How much intervention do these eggs need?

Day 10 of incubation. Humidity sitting at 86% and not budging. I put a tablespoon of water in the corner of each box a few days in when they started to dimple, but it didn't last. I left them alone until today and then I added some water to all four corners. Am I worrying too much?

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http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...s/image_45.jpg

It seems like you're going to have to aggressively get the humidity up and at the 100% mark like yesterday. I would grab some Press and seal for the top of the tub and cover any holes in the tub with tape and put a tight lid on the tub. I would do that right away and leave them alone for the next two weeks b4 even thinking about opening that tub again. Good luck. :colbert: For the future try and sit your eggs on a diffuser so they don't contact the incubation medium. Don't try and move the eggs at this point.

Looks like your way too dry.
I use perlite of an almost mud consistency but not dripping wet.
Never needed a light diffuser except when I tried substratless.

The humidity only went up to 88% after adding water last night. They're on Hatchrite, tub was sealed with press-n-seal and the two small holes in each tub were covered with duct tape already. Should I transfer the eggs onto light diffuser and drench the Hatchrite? Sphagnum moss? Cup of water in the corner? Paper towel over top? Any or all of those?

I'm leaning towards putting them on light diffuser and adding water directly to the medium and leaving them alone...

Never used hatchrite but have read a lot of complaints about it.

I couldn't find plain perlite or vermiculite so I went with Hatchrite. It seemed to dry out within days. Should I soak it then?

No, don't move the eggs at all! Absolutely don't try changing substrates now. Don't drain anything either. What is the thermostat temp set at and what is the internal tub temperature? Too late for big changes now. Double the press and seal sheeting. Raise the thermostat setting a couple of degrees but keep an eye on your internal tub temperatures. You don't want it ( internal) to go above 90f

Lowes carried the vermiculite. Its Miracle Grow brand but there is nothing added and I have not had a problem with it either.

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Originally Posted by Albert Clark

No, don't move the eggs at all! Absolutely don't try changing substrates now. Don't drain anything either. What is the thermostat temp set at and what is the internal tub temperature? Too late for big changes now. Double the press and seal sheeting. Raise the thermostat setting a couple of degrees but keep an eye on your internal tub temperatures. You don't want it ( internal) to go above 90f

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Thermostat is set to 99, temp in one egg box is 88, the other is 90. Two different digital thermometers, not sure which is most accurate.

I'm afraid to add more water directly to the Hatchrite since the eggs are directly on it. Would a small cup of water or a damp paper towel be better?

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

Lowes carried the vermiculite. Its Miracle Grow brand but there is nothing added and I have not had a problem with it either.

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Ok, I'll look for that for future reference!

So, ok. Don't raise the setting on the thermostat! Those temps are adequate, both of them. Don't add any more water at all for now. Double wrap the top of the tub with the press and seal. Double the tape over the tub holes and seal them well. What type of incubator do you have? Because if you can place a couple of plastic bottles of water inside the bator itself that would be a alternative. They don't have to be 16 oz. bottles they can be the small ones. Main thing is you want the humidity to rise to 99 or 100%

I'm using a reptibator. Don't think I could fit any water bottles in it. Are you sure I shouldn't add any water? I'm worried about those eggs drying out anymore.. :please:

Hoping someone with more experience can ether agree or correct me if I'm wrong but would getting the humidity up in the incubator help ? Maybe using a fogger or something ?
I would have thought Wet paper towels as long as there not touching the eggs should be fine ?
Also if the water seems to be going that quick then adding more than a tablespoon shouldn't hurt should it ?

I'm looking to get into breeding so would love to know

I just took thus quote off another site about sphagnum moss as incubator substrate ...
"It can be used as a sole incubation medium, but it is prone to drying out completely unless the incubator is completely airtight and then needs rehydrating. This is difficult to achieve without wetting the eggs.

Also it compacts under the weight of the eggs and becomes an airless pact mass.

But it has an acidic PH that is absolute death to fungus, better than any foot powder. Ive used it for rehydrating eggs kept on vermiculite/perlite mix substrate and have also put some loose clumps around eggs as a fungal retardent. It is good stuff."""

Yes, the reptibator has a well for added water in the bottom. I could add water to that so I don't have to open the egg tubs again?

Reptibator is a great machine. I use the same one. I don't know about hatch rite and I think you need very little water when using it , I could be wrong. You are supposed to dampen the sponge in the bator and water is supposed to be in the channels under the sponge. You certainly can fill the space in the bator with 100% cypress mulch. I am trying to keep you from moving the eggs too much.

