Day 62 Umbilical Cord?

Hello, this is my first clutch and I had some fantastic and not so fantastic odds. Let's start with the not so fantastic, my 1500g 5 year old BP laid 1 good egg and 3 slugs. I'm not super disappointed since I have another female who is almost of weight. The good odds were that she is a blue eyed leucistic which is the morph I wanted! I cut day 55 because I was worried, I made sure to candle and avoid all major veins. No bleeding, yay!

She crawled out of the egg today (Day 62) and is still attached to the umbilical cord, it appears as though there is not too much yolk left in the egg as far as I can see... but she is quite small! I'm not sure if she is normal weight because I have not weighed her yet, but she looks small compared to pictures I've seen of other hatchlings. I did incubate at lower temps (87-88 degrees F)

What should I do in this situation? I thought maybe I should just leave her for a few days but I saw something about putting her in a deli cup with a moist paper towel?

http://i68.tinypic.com/1j0uba.jpg

http://i64.tinypic.com/k1rx1i.jpg

Do you have a better pic of the yolk left and the snake. Put it in a 6 qt tub with heat on one side and damp paper towel to start. You don't want dry aspen or paper towel sticking to the cord or yolk

http://i65.tinypic.com/2exu05h.jpg
The yolk is about the diameter of a quarter it's very deflated but it is hard to see in pictures.

http://i63.tinypic.com/2hdur5s.jpg

Covered in verm, I'm preparing another clean container because the container I had the verm in had a hole for the prob of my incubator. She is moving around A LOT.

http://i64.tinypic.com/j9c70y.jpg
lots and lots of moving, she's tugging on it a lot I'm worried. :(

Put her in a deli cup inside the incubator on wet paper towel to see if she absorbs any more yolk. If she doesn't he cord may be bad. If this is the case she may need to be assist fed almost immediately depending on her condition. I've had snakes that didn't absorb much yolk and die before hey even shed

The dark red on the cord makes me think it may not be absorbing

Should I assist feed the yolk or FT mice? I have pinky mice.

Do you have experience assist feeding? I would still wait 24 hours to see if she absorbs yolk. You incubated lower so she may still be developing. The small deli cup will give less room to tug around

And should I do that in a couple days or right now? Maybe wait and see if she uses any more yolk? Do you think I will have to use floss and tie the umbilical cord then cut or will it perhaps dry naturally?

I've had to assist feed one of my balls before when she was younger (3 weeks), but that was just once. It was fairly easy with her since she is calm with me. Also I'm worried since she is very small and delicate. I'll get over it when the time comes but with such small hatchlings do you do anything different than when feeding 3 week old BPs?

It will probably fall off on its own but if doesn't absorb you may need to tie and cut it off. As far as assisting it's hard to tell with out seeing it in person. After a few seasons and losing some snakes, I tend to lead on the side of feeding them early. I feel like they get to a point where they are so weak they can not even take the stress of assist feeding. I know some people will disagree with me but if it doesn't absorb any yolk, I would assist it within the next day or so after.

The reason I ask if you have experience because you want the process to be as easy and least stressful as possible. Someone that will be able to get it done on the first time or so.

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showthread.php?t=219974

This is a thread from last year of one of my snakes. She turned out great and is a very strong eater now. I feel like if I waited a few more days to have her assisted, she may not have survived.

Well I left her over night and checked this morning to see if any of the yolk was getting to her. I don't think she is receiving any nutrients because there is what appears to be a blood clot in the umbilical cord. :( So I tied and cut the umbilical cord and I'm a bit concerned whether or not it is herniated from when she first crawled out. I couldn't find any images of what a herniated umbilical cord on a ball python looks like. I think I'm going to assist feed asap. She seems weak.

assist fed half a pinky. Her umbilical cord looks like this:
http://i68.tinypic.com/30wass1.jpg
Sorry if the picture is bad I couldn't get her to relax.

Also I called the vet and sent them an email with all this information as well. :( Could use more advice on herniated umbilical cords.

The cord will most likely just fall off on its own. Did she eat the whole pinky

I cut it in half and kept the other half to feed later if necessary. Should I have fed her the whole pinky?

