Need a solution to maintain temperatures

Hi everyone!

I'm still relatively new to the world of snakes, I've had reptiles before but never a snake. Now that I have moved out of my parents house I have two. A normal, and a Fire ball. I have a couple of questions that I couldn't find the answer to in stickies or searching. (If my questions are answered in stickies and searches, I apologize...I'm blind haha.)

But anyway,

I have one tank set up in my closet (I took the doors off, and the tank is sitting on my dresser) and the other is DIRECTLY under my A/C vent. Probably isn't the smartest place to keep him but there wasn't much space for him anywhere else lol. My room mate and I like to keep the apartment at about 70 degrees F so it's pretty chilly in here sometimes. (both are glass 40 gallon tanks)

The problem i'm having is keeping my temperatures up. On both set-ups I have two 100w daytime heat lamps (I understand snakes don't need lights on the tank) those fixtures are over the cooler side of the tanks. On the warmer side of the tanks I have the Ultratherm heating mat. I believe the sizes of both heating mats are 17x11 at 30 Watts.

the bulbs seem to be putting out more heat than the heat mats. I have (on each) a digital temp gauge with a probe, and the zoomed temp gauge/humidity gauge.

as of right now its almost 9:00pm so theyre heat lamps are turned off and the digital temp gauge is reading about 77 degrees F on both and the zoomed gauges are about 72-73ish

the care sheet I read in the sticky said my tank shouldn't get below 75 degrees (If I remember correctly)

Mainly the problem i'm having is during the day. I can't get the temperatures up to the ambient temps, nor the basking temps. I'll try to turn off the A/C but my room mate always turns it back on so it's pointless to try and keep our apartment warm.

I'm not sure if my heat mats are big enough to bring the temps up to where my snakes would like them to be. The associate at my local pet store said the size of the heat mats should be fine, but if not he would exchange my smaller ones for bigger ones.

basically you all read that to read this lol

should I go the heat mat route?

or should I get 150w day heat bulbs, and two 75w night heat bulbs and use one of each for my snakes?

As i've said before, I'm pretty new at this still. Should I have two pythons? Honestly? No but when I saw my newest python I instantly grew emotionally attatched. My love for the two grow every day and I just want to take care of them both properly.

I appreciate everyone for taking the time out of their day to read about my problem and thank everyone for they're replies.

Have you read a caresheet or a glass tank set-up guide? They'll be tremendously helpful in guiding you while you're learning about your two new friends!

Ball Python Caresheet: http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...s%29-Caresheet

Glass Tank Set-Up Guide: http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...With-Pictures!

Welcome to the forums! Let us know if you have further questions once you've read the two links above! :)

If you have a screen top it's best to cover half of it with something like a few sheets of aluminum foil. It helps keep the heat and humidity in. Do you have anything to measure humidity? You didn't mention it. I have a ceramic heat emitter(gives heat but no light) on my cold side to help keep the temps up and it works great. Also do you have a thermostat for your heat mat?

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Originally Posted by Drako21

If you have a screen top it's best to cover half of it with something like a few sheets of aluminum foil. It helps keep the heat and humidity in. Do you have anything to measure humidity? You didn't mention it. I have a ceramic heat emitter(gives heat but no light) on my cold side to help keep the temps up and it works great. Also do you have a thermostat for your heat mat?

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Yes, I have have the zoomed temp gauge/humidity gauge 2 in 1 thats stuck on the glass. I just looked at a "how to set up a glass tank" sticky and I saw that the digital temp gauge probe is taped underneath the heat pad, so tomorrow I'm going to try that. That way I'll have 4 digital gauges giving me a more accurate temp.

I do not have a thermostat and the moment. Is it necessary? If so I'll have to wait another week to get 2 of them when I get paid. I made the mistake of buying everything at once including the snakes. Let's just say next time I'll be smarter about it.

If the heat mat isn't big enough for my tanks, will the thermostat raise the temperature of the heat mat?

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Originally Posted by Crispy757

If the heat mat isn't big enough for my tanks, will the thermostat raise the temperature of the heat mat?

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No, the thermostat will prevent the UTH from heating up to the point where your snake gets burned. It is the single most important piece of equipment you can have.

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Originally Posted by Crispy757

Yes, I have have the zoomed temp gauge/humidity gauge 2 in 1 thats stuck on the glass. I just looked at a "how to set up a glass tank" sticky and I saw that the digital temp gauge probe is taped underneath the heat pad, so tomorrow I'm going to try that.

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Incorrect. The thermostat probe is taped underneath the heat pad (the Hygrofarm brand in the guide). The thermostat is the one that controls the temperature. A thermometer is what tells you what the temperature is (the Accurite brand one in the guide). Its probe is placed inside of your tank on top of the heat mat to tell you the temperature of the glass where your animals can actually touch. Please do not confuse the two and tape your thermometer probe underneath the heat pad, as they perform very different functions. :) On a similar note, please do not use anything sticky inside the tank itself. Adhesive + scales = a very scary situation.