Just looked at hatch rite and it's pre moistened so you are supposed to just pour it into the tub and you're supposed to be good? That can only be true if your egg tub is 100% sealed and you are reading 99% humidity on the hygrometer in the tub! Concentrate on sealing the egg tub for your best result. Don't ever use hatch rite again if you can avoid it.

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Originally Posted by Albert Clark

Reptibator is a great machine. I use the same one. I don't know about hatch rite and I think you need very little water when using it , I could be wrong. You are supposed to dampen the sponge in the bator and water is supposed to be in the channels under the sponge. You certainly can fill the space in the bator with 100% cypress mulch. I am trying to keep you from moving the eggs too much.

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Ok, I'll try adding water and mulch to the bator itself and I'll add an extra layer of press-n-deal to the egg boxes. I have sphagnum moss, could I use that instead of cypress mulch?

I very much appreciate your help. I'll make sure not to move the eggs.

Yep, Hatchrite has been more of a headache than anything!

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Originally Posted by Albert Clark

Just looked at hatch rite and it's pre moistened so you are supposed to just pour it into the tub and you're supposed to be good? That can only be true if your egg tub is 100% sealed and you are reading 99% humidity on the hygrometer in the tub! Concentrate on sealing the egg tub for your best result. Don't ever use hatch rite again if you can avoid it.

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Yes, the idea is that you're supposed to pour it in and be done with it. The tubs had condensation for the first few days and then it dried out.

How thick is the substrate?
You can add water as long as the eggs are not sitting in it.
Also make sure the water is about the same temperature of the substrate.

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

How thick is the substrate?
You can add water as long as the eggs are not sitting in it.
Also make sure the water is about the same temperature of the substrate.

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1 1/2 to 2 inches I'd say. I didn't consider the temperature of the water, thank you.

Just be careful of the amount of water you put into the hatch rite so as not to overly dampen the eggs from the bottom. I think once you are sealed tightly with the egg tub you will see the humidity rise and stabilize. Hope you can get it done safely. Good luck and keep us updated.

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Originally Posted by AerialArtist

The humidity only went up to 88% after adding water last night. They're on Hatchrite, tub was sealed with press-n-seal and the two small holes in each tub were covered with duct tape already. Should I transfer the eggs onto light diffuser and drench the Hatchrite? Sphagnum moss? Cup of water in the corner? Paper towel over top? Any or all of those?

I'm leaning towards putting them on light diffuser and adding water directly to the medium and leaving them alone...

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Hatchrite works well with gecko eggs but the water content does not appear to be enough when incubating snake eggs requiring temps in the high 80's.

It can still be used but water should be added to it.

What I would do is buy a light crate get that Hatchrite wet. This way it will be headache proof and you will not have to worry about your eggs being to wet since they will no longer be in contact with the substrate or too dry since the substrate will contain a lot more water.

Eggs can be moved they are very resilient, just make sure that you do not rotate them.

Water bottles are not necessary, and your eggs will be fine once you address the humidity issue in your tub.

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Originally Posted by Albert Clark

Just be careful of the amount of water you put into the hatch rite so as not to overly dampen the eggs from the bottom. I think once you are sealed tightly with the egg tub you will see the humidity rise and stabilize. Hope you can get it done safely. Good luck and keep us updated.

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I will avoid adding water directly to the egg box unless the other methods fail to bump the humidity. Thanks so much again, I'll definitely update.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Hatchrite works well with gecko eggs but the water content does not appear to be enough when incubating snake eggs requiring temps in the high 80's.

It can still be used but water should be added to it.

What I would do is buy a light crate get that Hatchrite wet. This way it will be headache proof and you will not have to worry about your eggs being to wet since they will no longer be in contact with the substrate or too dry since the substrate will contain a lot more water.

Eggs can be moved they are very resilient, just make sure that you do not rotate them.

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I have some light crate pre-cut ready to go if I end up going that route. I hope these little eggs are resilient enough to make it. Thank you!

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Hatchrite works well with gecko eggs but the water content does not appear to be enough when incubating snake eggs requiring temps in the high 80's.

It can still be used but water should be added to it.

What I would do is buy a light crate get that Hatchrite wet. This way it will be headache proof and you will not have to worry about your eggs being to wet since they will no longer be in contact with the substrate or too dry since the substrate will contain a lot more water.

Eggs can be moved they are very resilient, just make sure that you do not rotate them.

Water bottles are not necessary, and your eggs will be fine once you address the humidity issue in your tub.

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Thank you Deb! I really wasn't sure about the hatch rite. I did a quick look at LLL reptiles ad for the stuff and got right back to the OP. I appreciate the information.

