flexwatt heat.

I'm planning on getting a dumerils boa in October at the reptile expo and I was wondering if a flexwatt, regulated obviously, only on one side of the vivarium will heat the entire thing or if I'll need another heat source to keep the rest warm. Room temperature will be about 55-60 in winter and 70-76 in summer. I've never used a flexwatt before, only radiant sources(heat lamps and ches), but now I need to stack the cages so I can't use that for the cages with others on top of them, obviously.

Flexwatt won't be able to raise the ambient temps. It's only meant to provide belly heat in a designated area of the enclosure.

What kind of enclosures are you using? If you went with something along the lines of an animal plastics T8 you could use the flexwatt as well as a CHE and still be able to stack the enclosures.

I would try to keep them in a warmer room of the house. 60 in winter is too cold and it would be quite difficult to get your temps where they need to be even with additional supplemental heat.

Personally, I would select a room of the house to keep the snakes and put an oil-filled space heater (also on a t-stat) in the room. Keep the room temps at around 75 and your cages should be good with a controlled hot spot alone. :gj:

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Originally Posted by ginja ninja

Flexwatt won't be able to raise the ambient temps. It's only meant to provide belly heat in a designated area of the enclosure.

What kind of enclosures are you using? If you went with something along the lines of an animal plastics T8 you could use the flexwatt as well as a CHE and still be able to stack the enclosures.

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That's actually the exact one I'm using. Where would the che go?

Edit: we don't have any extra rooms for the snakes but I try to keep my room warmer for them, it's a bit difficult since my door can't shut all the way and I have two windows and a cat flap and everyone else in the house thinks they're going to melt if it gets above 65. I'll try to get a space heater and minimize heat loss.

I meant to say a radiant heat panel, sorry about that. The panel would attach to the top inside of the T8 i believe. However, I agree w/ Evenstar. Your best and safest bet would be to heat the entire room. If that is not an option though, a radiant heat panel could work.

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Originally Posted by ginja ninja

I meant to say a radiant heat panel, sorry about that. The panel would attach to the top inside of the T8 i believe. However, I agree w/ Evenstar. Your best and safest bet would be to heat the entire room. If that is not an option though, a radiant heat panel could work.

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Okay, that makes more sense. I'd also like my room hotter but everyone else just prefers it colder so, I'm out numbered three to one and no longer allowed to touch the thermostat.

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Originally Posted by TurkeyPython

Okay, that makes more sense. I'd also like my room hotter but everyone else just prefers it colder so, I'm out numbered three to one and no longer allowed to touch the thermostat.

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So add a space heater to that particular room so you don't have to touch the thermostat.

But a Radiant Heat Panel can help too. It is not the best or least expensive option though (see above). :gj:

Just use a radient heat panel instead of flexwatt. Its more expensive for the panel, but probably a whole lot cheaper then using a space heater. I like RHPs a lot. Creates a nice basking spot and ups the ambient temp of the whole cage

Sent from my SM-G730V using Tapatalk 2

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Originally Posted by CryHavoc17

Just use a radient heat panel instead of flexwatt. Its more expensive for the panel, but probably a whole lot cheaper then using a space heater. I like RHPs a lot. Creates a nice basking spot and ups the ambient temp of the whole cage

Sent from my SM-G730V using Tapatalk 2

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This is not a bad idea, but be aware that, like flexwatt, RHP's do NOT heat the ambient air temperature. They work using radiant heat which is directed downward and heats the surface immediately underneath the unit. So if your ambient temps are too low, an RHP will not help you - with or without flexwatt. The AIR temp will not be affected to a large degree at all. This is why I suggest the space heater for the room - that will adjust the AMBIENT temperature to the appropriate degree. :gj:

Additionally, you can buy a ceramic space heater for around $50-60 which will heat the entire room and all the cages within that room will be positively affected by it. A single RHP will run you roughly $65-85 and you'd need one for each cage. A space heater and an RHP both cost pennies to run if regulated by a t-stat. The amount saved off either unit in its operation is negligible. ;)

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

This is not a bad idea, but be aware that, like flexwatt, RHP's do NOT heat the ambient air temperature. They work using radiant heat which is directed downward and heats the surface immediately underneath the unit. So if your ambient temps are too low, an RHP will not help you

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That's COMPLETELY wrong! Not sure if you ever even had a RHP, but RHPs are made exactly to provide ambient heat for an enclosure.

