New bp still won't eat! Not settling in ? Scared/shy ? Pics ...

Tried feeding him again tonite but still no luck, had him 2-3 weeks tried food twice now, only handled him once since I've had him. He almost looks too scared to even move around his enclosure, he does not seem happy to move around, I've never seen him unless I lift his hide up! Are bp's really so shy and scared of things or is mine worse than usual ??
I've included pics to see if he looks healthy and not underweight ?
Many thanks

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He is beautiful and you have a great set up...BUT IMO his tank is just too large for him right now. Maybe you could divide it in half for awhile or add even more plants for cover? But I personally would temporarily move him into a small tub til he was eating and less shy? And maybe try a really small live mouse after he settles first to jump start his appetite? I also have the same hide but my girl is a whopping 450g and its stuffed with moss so she feels secure, so maybe a much smaller hide to start. They like it to be small enough that they touch the sides.
But I'm just starting out this year so maybe some more experienced keepers could suggest something.

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Hi.... I did want to keep him in a tub but I just can't heat one to the required temps, it's only 18" wide so thought he would be ok. If I remove his hide he just refuses to move around even though you can see he wants to! He also looks like he is interested in the food , looks like he is about to strike but then he looks spooked and turns away looking for a place to hide his head.
Sometimes at certain angles he looks lumpy / bumpy and his spine seems a little sharp but you know I'm no expert! I'm just a bit worried about him, as he seems so scared.
The one time I handled him last week, he let me pick him up just fine and was not acting scared at all, happily explored me whilst I had him out, seemed confidant even?
thanks

Why can't you heat a tub? Get a heat pad and a thermostat and a tub. Done.

If you can heat that big enclosure, you can heat a little shoebox sized tub.

I can't attach this 75w reptile radiator to the roof of a tub, think it will melt!
I would quite happily put him in a tub, mat and stat job done ( for the hotspot ) but my house is around 71f now correct me if I'm wrong but I've read numerous times that the ambient temp needs to be nearer 80f?

Well of course you can't mount the heat panel into the tub. You'll have to get a heat pad.

Maybe heat the enclosure you have now to 80f, put the shoebox inside and heat one quarter of THAT to 89f with a uth, keep the snake and water bowl and a hide in the shoebox.

If your snake is scared that will help.

Also you casn try getting it to start eating by cup feeding with a live rat pink or something else that is unable to hurt the snake. Make sure the delicup is opaque and has air holes, or use a breathable brown paper bag. Leave overnight. No guarantees but works great if the reason is fear.

Also don't stay there and watch it. I have snakes that won't eat anything until I gave up and left the f/t rodent there, as soon as I left the room, it ate. Came back an hour later rat was gone. This was after months of trying to get it to eat.

Yeah I may have to try a tub inside the viv, I may try cluttering up the viv floor first to see if that helps before I move the snake to a tub. Can I try a smaller or different prey as I won't be feeding live.
thanks

What have you tried to feed him? And how are you doing it?

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Originally Posted by Smith123

I can't attach this 75w reptile radiator to the roof of a tub, think it will melt!
I would quite happily put him in a tub, mat and stat job done ( for the hotspot ) but my house is around 71f now correct me if I'm wrong but I've read numerous times that the ambient temp needs to be nearer 80f?

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If you have a hot spot around 90F, the ambient in your house can go down into the 70's. Mine are in a rack, the hotspots are all 87 to 89 most of the time, and my room temps are 70 (at night) to 74 or 75 during the day.

I'm trying to feed rat pups I think they are called , I got a few with the snake. I tried dangling the rat, he goes towards it in the strike position then changes his mind? I then left it in the cage for two hours but never touched it......

Those temps are interesting in your rack, how long have you had them at that temp, people usually get shot down quickly when anything below 75-78f is mentioned, are yours healthy at that temp ? I can achieve probably 73-74f if I use the tub aswell as the 88-90 hotspot .

We hold ours a lot. I particularly hold the ones we get in that are more skiddish at least twice as much as the others. I hold them at least 2 times a day for about 30 minutes each time (morning and evening). That probably won't be a popular answer either but all my snakes are healthy, eat weekly, and are not shy by any means...

