underbelly peeling/flaking? please help!

i have a 21 inch long lesser bee ball python that i got 2 weeks ago and i dont know how this happened but his underbelly started flaking around a week ago and it has been getting progressively worse, the tips underneath the shiny part of his underbelly look a little torn as well. he has been getting these little orangish brown stripes along his belly but that could be the substrate rubbing off? he doesnt seem to be in any pain as far as i can tell, i keep his humidity in check at 55-60% and his heat is the issue, the UTH i have goes all the way up to 111 today so i immediately unplugged that and turned on his heat lamp and am now soaking him in a tiny container to get rid the already flaky scales, if this is any concern the scales along his back are a bit rough even when i pet him the way his scales are going, and the flaky underbelly scales are not coming off in one whole scale, underneath that the texture looks like some hangnails you get in the middle of your finger that end at your cuticle, if thats a good analogy :( i cant send pictures as i dont know how to on a laptop, any and all help will be appreciated!

Your UTH NEEDS a tstat. I suggest Herpstat. http://spyderrobotics.com/

As to the belly it could be a few things. Without seeing it we are only guessing.

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Originally Posted by KMG

Your UTH NEEDS a thermostat.

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This. I'm guessing the snake has been badly burned by now.

ETA: You need to remove all of his substrate and put him on paper towels so the burned area stays clean and doesn't get infected. You can soak him in diluted betadine once or twice a day - his bath should look like a weak tea - and apply Neosporin WITHOUT PAINKILLER to the area until you can get him to a vet for treatment.

he does not have any blisters whatsoever, there is no redness or anything to signify a burn of any sort, it is just his scales without the shiny part, there has been no bleeding, no blood on the substrate or on him and the soft-ish part underneath looks wrinkly now that i look more closely, does the underbelly shed a seperate layer off before the full shed? my friend has told me hes probably just shedding or it could be a rash. i use repti-bark as the substrate.

You better get a Thermostat for your under tank heater ASAP. An uncontrolled UTH will kill your snake, I'd be surprised if he makes it... I use a Jump Start thermostat from Amazon.com, they are about $25 and work great, should be set to 88F. If you use a heat lamp be sure to use a laser temp gun to check your snakes temp, shouldn't go above 95F max, even that hot can make your males sterile, stick with 88F max. You are frying your snake.

i think my snake will be good now, i have one question, this controller comes with a probe, do i need that in order for the temperature to stay where its set to? or is that just a little addition?

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Originally Posted by Deathangel2054

i think my snake will be good now, i have one question, this controller comes with a probe, do i need that in order for the temperature to stay where its set to? or is that just a little addition?

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So your snake just fixed itself? A burn doesn't have to bleed or ooze anything.....especially in the beginning.

If it is a shed, NO, the belly does not come off first. A properly maintained snake will shed in one nice piece. If it is a shed your husbandry is off and you have a stuck shed in the works.

As to your question above Im not real sure what you have. For us to help you we need you to help us and give more information. If you have a thermostat the probe needs to be between the uth and the floor of the cage. ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE CAGE.

You can put the probe on the outside of the tank between the under tank heater and the bottom, just tape it to the bottom of the tank. I also put the probe in the tank taped to the bottom but it can get wet, not good. And if you switch to a rodent tank they will chew the probe, happened to me before I caught it. Once the probe gets to the set temp it turns off the heater until it cools to a certain temp. If the probe is not in the hot spot it won't get to temp and your heater will run on high.

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Originally Posted by cchardwick

You can put the probe on the outside of the tank between the under tank heater and the bottom, just tape it to the bottom of the tank. I also put the probe in the tank taped to the bottom but it can get wet, not good. And if you switch to a rodent tank they will chew the probe, happened to me before I caught it. Once the probe gets to the set temp it turns off the heater until it cools to a certain temp. If the probe is not in the hot spot it won't get to temp and your heater will run on high.

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Tape in your snake cage is a BIG NO GO. Google it. Not pretty.

