The age long question of... tubs or tanks?

So, I know this question of which is better, tubs or tanks, has been answered literally a million times and I apologize for bringing up again, but as a soon to be first time ball python and overall snake owner, I really wanted answers and results that would tailor specifically to my situation. So... my step-father placed an order at a reputable reptile shop in northern Chicago (I live right above the Illinois/ Wisconsin border by the way), and from what I was told, it is going to be about a month for the snakes to hatch and weigh about 100 grams until we can drive down to go get him/her. I could not be more excited! He also said he purchased a 20gal tank, along with the essential equipment as well as some substrate among other select things. I was concerned when I first heard this because I have read and seen many professional snake owners/breeders/etc. say no matter what, tubs are the way to go. And I guess my big questions that I would be so grateful to have answered are... Is a tank substantial for just one very young ball python or is a tub more efficient no matter what, even if I only have one baby? I just want it to be as comfortable as possible so it can have a long and healthy life under my guardianship of this beautiful creature.
Note: I've read a lot of the past threads about this discussion and I wanted to say two things: If I do find out a tank is perfectly fine for the only one ball python that is soon going to be in my possesion, and I've read that them seeing everything around the room can stress them a bit, would paper or something like that work for blocking visuals on the three of the outer sides of the tank? And the second this is: If the tank does somehow seem to be unfit for the proper care of this creature, then I will immensely switch to tubs.

I greatly apologize if this is any way confusing, haha. But I would be so grateful if my questions were to be answered since I've witnessed hundreds of knowledgeable people on here answer tons of questions I used to have. Thank you so much :)

I would suggest checking out this sticky - http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showthread.php?t=201740
That being said, while a smaller enclosure would make the snake feel more comfortable, it is entirely possible to successfully keep a snake in a larger one provided you offer enough cover and concealment. Hot and cold hides that are size appropriate (to make her feel snug) and plenty of plants and foliage to hide behind will help. Covering 3 of the sides with paper is a good idea to help the space feel smaller.

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I would also suggest checking out this thread - http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showthread.php?t=229026 as an example of a small snake doing well in a larger enclosure. It's pretty photo heavy but shows good examples of habitat clutter that will help a smaller snake feel more hidden.

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Welcome! You really hit the nail on the head on this topic by doing your homework ahead of time. It sounds like you're a lot like me - you can make a plan for everything except for animal's own individual behavior. :P

Without any other information, there would be blind responses that will tell you a 20 gallon glass aquarium is far too big and exposed for a hatchling. You gave a lot of other information though - thank you! You can certainly make up for things by cluttering it up to make it feel more homely like you're thinking about doing. When I started out, I used display enclosures as well (an Animal Plastics T8 divided in half). The PVC helped a bit with the exposure part, but you can cover the sides of a glass tank to replicate that. For clutter, I used crumpled up newspaper and as they grew, the amount of newspaper necessary shrank. There will likely be humidity issues to deal with in a glass tank, but there are ways around those as well. As long as you can make a plan to meet the animal's needs successfully, and have plans B, C, D, E, F, etc ready when the animal tells you your plan sucks ;), there isn't a right or a wrong way to go about things.

Rule #1 - Be Educated
Rule #2 - Be Flexible
Rule #3 - Have Fun
*rules are in no particular order :D

Again, welcome to the forum. You're right - there are a TON of knowledgeable people here. I hope you enjoy your stay! :gj:

Best regards,
Eric

PS - If you haven't seen them already, here are a couple very informative threads I think you'll enjoy:

• Ball Python (Python regius) Caresheet - http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...s%29-Caresheet
• How to Setup a Glass Tank (20 long) With Pictures! - http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...With-Pictures!

The question is really: How much work do you want to put in?
I would hold off on the 20 and go for a 10 IF you want to do a glass tank.

Ohmygosh thank you so much for the two responses. Definetly made me more confident about this, thank you!

Thank you so much! That was so much information. Thank you again for helping out a brand new beginner into the world of snakes, haha, and thanks for the warm welcome, too!

My step dad ordered it, haha. But thank you, I could probably ask to exchange it. Again, thank you!

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Originally Posted by Drewcifer

Ohmygosh thank you so much for the two responses. Definetly made me more confident about this, thank you!

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Originally Posted by Drewcifer

He also said he purchased a 20gal tank, along with the essential equipment...

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Make sure that a thermostat for the heat source(s) was included in that essential equipment.

What work best is what works for YOU and allows you to provide proper husbandry for your animal.

Now tubs maybe more appropriated with a very young animal if experiencing issues.

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Originally Posted by bcr229

Make sure that a thermostat for the heat source(s) was included in that essential equipment.

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Oh, I was definitely going to check. Thank you!

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Originally Posted by Deborah

What work best is what works for YOU and allows you to provide proper husbandry for your animal.

Now tubs maybe more appropriated with a very young animal if experiencing issues.

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Thank you! I was planning on doing that is things like going off feed since putting him/her in the enclosure.

I'm currently using tanks for my 2 (planning to switch to PVC when they get upgraded), and they work alright for me. It's a bit more difficult to hold humidity and heat, especially in the winter, but it's not impossible with some tinkering! Although, I do wish I had just gotten a rack to start with.

Edit- I put my spinnerblast into a 20 gallon long when I first got her. She was about 2 months old. I covered all of the sides, except for a small window on front and put crumbled paper in. I also added a branch and fake plants to make it more crowded. After she ate a few times, I started removing the crumpled paper and the paper that was covering the glass one at a time. Not saying it will work for you, but I personally haven't had any problems.

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Originally Posted by Megg

I'm currently using tanks for my 2 (planning to switch to PVC when they get upgraded), and they work alright for me. It's a bit more difficult to hold humidity and heat, especially in the winter, but it's not impossible with some tinkering! Although, I do wish I had just gotten a rack to start with.

