Substrate Question

Greetings all!

I'm currently using sand for Norbert's cage (and have been for the last 4 years), but its dust is starting to get annoying. I'm thinking of switching to a ground walnut shell or something similar.

Any thoughts? What do you guys use?

Maybe something like this:

http://www.petsmart.com/reptile/subs...pfm%3Dcategory

Is Norbert a BP? Or? :confusd:

This post is is in the Bearded Dragon section, so Norbert must be......

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Originally Posted by Reinz

This post is is in the Bearded Dragon section, so Norbert must be......

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A bearded dragon!

Sorry! Just had gotten up/kinda special in the "morning"..... :rolleye2:

My husband lost his first bearded dragon to a bad impaction due to walnut shell, which is absolutely NOT an acceptable substrate for bearded dragons. The best thing you can have your beardie on is going to be tile or reptile carpet, both of which can be used to very pretty visual effect and are super easy to clean.

This is what I've got my girl on right now, but we're about to switch her over to a custom terrarium with a sealed grout for "substrate".

http://i.imgur.com/SOs8Sxp.jpg

The bits are something my husband picked up today that I wasn't paying attention to.

I personally use tiles, and I love them, as they are visually great and awesome to clean. I suggest you get bigger tiles or tiles cut to fit, less cracks means less of hassle with clean ups. Here is an older picture of my setup I had, I have two 18x18 tiles cut to fit now for ease. But if you get a more natural tile and not ceramic, it can help file their nails as well and prevent poking when handling. Also I lay down paper towels on bottom to help glass on tile and if some does go between cracks

http://i1382.photobucket.com/albums/...psttsdlmpf.jpg

"Reptile Carpet" is NOT the best thing to have any reptile on, it holds bacterial, it doesn't allow for burrowing, and it retains zero humidity, if it becomes wet and saturated it can mold. A healthy Bio-Active style soil mix that is a little on the desert side as far as moisture works great. I don't like hearing "its the easiest to clean" when it comes to substrates for lizards, lizards burrow, they dig, they don't just sit.

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Originally Posted by jclaiborne

"Reptile Carpet" is NOT the best thing to have any reptile on, it holds bacterial, it doesn't allow for burrowing, and it retains zero humidity, if it becomes wet and saturated it can mold. A healthy Bio-Active style soil mix that is a little on the desert side as far as moisture works great. I don't like hearing "its the easiest to clean" when it comes to substrates for lizards, lizards burrow, they dig, they don't just sit.

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I did not say it was the best, but it is certainly a better option than almost any substrate sold at big chain pet stores. Crushed walnut and calci or vita sand are well known by the bearded dragon community to contribute to high mortality rates in young bearded dragons, as these substrates are much too easily ingested. Burrowing is not essential to a healthy bearded dragon lifestyle, and dig boxes are only recommended for gravid females. The 3 top substrates ANY bearded dragon breeder will tell you to use are reptile carpet, tile, or paper towels/newspaper.

The holding humidity/saturation issue isn't a problem for bearded dragons, since the humidity is supposed to be very low anyway and misting is hardly ever required. A lot of keepers don't even keep water bowls in their tanks, since the daily (or every other day) soaking is more than enough to keep a desert reptile hydrated. Holding bacteria is only a problem if you let the carpet sit and gather poo for extended periods of time without washing it, which my husband and I do weekly.

Reptile carpet is a very safe substrate for bearded dragons, chosen for many reasons besides it's ease of cleaning.

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Originally Posted by Daigga

I did not say it was the best, but it is certainly a better option than almost any substrate sold at big chain pet stores. Crushed walnut and calci or vita sand are well known by the bearded dragon community to contribute to high mortality rates in young bearded dragons, as these substrates are much too easily ingested. Burrowing is not essential to a healthy bearded dragon lifestyle, and dig boxes are only recommended for gravid females. The 3 top substrates ANY bearded dragon breeder will tell you to use are reptile carpet, tile, or paper towels/newspaper.

The holding humidity/saturation issue isn't a problem for bearded dragons, since the humidity is supposed to be very low anyway and misting is hardly ever required. A lot of keepers don't even keep water bowls in their tanks, since the daily (or every other day) soaking is more than enough to keep a desert reptile hydrated. Holding bacteria is only a problem if you let the carpet sit and gather poo for extended periods of time without washing it, which my husband and I do weekly.

Reptile carpet is a very safe substrate for bearded dragons, chosen for many reasons besides it's ease of cleaning.

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This arguement comes up at least once a month on here. You literally said in your initial post "the best..." I have to agree that calci, vita, and crushed walnut shells is a terrible substrate. However I respectfully disagree that paper towels, tiles and carpet are any better. Just because breeders suggest it doesn't make it the spoken truth. Most breeders suggest things that make life easier for breeding. Which is why people keep snakes in racks with sani chips and disposable water dishes. It makes life easy for the breeder. I am well aware that bearded dragons are from a dry climate, however that doesn't mean they don't need access to some humidity even if it is minor, humidity helps keep lizards hydrated, so while you say misting is never needed how many people that keep beardies say you should "bathe" them once a week. They say this because soaking them keeps them hydrated, which generally means that something else is lacking correct? Again while the ability to burrow may not be a "requirement" they do burrow in the wild. Mine burrows on a daily basis. Is reptile carpet going to kill a beardie? NO, but is it something that simulates a natural habitat? No. I believe it is up to keepers to provide the best enclosures possible for their animals. All my lizards are on bio-active substrate with rocks, branches etc, my snake is on the same setup without the "bio-active" aspect of it and since doing the switch they have all become more active, dig, explore etc.

