PVC Owners - How Do You Heat?

Just out of curiosity. I'd always assumed I'd need two sources of heat for my upcoming AP T-10 purchase, but now I'm seeing a lot of mixed opinions about RHP vs. UTH vs. both. Quite a lot of heated debate a few years back about the merits of RHPs! For PVC enclosure owners specifically: How do you heat your enclosure? (Nothing against rack/tank/tub owners, you've already had some polls on the subject...)

I've gone through about 4 years worth of posts and haven't seen this poll before. Apologies if it's a common topic! Feel free to link me to previous discussions if you feel they're helpful.

I use both considering my room is on the cooler side and no way I could stand room being warmer then 72. UTH at 90 and rhps Heat enclosure to 80-82 degrees

Thanks, I think I'm in the same boat. However, Mr. Misha and Sauzo had some interesting comments about using an RHP alone (installed on one side to produce a temp gradient). Given it's been a few years since the early RHP vs. UTH discussions, I was curious to know what most people were using!

I didn't vote, because my cages are for lizards and I wired bulbs inside, I don't have RHPs but looked into them for lizards, what I found in talking with others is that they can work well in a 1ft tall snake cage where basking temps are lower than some lizard requirements.

I just use an RHP for my ball pythons PVC cage. He has the perfect temp gradient and I never have to worry about the temperature in his cage. I have a Pro Products RHP and when before you buy one you fill out a little questionnaire about what animal your heating, the high/low temps of your home, where you will be keeping the animal in your home etc. Then he tells you which RHP would be best for your specific needs and that's the one you buy. It's a little tricky getting it set up but with some fiddling and help from people on this site you'll get everything set up :) my temp gradient is about 90 on top of the warm side hide, about 88-89 inside the hide and the cool side is usually around 78.

I heat my entire room with a oil heater. I do this because my cages would not get warm enough with the RHPs that are in them. I have 4ft x 2ft x 18in cages that have both uth and rhp but the rhp would not give the needed temps. Now I heat the room and run the uth. If it gets cold I will also turn the rhp on. Just in case the temps need a boost.

Knowing what I know now I would have skipped the rhp and only got the uth.

I've got two 3x2 pvc cages, one taller one with flexwatt and heat light, the shorter one just has flexwatt. I just ordered more 3x2 and a stack of four footers with heat panels and max flexwatt since I live in a cold climate and keep my house cool. Not yet sure if this will do the trick but planning on adding a room heater if not.


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Interesting, I wonder what would create such different results between KMG and AlexisFitzy. AlexisFitzy, what are your ambient room temps? I wonder if the RHP works better for you because your room is warmer. Maybe it's a brand/materials thing? Or the amount of "heatable objects" within the enclosure?

Bob at pro products requests detailed info on your setup. He uses this info to choose the best RHP for your situation.

As far as I know other manufacturers don't do this.

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Originally Posted by tbowman

Bob at pro products requests detailed info on your setup. He uses this info to choose the best RHP for your situation.

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That is correct. I spoke to him and took his suggestion but it just didn't warm the entire cage like I wanted. When it was high enough to warm the entire cage the hotspot was too hot. He does know his stuff and is very helpful.

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Originally Posted by thejennabird

Interesting, I wonder what would create such different results between KMG and AlexisFitzy. AlexisFitzy, what are your ambient room temps? I wonder if the RHP works better for you because your room is warmer. Maybe it's a brand/materials thing? Or the amount of "heatable objects" within the enclosure?

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I have ProProducts RHPs. I think it has to do with the fact that my cages are huge and I like my house cool. I like it around 68 so it was just to much for the rhp alone.

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Originally Posted by KMG

When it was high enough to warm the entire cage the hotspot was too hot.

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I wondered about that as well. Or the top of hides getting too warm compared to temps inside the "hot hide".

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Originally Posted by KMG

I have ProProducts RHPs. I think it has to do with the fact that my cages are huge and I like my house cool. I like it around 68 so it was just to much for the rhp alone.

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Out of curiosity, how tall are we talking? Wonder if the problems would be better or worse with lower (15"-ish) heights.