Well, I added water to the reservoir at the bottom of the incubator and a little bit of sphagnum moss to the side behind the egg boxes, but there's not much space to begin with. The incubator humidity has risen, but the egg box humidty has actually dropped to 87%. I found and bought pure perlite and vermiculite and am considering mixing and soaking those, replacing the Hatchrite, and transferring the eggs onto a light diffuser, then re-sealing everything. I HATE to disturb them again, but I'm getting so frustrated with the humidity and worried about letting the eggs get any more deflated. Help?

Good! If that is the route you want to go then try that. Like Deborah said, make sure you don't allow the eggs to rotate at all. It would be great if you gathered everything together first and limit the time the eggs are exposed to less than optimal temperatures and humidity. I think the light diffuser is a great move. This way you have everything you need very close by and can do the rearrangement and transfer quickly and efficiently. That is what will be important. Great job and good luck! :gj: Oh, don't get frustrated, get busy.

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Originally Posted by Albert Clark

Good! If that is the route you want to go then try that. Like Deborah said, make sure you don't allow the eggs to rotate at all. It would be great if you gathered everything together first and limit the time the eggs are exposed to less than optimal temperatures and humidity. I think the light diffuser is a great move. This way you have everything you need very close by and can do the rearrangement and transfer quickly and efficiently. That is what will be important. Great job and good luck! :gj: Oh, don't get frustrated, get busy.

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Haha good point, gotta get busy and productive. I will make sure everything is prepped ahead of time for sure!

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I found and bought pure perlite and vermiculite and am considering mixing and soaking those, replacing the Hatchrite, and transferring the eggs onto a light diffuser, then re-sealing everything. I HATE to disturb them again, but I'm getting so frustrated with the humidity and worried about letting the eggs get any more deflated. Help?

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That's really the only solution, trying to increase the humidity in the incubator itself will do nothing in the short or long run, the important is the humidity in the box itself.

You don't have to buy another medium just use the hatchrite currently in the box and give it a nice soak and lay your light diffuser with your eggs on the top.

You really want to do this ASAP.

AA, how are you making out? Hoping everything went smoothly.

I discarded the Hatchrite already, so I just added vermiculite that was probably slightly wetter than average, but they're on light diffuser and both tubs are tightly re-sealed. My boyfriend and I prepped everything and transferred everything pretty quickly and carefully. The eggs feel quite dehyrdated, with a couple showing the very slightest signs of mold(so slight that it might be my imagination, but still..) All still showing veins, though. I've been monitoring the temps and humidity over the past hour and humidity rose to 87% and is now sitting. If it doesn't continue to rise, I'll add more water tonight, but I'm hoping to not have to mess with these babies anymore.

I know the first season can be a bit of trial and error, but I reeeeally hope it doesn't cost my first clutch.

Great news! I feel the humidity will continue to rise and we will be in good shape. Fingers and toes crossed. Nice work.

Fingers, toes, eyes all crossed here LOL

I'll keep updating.

Ummmmm humidity will absolutely not budge above 87%. I added several teaspoons of water to the edges last night and it didn't make a difference. Do I drench the vermiculite now? Add moss to the edges? :rolleye2:

Guys, something about his incubator doesn't make sense. In one of the threads he mentioned that his thermostat is set at 99 and the egg bins are at 88 and 90. That means the incubator isn't insulated well, and it is losing a lot of heat and humidity. I find that if you have a well insulated incubator, set the whole thing at 90, the bins will heat up to that point and then keep the humidity in the incubator high as well, which helps keep the egg bin humidity high. I keep my incubator above 70% and then the bins stay near 100% with the vermiculite.

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Originally Posted by ThePhenom

Guys, something about his incubator doesn't make sense. In one of the threads he mentioned that his thermostat is set at 99 and the egg bins are at 88 and 90. That means the incubator isn't insulated well, and it is losing a lot of heat and humidity. I find that if you have a well insulated incubator, set the whole thing at 90, the bins will heat up to that point and then keep the humidity in the incubator high as well, which helps keep the egg bin humidity high. I keep my incubator above 70% and then the bins stay near 100% with the vermiculite.

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It's a ZooMed Reptibator. It's got a groove on each side just under the lid that I think is letting heat and humidty out. I've considered plugging those up.

I did add wet moss to the egg tubs, just not touching the eggs, and added about half a cup of water to the vermiculite. There's now a decent amount of condensation on the sides, but the humidity is only bumped up to 88%. I know part of my problem is repeatedly opening the tubs, but I'm more afraid of letting the eggs dry out. Very frustrating.

I'm a she, btw :)

Wait, just checked it again. Back down to 86%. Ready to tear all my hair out.

My guess is that your gauge is far from accurate too. And you need to stop messing with the tubs once they are set properly. The more you open the more you let humidity out.

