Do snakes overeat?

I fed my BP on Saturday one adult mouse. Yesterday he was still in feed mode, so I fed him his second adult mouse (I feed two every two weeks.) Today, he was STILL in feed mode, so I got a frozen adult mouse from the pet store (figuring if he's hungry, he'll eat it, if not I'll take it out and toss or refreeze it. He has never eaten f/t for me before.) Before it hit the bottom of the tank, he had himself wrapped around the mouse. I know 3 mice isn't considered overeating for a snake his size, and now that I know he will eat f/t I will be moving to rats.

Will snakes overeat? I know they are opportunistic eaters, but he always had his fill with two, and if I offered him a third he'd ignore it.

He is roughly 4 years old. Approx. 4ft long (not sure about weight).

If he is still aggressive in a few days should I try feeding him more or just not handle him until next feed (two weeks)?

Weight is really gonna be the most accurate way to figure it out. The guideline I've seen most often is to feed a prey item (or equivalent multiple smaller items) equal to 10 - 15% the snakes body weight. Two weeks is also a long time to go between meals, and one mouse is NOT gonna be a satisfactory meal unless it's a pretty big one. You might find these charts helpful. General guideline for what to be feeding by weight and prey sizing equivalent.

No no, I feed two large mice. Every one to two weeks (when we rescued him the previous owner fed him that way, and he was my first ball so I didn't find it odd.) I used to have a RTB and she only ate once a month, so I thought it normal. I can't weigh him until he stops striking at me. But if I had to guess (from the last time I held him) I'd say 3-5 lbs?

Well that's good it ate a f/t. You need to find out the snakes weight and feed appropriate sized meals. After starting that I would stick to a feed schedule and see how the snake starts acting.

Place a towel over it and then pick it up. That or just pick it up and let it learn you are not there to hurt it and will not be deterred by a lil bite.

He's between 1360.8 and 2268 grams. (I know it's a large margin, but its hard for me to weigh him without getting bit right now.) The mice I've been feeding him are roughly 20 grams a piece (so 60 grams total)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

He's between 1360.8 and 2268 grams. (I know it's a large margin, but its hard for me to weigh him without getting bit right now.) The mice I've been feeding him are roughly 20 grams a piece (so 60 grams total)

---

You just did your own math. Even at your lowest eyeball estimate 60 g is not anywhere close to 10% of body weight. If you're right, you would need to double that.

Okay, 136 is roughly one med/large rat. So should I give him a 60g prey animal tomorrow? Or wait? I'm afraid to feed him four separate times

To answer your question, yes snakes can over eat. They are opportunistic eaters and will eat when they get the chance to an extent. I mean if you feed a baby snake 4 mice, it will eventually get full to where it wont take more but in a couple days when those mice digest, he would take more. That is partially why adult snakes can get overweight. My red tail will eat pretty much anytime you offer her food be it 2 days or 2 weeks.

Also like some others have said, once your snake gets to adulthood, the 10-15% rule doesn't really apply anymore. You just feed them something that is about their girth usually every week or so for a BP. My red tail boa eats a large rat every 2 weeks or when she goes into hunt mode and starts patrolling the cage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

Okay, 136 is roughly one med/large rat. So should I give him a 60g prey animal tomorrow? Or wait? I'm afraid to feed him four separate times

---

How large is your BP??!! My red tail boa who is 5ft+ eats a large rat once every 2 weeks. Unless your BP is a BIG girl, I couldn't imagine a large rat for them.

The "gourmet rodents" brand they had at the pet store says their approx for an adult mouse is 18g, possibly heavier. I will weigh him in a few days, after he's had the chance to digest. I'll then have a much better idea of how much to feed him.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sauzo

How large is your BP??!! My red tail boa who is 5ft+ eats a large rat once every 2 weeks. Unless your BP is a BIG girl, I couldn't imagine a large rat for them.

---

He's a big boy, I am estimating his weight because I can't get an exact weight with the way he's acting.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sauzo

How large is your BP??!! My red tail boa who is 5ft+ eats a large rat once every 2 weeks. Unless your BP is a BIG girl, I couldn't imagine a large rat for them.