OP: If you need to raise your ambient temp in you PVC enclosure, RHPs are a great way to go. Just make sure they're hooked up to a thermostat.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

That's COMPLETELY wrong! Not sure if you ever even had a RHP, but RHPs are made exactly to provide ambient heat for an enclosure.

OP: If you need to raise your ambient temp in you PVC enclosure, RHPs are a great way to go. Just make sure they're hooked up to a thermostat.

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Pardon me. I DO have RHPs. And I use several. I also have talked about them extensively with Rich at Reptile Basics and the good folks at Pro Products. Please do a little more research on the subject and please do not assume or make such strident accusations. Your response is rude.

Mr Misha, I shouldn't have to do your research for you, but here is some basic information.

From Reptile Basics:

"RHP's are similar to Ceramic Heat Emitters (CHE) - they both project IR (infra red) heat into the cage. Unlike CHE's that get very, very hot on their surface, these RHP's maintain temperatures safe to use inside the cage. This Infrared Heat tends to heat objects more than the air, much like the natural sunlight outdoors. This type of heat mimics real sunlight both in the direction it comes from and its penetration into the muscle tissue. IR heat has been shown to have a therapeutic effect on sick and injured animals as well. Your reptiles will spend less time basking and receive a much greater benefit from it."

From ProProducts:
"Radiant Panels replicate the sun’s direct radiant warmth from above that reptiles have evolved with, allowing them to properly thermo-regulate...."

Notice they use the terms "IR heat" and "radiant heat". Radiant heat (which IS IR heat) is like the sun's rays - it heats the surface below. There IS some minimal heating of the enclosure. Of course there is. Any heat source is going to affect the overall internal temps of the enclosure due to the enclosed and insulated space. But an RHP does not work well to heat the ambient air temperature, it just doesn't heat that way. Personally, I LOVE my RHPs. They are fantastic and I would like to switch all of my boas over to them instead of belly heat. Maybe one day.

I'm not trying to be rude here, but frankly I do not appreciate being talked to like I'm wet behind the ears. I see you have 5 snakes in your signature. Not sure how long you've been keeping reptiles and snakes in general, but I've been maintaining them for nearly 20 years and have almost 40 snakes. Most of them are boas. I also use RHPs in all of my Green Tree Python enclosures. Sorry, but I've been around the block just a few times. I do kinda know what I'm talking about here.

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

Pardon me. I DO have RHPs. And I use several. I also have talked about them extensively with Rich at Reptile Basics and the good folks at Pro Products. Please do a little more research on the subject and please do not assume or make such strident accusations. Your response is rude.

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If you've done your research, then you should know that RHPs are used to heat ambient air in enclosures.

My response is rude because I don't like when people speak about something they have no knowledge about and teach new members wrong information.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

If you've done your research, then you should know that RHPs are used to heat ambient air in enclosures.

My response is rude because I don't like when people speak about something they have no knowledge about and teach new members wrong information.

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And I do not do that. Ask anyone here about the kind of advice I give. You, sir, need to reconsider your approach.

See above. I showed you some research.

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

And I do not do that. Ask anyone here about the kind of advice I give. You, sir, need to reconsider your approach.

See above. I showed you some research.

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Are you serious??? RHP are mostly used to heat ambient air. I don't understand how you don't get that after reading the information you provided for "my" education. Think about it! What to the sun rays do? They heat the air. Right?

I am done with you. Leave it alone.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

If you've done your research, then you should know that RHPs are used to heat ambient air in enclosures.

My response is rude because I don't like when people speak about something they have no knowledge about and teach new members wrong information.

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Wow.... perhaps you should check into a bit of Kali's posts. She is very knowledgeable. And very helpful. And someone I would 100% trust for sound advice. And there is no need for being rude.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Misha

If you've done your research, then you should know that RHPs are used to heat ambient air in enclosures.

My response is rude because I don't like when people speak about something they have no knowledge about and teach new members wrong information.

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The last part of this is absolutely poor on your part. You admit you are rude, and on purpose.

Perhaps you should have brought your point up in a different manner.

I was tracking this and wanted to mention that my RHP's DO provide FULL heat to my enclosures. I have 2 cages that use Pro-Products heat panels and nothing else. So in a sense I agree they can, and in my case DO heat a cage fully. I'm also not a heating and cooling guru so I won't go into why or how as I'm not interested in that as long as they work for me.

