Ball Python Personalities

So earlier today I got into a debate with a friend of mine (read non-reptile loving friend) over whether or not ball pythons have personalities. His argument was that all reptile keepers were disillusioned and pretty much imagined their animals had unique personalities when I'm fact they did not. To him, reptiles, especially snakes, were not capable of having an individual personality.
In my opinion, this is just not true. I may only have 7 snakes, but not a single one acts the same or is the same as the other. Each one to me has their own personality.
I have some that are complete opposites of each other. My albino girl is one of the most laid back snakes I've ever owned. Nothing seems to faze her. Meanwhile, Bindi is the most sensitive snake I've ever owned. Granted she's still adjusting but my gosh she can be a drama queen.

Anyways, just wanted to see what everyone else thought.

Here's what I tell people. There are exceptions to this but, the darker the snake the darker the soul. LOL I'll hand my pieds or white snakes to my kids all day long, but stuff the axanthics, cinni's, het reds, even my silver bullet then to be more defensive than the lighter snakes. They are defiantly all different animals and have different ways they interact with their world.

LOL

Now that's funny:D
It seems random with my crew of little guys. My two albino are super laid back and sweet and so it my little piebald girl. My banana boy occasionally hisses at me but he's all bark and no bite. My butter female is a bit of a drama queen, she likes to hiss at me initially and than attempts to escape the tub as quickly as possible but again, all bark and no bite with her. The only one who is all bite and bark is my SuperFly female. She is feisty as all living hell. I moved her hide today when I was spot cleaning her cage and she struck at it at least twice before than attempting to stiffen and puff herself up as much as possible. Granted , she's been taking longer to adjust than all the others, it still makes her unique.
My big normal girl is my favorite. Me and her have a mutual understanding, if she doesn't want to be held, she lets me know and I respect that and leave her alone. She's the sweetest snake I've ever owned, I adore her.

The reason some people do not believe certain animals, especially snakes, cannot have a personality is because they cannot make facial expressions. Snakes cannot even blink. But with us keepers who have been around multiple snakes can see the difference in the way they act. Some are friendly, others aggressive, some eat like food is in short supply while others are on a diet. Some snakes feel they must always be defensive where others couldn't give a care and is loving life. You take these personalities mix them up and most snakes are unique. Of course there are other ways snakes choose to live their lives and not the ones just stated but they are the easiest to see. If not a since being, living creature had a personality, they wouldn't have a life period. And I don't mean going to the bar with friends life, I mean be alive, on this earth. Personalities is what makes us us.

You may have a tough time convincing this friend of yours that they do have personalities. I know someone who prides herself on being very logical and science-minded. She thinks in a very black and white way and needs to have something definitively proven or disproven to her via intense scrutiny under the scientific method, otherwise she will absolutely not budge on her views.

Since "personality" isn't really something that can be proven out in scientific terms, she of course refuses to believe that reptiles can have different personalities. She is also still of the firm belief that snakes are purely "instinct-based" as opposed to mammals. She's of the idea that dogs and cats can "love" people but that reptiles are physically incapable, due to brain structure. Me? I'm an agnostic so I will just say "I don't know" on the love issue :D which means I'm not saying that they can, but also not saying that they cannot. How could we possibly presume to know something like that? But other people are more certain, even to the point that they will ignore people's experiences and dismiss them as useless anecdotal evidence.

My view is that... Of course snakes have different personalities. They act differently under the same circumstances. They're not rocks.

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Originally Posted by cristacake

You may have a tough time convincing this friend of yours that they do have personalities. I know someone who prides herself on being very logical and science-minded. She thinks in a very black and white way and needs to have something definitively proven or disproven to her via intense scrutiny under the scientific method, otherwise she will absolutely not budge on her views.

Since "personality" isn't really something that can be proven out in scientific terms, she of course refuses to believe that reptiles can have different personalities. She is also still of the firm belief that snakes are purely "instinct-based" as opposed to mammals. She's of the idea that dogs and cats can "love" people but that reptiles are physically incapable, due to brain structure. Me? I'm an agnostic so I will just say "I don't know" on the love issue :D which means I'm not saying that they can, but also not saying that they cannot. How could we possibly presume to know something like that? But other people are more certain, even to the point that they will ignore people's experiences and dismiss them as useless anecdotal evidence.