---

Length wise he's approx 4 ft.

Use a pillow case as a snake bag. Place it over the snake and pick it up where the snake ends up inside. Then give the top a few twist and you can easily weigh your snake without getting tagged.

I would if our kitchen scale wasn't MIA. (I have no idea how things like that go missing, but they do). I'll go purchase a new one from Walmart tomorrow!

It's possible that he's less than 3 lbs. He just like to hang out with his head in my hand, and my arm up, so he gets heavy, fast. I have a regular scale that I can use to weigh him in lbs temporarily.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

It's possible that he's less than 3 lbs. He just like to hang out with his head in my hand, and my arm up, so he gets heavy, fast. I have a regular scale that I can use to weigh him in lbs temporarily.

---

That'll work. Then you can google pounds to grams and convert.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lizardlicks

That'll work. Then you can google pounds to grams and convert.

---

1 lb is roughly like 486 grams or something.

If he's 2200 grams, I would guess you need to step up to a small rat or probably 3-4 adult mice. Like I said though, at adult ages, the whole 10-20% weight measurement goes out the window. That applies more to babies as they eat much more often and are growing like weeds. Adults slow down a lot so you need more of a maintenance feeding schedule vs a growing feeding schedule. At Big Cheese Rodents, their adult mice weigh between 19-29 grams while their small rats weigh between 50-89 grams to give you an idea.

Well, I can't weigh him right now anyways. He ate less than 4 hours ago and he does have a habit of regurgitating (hence feeding him in his tank). So what I'll do is tomorrow or the next day I will weigh him, and check to see what 10-15% of his weight is. If the percentage and the "girth" method match in size of prey, I'll stick to that size of prey. If the two methods don't match, I'll pick a prey size between the two. I am also going to put him on a closer schedule if the percentage method points to staying with mice (which I doubt) and check for signs of weight loss.

Well its kind of tricky because if your snake is overweight already, then judging the size of the food by either its girth or weight will give you false readings and you will keep overfeeding it and just increase its girth and weight and keep feeding larger and larger if that makes sense. My advice personally would start with a small rat and then wait till he takes a poop or goes into hunting mode and starts looking around for food. Then you can adjust based on that.

He isn't overweight. He's been having two mice every two weeks for the last 7 months. From what ive heard, and the way he's acting, I feel I've been UNDER feeding him if anything (which makes me feel completely negligent). He is acting as if he hasn't eaten in weeks (I keep a very strict schedule).

If he is regurgitating, it might be too many mice or too big of an item or the cage is too cold. I've feed my 8 week old baby BP a 28 gram rat and she weighed 138 grams at the time. It looked like she ate a football and she pretty much went into a food coma on the spot and slowly slithered into her warm hide. She got it down and didn't regurgitate luckily but regurgitating for a snake is a very uncomfortable ordeal so I would wait a week before you feed again so the snake has time to replenish his stomach acids.

You're better off starting with a smaller meal and watching how he acts, does he go into hunt mode in 2 days or 1 week etc. Then you can adjust the size based on that as snakes tend to not like to expend energy unless needed so if he is out hunting and looking for food at night, it probably means hes hungry

Yeah if he is 2200 grams or around there, 2 adult mice every 2 weeks is underfeeding. That's ok though, just up it slowly till you find the happy size. Easier to correct underfeeding than overfeeding. My red tail boa lived luxury and was feed every week on medium rats. She is now pretty fat and now I gotta do tough love and like I said, cut her down to 1 medium rat every 2 weeks or when she takes a poop and is empty for a few days so I can slowly get her to lose weight. Its harder as with no food, any animals body goes into conservation mode and starts to hoard every calorie since it thinks its starving and thus losing weight is even harder. And its even harder as she is a lap snake who loves to have her head and body rubbed and come out and sit on me while I do stuff around the house or go outside so I feel bad cutting down her food :P

He only ever regurgitated when I put him in a feeder box. So just once. Never since then. For a few days he was very active, and defensive. Then I fed him, he went into his hide and was still aggressive. Fed him again and still seemed to be acting off. So I fed a f/t and he ate that, and still hasn't regurgitated. So I don't think I overfed him. My concern is he will never go back to his docile self.