I personally use paper towels and then I give Harley a towel as her floor. She loves it and usually will just stretch out and go sexy legs(when they stretch their back legs out straight, showing you some leg) and usually watch tv lol. Towels are easy as I just throw them in the washer ones a week and bam, clean. Of course Harley refuses to poop in her cage and will pace like crazy when she has to go poop. So I take her out and let her soak and she drops a huge deuce. She only poops once a week though so I guess im lucky.

I'm not a lizard expert but isn't a reptile not being able to go to the bathroom a sign of dehydration? If an animal isn't able to poop because it's dehydrated couldn't that contribute to these impactions that everyone is always going on about?

Bioactive dirt is always better for lizards. Always. Obviously you can keep a beardie on paper towels etc. but bioactive dirt will always be better (assuming the rest of their care is correct as well).

To the op. If you go this route, here's a bit more info. http://www.varanustalk.com/forum/index.php?pageid=Dirt

For a beardie, I'd recommend around 60-70% good topsoil and 30-40% sand. if you are debating between the carpet, tile, or towels, go with tile. It's up to you and how much effort you want to put in in the long run.


Jhill001 with lizards there can be a lot of things keeping them from going, such as low heat, or bad substrate. It mostly depends on the setup.

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Originally Posted by Daniel.michelle

Bioactive dirt is always better for lizards. Always. Obviously you can keep a beardie on paper towels etc. but bioactive dirt will always be better (assuming the rest of their care is correct as well).

To the op. If you go this route, here's a bit more info. http://www.varanustalk.com/forum/index.php?pageid=Dirt

For a beardie, I'd recommend around 60-70% good topsoil and 30-40% sand. if you are debating between the carpet, tile, or towels, go with tile. It's up to you and how much effort you want to put in in the long run.


Jhill001 with lizards there can be a lot of things keeping them from going, such as low heat, or bad substrate. It mostly depends on the setup.

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Obviously if a reptile eats something REALLY big its bad but it seems like every substrate has caused an impaction at some point.

more often than not, an animal will eat a bit of dirt, then something in there care is wrong, like too cold, which makes the lizard unable to pass the ingested substrate and the lizard passes away. The substrate is what is blamed but is not the cause. But obviously if they eat a rock or a piece of bark, that would be difficult to pass through and should be avoided.

(Rant warning)
I keep pointing at heat as a main cause because a lot of bearded dragons and many other lizards (mainly monitors) are kept too cold. I live in Michigan where mother nature is on menopause and the seasons are drunk. It got up to 75°F for a day after one of the coldest winters here. That day I took out my temp gun and pointed it at the front porch, 102° as a basking spot (which is about where most care sheets suggest as good). that's spring in michigan, imagine the basking Temps where they actually come from in Australia(it's way hotter). far too many keepers keep them just warm enough to be easy to manage, but not warm enough for proper immune system function etc. And it often gets blamed on the substrate for a misconception.

Isn't the proper temp for a basking spot around 120 or so?

personally that would be my "at least" temp.
I see all the time websites saying "no more than 110" etc. It just bugs me. Even reptiles magazine sas "Bearded dragons like it hot. A basking site of about 100 degrees Fahrenheit works well for them." 100 is not hot at all (In terms of basking)

Sorry, this got a little off topic from substrate.

My opinion is hotter is always better as long as the thermal gradient is correct.

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Originally Posted by Daniel.michelle

personally that would be my "at least" temp.
I see all the time websites saying "no more than 110" etc. It just bugs me. Even reptiles magazine sas "Bearded dragons like it hot. A basking site of about 100 degrees Fahrenheit works well for them." 100 is not hot at all (In terms of basking)

Sorry, this got a little off topic from substrate.

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Yeah but can't we say that improper heat is probably one of the main contributing factors in terms of impactions. Proper heat makes every substrate more safe.

That is exactly true. If a lizard (or really any reptile. I'm just more experienced with lizards) is not properly heated, they cannot digest as fast, if at all. It's almost like if we tried eating without stomach acid. It just wouldn't work.

if you get into monitor lizards, they need crazy high basking spots (My savs bask comfortably at 146-150.) Tons of people go onto forums freaking out cuz they ate a mouthful of dirt. As long as they are heated properly, there is almost no risk of impaction. My lizards all like rolling their food in the dirt and mud. And my savs love drinking up mud puddles while I spray the tank(And they have a big water tub too)

What methods do you use to get the spot that high?

3 flood lights (45 watts, par 38) About a foot from the basking spot. I use flood lights for almost all my basking spots. They are very efficient compared to spot bulbs. They make a far better gradient.