often or spray the tank numerous times and that presents many problems.

Don't forget the thermostats to regulate the heat lamp and the UTH.

With a plexiglass top you may be better off with two UTH's, set the one on the warm side for belly heat of 90-92*F, and the one on the cool side for 78-80*F. Put a hide over each to help trap the heat underneath. In the long run it will be cheaper since bulbs tend not to last long.

By the way, the reason CHE's and heat bulbs tend to be bad for humidity is not the lamps themselves; it is because they go over wide open screen area that lets all the warm air rise out and take the moisture with it. I don't know about using one over top of plexiglass, but you'd want to make sure that it didn't make the plexiglass surface too hot. I agree that radiant heat panels are much easier, even if they're more expensive initially.

By the way, you can also use a UTH stuck to the side of the glass instead of the bottom. That will let it heat the air more, instead of just the substrate. It is also much less likely to get hot enough to burn if it is not covered by substrate because the substrate acts as insulation, trapping heat. It still needs to be on a thermostat or at the very least a dimmer, just to be sure. But that will do more for the ambient temperature.

The number and size of ventilation holes depends on how your humidity is once you get everything set up. If it's very dry in your house, you might need to cover some of them to retain humidity; if it's very humid, you might need more ventilation. You'll just have to find out once you set everything up.

Also, keep in mind that you might need to reasses your heating/ventilation situation in six or eight months depending on how the conditions in your house vary between summer and winter. Right now my living room is pretty close to perfect BP conditions by itself, LOL; but back in February not so much.

Wow! Look at all these replies <3 Thank guys!

@Usa: Thanks! I've been reading a lot since my friend got a BP just about two weeks ago. There was a second at the store that got returned because the owners charred his mouth with a skillet-cooked rat. He's in isolation until he's better, and I want to adopt him and give him a better start.
What is the benefit of the red bulbs to the black or moonlight?

@Wicked: No night drops, got it! And velcro seems better?Nice. I already had a 6ft roll on hand so I thought it'd help.

@Chrid: CHE is Ceramic Heat Emitter, yes? I don't know how the temps are gonna be, yet. I've yet to set it up. I'm hoping that my own cold-bloodedness will help keep my room at the right temp for the tank, also. Do CHE's draw up moisture less than bulbs do? Also, you've lost me on the LED thing...

Yikes! The second half of your message went way over my head. I'm just starting out, and I had a large glass tank in the basement for like. 30+ years so I thought I'd get some use out of it. Maybe in the future I'll upgrade, though :3

@dan: My friend has a very large bag of aspen but she found out she's allergic to it. She wanted to give it to me, but I had read that mulch is better for humidity.

@bcr: Oh yes! I have a thermostat on the way I got online~ Though if you suggest using two UTH, I'll need another one, yes?

@Coluber: What is a RHP? And, a UTH on the side will heat the ambient air better than a lamp - which will draw up all the moisture? Ok, that seems fair!



Alright, so.
2 UTH, one on bottom, one on side, should hopefully heat the ambiance enough that I don't need a lamp.
Holes in plexiglass depends on the humidity in tank.
Aspen sucks for humidity
If I do need a lamp, red light is best?
Velco is a good idea to keep noodle from escaping.
*PVC is better, but I'll upgrade later when I learn more.

A RHP is a radiant heat pannel. I've just set up 3 4ftx1ft vivs with RHPs and there really good to be honest.
I started out with a glass viv and wouldn't recommend it but anyway. . I would use 2 under tank heaters underneath the tank on opposite sides with 2 different thermostats to have a hot and cold hide like suggested above. . Putting one on the side does warm up the ambient a little but but no where near what a bulb or che does.
Use thin substrate to avoid burning your snake and I used bark chips for humidity. They worked best for me out of the ones I tried. Aspen was the worst for humidity for me.
Avoid a CHE if possible as I found them to be the worst for drying out the air.

As long as you have a hot and a cold side at the right temp then the ambient really does not matter in my opinion. As long as your snake has somewhere to warm up and cool down.

Unless your room is very cold then the ambient might need to have some help lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Moosefriend

@Usa: Thanks! I've been reading a lot since my friend got a BP just about two weeks ago. There was a second at the store that got returned because the owners charred his mouth with a skillet-cooked rat. He's in isolation until he's better, and I want to adopt him and give him a better start.