Edit- I put my spinnerblast into a 20 gallon long when I first got her. She was about 2 months old. I covered all of the sides, except for a small window on front and put crumbled paper in. I also added a branch and fake plants to make it more crowded. After she ate a few times, I started removing the crumpled paper and the paper that was covering the glass one at a time. Not saying it will work for you, but I personally haven't had any problems.

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Thank you! I'll be getting mine younger than two months, as soon as he/she hits 100 grams and is on a proper feeding schedule. Thank you for the info!

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Originally Posted by Drewcifer

Thank you! I'll be getting mine younger than two months, as soon as he/she hits 100 grams and is on a proper feeding schedule. Thank you for the info!

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No problem! Hope all goes well.


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Something that really needs to be accounted for when deciding to go with a tub or a tank/pvc enclosure is room temperature

If the room the enclosure is going to be in is consistently in the mid to upper 70s, I think tubs in rack systems are the way to go for ball pythons. The reason I say this is because you will only need to provide heat in the form of a hotspot for the snake to use if it chooses.

If the room is much lower than 75 consistently, you will not have control over the ambient temperature in the tub, and then you run the risk of a depressed immune system, which can lead to sickness of your animal.

In that case it would be more sensible to use a pvc enclosure or a tank, something which you can provide ambient heat via radiant heat panel or heat lamp, as well as a hotspot via UTH.

I think you may be more likely to run into shedding problems with a pvc enclosure or tank if you don't keep an eye on it. My Ball Pythons that are in tubs shed perfectly every single time and I never put a drop of water on them. This is with paper substrate living in the midwest. (I do humidify the room to about 50% in the winter)

There really is no right or wrong when it comes to tubs verses tanks, as Deb said, it more a matter of what works best for you. I'd just go with the 20, and clutter the heck out of it. In addition to crumpled paper, I have used cheap dollar store fake plants, which look nice and are cheap enough to be trashed if they get too stained up. I use tubs and racks to save space, but I have quite a few snakes. For just one or two, I would use some kind of display setup so I would have more of a chance to see them when I didn't have time to get them out. Good luck with your new friend.

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Originally Posted by tbowman

Something that really needs to be accounted for when deciding to go with a tub or a tank/pvc enclosure is room temperature

If the room the enclosure is going to be in is consistently in the mid to upper 70s, I think tubs in rack systems are the way to go for ball pythons. The reason I say this is because you will only need to provide heat in the form of a hotspot for the snake to use if it chooses.

If the room is much lower than 75 consistently, you will not have control over the ambient temperature in the tub, and then you run the risk of a depressed immune system, which can lead to sickness of your animal.

In that case it would be more sensible to use a pvc enclosure or a tank, something which you can provide ambient heat via radiant heat panel or heat lamp, as well as a hotspot via UTH.

I think you may be more likely to run into shedding problems with a pvc enclosure or tank if you don't keep an eye on it. My Ball Pythons that are in tubs shed perfectly every single time and I never put a drop of water on them. This is with paper substrate living in the midwest. (I do humidify the room to about 50% in the winter)

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Thank you!... I couldn't be sure but I'd give my room at least... a 68 degrees. I am no expert and are purely guessing... but I want to use plenty of heat sources such as an uth as well as a light above. Any further information such as to tge absolute best placement of those heat sources would be much appreciated. Thank you!

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Originally Posted by Darkbird

There really is no right or wrong when it comes to tubs verses tanks, as Deb said, it more a matter of what works best for you. I'd just go with the 20, and clutter the heck out of it. In addition to crumpled paper, I have used cheap dollar store fake plants, which look nice and are cheap enough to be trashed if they get too stained up. I use tubs and racks to save space, but I have quite a few snakes. For just one or two, I would use some kind of display setup so I would have more of a chance to see them when I didn't have time to get them out. Good luck with your new friend.

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Thank you very much! I am planning on many plants now, I'd just love to make it a comfortable home for him or her. I am almost uncontrollably excited. Thank you again!

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Originally Posted by Drewcifer

Thank you!... I couldn't be sure but I'd give my room at least... a 68 degrees. I am no expert and are purely guessing... but I want to use plenty of heat sources such as an uth as well as a light above. Any further information such as to tge absolute best placement of those heat sources would be much appreciated. Thank you!

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With your ambient room temp at 68*F I would recommend either a PVC or melamine enclosure with a RHP to provide ambient heat and UTH for basking spot. Glass is a poor insulator, which is why you find double and triple-pane windows on houses these days, and you will lose a ton of heat through the sides of the tank as well as the top.

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Originally Posted by bcr229

With your ambient room temp at 68*F I would recommend either a PVC or melamine enclosure with a RHP to provide ambient heat and UTH for basking spot. Glass is a poor insulator, which is why you find double and triple-pane windows on houses these days, and you will lose a ton of heat through the sides of the tank as well as the top.

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Ooh, that makes me a little scared. I wouldn't think a RHP would be included into the essential things, and it might not be in the budget. I could not turn on my fan anymore and crank up the heating pad a little tiny bit... would that help even a tiny bit??

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Originally Posted by Drewcifer

Ooh, that makes me a little scared. I wouldn't think a RHP would be included into the essential things, and it might not be in the budget. I could not turn on my fan anymore and crank up the heating pad a little tiny bit... would that help even a tiny bit??

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Uhmm No.
Running your UTH too hot will only create a burner spot and still wont do much for your ambient temps.

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

Uhmm No.
Running your UTH too hot will only create a burner spot and still wont do much for your ambient temps.

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I see, well thank you. A apologize for the idiotic assumption.