Would more handling make him more confidant in the viv though? I was going to leave him until he has eaten, but at this rate he isn't going to be handled for a good while!

I handle mine a lot too. Not popular but they start to accept your not going to eat them and relax generally


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Smith123

I'm trying to feed rat pups I think they are called , I got a few with the snake. I tried dangling the rat, he goes towards it in the strike position then changes his mind? I then left it in the cage for two hours but never touched it......

Those temps are interesting in your rack, how long have you had them at that temp, people usually get shot down quickly when anything below 75-78f is mentioned, are yours healthy at that temp ? I can achieve probably 73-74f if I use the tub aswell as the 88-90 hotspot .

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I usually have best luck feeding exactly the same way the breeder was feeding, before switching to something else. For example - if they were feeding mice hoppers, I feed mice for a few feedings while they get settled in. If they were on live rat pups, I would feed live rat pups.


Are you trying dead rat pups and dangling in front? If so - I would try a live rat pup. Sometimes hatchlings are finicky and the "right" temp and behavior of a live rodent will do the trick. Also - if they haven't been eating rats, try a live hopper or small adult mouse. Mice have a different scent than rats and can often help. You can convert over to rats or frozen/thawed later, once they are regularly eating in their new home.

Yes they were feeding him rat pups so that's what I'm sticking with, defrosted , warmed up rats yes dangling then leaving. I'm not prepared to feed live really . Interestingly when I handled him at the breeder before purchase there was a rat in with him that he obviously hadn't eaten the evening before but they assured me he was not a 'problem' feeder.

Well, if you aren't ready to try live yet (though i do encourage it - especially rat pups, since they don't bite or chew like mice), then here's something you might try.

Feed at night time. Make sure the rat pup is thoroughly thawed. Then heat it up with a blow drier and use a temp gun to make sure he's about 100 degrees or warmer on the head. Put the rat pup in their den or hide and leave it over night. You can either have the BP out of it's hide, where he'll find the rat pup when he goes back in it later. Or you can gently lay the rat pup inside the opening with the BP already in it.

Bps are ambush hunters and the above will often work (and has often worked for me). So has putting a fresh killed or thawed pray and the snake together in a paper bag inside their tank...check in the morning, and the food is gone. :)

Also - if you haven't read this article - it's great. I wouldn't consider yours a "Problem Feeder" yet, but this offers some insights and temps that might be helpful...
http://jkrballstreetjournal.com/2014...-eating-again/

A very interesting read thanks! The advise about moving them to a different tub bigger or smaller each week if necessary, cleaning the whole tub out etc.... A lot of that goes against many things I've read about bp's being upset if you move them, touch them even look at them too much! I would of thought moving them around to get them to feed would make the problem worse ? Maybe not?
I think I will try the leaving to prey in over night next week when I try again .... To be honest there that many options I don't know what to try for the best!

He was kept on kitchen roll/paper towel substrate but I put aspen down , would that make any difference? If I leave the rat in overnight on floor I worry he may ingest aspen too ?

As long as his current tank and bedding isn't dirty (pee and poop in various places), I recommend leaving him where he is for now. He's not a sub-adult or adult that has become a problem feeder, so I wouldn't go to those extremes yet.

But I would definitely try feeding at night, placing the rat in the hide, and leaving it over night. Snakes are fed on aspen shavings all the time and occasionally ingest some, and it's not a problem. Their digestive system breaks down bone and fur and feathers and what not, so it can handle a little sliver of aspen that might get in there. :)

If you have a frozen rat pup - some people also recommend letting it thaw on top of the cage where the snake can start smelling the scent. Then later, it finds it and boom - it wants to eat it.

Just some ideas based on experience. While we recognize patterns and certain things tend to work, every animal is an individual, so we just have to be patient and work with them and see what works for them...

Good luck. Hang in there. He looks healthy still and they can go quite a while without food, so no need to worry yet. :)

Ok, so your setup is fine. There is no need to move him into a small tub. I have had a hatchling (straight from the egg) in a 180 gallon PVC enclosure for a year and he hasn't missed even 1 meal.