He will probably become docile again. Just give him time because like I said, regurgitating for a snake is primarily a defensive move and is very stressful and hard on the snake. So he might still be upset from it. I would slowly just work with him to get him to trust you. And also as you learned, feeding outside the cage isn't the best idea. I mean it was old school thought and mostly applied to big snakes with really strong feeding responses like burms and retics and big boas like suris, Peruvians or large Colombian girls. But its been pretty much debunked as trying to move a snake that big after it fed can be dangerous as they can stay in feed mode for hours. As long as you handle your snake or open the cage for something other than feeding, they wont get conditioned to think anytime the cage is opened, food will be put in. I've feed my 5ft+ red tail boa in her cage forever but like I said, I take her out regularly so the only time she goes into feed mode is when she can actually smell a rat.

He regurgitated 7 months ago when I got him. Not recently.

Oh, well that's different then. Well in that case, you might have to do tough love and just pick him up regardless. Maybe he has learned that if he puffs up or strikes or whatever he does, it will make you leave him alone so that gets conditioned into them and they do that whenever you try and pick them up. That's why when babies try to bite, hiss or strike, you just suck it up and keep picking them up so they learn that stuff like that wont work. With a big boy like yours, you might need to wear gloves til you can break him of that habit or suck it up and go bare hand :P After a while he will probably learn it doesn't work anymore and that in fact you wont hurt him and he will mellow out.

Good idea. I don't know where he got that idea from. The fish must be whispering secrets to him at night or something. I haven't had this issue in the 7months I've had him

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

He isn't overweight. He's been having two mice every two weeks for the last 7 months. From what ive heard, and the way he's acting, I feel I've been UNDER feeding him if anything (which makes me feel completely negligent). He is acting as if he hasn't eaten in weeks (I keep a very strict schedule).

---

He will probably calm down when he isn't hungry anymore... My 600-1200 gram bp's eat small rats once a week.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

I would if our kitchen scale wasn't MIA. (I have no idea how things like that go missing, but they do).!

---

Must have females living in that house. :oops:

(I'm not being rude. It's just that in my house, things stopped going MIA once the females left.) :rolleye2:

If he's really 2200 grams try a medium rat instead of multimple mice. If he takes it, leave him alone for a few days to digest and then handle him. If he's not ravenously hungry he may have a whole different attitude.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reinz

Must have females living in that house. :oops:

(I'm not being rude. It's just that in my house, things stopped going MIA once the females left.) :rolleye2:

---

LOL that logic doesn't work when the females are also the snake keepers. My husbands the chef in the house, if the scale or the temp gun is missing I can guarantee you who took it :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reinz

Must have females living in that house. :oops:

(I'm not being rude. It's just that in my house, things stopped going MIA once the females left.) :rolleye2:

---

No, unfortunately we had druggies living in our house.

1132 grams if I weighed him right. (Put him in a makeshift snake bag and bowl, subtracted the weight of each). Took the opportunity to clean his tank while he was out for weighing. He is investigating and enjoying laying in the fresh water (81.8 f). I'm enjoying my new non-contact thermomer and scale (Christmas present to muhself) and also enjoying my very , apparently, better feeling snake. Still hasn't checked out the new hide, but little bits at a time.

And I spoke too soon. Into his new hide he went!!

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14...d1c1d70d51.jpg

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

1132 grams if I weighed him right.

---

I would offer a small rat every week.

I think the "gormet Rodent's" brand of frozen rats they have at the closest petshop, is like 120g for a med rat. So I'm either gonna do that, or try smaller and work my way up. I was extremely surprised he ate f/t for me. I am a very VERY proud momma right now. Lol.

I'm offering a medium rat (100g) every week and a half. I want to make sure he can eat it.

Do snakes overheat?

No.

People oversees them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skiploder

Do snakes overheat?

No.

People oversees them.

---

Over EAT. Not overheat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skiploder

Do snakes overheat?

No.

People oversees them.

