Breeding

I am about to start breeding does anyone know two cheap morphs I can get that produce something expensive I am not doing this for the money I want money because I would like to start a panda pied project and I need money to buy a pied ball python I have about $180 to spend on the snakes.

Dont think you are going to get a lot of options for 180.00 otherwise everyone and their mother would be doing this. Also you say you arent in this for the money but that appears that is all you are in it for which is gonna push some buttons here. I would look into a savings program that would yield you enough money to buy the snake you want.

So you want something cheap to make something expensive but are not doing this for the money?

Make sense! Good luck with that, if you want to see a return that you can invest in future projects you need to change your thinking.

With a $180 "investment" you will lose money and not even break even. Basic housing, feeding, and cost of breeding will cost you more then what you will produce your first year, if you even produce anything.






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So you say your starting to breed but do you actually have any animals ready to breed? Or are you asking us to recommend cheap morphs that are breeding size that are $180?


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This kid wrote he is 13 and wanted to start a reptile collection then later on the post he said he is 12 years old. Gee and your dad Is helping you build a room for your 28 reptiles you're wishing to get. OK. My advice stay in school.

Let me be slightly off topic. I was big into cars and when I got into them I paid 35k for it and 50k in mods. You couldn't touch it with anything under 450k. Now those cars are 15k used and those mods are tons cheaper cause its old technology. Guess what every 17 year old kid drives them and it eventually happens to all markets.

I have been on this site for a little over a month and have seen dozens of posts of I wanna be a breeder so I can be rich.. sad to see what these animals conditions will look like.

I plan to breed selectively for me. I have a plan, I am collecting supplies and I am making contacts in the industry. i dont understand why people are so lazy they cant do their own legwork.

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Originally Posted by ElliotNess

Dont think you are going to get a lot of options for 180.00 otherwise everyone and their mother would be doing this. Also you say you arent in this for the money but that appears that is all you are in it for which is gonna push some buttons here. I would look into a savings program that would yield you enough money to buy the snake you want.

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I said that I was not in it for the money I kinda end money to get snakes I can't give away snakes for free and expect to get be able to get more animals.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

So you want something cheap to make something expensive but are not doing this for the money?

Make sense! Good luck with that, if you want to see a return that you can invest in future projects you need to change your thinking.

With a $180 "investment" you will lose money and not even break even. Basic housing, feeding, and cost of breeding will cost you more then what you will produce your first year, if you even produce anything.






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it does make perfect sense how am I going to pay for snakes food and other supplies if I don't have money if you can find me someone who will donate me the food and supplies then I will not sell the snakes I would gladly keep them. I have $400 dollars I just subtracted the money from racks, cages, supplies, and food. I did not ask this question to be insulted and to be told I am lying, so please don't do that just help me by answering my question.

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Originally Posted by AlexisFitzy

So you say your starting to breed but do you actually have any animals ready to breed? Or are you asking us to recommend cheap morphs that are breeding size that are $180?


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I have one snake that can breed but I wanted to breed some morphs.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

it does make perfect sense how am I going to pay for snakes food and other supplies if I don't have money if you can find me someone who will donate me the food and supplies then I will not sell the snakes I would gladly keep them. I have $400 dollars I just subtracted the money from racks, cages, supplies, and food. I did not ask this question to be insulted and to be told I am lying, so please don't do that just help me by answering my question.

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Hey, I have 400 to invest!!! If you find someone willing to donate the food and supplies let me know!!! I want in!!!!

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Originally Posted by JiBster816

This kid wrote he is 13 and wanted to start a reptile collection then later on the post he said he is 12 years old. Gee and your dad Is helping you build a room for your 28 reptiles you're wishing to get. OK. My advice stay in school.

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Maybe I said I was 13 and then later on in the post I said because of a typo? Yeah, I would like to say I am 14 to make there is no confusion I was 13 when I posted that now I am getting the supplies and I am now 14 years old, 14. My dad is not gonna help me build a reptile room but he has changed his mind so I am selling my drums to get the money to get 2 ball pythons to breed. Also I am not quitting school to do this it is summer and I plan on stating in school.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

I have one snake that can breed but I wanted to breed some morphs.

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Okay so is your snake that can breed a normal? And is it male or female?


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Originally Posted by ElliotNess

Let me be slightly off topic. I was big into cars and when I got into them I paid 35k for it and 50k in mods. You couldn't touch it with anything under 450k. Now those cars are 15k used and those mods are tons cheaper cause its old technology. Guess what every 17 year old kid drives them and it eventually happens to all markets.

I have been on this site for a little over a month and have seen dozens of posts of I wanna be a breeder so I can be rich.. sad to see what these animals conditions will look like.

I plan to breed selectively for me. I have a plan, I am collecting supplies and I am making contacts in the industry. i dont understand why people are so lazy they cant do their own legwork.

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The reason I am only getting 2 snakes is so that I have money to spend on the racks I might wait until I can get the perfect racks for the snakes I just wanted to know some morphs to breed and I don't understand why no one will help I just keep being insulted and called a liar.