You need to make sure that husbandry is correct, and that they have a place to hide, and it sounds like you've provided that.

Often times young Ball Pythons won't eat frozen food, its just the way it is. Eventually you can switch them over to f/t easily, but as young snakes its better to stick to live. I'd offer a live rat pup to your snake. Feed the snake at night, around 10PM, when it's been dark for a few hours. Once you put it in, leave it along till the following morning.

Continue not to handle the snake, that is the correct thing to do. My general rule is, "No handling until the snake has had 3 meals in a row"

As stated I won't feed live , he hasn't been fed live before for the first six months of his life so I don't see a need for it now but thanks for the advise .

His bedding isn't dirty as he hasn't done anything since I've had him...I did leave the rat to warm up on his viv for a few hours already but he doesn't so much as poke his head out! As I've said I never see him! Next week I will leave the rat in over night, and I won't handle him or move him in the mean time and see what happens next week!
Thanks again

I have a Female Mojave exactly the same size as yours
Miy snake is acting exactly like your snake she seems too scare and when i try to handle her she tries to hide and doesnt move
I got it three weeks ago and she didnt want to eat i tried live pinky and she finally ate last night

I think you should try it
I was feeding her frozen rat pups and she never take it i think it was to big for her im sure is the same problem with your snake

Try this and then let us now [emoji120]

My ball didn't eat for the first month after we brought him home, even though he was only 71g. He is/was in a bigger tank than yours, it just took him a few weeks. It actually got better when I started handling him more, rather than leaving him in his tank all the time. However, Stormy is kind of an odd ball. He sulks if I don't play with him often enough, lol

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Originally Posted by Fireproof

Make sure the rat pup is thoroughly thawed. Then heat it up with a blow drier and use a temp gun to make sure he's about 100 degrees or warmer on the head.

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This. Many times BPs won't recognize f/t prey as food because their person hasn't warmed it up enough. Here's what I'd recommend:

1. Leave a rat out to thaw in the snake room for a few hours. I take mine out of the freezer in the morning and feed at night.
2. Once thawed, set a hairdryer on the bathroom counter with the thawed rat in front of it (on a paper towel, head first) like it's staring at the front of the dryer.
3. Turn the dryer on and make sure the towel and the rat don't get blown off the counter.
4. Set a timer for 5 minutes and browse the forum for a bit until your timer goes off. Once it does, your rat will be nice and toasty for your little guy.
5. Do a little zombie dance for your BP and watch in amazement as the rat becomes dinner.
6. After you do a little happy dance, come back and share your results with the group!

:gj:

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

This. Many times BPs won't recognize f/t prey as food because their person hasn't warmed it up enough. Here's what I'd recommend:

1. Leave a rat out to thaw in the snake room for a few hours. I take mine out of the freezer in the morning and feed at night.
2. Once thawed, set a hairdryer on the bathroom counter with the thawed rat in front of it (on a paper towel, head first) like it's staring at the front of the dryer.
3. Turn the dryer on and make sure the towel and the rat don't get blown off the counter.
4. Set a timer for 5 minutes and browse the forum for a bit until your timer goes off. Once it does, your rat will be nice and toasty for your little guy.
5. Do a little zombie dance for your BP and watch in amazement as the rat becomes dinner.
6. After you do a little happy dance, come back and share your results with the group!

:gj:

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This is exactly what finally worked for me changing my picky girl to F/T...but live first to really get that feeding instinct going.


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I'm so glad I don't have feeding problems with mine.. Brought him home on a Saturday and handled him about 4-5 times before feed day.. And hasn't missed a meal yet but I do feed live mice. I move him to a seperate box and set the box with the mouse in it on the edge of the box to get him interested then drop it in and within a few seconds of dropping it in he has it gripped.. Then I let him eat and move him back 15-20 min after its down. Only reason I use different box is so the mouse isn't peeing or crapping in the enclosure

Thanks guys , certainly a few things to think about, maybe I didn't get the rat warm enough? I will try the hairdryer trick next time. So leave him where he is maybe? Don't move him to a smaller tub? I would keep him in a tub no problem if it was better for him, although I do worry about ambients in a tub as I think my house would be too cool which is a shame ....