You can put the probe on the outside of the tank between the under tank heater and the bottom, just tape it to the bottom of the tank. I also put the probe in the tank taped to the bottom but it can get wet, not good. And if you switch to a rodent tank they will chew the probe, happened to me before I caught it. Once the probe gets to the set temp it turns off the heater until it cools to a certain temp. If the probe is not in the hot spot it won't get to temp and your heater will run on high.





so what i did was i taped the probe to the bottom of the UTH, is that bad or is that what i should do?

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Originally Posted by Deathangel2054

You can put the probe on the outside of the tank between the under tank heater and the bottom, just tape it to the bottom of the tank. I also put the probe in the tank taped to the bottom but it can get wet, not good. And if you switch to a rodent tank they will chew the probe, happened to me before I caught it. Once the probe gets to the set temp it turns off the heater until it cools to a certain temp. If the probe is not in the hot spot it won't get to temp and your heater will run on high.





so what i did was i taped the probe to the bottom of the UTH, is that bad or is that what i should do?

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That will work.

Know that just because you set the tstat to a certain temp does not necessarily mean that is the number the hotspot in the cage will be. It can be higher or lower depending on a few factors. You need to test the hotspot and dial the tstat in so you get just the temp you want at the hotspot.

The substrate over the uth needs to be very thin, 1/4 inch at most.

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Originally Posted by Deathangel2054

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so what i did was i taped the probe to the bottom of the UTH, is that bad or is that what i should do?

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Now are you talking about a thermostat probe or a thermometer probe? What kind of heat mat are you using? The uth doesnt heat the bottom much. It heats whatever it is stuck to so a thermostat probe does not go on the bottom of the uth. If your using a uth that sticks to your tank peal back the uth just enough to put the probe in the middle of the uth and then press the uth back into place. You need a temp gun or a thermometer with probe to check your temps. Make sure you get around 88-90 inside the tank, in order to achieve these temps you will have to set your thermostat a little higher then 90. I can't give you an exact number to set it to bc it varies by setup.

This is the way I would set it up: tape probe to bottom of tank in the middle of the biggest part of your UTH. Then tape on your UTH. I even tape on the sticky ones so I can remove it without ruining it. I use packing tape around the edges only. Then I put a thin layer of bubble wrap followed by cardboard, both to the size of the entire bottom. The bubble wrap and cardboard keep in the heat and reduce thermal cycles.

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Originally Posted by chrid16371

Now are you talking about a thermostat probe or a thermometer probe? What kind of heat mat are you using? The uth doesnt heat the bottom much. It heats whatever it is stuck to so a thermostat probe does not go on the bottom of the uth. If your using a uth that sticks to your tank peal back the uth just enough to put the probe in the middle of the uth and then press the uth back into place. You need a temp gun or a thermometer with probe to check your temps. Make sure you get around 88-90 inside the tank, in order to achieve these temps you will have to set your thermostat a little higher then 90. I can't give you an exact number to set it to bc it varies by setup.

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A heat mat is nothing more than two thin pieces of plastic put together with some sort of heating element in the middle.

If the OP has a tstat placing the probe on the bottom can and will work just fine. It has been done many times and sometimes we even suggest it over placing the probe in the middle if the probe is large. We do this to keep the uth in contact with the cage floor and not create a cool spot in the middle from lack of contact.

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Originally Posted by cchardwick

This is the way I would set it up: tape probe to bottom of tank in the middle of the biggest part of your UTH. Then tape on your UTH. I even tape on the sticky ones so I can remove it without ruining it. I use packing tape around the edges only. Then I put a thin layer of bubble wrap followed by cardboard, both to the size of the entire bottom. The bubble wrap and cardboard keep in the heat and reduce thermal cycles.

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OP, Taping the uth on instead of sticking it is a good tip. To add to that you can place foil on the sticky part of the uth.

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Originally Posted by KMG

A heat mat is nothing more than two thin pieces of plastic put together with some sort of heating element in the middle.

If the OP has a tstat placing the probe on the bottom can and will work just fine. It has been done many times and sometimes we even suggest it over placing the probe in the middle if the probe is large. We do this to keep the uth in contact with the cage floor and not create a cool spot in the middle from lack of contact.