I would suggest you save your money and just purchase a pair of black pastels that are both het for pied. By the time you buy a pair of snakes, breed them, hopefully get eggs, hopefully hatch babies and sell them you probably could have purchased the snakes you want. Plus, you'll have a hard time making any profit from breeding two inexpensive snakes.

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Originally Posted by AlexisFitzy

Okay so is your snake that can breed a normal? And is it male or female?


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It is a normal male.

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Originally Posted by Dave Green

I would suggest you save your money and just purchase a pair of black pastels that are both het for pied. By the time you buy a pair of snakes, breed them, hopefully get eggs, hopefully hatch babies and sell them you probably could have purchased the snakes you want. Plus, you'll have a hard time making any profit from breeding two inexpensive snakes.

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Thank you, you are the only person who hasn't insulted me. Thank you for actually helping me.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

it does make perfect sense how am I going to pay for snakes food and other supplies if I don't have money if you can find me someone who will donate me the food and supplies then I will not sell the snakes I would gladly keep them. I have $400 dollars I just subtracted the money from racks, cages, supplies, and food. I did not ask this question to be insulted and to be told I am lying, so please don't do that just help me by answering my question.

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Please point out where I insulted you or said you were lying?

What I posted is just a facts now you want to shortest answer to your question that is fine.

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does anyone know two cheap morphs I can get that produce something expensive

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NO, because two cheap morph don't make something expensive. :gj:

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

It is a normal male.

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Okay perfect :) I started with a normal male too. He was sold to me as a girl but turned out to be a boy lol. So instead of using your normal male for a breeder I would invest in two morphs 1.1 male/female. But instead of buying that 1.1 pair right off the bat I would buy all of your supplies first and have everything ready for your snakes. The supplies are so much more expensive than the snakes. So get your racks, thermostats, water bowls, hides, whatever substrate you prefer, and your incubator. Have all your supplies ready. Then save up for a nice 1.1 pair or even 1.2 pair whatever you can afford. I'd also check out http://www.worldofballpythons.com it's an awesome site that I spend hours on :D it will help you figure out what morphs you like and where you want to go with your breeding plans.


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Originally Posted by Deborah

Please point out where I insulted you or said you were lying?

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i said I wasn't in it for the money and you said it looks like that is all I was in it for.

I never once insulted you or called you a liar. I made the point that what you are attempting to do is unreasonable and like not possible. My other point was that the market has turned from get rich energy drink schemes to breeding. The route you are going, you will be a CL breeder selling substandard animals for ridiculous prices and contaminating the market. I am a grown man with a good job. I am slow, methodical and I plan thanks to my OCD. I am building a 2nd 3rd and 4th rack of varying sizes before the end of the year. You know how many BPs I have. 1 male het ghost and am in the process of collecting more. Be prepared. Be methodical. PLAN. PLAN and PLAN AGAIN.

There is a saying - Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part.

Figure that out and it will help you tremendously in life.

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Originally Posted by AlexisFitzy

Okay perfect :) I started with a normal male too. He was sold to me as a girl but turned out to be a boy lol. So instead of using your normal male for a breeder I would invest in two morphs 1.1 male/female. But instead of buying that 1.1 pair right off the bat I would buy all of your supplies first and have everything ready for your snakes. The supplies are so much more expensive than the snakes. So get your racks, thermostats, water bowls, hides, whatever substrate you prefer, and your incubator. Have all your supplies ready. Then save up for a nice 1.1 pair or even 1.2 pair whatever you can afford. I'd also check out http://www.worldofballpythons.com it's an awesome site that I spend hours on :D it will help you figure out what morphs you like and where you want to go with your breeding plans.


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i was saving up for the supplies first I think I'll exactly what you said, thank you.

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Originally Posted by ElliotNess

I never once insulted you or called you a liar. I made the point that what you are attempting to do is unreasonable and like not possible. My other point was that the market has turned from get rich energy drink schemes to breeding. The route you are going, you will be a CL breeder selling substandard animals for ridiculous prices and contaminating the market. I am a grown man with a good job. I am slow, methodical and I plan thanks to my OCD. I am building a 2nd 3rd and 4th rack of varying sizes before the end of the year. You know how many BPs I have. 1 male het ghost and am in the process of collecting more. Be prepared. Be methodical. PLAN. PLAN and PLAN AGAIN.

There is a saying - Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part.

Figure that out and it will help you tremendously in life.

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I am planning I want to get all of my supplies before I get another snake even if I have to wait till next year I just want to be prepared first I wanted to know what kinds of snakes to get when I do get them.

You could also but a female black pastel het pied and raise it up for a year or two and then buy your male black pastel het pied.