My view is that... Of course snakes have different personalities. They act differently under the same circumstances. They're not rocks.

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I'm staying out of the debate on this, however:

Logic based on incomplete information can be wrong.

Scientists still know very little about how the brain (any brain works). What is instinct, really?? How does a chicken that was raised in an incubator and under a heat lamp know how to brood a clutch of eggs and care for her chicks? Just saying "instinct" does not explain it.
How is a memory stored?? Really, they can't explain it.

Does your friend have direct experience with various snakes? If no, then how can she say she knows? She hasn't tested her theory!

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Originally Posted by distaff

I'm staying out of the debate on this, however:

Logic based on incomplete information can be wrong.

Scientists still know very little about how the brain (any brain works). What is instinct, really?? How does a chicken that was raised in an incubator and under a heat lamp know how to brood a clutch of eggs and care for her chicks? Just saying "instinct" does not explain it.
How is a memory stored?? Really, they can't explain it.

Does your friend have direct experience with various snakes? If no, then how can she say she knows? She hasn't tested her theory!

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Right, I think you've explained what I failed to. I'm not great at getting my points across but yes, I think she has some work to do on her understanding of what science really is and what its limitations are.

I do think I'll let others handle these more abstract concepts from now on, I've realized I'm terrible at putting my thoughts into words. :oops: Your input is appreciated

I have family members who say that reptiles aren't real pets because they don't "love you." That because they're reptiles, they are incapable of love or emotion, therefore, "personality." Simply, they are living machines, only programmed to feed and reproduce and do nothing else.
In a sense, I understand where the argument comes from. How is anyone able to determine what any animal "feels.?" We only based our judgement off of what we believe we see. We see dogs running to the door and greeting us enthusiastically; tail wagging, toothy grin plastered on their faces, and we believe we are seeing love between dog and human. But what if we're wrong? What if really this is just a behavior meant to express a different action all together; a subordinate pack member greeting the perceived pack leader with respect, etc. Because we don't see any of these behaviors exhibted in reptiles, many people just assume it is because they are creatures incapiable on doing so.
I'm personally not the type of person to view the behaviors of a dog or other domesticated animals and believe that THOSE behaviors are the only ones animals exhibit that could possibly express emotion. I like believe that the subtle moments with our reptiles are the moments that these creatures are at least expressing trust or even respect. I would like to believe that there is mutual trust between my oldest snake and myself at this point. And if an animal can express trust, than they have personality.


Than again, I could just be a crazy snake lady ��

See, the whole love thing... I do not think some animals are capable of love. This in my opinion does not mean they do not have personalities. A dog does not love you, he needs you for food. Dogs are pack animals and therefor see you as pack leader, they do not love you. But as stated before, how do we truly know? I believe some animals are capable of love, such as birds and dolphins. Not snakes though. I do not believe my snakes love me but they tolerate (well some do) me in their life. Some of them have a life long goal to remove my digits. 10 points for the little one, 60 points for the fat one on the other end.

Every snake I've ever worked with has its own personality, but it is not the same as any bird or mammal I've worked with. My two balls at home definitely have different personalities (granted Sadie is still young and developing hers).

They definitely have their own personalities. If you're defining 'personality' as a unique way of responding to external and internal stimuli, then just about every animal I can think of has a personality. It just makes evolutionary sense; if there were no variations in behavior whatsoever in a population, it wouldn't last long. One 'bad reaction' would doom an entire species. Instead, there is a wide range of reactions to stress, pain, ect. that have their own advantages and disadvantages. The snake that doesn't react too strongly to stressful or 'scary' situations like being handled may be the snake that is brave enough to traverse an open area and find a better food source. Or it could be the snake that gets eaten by a predator because it was out in the open. I can think of a lot of examples.
Their personalities are certainly not as complex as those of a mammal; their brains just aren't built for navigating social structures or solving complex problems. They don't need to be. But I'd say they definitely have personalities.