@Coluber: What is a RHP? And, a UTH on the side will heat the ambient air better than a lamp - which will draw up all the moisture? Ok, that seems fair!

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Holy crap, someone actually fed their snake prey hot enough to burn its bleeping mouth?!? Good thing that person doesn't have the snake anymore!

Re. Lamps: It's not really the lamp that draws up the moisture; it's the wide open area of screen the lamp needs to shine through. Normally, if the humidity in a tank with a screen top is too low, you just cover up more and more of the screen until it isn't. That may well mean covering the entire screen and just leaving a couple of small holes for ventilation. If you have a lamp sitting on top of the screen, you can't cover it all up because you have to leave it open where the lamp is. Heat is heat; but if your heat source requires you to leave a big hole for the moisture to escape through, it will dry out your enclosure. Radiant heat panels are mounted on the inside and don't get hot enough to burn; a UTH is on the outside, but it works by heating the glass, and glass is airtight. So it can be independent of how much ventilation you have.

As long as you can control how much ventilation there is (i.e, cover some holes if the humidity is too low), aspen can be just fine for humidity. Lots of people also use paper towels, newsprint, etc, and those things hold less moisture than anything. There are plenty of good substrates, and as long as you don't have an uncovered open screen top, humidity shouldn't *have* to be the reason for using or not using any of them.

Yeah; they took a frozen rat and tried to "heat it up faster" in the skillet... the snake bit into it and immediately refused. They brought him back to the store and said he "wasn't eating" when they found the burn marks in his mouth that got infected and... needless to say they're not allowed in the store anymore... I check up on him every once in a while to see how he's healing, cos I wanna give him a better, less burny, home...

But uh...
Is a RHP something I can get at the petstore? Would one of them heating wires work the same way?

An RHP direct the heat down so there pretty efficient at heating. Heat cable doesn't and it also gets very hot in some places. I have heat cable in an incubator and if I plug it in with no thermostat it gets above 100°C
As for buying one. In the UK you have to get them online. Not sure about other countries tho.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scottywelsh

An RHP direct the heat down so there pretty efficient at heating. Heat cable doesn't and it also gets very hot in some places. I have heat cable in an incubator and if I plug it in with no thermostat it gets above 100°C
As for buying one. In the UK you have to get them online. Not sure about other countries tho.

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Above 100°C?!?!?!?! That's INSANE.

There's a 45$ 25w heat cable 70% off at the store (they're going out of business).

@scotty: i'm in Canada, but I'll look around!

50W Zoo med repti heat cable is what mine is if I remember rightly.
When it's stretched out the single strand gets about 60°C but when coiled together it's absolutely insane !! Needless to say a thermostat is needed lol
But if I'm not mistaken when a heat Mat malfunctions it turns all the way on and burns your snake but when heat cable doesn't it just turns off. . Don't quote me on that tho !

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scottywelsh

But if I'm not mistaken when a heat Mat malfunctions it turns all the way on and burns your snake but when heat cable doesn't it just turns off. . Don't quote me on that tho !

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It's not the matt that malfunctions, it's the thermostat controlling it. Some run wide-open when they fail, others shut off.

VE's are notorious for running wide-open when they fail. A dimmer switch between the t-stat and the appliance set so that the appliance maxes out in the upper 90's if there is no t-stat in the circuit will help ensure that while your snake may be uncomfortably warm for a while, it doesn't get badly burned.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bcr229

It's not the matt that malfunctions, it's the thermostat controlling it. Some run wide-open when they fail, others shut .

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Sorry I should have said when not connected to a thermostat. Everyone knows that they shouldn't be run without one but if they are that's what I have heard is the case when they malfunction.
I know first hand that when a microclimate on/off thermostat malfunctions it turns on full !! I was lucky to catch it relatively quick before anything bad happened.

Hey, I kept my BP in a 46gal bow front tank until I built an enclosure. I had to have it self sufficient as I work a 48 hr shift that can go to 72hrs. I learned the hard way about humidity and heat the hard way before I found this forum.

You will have some trial and error as the climate in your home is different than mine but here is a video I made about being able to control heat and humidity using a glass tank.
https://youtu.be/f4zpIxNDGPs

I also have a few more about building the lids for the 46 gal and lids for a 120gal tank. In the long run, if you can get something to fit your needs that you can install a rhp in, they are the way to go.

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