---

I know that snakes can overheat. I'm not a complete moron. My concern was that I had already fed my snake 5 mice over the course of 5 days and he was still acting aggressive. I had finally gotten a scale and weighed him and found out I was underfeeding him before, so I bumped him up to rats yesterday. He now has had one big happy meal, and he is doing better

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

I know that snakes can overheat. I'm not a complete moron. My concern was that I had already fed my snake 5 mice over the course of 5 days and he was still acting aggressive. I had finally gotten a scale and weighed him and found out I was underfeeding him before, so I bumped him up to rats yesterday. He now has had one big happy meal, and he is doing better

---

Why do you think you are under feeding him? Most snakes are overfed...

What is the caloric requirement of a largely inactive ball python living in captivity?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skiploder

Why do you think you are under feeding him? Most snakes are overfed...

What is the caloric requirements of a largely inactive ball python living in captivity?

---

They are supposed to eat 10-15% of their bodyweight every 1 1/2 - 2 weeks. Monty was eating about 3%. I've corrected the problem and he is now eating a 100g rat every week and a half (still smaller than what he should be eating, but the next size up is 180g). He weighs approx. 1138g. He should be eating 113.8 - 160.0g.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

They are supposed to eat 10-15% of their bodyweight every 1 1/2 - 2 weeks. Monty was eating about 3%. I've corrected the problem and he is now eating a 100g rat every week and a half (still smaller than what he should be eating, but the next size up is 180g). He weighs approx. 1138g. He should be eating 113.8 - 160.0g.

---

Ah.

Do they snakes know they are supposed to be eating 10 to 15% of their body weight?

Is this for all snake species?

Is it dependent on enclosure size?

Activity level?

I'd love to know how this percentage is calculated or how it was arrived at.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skiploder

Ah.

Do they snakes know they are supposed to be eating 10 to 15% of their body weight?

Is this for all snake species?

Is it dependent on enclosure size?

Activity level?

I'd love to know how this percentage is calculated or how it was arrived at.

---

Less than 10-15% for a ball python (a generally inactive snake) can cause weight loss. To maintain body weight, a 10-15% intake is required. To add weight is 20% or more (for malnourished or baby snakes). The snake knows that if it doesn't eat at all, it will starve. If it eats less than what it should it will stay in hunting mode longer. So you're telling me that you have a ball python, and because it is inactive, you don't have to feed it? How do you calculate how much your snakes eat? What you believe is just enough to keep them going? Just like the AVERAGE caloric intake for a human is 2000 calories, some need more, some need less to survive. The difference between me and Monty is that when I feel hungry I can walk into the kitchen and open the fridge. He has no way to tell me he is hungry other than to strike.

I'm new here but even I can tell that Skiploder is being facetious with his remarks lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mykuhl

I'm new here but even I can tell that Skiploder is being facetious with his remarks lol.

---

I'm well aware. If he wants to ask smartass questions he will get smartass answers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

Less than 10-15% for a ball python (a generally inactive snake) can cause weight loss. To maintain body weight, a 10-15% intake is required. To add weight is 20% or more (for malnourished or baby snakes). The snake knows that if it doesn't eat at all, it will starve. If it eats less than what it should it will stay in hunting mode longer. So you're telling me that you have a ball python, and because it is inactive, you don't have to feed it? How do you calculate how much your snakes eat? What you believe is just enough to keep them going? Just like the AVERAGE caloric intake for a human is 2000 calories, some need more, some need less to survive. The difference between me and Monty is that when I feel hungry I can walk into the kitchen and open the fridge. He has no way to tell me he is hungry other than to strike.

---

I'm not sure snakes do know that actually...

I was told that if they can't easily curl up in a tight ball, they are overweight.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MontyAndMelissa

Less than 10-15% for a ball python (a generally inactive snake) can cause weight loss. To maintain body weight, a 10-15% intake is required. To add weight is 20% or more (for malnourished or baby snakes). The snake knows that if it doesn't eat at all, it will starve.

---

More to the point, using your percentage rule, how do you explain wild-caught adult ball pythons that may go 12-24 months before taking their first meal in captivity that lose very little weight during this extended fast?