I like to make assist feeding worth it. If you are going to stress it out by assisting it, at least feed it something that will be large enough to make it a real meal. That's why I was saying it should be someone experienced. It should probably be taking a full fuzzy mouse

Aw, sorry about that! I tried to feed it to her whole and she wasn't really having it so I cut it in half and she eventually swallowed it. How long should I wait until feeding her a fuzzy? I was thinking 2-3 days I'd try again.

They are always going to resist being assist fed and they are going to fight it. I would really try to get someone local to help you do it if you are comfortable feeding something that big. And yes I would wait a few days

How's the snake doing

I think she is doing alright! Her umbilical cord has started falling off, she has been cruising around her tub flicking her tongue and drinking water. She appears a little wrinkled, at first I thought perhaps it was a dehydration issue so I tried to help her to water when she was too weak to move, and she drank. I think the wrinkling might be a weight issue. She has been drinking regularly, I just weighed her yesterday and she is 51 grams. :)

I also emailed a veterinarian, she said the snake's chance of survival was very low. I think that she will live if I just care for her properly.

I'm thinking about trying to feed her today but instead of assisting see if she will take it herself. I doubt this, but I figure it's better than stressing her out like that again unless necessary.

I fed her half a pinky on Saturday, wondering if I should wait three days to feed her again since it has only been two days?

https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...23164444_o.jpg
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...82036494_o.jpg
She's full of energy now although a bit wrinkled from being deprived of yolk? Her umbilical cord hasn't completely fallen off, should I give it until her first shed?

Also thank you so much Billy, without you I would have been so lost. I really appreciate all your advice and helping me to keep this little one alive. :)

It took a while for our snake to lose the umbilical cord. Just keep her on a very moist paper towel. As far as the wrinkling, makes me think she needs more water. But I don't know.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

How does she feel. It's hard to explain but does she feel like a normal snake of does she feel kind of gummy-ish

She feels like a normal snake, I have her at 100% humidity and changed the water bowel to a saucer since I felt like maybe it was a bit too tall for her? She lost more of her umbilical cord today and now she has just a tiny amount left. :) I'm waiting to see if she'll have her first shed to try and feed her normally.

Congrats and I think you are doing a fantastic job and so is the little girl. Try purchasing some Pedialite solution and mixing it with some warm water at about a 50% Solution concentration. This way she can soak in that and also mix some into her drinking bowl as well. The extra electrolytes will help her towards recovery. Great job!

I'll try to buy some after work. :) She is very wrinkly. It has been 5 days since she hatched so is it possible it could just be that she is close to shedding?

Sure. It could be the shedding as a possibility. Overall though, the pedialite/water soaking and drinking would be something that is therapeutic. You can always start to replace fluids in dehydrated and struggling animals as a first line even before assist feeding and or tube feeding. Reptiles can absorb a nice amount of fluid through the cloaca from soaking. Keep up the good work and kudos to you and her. She's a survivor and I think she will be ok.

The hypo butter that Billy saved if I remember correctly didn't shed until a month later. In that we actually fed her every 5-7 days


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So the pedialyte worked wonders, I'm so glad I followed your advice! I soaked her in a 50% solution of it for a few minutes and she now has almost no wrinkles except around her head and her umbilical area. I put a little in her water saucer too.

So looking back I think next time I'll incubate at higher temps and avoid cutting until either 1 pips naturally or day 60. (I only had one fertile egg so it was kind of hard to tell.) I'm wondering if some of this could have been avoided if I did that in the first place. >__< I'm so glad everyone on this forum is awesome and guided me through this, everyone's advice has been great and I'm glad I listened to everyone's ideas. :gj:

How is the snake doing

Ate her first meal all by herself recently! Right after she shed. She has some off scales, but I think they might go away with a few meals and sheds. :)

Awesome. Had you been assist feeder her?

Yes I assist fed her a few times. After she ate her first two meals by herself she stopped eating again. I've tried live, F/T, gerbil bedding, etc. She's eaten F/T twice. Not really sure why she stopped eating by herself again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Miko

Yes I assist fed her a few times. After she ate her first two meals by herself she stopped eating again. I've tried live, F/T, gerbil bedding, etc. She's eaten F/T twice. Not really sure why she stopped eating by herself again.

