Just got my first snake, a baby ball python...few questions I have

Hey Gang,

Nice to join this forum. Just purchased my first snake...a baby ball python from PetSmart. They were 25% off and I have been debating my next critter ever since my caiman died....I wanted something that was a lot less maintenance in terms of tank cleaning but still something I could watch and hang out with when I was working in my home office. I also have 5 kids and they have been begging me to get something as cool as the caiman. lol.

Anyways I ended up getting a 2 month old ball python with the following enclosure

*40 gallon enclosure
*bedding on the bottom of the enclosure
*heat lamp on top over screen
*Hollow rock for the snake to hide in
*large branch
*water bowl

All the items were purchased from petsmart. Is this a good setup? Am I missing anything?

My big question is feeding. I have had the snake for 4 days and was told to purchase frozen baby artic mice. I tried feeding the snake on the 3rd day (as I was told to give them 3 days to adjust to the new environment) but the snake is not interested in the artic mice at all. I put the frozen artic mice in warm water for a few minutes as rec'd.

I tried again today with a new mouse. Still nothing.

What am I doing wrong?

Another question I have...is it normal for the baby ball to hide under the bedding of the enclosure? I turn the heat lamp off at night...I don't have a temp gauge in the enclosure but I'd say it was 66-70 degrees in there at night as my office is heated and part of my home. Does this mean the snake is cold?

The people at PetSmart told me to feed the snake in a separate area after the first week as that would not make the snake aggressive everytime I reached into the enclosure...is that a good way of doing things?

Any help or advice would be great and thanks in advance.

A few pics...

https://scontent.ford1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...6b&oe=56E27C02

https://scontent.ford1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...94&oe=56D89CBE

Not an expert by any means but those are not ideal conditions for the snake. Way to cool at 67. Hot side should be 90 and I like my cool side in the low 80s. I also hate putting them in tanks as they don't hold humidity.

Feeding-the mouse should be 100% defrosted and then warmed. I usually let mine sit out for hours and then hear them a bit with a hair dryer. My snakes don't seem to want to eat them if they are not heated up. Also I have one that will only take live

Hello and welcome!

So a few things

1. 40 gallon is too large for this little guy and he will feel a little insecure. to off set this you will need to fill the enclosure up with lots of stuff, really crown the space. (don’t worry about this too much, the snake will grow into the tank but many people will tell you its too large. if you clutter it things will be fine.
2. You need to try and set up a temperature granulation (hot and cool side with the middle be in-between). The 'hotspot' should be 87-91 degrees (that temp is off the floor of the cage, the snake will burrow down and you want to know what the temperature of the hottest place your snake could be in contact with. I recommend switching from the heat lamp to an under tank heater (UTH- heat pad). having belly heat helps with digestion and with this method it will be easier to control the hotspot in your set up. You will also need to purchase a thermostat that controls the heat pad and prevents it from getting too hot. You set the thermostat to lets say 93, measure the temp of the cage floor, and play around with it until you get a consistent 87-90.
3. Feeding: feed the little guy in his new set. Feeding them outside their cage does more harm than good. Make sure the prey is fully thaw (just a few min does not seem like enough time). After the pray is thawed hit the head and butt with a blow-dryer for a min (this dries the mouse off, and heats it up so the sent is stronger). use tongs or something similar when you offer, make the mouse do a little zombie dance if you need to. be patient. if he seems really interested, but does not strike, you can try leaving the mouse in with him for 20 min or so before checking. If he refuses again, wait 5 days before trying again.

Important things:
1. look up a care guide (there are lots on this site) to really nail down what your temps and humidity should be
2. get a simply heating pad and thermostat to regulate it

if you can post pictures of the set up that will also help to give some advice on the substrate, size of your hides, etc.
Congrats again, BP are the best!!

I have my own opinion of this place when talking about animals. You need to think do they have the best knowledgable people working there when they just pay above minimum wage? The hs kid there is trying to help, but usually doesn't know much of what he is talking about.

Dont feed in a seperare container, it just stresses the snake out. Yeah, I do agree if you feed in their normal habitat they can seem a little more agressive when you open up the habitat, but that's cause they are expecting food. Once they realize it's you and not good they are fine.

Thanks guys...heres a pic of the heat lamp side of the enclosure. As you can see I heated up the mouse and left it next to him as rec'd. I will get the a temp gauge for the setup.

https://scontent.ford1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...85&oe=570F103D

that hide is sweet looking! I would keep it in there (remember to clutter the tank up). that being said i would also provide a hide on both the warm and cool side (they love tight spaces and for that size snake if you put a toilet paper roll in there I’m pretty sure you will find him in it shortly after its introduced.)

for feeding: the blow-dryer will help a lot. if you still having trouble there are lots of other little tricks you can do, you will just have to try a few until he goes for it.