As far as the capability to love goes, I don't think snakes have that capacity. They don't form social attachments to their own species, as they have no need of another individual beyond mating, so why would they form an attachment to another species? Their hardware just isn't wired for that. I think that, depending on the species, interaction with humans can range from being simply tolerated to being 'enjoyed'. For example, I think a snake with a faster metabolism that would display a lot of seeking behavior in the wild in order to find plenty of food could definitely gain something from a novel experience such as being handled, as it meets the need of that seeking behavior.
All 'love' is in any species including our own is a way to meet needs. Sure, we like to think we're above that, but we're social animals. We are safest in a group of other humans that will help us accumulate resources, our offspring are more likely to survive with the help of other adults, ect. 'Love' is just a chemical reaction that helps convince us to work together.
'Love' is going to be a completely different concept for any species. Like a colorblind person looking at a stoplight; you're seeing the same object, but your brains are processing it in two very different ways. I have no doubts that my dog 'loves' me and looks at me as a member of his pack. I'm important enough to his survival that he is willing to put himself in danger and show aggression in order to defend me. It's not the same exact reaction or thought process you undergo when you help out your friends or family, but IMO it's close enough to be called the same thing.

Why is it Universally accepted that dogs and cats have personalities?

Experience is why.

I bet greater than 95% of the US population has either owned, has owned, or had interactions with dogs and or cats.

How many of these people own, have owned, or have interacted with captive snakes?

10% ? Less, more, I don't know. But I would venture to say that due to lack of experience with snakes is why folks and your friend does not believe that they have personalities.


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your friend has no experience to speak on this

i have 28 ball pythons, and they all have different personalities

i'm far from "disillusioned" (i think your friend may have meant "delusional", which also does not apply)

They definitely have different personalities. each reptile is like a little snowflake lol. I don't think they're capable of feeling true love and affection, but they definitely seem to get used to certain people and will act differently around them.

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They definitely have personalities, or at least different qualities. They're not all the same, and they aren't living machines. Just think about these questions...

1. If they're all the same and don't have personalities, why do some snakes prefer certain prey?
2. Why are some more active?
3. Why do some snakes hiss when you pick them up?
4. Why do some snakes constantly try to escape, but others stay in one place all day?
5. Why do some snakes like water (shown by voluntarily soaking) while others act like it'll kill them?
6. Why do some snakes strike more than others?
7. Why don't all snakes use their hides?
8. Why are some snakes ok with larger spaces, while others want to be in a small area?
9. Why do some snakes eat like it's their last meal every week, while others couldn't care less about food?
10. Why do some snakes climb while others stay on the ground?

Do they have the capability to love? Hey, I don't know. Ask a snake, not me. Regardless of whether or not snakes have emotions, I believe it's possible for them to have personalities based on what I've observed with my group.

I only have 2 BPs (and a third I take care of), but each has a very different personality. I suppose it's just their level of natural fear vs curiosity.

My first snake, a Mojave male is very curious, but extremely shy and will go running for his hide if he sees you move towards him across the room while out exploring. He is very nervous being picked up and it takes him a good 5 minutes to start moving once in my hands. Then he will explore my hands briefly before trying to head for the floor or just generally away from me. Only snapped at me once when he was really young, but definitely not a snake that loves being handled. He's only 4 months old, so maybe it will wear off with time (and I make sure to handle him a couple times a week long enough for him to calm down and be comfortable with me).

My second snake, a Coral Glow female is the complete opposite. She is extremely friendly and is the only snake I'd allow someone else to hold without fear of being bit. She has never even taken a defensive striking stance with me at all and at worst will just ball up a little if she gets scared. She loves to wander her cage at night and if she's out and I open it, she'll come to my arm and crawl aboard to continue her exploration. It may not be puppy love, but she is an absolute joy to handle.

The third snake, my friend's normal who I take care of, is not curious at all it seems. He spends all day in his hides and at night it seems he'll just poke his head out a little. I've never seen him out exploring the cage. If I pick him up he is a little nervous at first, but quickly comes around and settles in on my hand where he does the same thing he does at home...sit around. I don't think anything is wrong with him, just a lazy snake. Out of the three, he is actually the strongest even though he is about 30 grams less than the other two. He really takes a firm grip when moving around and has never come close to falling (unlike my Mojave who is Mr. Clumsy and I've had to catch him several times when he makes a bad move). He is also the fastest to kill and eat his dinner.

Sure, I probably like to assume there is more to them than not. In reality the each have different levels of general fear, survivalism and curiosity (as was mentioned, variations in these traits is a good thing for the evolution of their species in the wild). I think those traits are enough to give them personalities, especially when keeping them as pets.