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My intellitemp mats are about the same temp top and bottom and I just opened 3 unused zoo med spares and tested those and one was 12 degrees cooler on bottom another 17 degrees cooler on bottom and the last 13 degrees cooler on bottom. This was the reason I asked for the brand. I remember testing zilla, flukers, zoomed, Kane, intelltemp awhile back but couldn't find where I put my results so I decided to test a couple spares I had, unfortunately I don't have all the brands I had then. All these test I used 3 different temp guns to confirm Maybe this is the reason the thermostat let her hot spot get up to 111 degrees. Not only that but if you have a sensitive thermostat like a herpstat all it takes is a window open and cool air blowing over the exposed probe to raise the temps. This has happend a few times with my herpstat probe for the rhp when opening the cage or misting so I moved it and all is fine now. I have a dead zoomed uth I will be dissecting tomorrow to see if there is a reason the heat is more concentrated upwards instead of evenly both ways.

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Originally Posted by chrid16371

My intellitemp mats are about the same temp top and bottom and I just opened 3 unused zoo med spares and tested those and one was 12 degrees cooler on bottom another 17 degrees cooler on bottom and the last 13 degrees cooler on bottom. This was the reason I asked for the brand. I remember testing zilla, flukers, zoomed, Kane, intelltemp awhile back but couldn't find where I put my results so I decided to test a couple spares I had, unfortunately I don't have all the brands I had then. All these test I used 3 different temp guns to confirm Maybe this is the reason the thermostat let her hot spot get up to 111 degrees. Not only that but if you have a sensitive thermostat like a herpstat all it takes is a window open and cool air blowing over the exposed probe to raise the temps. This has happend a few times with my herpstat probe for the rhp when opening the cage or misting so I moved it and all is fine now. I have a dead zoomed uth I will be dissecting tomorrow to see if there is a reason the heat is more concentrated upwards instead of evenly both ways.

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Even if the temp is lower on the bottom than the top, the tstat will still control the uth. Just instead of having to set the tstat at a higher temp to account for the upper temp you would set it lower to account for the lower bottom temp. Still works the same.

As long as the hotspot is properly checked and the temp known it will not matter if the probe is on top or bottom. I personally like to have the probe on top but sometimes the bottom just works better.

I have no clue what the OP had setup or has done with the little information we have been given and expected to help. I feel as if there is more to this story than they care to reveal.

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Originally Posted by KMG

Even if the temp is lower on the bottom than the top, the tstat will still control the uth. Just instead of having to set the tstat at a higher temp to account for the upper temp you would set it lower to account for the lower bottom temp. Still works the same.

As long as the hotspot is properly checked and the temp known it will not matter if the probe is on top or bottom. I personally like to have the probe on top but sometimes the bottom just works better.

I have no clue what the OP had setup or has done with the little information we have been given and expected to help. I feel as if there is more to this story than they care to reveal.

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Very true. The thing is some people go solely off what the tstat says or what other people set it and don't check with temp guns or anythjng so it doesn't always come out with the same results bc everyone's environmental factors, substrate, etc are not the same. In one of the zoo meds I tested (let's say the one that was 17 degrees cooler on bottom) if you put the probe on the bottom and set it to 95, bc that's what someone told you they ran it at, the top of the uth thats setting directly on the tank would be running at 112 which would be way to high. Yes this could be solved by lowering the tstat but let's face it some people don't check there temps properly and like I said above go solely on what other people say just to save themselves the $12 to buy a probed thermometer. This is why I think its safer and why I give the advice to put the probe in between uth and enclosure that way if they go by what someone else told them it would be at a safer temp. I'm so ocd about my temps I use 8 acurite thermometers, 4 for each of my bp. Of course there not all in the same spot and do there job of telling me the temps inside and outside hides and under and on top substrate. I know its a little overboard but I still don't get why people can't pick up 1 while I'm sitting here with 8 and that's just for my bps.

But yes I do agree with you they can be used top or bottom when monitored correctly. I also agree there is more to the story then what is being shared. Hopefully the problems are addressed and the snake continues on to a healthy life.