Please start here: http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...ius)-Caresheet

Congrats on your new BP. I would make a few changes to your setup. For starters I would replace the heat bulb with an under tank heater. Heat lamps tend to suck humidity out of the enclosure. You also want to make sure your heat source and temps are controlled by a thermostat. I think your temps are a bit cool which could cause the snake not to eat. You want a hot spot of about 90F with ambient temps around 75-80F. It's easy to create the hot spot with a UTH and you can supplement the ambient temps with an IR heat bulb or CHE on a dimmer or you could use a radiant heat panel as your sole heat source. You'll also want snug hides on the warm and cool sides of the enclosure. I would make sure your temps and humidity are dialed in before any more attempted feedings. Give the snake another week to acclimate to it's new environment once your husbandry is up to par. Make sure your prey items are completely thawed and warmed up to about 100F before offering them to the snake. Feeding snakes inside their enclosures does not make them more defensive. That is a myth. I believe feeding them in separate bins causes the snake more stress and could lead to regurgitation when moving the snake back to it's enclosure. All of my snakes are fed inside their enclosures. I'd also suggest getting your BP on rats ASAP. Eventually one mouse won't be enough and it's easier and less expensive to feed one rat as opposed to multiple mice. Lastly, since they prefer tight dark spaces, I would cover 3 sides of the enclosure to give the snake more of a sense of security.

Hides are too big , enclosure is too big, basically you need to get started again from scratch.

BP are are not very forgiven with husbandry issues.

Here is what I recommend to get back on track ASAP

Get a 6 quarts tub

Aspen bedding

1 Plastic flower pot saucer for hide (6 inch in diameter)

UTH

Thermostat

Provide a temp of 86/88 on the warm side.

Leave the animal ALONE for a week so it adjust to his new setup (no handling until the animal eat successfully for you)

Once the week is over offer a live mouse (right now the animal feeding is the priority, switching to F/T is only secondary). Place the mouse in the tub (do not feed outside the enclosure)

When the animal reaches 200/250 grams you can switch to either a 15 quarts tub or 10 gallons tank, the 40 gallons tank will be fine when your snake is an adult but until than the enclosure must fit and meet your BP's need.

I also want to add... if you're using two hides, one on the cool side and one on the hot side, get two that are the same. Two identical, tight hides. They likes spaces where they are touched on all sides.

Lets start with that the tanks looks like a 20 gallon and definitely not a 40.

Here's a great write-up how to set up a 20 gallon:
http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showthread.php?t=201740


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Nice looking snake! For feeding, start with mouse hoppers, nothing smaller. For f/t, heat the mouse to around 120F. Get an infrared thermometer gun to measure that and your surface temps inside the tank.

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thanks for all the advice so far...few more things I would like to ask and mention...

*my snake seems to like to burrow under the bedding on the cold side of the tank away from the heat lamp...could this mean the tank is too hot?

*as far as creating humidity...would you guys rec'd a spray bottle and misting the bedding a few times daily?

*could a snake this young really eat live small mice or should I stick with the frozen arctic mice and heat them up as rec'd by a few of you?

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Originally Posted by ArabianOak

thanks for all the advice so far...few more things I would like to ask and mention...

*my snake seems to like to burrow under the bedding on the cold side of the tank away from the heat lamp...could this mean the tank is too hot?
Could be... I would set a thermometer on the substrate under the lamp and see how hot it is. It maybe that it likes to hide, and the temperature under the substrate is what he/she really likes. Could be perfectly fine.

*as far as creating humidity...would you guys rec'd a spray bottle and misting the bedding a few times daily?
That will work, but will be cumbersome for you over time. Maybe try a slightly larger water bowl, or get a small bowl and put some sphagnum moss in it and wet that down a little. That will slowly release moisture and helps a bit.

*could a snake this young really eat live small mice or should I stick with the frozen arctic mice and heat them up as rec'd by a few of you?

Could/would/should... all different. If it is currently on frozen/thawed mice, my personal opinion would be to tell you to keep with the frozen/thawed. They are easy to store and cannot scratch or bite the snake. Many people feed live and don't have issues, but I know for me, i don't want to introduce the potential for injury to the snake if I don't have to. Aside from that, I don't have to worry about keeping live mice/rats alive until feeding day.

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Just my two cents....

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*my snake seems to like to burrow under the bedding on the cold side of the tank away from the heat lamp...could this mean the tank is too hot?