Whatever "wrong" info you think Evenstar is giving out could have been questioned much differently. She and a few others here have more quality advice regarding boa constrictors than most others on this board. The majority, including yourself, unless you are not listing all of your animals, keep royals.

So instead of waltzing into this section of the forum with a less than friendly attitude, consider discussing the topic in a more mature manner.

I was actually going to mention to Kali that I am successful heating my cages with RHP's, and I'm certain her response would have been open and willing to discuss how or why. Then I saw your post, and frankly it pissed me off. There are other knowledgable members in the royal forum (Kitedemon) that agree with Kali and her view on RHP's, so she is not making things up.

There are a lot of variables with caging/heating. Not everything works for everybody and not everybody uses the same techniques to house their animals.

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Originally Posted by Gio

The last part of this is absolutely poor on your part. You admit you are rude, and on purpose.

Perhaps you should have brought your point up in a different manner.

I was tracking this and wanted to mention that my RHP's DO provide FULL heat to my enclosures. I have 2 cages that use Pro-Products heat panels and nothing else. So in a sense I agree they can, and in my case DO heat a cage fully. I'm also not a heating and cooling guru so I won't go into why or how as I'm not interested in that as long as they work for me.

Whatever "wrong" info you think Evenstar is giving out could have been questioned much differently. She and a few others here have more quality advice regarding boa constrictors than most others on this board. The majority, including yourself, unless you are not listing all of your animals, keep royals.

So instead of waltzing into this section of the forum with a less than friendly attitude, consider discussing the topic in a more mature manner.

I was actually going to mention to Kali that I am successful heating my cages with RHP's, and I'm certain her response would have been open and willing to discuss how or why. Then I saw your post, and frankly it pissed me off. There are other knowledgable members in the royal forum (Kitedemon) that agree with Kali and her view on RHP's, so she is not making things up.

There are a lot of variables with caging/heating. Not everything works for everybody and not everybody uses the same techniques to house their animals.

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You're absolutely right I did come off very rude and I apologize to her for that.

However, my comments regarding the RHP still stand. I wasn't attacking her knowledge in boas, but she's doesn't have the proper understanding in how RHPs work.

This is what she originally wrote. Please tell me if this is correct:

" be aware that, like flexwatt, RHP's do NOT heat the ambient air temperature. They work using radiant heat which is directed downward and heats the surface immediately underneath the unit. So if your ambient temps are too low, an RHP will not help you - with or without flexwatt."

Then she proceeded in suggesting for the OP to get a space heater... So not only did she provide incorrect information, she suggested for the OP to buy unnecessary equipment.

Anyway, I again apologize for being rude and I apologize for hijacking OP's thread but the info Evenstar provided regarding RHPs is completely wrong.

My :2cent: worth:

The short version:

• "Radiant heat energy is emitted from a warm element, such as a floor, wall or overhead panel, and warms people and other objects in rooms rather than directly heating the air."

The long version:

• "Radiant panels heat a room through thermal radiation rather than convection. That is, a radiant heat panel transmits energy as photons in the infrared section of the electromagnetic spectrum. On the other hand, a furnace or boiler transmits energy via thermal excitation of air molecules. Although the example is unrealistic, a radiant heat panel could work in the vacuum of space where other heating systems would not. A radiant ceiling panel does very little to warm the air, but will warm any object in its direct line of sight. Radiant heat panels usually operate between 150 to 170 degrees F, but can go as low as 85 degrees F or as high as 300 degrees F. The ideal temperature is a function of the room size as well as the panel's surface area and wattage."
  

:gj:

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

My :2cent: worth:

The short version:

• "Radiant heat energy is emitted from a warm element, such as a floor, wall or overhead panel, and warms people and other objects in rooms rather than directly heating the air."

The long version:

• "Radiant panels heat a room through thermal radiation rather than convection. That is, a radiant heat panel transmits energy as photons in the infrared section of the electromagnetic spectrum. On the other hand, a furnace or boiler transmits energy via thermal excitation of air molecules. Although the example is unrealistic, a radiant heat panel could work in the vacuum of space where other heating systems would not. A radiant ceiling panel does very little to warm the air, but will warm any object in its direct line of sight. Radiant heat panels usually operate between 150 to 170 degrees F, but can go as low as 85 degrees F or as high as 300 degrees F. The ideal temperature is a function of the room size as well as the panel's surface area and wattage."
  