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Originally Posted by Crispy757

I do not have a thermostat and the moment. Is it necessary? If so I'll have to wait another week to get 2 of them when I get paid. I made the mistake of buying everything at once including the snakes. Let's just say next time I'll be smarter about it.

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The thermostat is the most important piece of equipment you can buy for your animals. Without one, the heat mats can reach temperatures that are too hot for your snakes and potentially cause them harm. Yes, even the small heat mats. The set-up guide recommends a few different ones (depending on your price range) that will serve you well.

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Originally Posted by Crispy757

If the heat mat isn't big enough for my tanks, will the thermostat raise the temperature of the heat mat?

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A thermostat will not raise the temperature any further than a heat mat by itself is capable of reaching. The size of the heat mat simply increases the size of the hot spot. Regardless of the heat mat chosen, they all require a thermostat to control their output.

Thermostats are absolutely. Neccessary. Right now your temps are way higher than you think. My guess is that hot spot is pushing 110 degrees. You should really Turn it off until you get that thermostat, otherwise you Will burn your snake if they get to the bottom and stay on that heat pad. It's summer, they will be fine for a few days without heat. Even if you just go buy a cheap temperature dialer at the pet store that will be fine for. NOw until you get a nice one.

Or at the very least if you are strapped for cash at the moment you can hook the heat mat up to a dimmer so you can at least lower the temperature down to a safe level.

Thank you everyone for your input. I'm on my way right now to my local pet store to buy a thermostat. My only other question is, do I have to buy two seperate ones since I have two set ups? Or would I be able to get one and hook it up to both heat pads?

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Thank you everyone for your input. I'm on my way right now to my local pet store to buy a thermostat. My only other question is, do I have to buy two seperate ones since I have two set ups? Or would I be able to get one and hook it up to both heat pads?

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If they are the same size and brand of heat mat, you can plug the t-stat into the wall and a power strip into the t-stat then plug the heat mats into the power bar. HOWEVER, they must absolutely be the same brand and size of UTH, or they won't maintain the same temperature.

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Originally Posted by CptJack

If they are the same size and brand of heat mat, you can plug the t-stat into the wall and a power strip into the t-stat then plug the heat mats into the power bar. HOWEVER, they must absolutely be the same brand and size of UTH, or they won't maintain the same temperature.

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They are the same set up and same brand heat mat yes. I just had to get two more digital temp gauges with probes to put the probes directly inside the tank over the hot spot to keep an eye on both temps. I ended up getting the zilla thermostat which was 50 bucks

You don't really have to use extra probes, honestly. If the t-stat is sending current/power to keep one at 90 degrees (or whatever), then the other one is getting the same amount of power and with all the variables being the same (brand, size, set up) temperature is going to be the same.

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Originally Posted by CptJack

If they are the same size and brand of heat mat, you can plug the t-stat into the wall and a power strip into the t-stat then plug the heat mats into the power bar. HOWEVER, they must absolutely be the same brand and size of UTH, or they won't maintain the same temperature.

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I bought a Zilla thermostat today and my temperatures are way better. Although the dial seems to be off on the thermostat. I would turn the dial to between 80 and 90 and temperatures raised to like 96 degrees F (snakes were not in the tank and this time.) I played with the dial after a while to let the temp drop and brought them down to about 80 on both hot ends of the tanks. (its night time)

I'm assuming I just leave it plugged in and just ajust the dial accordingly to day and night temps?

I guess? I honestly don't know. The only night-time drop my guys get is the ambient temps cooling a few degrees after dark. I don't much around with their hot spots. I figure if they want out of the heat they can move. I don't think I even realized day/night temp differences were something you were supposed to do though, so! Maybe somebody smarter will come along and help us both out.

No reason to change temps between day and night. Just get your warm side dialed it at around 90 and leave it be 24/7. Keep an eye on that Zilla with your thermometers - they have known to be mildly unreliable if you aren't double checking them occasionally.

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

No reason to change temps between day and night. Just get your warm side dialed it at around 90 and leave it be 24/7. Keep an eye on that Zilla with your thermometers - they have known to be mildly unreliable if you aren't double checking them occasionally.

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Ok so now that I have this thermostat, it's not maintaining my temperatures well at all. I had my girlfriend turn the dial to about 85 degrees F before she left my house and she told me the temperatures and they were fine. I just walked into my apartment from work and checked the temperatures.....The tank under my A/C vent is reading 95.5 degrees F and the other one is reading 109.6!! I have the probes of the yellow digital thermometers right in the middle of the hot spots inside the tank.