---

Did you try live mouse hoppers? My little guys loved those. For a picky eater, I had her in a 6qt tub, with TWO hides and a water bowl (yes, it was very cramped), her tub was covered with a towel all the time to block light, and she had aspen shavings. She eventually ate a live mouse hopper a little over a week of being left alone in these conditions, and she was eating well from then on.

Once they are eating on their own, they keep doing it. Dont worry it will take again, I wouldnt assist once they take it, you will only stress her and that wont be productive.
If she has a couple of meals already that means she has some energy, it not a life or dead situation. Try no to pet her, o check on her every ten minutes, I know it makes you nervous but security is very important for them at that stage.

Keep her husbandry ok, and try to feed again in a couple of days.

This year I hatched a spider with a hardened yolk, he couldnt absorb any of it.
I cut away, and put it just like the others in her own wet tub, it was so weak. The next day I assist her, and now she is doing great, eating on its own.

Good job, and good luck!!

Enviado desde mi XT890 mediante Tapatalk

So update on Luna! She is doing fantastic. She just had her second shed and took a meal by herself, it was even FT! I tried live mice hoppers but she just seemed intimidated?

For a while she had this weird bug eye on the right side, and a normal eye on the left. I had hoped that it would go away with her second shed, but alas it stayed the same. After checking on her eye a few days after her second shed I assumed that her eye would just be that way forever. Today I checked on her and her eye is actually going to normal size! It's very impressive. She's seriously beautiful and now she is bright white!

She is a blue eyed leucistic, but when she was first born I noticed pinstripe markings. She may even be a super pastel. She is definitely a pastel pinstripe blue eyed leucy because the pairing was Pastel Lesser x Pasetl Lesser Pinstripe.

Anyway, although this experience has definitely opened my eyes to how difficult breeding can be and how so many things can go wrong and be terrifying all at once. I feel as though I have really grown from the experience and overall really enjoyed it. Seeing her do as well as she is doing now is a gift in its own and I really feel like every second was truly worth it.

I also came to the conclusion that there are things I can adjust on my end to prevent what happened from happening again and it's something you just learn by trial and error.

I really just want to thank everyone on this forum, because I emailed a veterinarian and the vet told me that she would probably just die. Yet here she is, doing really well for herself with the guidance the people from this forum gave me.

Wow, what a dramatic saga to read through - I'm super glad your little Luna is doing okay now! The experience and friendliness of this community is absolutely wonderful, I'm so happy you got the help you needed to give this little girl a chance.

Glad to see she has made it through!

Such a great success story!! You did a great job saving her :). But may I ask....where are the dang pics of her at present??? lol

Sent from my SGH-S970G using Tapatalk

I'm a bit worried about her swollen eye? I'm not sure if it is a birth defect or an infection/something caught by a gland in her mouth. I thought it looked like it was going away, but it seems swollen again. I want to take her to a vet, but considering my experience with the vet I'm a bit disappointed with local choices for reptile care.

I opened her mouth and I see a very dark red vein on the side of her mouth the eye is on. It goes pretty deep through the throat and would be very hard to take pictures of. There is also a slight click when she breathes. Definitely not a respiratory infection. No bubbles or anything, healthy saliva.

There is a crescent on the upper half of the eye.

I will attest that both her eyes seem a little weird, the other one is small with a light blue crescent on top. Not swollen, but it's a very small eye. xD

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...57633767_o.jpg
https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...24210805_o.jpg
https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...80637219_o.jpg

Here eye isn't as red in these pictures. owo Good looking little baby otherwise. The area around the eye also swells. Wondering if it is a blocked lacrimal duct issue?

What a little sweetheart. I don't have any input on the eye issue unfortunately, other than to say that super lessers do sometimes come out with uneven eye sizes so her genetics may have something to do with it.

I think it could be a blocked lacrimal duct? I'm just going to go to the vet to make sure because I noticed it loss swelling after the shed slightly, then became more swollen. I opened her mouth and there is a large red vein and it looks irritated. Taking her to the vet as soon as they return my call. I tried saline drops and neosporin on the eye hoping maybe it would help. I couldn't think of much else as I am obviously not an expert.

I'm sensing a possible removal of blockage and draining. She slightly clicks when she breathes and the dark irritated vein goes pretty deep into the throat which I think may be causing the clicking. Poor girlie.

What was the pairing that produced her?

The male was a pastel lesser pinstripe and the female was a pastel lesser.