:gj:

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Excellent post Eric!

This (your post) is what Evenstar, I believe was trying to convey in the first place. THEY DO NOT HEAT AIR.

However, the heat they put out can be refracted to heat the air, and there are variables that can make that happen more, or less.

When I purchased my panels, I was told I needed to give specific high/low temps of the room, I was told to insulate under the cages, and I was also encouraged to have a room heater to assist with ambient air temps. The Pro-Products guy wanted the size of the cages and the species being kept, so he could determine the proper panel.

I'm not about to go into all of the how's and why's the panels provide my enclosures with "jungle like" temps, as that's not important and this thread isn't about my caging.

Kali offered several suggestions to assist the OP with temps.

Her information stating that RHP's do not heat air directly is correct. The maker of the panels will also tell you that.

An example of this, is a snake basking in the sun. The outside (air) temp could be 65-70F, yet the area in direct sunlight is 80-90F. The air is cool, the place where direct heat is shining is warm. That is not an ambient temp, as the air is still 65-70 degrees.

Here are some of the how's/why's I said I wasn't going to get into. BTW, I'm not a heating and cooling expert.

I assume my overall enclosure heat is from the RHP heating objects like the cage sides, the substrate, the rocks, branches and other clutter within the cage. Then, because the enclosures are small and tailored to the panels or vice versa, the heat builds up over a period of time and heats the air INDIRECTLY and the ambient temps go up.

This is why when you start using a RHP, getting your temps spot on takes a little while as the generated heat needs to build up.

So in reality Evenstar is exactly right, it's just more easily understood the way Eric Alan posted it.

That said, you CAN heat an entire, quality enclosure with a panel.

I think the advice offered to the OP was very good, and I would not say a room space heater is a bad suggestion. IF there is too much worry about the heating situation and these suggestions don't work, my advice would be not to keep that species of reptile until you can provide the proper environment.

People here try to help, and ALL options are given in some instances because it's not always easy to determine the exact situation another person has.

I have certainly found benefit from being offered several solutions to a problem and then hand picking the one that worked best. Sometimes trial and error is required.

Anyhow, I think Evenstar successfully keeping a HEALTHY collection of 40+ snakes that include lots of BC's, a carpet, some royals and god knows what else says a lot. Chances are she's run into her own heating/cooling crisis over the years and has solved the problems.

Hopefully, the OP is not discouraged by the train wreck this thread has become.

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Originally Posted by Gio

Excellent post Eric!

So in reality Evenstar is exactly right, it's just more easily understood the way Eric Alan posted it.

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I can't take the credit for the information, but I can take credit for being the best Google searcher in the West. It's amazing how much information is available at your fingertips if you just take the time to look for it (and have a clue about the information you're looking for before you get started). ;)

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Originally Posted by Gio

Hopefully, the OP is not discouraged by the train wreck this thread has become.

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This x 1000%. Information overload can be dangerously overwhelming, but keeping these amazing animals doesn't need to be as complicated as some attempt to make it out to be.

OP - if you were able to wade through all of this information and still have questions, you're still in the right place to ask. Please don't hesitate to do so. :)

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

I can't take the credit for the information, but I can take credit for being the best Google searcher in the West. It's amazing how much information is available at your fingertips if you just take the time to look for it (and have a clue about the information you're looking for before you get started). ;)

This x 1000%. Information overload can be dangerously overwhelming, but keeping these amazing animals doesn't need to be as complicated as some attempt to make it out to be.

OP - if you were able to wade through all of this information and still have questions, you're still in the right place to ask. Please don't hesitate to do so. :)

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I totally agree with this. I appreciate you outlining everything so clearly and being so helpful with this Eric. Gio is correct - this is exactly what I was trying to convey. :gj:

I will add that the idea of a space heater is still an alternative. An RHP, as I said originally, is certainly not a bad idea - not at all. The space heater is simply a different way of doing things and is also not wrong or unnecessary. I do have some concerns that an RHP will provide adequate heating if the room temps are only around 60. That is quite low for boas. But it could work - it all depends on your caging and the wattage of the unit. I would suggest to the OP that if you decide that is the way you want to go, give a shout to Rich at Reptile Basics, or talk to the folks at Pro-Products, to ensure you get the right unit for the job. ;)