Thought I'd be productive and weigh the little guy...... Around 60grams? I hope the breeder got his age wrong as that seems very light for 6mths old ? Is that weight possible at 6mths? Going to ring the breeder and double check!

Now cluttered up the viv some more and changed for lower hides for added security

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live hopper mouse. better that than a dead snake!


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Originally Posted by Rickys_Reptiles

Ok, so your setup is fine. There is no need to move him into a small tub. I have had a hatchling (straight from the egg) in a 180 gallon PVC enclosure for a year and he hasn't missed even 1 meal.

You need to make sure that husbandry is correct, and that they have a place to hide, and it sounds like you've provided that.

Often times young Ball Pythons won't eat frozen food, its just the way it is. Eventually you can switch them over to f/t easily, but as young snakes its better to stick to live. I'd offer a live rat pup to your snake. Feed the snake at night, around 10PM, when it's been dark for a few hours. Once you put it in, leave it along till the following morning.

Continue not to handle the snake, that is the correct thing to do. My general rule is, "No handling until the snake has had 3 meals in a row"

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This is excellent advice. As I was reading through the thread I was mentally cataloguing points and then I read this and this summed them up.

I agree, there is nothing wrong with your set up, as long as all of the husbandry parameters are correct.

Do not handle him more and as Ricky said, try live. If that doesn't work, try a different prey item of the same size.

They key here is to minimize stress. Snakes have individual temperaments. Some settle quickly, some take forever. What you need to keep in mind is that keeping snakes is all about reducing and limiting stress.

That means no changing things around and no weighing him...interaction needs to be at a minimum.

Well I have handled him again and moved him! As I rang the guy I bought him from and he said I must put him in the 9L rub/tub or he will not eat..... So I told him on the phone about my temp concern in a rub and he said as long as I have the correct hotspot over the mat then the ambient temp in the rest of the tub makes no difference? Which is my room temp around 71f. So that's what I've done. Try to feed again tomoro

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14...90713204f6.jpg

This is his rub


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It doesn't have to be his permanent home, just til he settles in and starts eating for you. I suspected this was what he was used to, which is why I mentioned it earlier. I'm sorry if, as a beginner myself, I insulted anyone by giving that advise. I don't like the tiny tub thing either but snakes seem to thrive in them. As my first BP grew I moved her into her current home. In due course we will be converting a couple of rooms to reptile habitats giving each one even more space.

My babies:
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14...dbb0593c01.jpg

My juvenile:

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14...a714a01827.jpg


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Yeah I will happily keep him in a rub if he is happy and eating. I only put him in a small viv as I felt it was the only way of getting the correct temps, since ive been told it's not a must to have the ambient as high as recommended on these forums then I will go with it, difficult for beginners like me as there lots of conflicting advise. Thanks for input

Actually the ambient temp is very important.

Ball pythons in the wild don't bask or use hot spots. They den where the ambient temp is suitable. Some keepers keep forego hot spots altogether. You have been given bad advice

You were given good advice by several people in this thread. Leave the animal alone, try a live prey item. Dial in your parameters.

You have ignored it. You have moved him and are now potentially keeping him at too low an ambient temp...

Good luck with that.

As I stated..... What is a beginner supposed to do!! Why would the breeder I got him from say temps will be fine? Why did I have a reply on this forum and on this thread from a keeper with low 70's ??
how many times do I need to state I will NOT feed live and there should not be a need to.
Hopefully he will feed tomoro or soon or the breeder said I've to take him back to get him eating again ...

Can you get a small space heater with a thermostat? I have a radiator style one that keeps the room at 78. The tubs stay at around 80-82 without lights, the viv needs a CHE to keep it at 80. But the heater does the main work. Yes it's a bit warm for us right now cuz they are in our bedroom but we are willing to deal with that for happy snakes.
And looking at his tub you will probably need more holes or the humidity is going to be crazy.
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Originally Posted by Smith123

I will NOT feed live and there should not be a need to...