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The two main reason I see based on your setup are hides too big (it burrows for additional security, and hot spot too hot (not being regulated with a t-stat.

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*as far as creating humidity...would you guys rec'd a spray bottle and misting the bedding a few times daily?

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It's one of the option however depending on the bedding it can create molds, the best way to improve is to use a UTH instead of a light, use a bedding that holds humidity) , place the water dish partially over the UTH

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*could a snake this young really eat live small mice or should I stick with the frozen arctic mice and heat them up as rec'd by a few of you?

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They can take live right out of the egg.

There are a lot of things that need to be addressed husbandry wise for an animal that size.

Thanks gang...I ran over to the store and picked up a 30-40 gallon terranium UTH....it doesn't have any options to regulate heat though...I placed it under the tank and put the water bowl slightly on it to create some humidity. I also picked up a temp and humidity gauge...where should I place that in the tank? on the light side or on the darker side?

I will buy another hide tomorrow and keep chipping away. By the way, I filled the water bowl up with fresh water and he came slithering along to have a fresh drink almost immediately...not sure if that is a good sign or not...can't believe how calm and passive this snake is. Being my first snake I expected a lot more distrust, but I have been calm and slow and he doesn't seem to mind me at all. I hope that's a good sign too.

thanks...let me know what else I can do.

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Originally Posted by ArabianOak

...let me know what else I can do.

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Unplug that unregulated heat mat until you get a thermostat or rheostat to regulate it before worse happens.

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

Unplug that unregulated heat mat until you get a thermostat or rheostat to regulate it before worse happens.

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X2

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Got it...I unplugged it...I will pick up a regulator for it tomorrow. I put the humidity and temp gauge on the light side of the terranium...humidity a tick over 40% and temp around 82/83...

Hey congrats on your new pet! Ball pythons are the best, especially when they are little worms like yours:) the setup you bought sounds good, it's just a matter of using it correctly. A baby bp can happily grow up in a 40 gal, so long as you clutter it and give him a ton of hiding spots. I personally prefer heat lamps over heat mats. They distribute the heat more and are a lot less faulty!! It's completely normal for your bp to refuse food after only 3 days. Give him a week to settle in, these guys don't handle change too well. As for feeding size, aim for a rat or mouse the same thickness as the thickest part of his girth. No bigger. I know someone said don't go any smaller than a hopper, but this is entirely untrue. My guy had to start on mouse fuzzies, that's how tiny he was! I tried going bigger too soon, and he couldn't handle it. Regurgitated rodents are not something you want to deal with!


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Everything that's been said is great advice as far as figuring out why he's burrowing and why he won't eat. Ball pythons are such picky eaters especially when their conditions arnt right.

Im curious though on how you present the mouse after its been thawed. He will most likely ignore it if you just lay it next to him. If you haven't already I'd get a pair of tongs or something to dangle the mouse in from of him. A little zombie dance seems to get them more excited and interested in eating a FT rodent.

I'd also suggest trying feeder rats or mice from a different source? I've had terrible luck with the artic mice. I noticed when they thaw out they are normally covered in urine and look like someone smooshed them. My snake won't touch them. But he will devour FT mice/rats from anywhere else.

Not that this will solve your problems without addressing your other issues first. Just a possible helpful tip.

Good looking snake!

Listen to these guys on the tank conditions. After he's more comfortable, you can try a live fuzzy or a hopper mouse to get him started. I had to restart 2 baby balls on live that now happily take F/T.

Tash, my snake wont touch arctic mice either. I think it's a smell issue :gj:

Thanks gang...I came down this morning and it was the first time he was not burrowed under the bedding...he was actually perched on top of his hide looking around...ha.

https://scontent.ford1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...f1&oe=5717F7CA

Just purchased some baby live African rats...gonna attempt to feed him now...in the mean time I came home to this...

https://scontent.ford1-1.fna.fbcdn.n...f4&oe=56DA6A14

no dice on the feeding...I left the baby mice in there...they are still alive but all they do is flinch around...very little...is that a good idea?

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Originally Posted by ArabianOak

no dice on the feeding...I left the baby mice in there...they are still alive but all they do is flinch around...very little...is that a good idea?

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I hope you watching the tank while the mice are in it. You should never leave live mice alone with your BP. It's not a good practice to learn even if they're pinkies and can't hurt your BP. Google what happens when mice start chewing n snakes... It's not a pretty picture.

Also, your thermometer is not doing you any good being so high. You ahould put it on the same level where your BP is so you know the temps and humidity down there. I'd replace it completely and get a digital thermometer/hygrometer.

Something like this:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...9817e0618e.jpg


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