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Originally Posted by KMG

That is correct. I spoke to him and took his suggestion but it just didn't warm the entire cage like I wanted. When it was high enough to warm the entire cage the hotspot was too hot. He does know his stuff and is very helpful.

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Ah wasn't sure which RHPs you had.

Agreed they don't do the greatest job by themselves in larger cages. Mine is in a 6 x 3 x 18. I also heat the room with a radiator and use the RHP primarily for the hotspot. I don't see there being any problems in a smaller enclosure.

A lot of nice info here. I'm starting of with racks but will eventually move to larger enclosures. Good to know this ahead of time.

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Originally Posted by thejennabird

I wondered about that as well. Or the top of hides getting too warm compared to temps inside the "hot hide".

Edit:
Out of curiosity, how tall are we talking? Wonder if the problems would be better or worse with lower (15"-ish) heights.

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I just noticed the first time I said my cage sizes I said 4 x 2 x 18inchs, mine are actually 15 inches. I don't know why or how I hit 18. At 15 inches the rhp give me a great hotspot, they just don't give me the ambient temps I need on the other end of the cage.

I also have a 2ft x 2ft x 20inch cage for my GTP that has a RHP. The rhp did the same thing in this cage. It made the upper perches way to hot when you try to get the ambient temp within the ideal range.

In all of these I settled for using the oil heater for the ambient temps and just using the rhp for hotspots.

I also had another issue with them. I have three large cages stacked and when you start to raise the temp of the rhp they heat the floor of the cage above it. So this means the rhp in the cage heats the floor but the other rhp in the cage below also heats the floor. This made the temps hard to control and forced me to keep the rhp at a lower temp.

I also tried different hides and objects in the cages but when your housing a 5.5 ft and 30 pound Blood nothing stays in place and she does with her hide as she pleases.

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Originally Posted by KMG

I just noticed the first time I said my cage sizes I said 4 x 2 x 18inchs, mine are actually 15 inches.

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Duh me, just noticed you specified your cage sizes the first time! Sorry for that. Thanks for all your info! This was super-informative, and gives me a lot to think about.

Like I said before, I just use a RHP in my 48x23x14. I keep the room around 75F so it's easy keeping the cage in the 80s to low 90. Snakes don't need belly heat as long as the ambient is warm enough. My 6ft BCI has never had a UTH, just RHP and she has grown like a weed. Went from a little 18" baby to now 6ft. She is kind of chunky but that's cause I have overfed her a little. If you want belly heat, just throw a flat rock under the RHP and it will heat right on up and provide even more ambient warm air. The RHP I use is a Pro Products PH3 65 watt. When I get my AP cage, i'll do the same thing, just a RHP. I tend to like to have thick substrate to give my snakes something to "dig" into. My BCI likes to make a round divet and curl up in it and just leave her head out. Plus the deeper substrate soaks up more of the river she makes when she goes piss.

Also remember a UTH isn't going to heat the air so if you cant get the cool side high enough, you probably need a bigger RHP or you need to insulate the floor of the cage. Bob at Pro Products told me to put down about a 1/2-1" sheet of rigid insulation between the table and the cage. I did it for awhile but after doing a big cage cleaning where I tore it all down and cleaned each piece, I just put it back on the table with no insulation as it doesn't get cold enough for me since it didn't really look good.

Now don't get me wrong, I use a UTH in my glass cage for my BP but that's because we all know glass is a bad insulator but PVC cages, again I don't see the point. But hey, each to their own and if you feel better with it, go for it :)

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Originally Posted by thejennabird

Interesting, I wonder what would create such different results between KMG and AlexisFitzy. AlexisFitzy, what are your ambient room temps? I wonder if the RHP works better for you because your room is warmer. Maybe it's a brand/materials thing? Or the amount of "heatable objects" within the enclosure?

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My ambient room temps in the winter are around 68-70 so my RHP barely has to do any work to get temps in the proper range. My cage is also on the smaller side. Placing the thermostat probe in the right spot is a huge thing when it comes to your RHP being effective or not. When I first got it I put it in the wrong place and the temps would never get to right range, but with some help from the member on this site they helped me get everything worked out.

I heat my room to 80 degrees, and offer a hot spot using heat tape (UTH).