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While I certainly respect this choice, sometimes the need to feed live is in the best interests of the animal. I prefer to feed frozen/thawed myself. However, I also know that not all animals will eat frozen/thawed consistently (or at all). If the decision is to feed live or have an animal that doesn't eat (or force feed), I'm feeding live every time. If you cannot make this same decision, then maybe this animal isn't the right animal for you.

Now, having said all of that, I absolutely wish you the best of luck! Remember, the snakes know what they need best - everyone else will just give you their opinions (based on varying levels of experience).

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

While I certainly respect this choice, sometimes the need to feed live is in the best interests of the animal. I prefer to feed frozen/thawed myself. However, I also know that not all animals will eat frozen/thawed consistently (or at all). If the decision is to feed live or have an animal that doesn't eat (or force feed), I'm feeding live every time. If you cannot make this same decision, then maybe this animal isn't the right animal for you.

Now, having said all of that, I absolutely wish you the best of luck! Remember, the snakes know what they need best - everyone else will just give you their opinions (based on varying levels of experience).

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Yep. Sometimes live is necessary - especially in hatchlings. I would suggest that getting him to eat is top priority, and it sounds like you have tried most other things, so this would be my next step. After he's taken a few live feedings under your care and is doing well in all respects, then you can transition to F/T.

Why are you so opposed to feeding live? Especially for just the short term?

Well I tried feeding again tonite after only two days of being in the tub, and he hit it instantly! Result!
I have seen a little bit more of him since the move too, more confident to come out for a look around, I left the rat on the heater radiator next to his tub to warm and he was cruising around smelling it. I can't believe the difference , he is a different snake. Goes to show the value of the small tub, even though the viv I first put him in was less than 2ft.
He is still cruising around now? Hours later, is he still hungry ? Should you or can you feed two rats at one sitting??

Thanks to all for the positive advise, hints and tips!
Hopefully he will keep on eating regularly.

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Originally Posted by Smith123

He is still cruising around now? Hours later, is he still hungry ?

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Their feeding response (especially when young) is pretty amazing. They're programmed to eat as much as they can when it's available - some stay in feeding mode for quite some time after a meal. Chances are he's not actually hungry (as you and I think of hunger). As long as his meal was of appropriate size for him, you're good.

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Originally Posted by Smith123

Should you or can you feed two rats at one sitting??

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You certainly can feed multiple animals in one sitting as long as the total amount eaten is an appropriate amount for his size. Anything more than that and he'll probably end up just pooping more or not eating consistently for you.

I'm hoping he eats consistently now so I will stick to 5day feeding and see how he does. The rat pup was probably just as wide as his mid body?
thanks

I have a pinstripe that I got from a breeder who kept her in a tub. I put her in a 20gal tank and she did not eat for 7 months. To my surprise she only lost about 10g total in those months. I tried every week for 5 months, then I literally stopped. Everything. I stopped going in her tank (only to change water) I stopped trying to feed. I painted three sides with black paint, and covered the unpainted side (front) with a towel and left her alone for 2 months. Until one day I decided to try again and she finally ate for me. She's been eating every week since August, sometimes 2 in one feeding.
I guess what I'm trying to say is keep trying once a week for a while. Keep the Viv dark and leave it alone. If still nothing, then I would stop trying to feed for a month or two.
I've heard of a ball going over a year without eating.


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He has now eaten again after another 5days and seems calm and content so hopefully he just had moving in stress and all is fine now 😀.....
I have to say after reading your post that sounds like animal cruelty to me! Yes I'm a reptile beginner but a massive animal lover. And as far as I'm concerned leaving your snake to go hungry for all those months before you decided to do something about the husbandry issues is not good enough nor is covering with a towel and not allowing the poor snake to see the light of day for two months!
Im glad i moved mine back into a small tub when I did as that way he didn't go without food too long. I will put him into a viv when he is a little bit more older and settled.