When properly setup you can put the eggs in the incubator and not open the egg tub until one week before eggs are due to hatch.

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Originally Posted by AerialArtist

It's a ZooMed Reptibator. It's got a groove on each side just under the lid that I think is letting heat and humidty out. I've considered plugging those up.

I did add wet moss to the egg tubs, just not touching the eggs, and added about half a cup of water to the vermiculite. There's now a decent amount of condensation on the sides, but the humidity is only bumped up to 88%. I know part of my problem is repeatedly opening the tubs, but I'm more afraid of letting the eggs dry out. Very frustrating.

I'm a she, btw :)

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Sorry about calling you he! :)

I would seal the incubator the best you can then, and try to get overall incubator humidity to stay up. I use vermiculite in a container, and then I soak it until it is basically a paste / mud type consistency. Then put in a plastic egg grate, and eggs on top of that. This prevents the eggs from directly touching the vermiculite, and I can make it as wet as I want. I then put saran wrap, or cling wrap over the bin, and then put the lid on. This ensures that the humidity cannot escape. Then that all goes into the incubator. My incubator itself is a old wine cooler, with heat tape on the back wall, a fan on the top to circulate air and heat and 4 shelves. I then put a bin full of water at the bottom to help keep incubator humidity up. If I notice the incubator dropping, I will even spray the incubator from time to time. I like to keep it around 70%. Hope this helps.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

My guess is that your gauge is far from accurate too. And you need to stop messing with the tubs once they are set properly. The more you open the more you let humidity out.

When properly setup you can put the eggs in the incubator and not open the egg tub until one week before eggs are due to hatch.

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I'm starting to think that has to be the case. I do know that I need to leave the eggs alone, so I'll be sitting on my hands for a while. The fact that there is condensation is somewhat reassuring.

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Originally Posted by ThePhenom

Sorry about calling you he! :)

I would seal the incubator the best you can then, and try to get overall incubator humidity to stay up. I use vermiculite in a container, and then I soak it until it is basically a paste / mud type consistency. Then put in a plastic egg grate, and eggs on top of that. This prevents the eggs from directly touching the vermiculite, and I can make it as wet as I want. I then put saran wrap, or cling wrap over the bin, and then put the lid on. This ensures that the humidity cannot escape. Then that all goes into the incubator. My incubator itself is a old wine cooler, with heat tape on the back wall, a fan on the top to circulate air and heat and 4 shelves. I then put a bin full of water at the bottom to help keep incubator humidity up. If I notice the incubator dropping, I will even spray the incubator from time to time. I like to keep it around 70%. Hope this helps.

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Haha no worries ;)

Thanks for the tips! I think I may go with the converted wine fridge idea next season.

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Originally Posted by AerialArtist

I'm starting to think that has to be the case. I do know that I need to leave the eggs alone, so I'll be sitting on my hands for a while. The fact that there is condensation is somewhat reassuring.

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Trust me it's hard but the less you open that box the better and the humidity in the incubator itself really does not matter.

It's hard to put the eggs away and forget about them for 60 days but checking all the time won't make them come out faster. ;)

I don't see mine at all except when I put a new clutch in or take one out and I glanced at the boxes I do not open them, takes a lol of self control lol

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Checking won't make them come out faster??:tears: Lol, what about camping out in front of the incubator and checking the clock every 5 minutes? Haha, hope to have positive updates in a few weeks...

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Originally Posted by AerialArtist

Checking won't make them come out faster??:tears: Lol, what about camping out in front of the incubator and checking the clock every 5 minutes? Haha, hope to have positive updates in a few weeks...

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Don't worry. She tells me the same thing all of the time and I'm still out to prove her wrong. :D

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

Don't worry. She tells me the same thing all of the time and I'm still out to prove her wrong. :D

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Shouldn't YOU be staring at your incubator right now [emoji48] [emoji48]

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Hahaha, that's great. Glad to see I'm not alone in my struggle:oops:

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Originally Posted by AerialArtist

Hahaha, that's great. Glad to see I'm not alone in my struggle:oops:

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oh you are not! but I am restraining myself allowing myself to only look 2 times a week but that is also because I don't want the heat to get out of the incubator so the temperatures will be more constant

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Originally Posted by ARBallMorphs

oh you are not! but I am restraining myself allowing myself to only look 2 times a week but that is also because I don't want the heat to get out of the incubator so the temperatures will be more constant

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Glass front incubators FTW!

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

Glass front incubators FTW!

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Yeah, I plan on making one for next season.

Oh yeah, mine incubator is in my living room so I stare at my 1 poor lone egg almost every time I walk past!

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

Glass front incubators FTW!

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I agree! Mine has an acrylic door. Can't wait to use it!!!!!!