The thermostat I have is the Zilla one, and both of my heat mats are the same brand and size.

this is driving me up the wall, and is very stressful! lol

109.6 is WAY to high and 95.5 is pushing it to the limit! Having no thermostat (unplugging it) is better than those temps.

You have the thermostat probe placed between the heat pad and the glass, right?

Also, there's a reason that this: http://www.spyderrobotics.com/store/...products_id=24 gets used by most breeders. I know it's a bit more money than the Zilla, but it's worth it IMO. Quality thermostat = peace of mind. :)

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

109.6 is WAY to high and 95.5 is pushing it to the limit! Having no thermostat (unplugging it) is better than those temps.

You have the thermostat probe placed between the heat pad and the glass, right?

Also, there's a reason that this: http://www.spyderrobotics.com/store/...products_id=24 gets used by most breeders. I know it's a bit more money than the Zilla, but it's worth it IMO. Quality thermostat = peace of mind. :)

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I know the temps are way too high haha.

The knob on the dial was only at like 85. And since I'm running two heat pads on the same thermostat, no the probe isnt placed between the heat pad and the glass. I honestly feel like I'm going to have to buy another thermostat...I've spent almost 600 bucks on this stuff and half of it I can't even take back lmao. But what's another 50 bucks right? hahaha

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Originally Posted by Crispy757

I know the temps are way too high haha.

The knob on the dial was only at like 85. And since I'm running two heat pads on the same thermostat, no the probe isnt placed between the heat pad and the glass. I honestly feel like I'm going to have to buy another thermostat...I've spent almost 600 bucks on this stuff and half of it I can't even take back lmao. But what's another 50 bucks right? hahaha

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Wait. WHERE IS the thermostat probe? It should still be between the headpad and glass of one of the enclosures! If it's jsut in the air, it's reading air temps and sending heat to the pads accordingly. It cuts off and stops sending energy/eat to the pads when it reads the temperature you've set it to. If it's not in a place TO read that temperature (between the pad and the glass) then it's just going to keep dumping energy in. It doesn't matter how many pads you're running on one t-stat. The probe *has* to be sandwiched between one of them and the enclosure bottom.

My cats yanked my thermostat probe out from where it was sandwiched and heat RAPIDLY climbed up to dangerous levels because, like I said, the probe said it was about 80 (room temp in the snake room).

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Originally Posted by Crispy757

I know the temps are way too high haha.

The knob on the dial was only at like 85. And since I'm running two heat pads on the same thermostat, no the probe isnt placed between the heat pad and the glass. I honestly feel like I'm going to have to buy another thermostat...I've spent almost 600 bucks on this stuff and half of it I can't even take back lmao. But what's another 50 bucks right? hahaha

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So where is the probe? :confusd:

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

So where is the probe? :confusd:

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Hahahaha, I feel like an idiot now.

The probe is just laying on the ground. The guy at the pet store said I don't have to worry about it....but apparently he was wrong and wanted my snakes to die so I can spend more money.


The heat pads are unplugged for now so they can cool down. in a few hours I'm going to hook them back up and sandwich the probe between the heat pad and glass.

I can't thank you guys enough hahaha.

You're welcome! Pet store employees are either worth their weight and gold, or need to be evicted from the planet. This guy definitely belongs to the later group.

Glad nobody got hurt and you didn't have to spend more money!

:D I'm glad I came back from running errands to a happy ending. Best of luck to you and your snakes! :gj:

now that the thermostat is working, do you still have a tank that is located directly under the vent from the AC unit, meaning there is cool air blowing right on top of it?

i could not find an update on that. i think you really need a different location. its not as bad as trying to run a coffee machine in a fridge, but lets just say its really not ideal. the AC is reducing the effectiveness of the heat mat and the heat lamp which are reducing the effectiveness of the AC, its like a tug of war.

i see 3 long-term problems: humidity will be really low when cold air is constantly coming in and getting heated. warm air can hold more water than cold air so that causes a humidity drop and greatly increases evaporation. then, you need more powerful heat sources to locally overpower the AC, which makes it more dangerous if a thermostat fails, more power increases the risk of bad burns if equipment fails. the third problem will be increased utility bills.

you might want to put all your enclosures in a closet with doors that can be closed and some ventilation holes in the doors. or use a rack system which has good thermal insulation. in general, thermal insulation is your friend when you want to see any efficiency in this situation.

I went and got those plastic covers for vents that direct the air in another direction. Thanks to everyone's help my temps are now regulated and my snakes are happy. And that makes me happy lol. I guess you gotta make mistakes to learn from them right? Haha

Thanks again everyone!

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/07/13/epybutag.jpg

Here's my little family lol. My female normal named Medusa, my male fire ball named Hades and the woman who let me spend all this money, my lovely girlfriend Jessica hahaha


Hades' head got cut out, but I'm sure you all know what it looks like haha.