I will try to temper my response and ask you a few simple questions.
After you initial investment, do you have a steady cash flow to buy food
and supplies?
Your breeding may take time, these animals don't breed on your
financial needs are you prepared to house and care for them till they
produce?
Lets consider that you breed, do you have an incubator to hatch the eggs?
A rack that will house the babies?
More money for food and supplies?
A person or pet store to sell the babies to?
There are alot of thing's to consider before you breed and most cost money,
but the most important issue is the wellbeing of the animals and thats where
you are making your biggest mistake.
Save you money enjoy your snake and forget about breeding.

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Originally Posted by ElliotNess

I never once insulted you or called you a liar.

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You said I was in it for the money after I said I wasn't.

I would just save up my money and buy a nice enclosure and get everything set and then get the panda pied you wanted.

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Originally Posted by brock lesser

I will try to temper my response and ask you a few simple questions.
After you initial investment, do you have a steady cash flow to buy food
and supplies?
Your breeding may take time, these animals don't breed on your
financial needs are you prepared to house and care for them till they
produce?
Lets consider that you breed, do you have an incubator to hatch the eggs?
A rack that will house the babies?
More money for food and supplies?
A person or pet store to sell the babies to?
There are alot of thing's to consider before you breed and most cost money,
but the most important issue is the wellbeing of the animals and thats where
you are making your biggest mistake.
Save you money enjoy your snake and forget about breeding.

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I have the stuff to take care of the snakes but obviously that doesn't matter. I think everyone is right even though I have the stuff to take care of them that doesn't mean I have the stuff to take care of them ( because that makes sense) I guess I should just give up on everything sell the snake I got now and just back out because I wouldn't want to as one person on here said be a breeder selling substandard snakes for expensive prices.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

i was saving up for the supplies first I think I'll exactly what you said, thank you.

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Perfect [emoji4] and also try & find nice quality snakes. You don't want to be a breeder with a lot of low quality animals. The market these days is pretty rough. Even high quality snakes are difficult to sell. So start with quality my friend :) and also I know your offended by some of the comments but please stay on the site and absorb all of the knowledge these people have to offer. Some of these people have been breeding for years & years so they have lots of great experience. Even though I feel they went about it in a way I personally would not have, but it's all said and done now so we have to move on. But keep us updated on your endeavors :) we are all rooting for you.


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Originally Posted by AlexisFitzy

Perfect [emoji4] and also try & find nice quality snakes. You don't want to be a breeder with a lot of low quality animals. The market these days is pretty rough. Even high quality snakes are difficult to sell. So start with quality my friend :) and also I know your offended by some of the comments but please stay on the site and absorb all of the knowledge these people have to offer. Some of these people have been breeding for years & years so they have lots of great experience. Even though I feel they went about it in a way I personally would not have, but it's all said and done now so we have to move on. But keep us updated on your endeavors :) we are all rooting for you.


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Thank you I will.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

I said that I was not in it for the money I kinda end money to get snakes I can't give away snakes for free and expect to get be able to get more animals.

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If you want to do this I would suggest looking into it once you have a job, there are reoccurring costs and a few start up costs to go along with it. If you want to have more animals, you better have the fiances to do this for free. Most of us do not make money. Never ever plan on making money, it's like putting all that money on "4" and expecting something in return.

http://www.kanzen.com/genimg/america...l-0-00-abb.jpg

Sure there are some people who do very well, as for the rest of us.... it's just fun playing.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

I am about to start breeding does anyone know two cheap morphs I can get that produce something expensive I am not doing this for the money I want money because I would like to start a panda pied project and I need money to buy a pied ball python I have about $180 to spend on the snakes.

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Did I miss something here. I am telling you that you state you need to breed 2 cheap snakes into expensive ones. Thats in it for the money. I would take everyone's advice here, step back and plan some more.

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Originally Posted by OhhWatALoser

If you want to do this I would suggest looking into it once you have a job, there are reoccurring costs and a few start up costs to go along with it. If you want to have more animals, you better have the fiances to do this for free. Most of us do not make money. Never ever plan on making money, it's like putting all that money on "4" and expecting something in return.

http://www.kanzen.com/genimg/america...l-0-00-abb.jpg

Sure there are some people who do very well, as for the rest of us.... it's just fun playing.

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I will make sure to do that, thanks

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Originally Posted by ElliotNess

Did I miss something here. I am telling you that you state you need to breed 2 cheap snakes into expensive ones. Thats in it for the money. I would take everyone's advice here, step back and plan some more.

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listen carefully and please reply answering these questions. I am not in it for the money I am in it for the reptiles. How am I going to take care of the reptiles if I don't make money breeding them? Do you expect me to just magically create the rats and the racks and the tubs and the substrate and the hides and the water bowls? Because I don't know how to do that.I am going to spend all of the money on the reptiles.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

I have the stuff to take care of the snakes but obviously that doesn't matter. I think everyone is right even though I have the stuff to take care of them that doesn't mean I have the stuff to take care of them ( because that makes sense) I guess I should just give up on everything sell the snake I got now and just back out because I wouldn't want to as one person on here said be a breeder selling substandard snakes for expensive prices.

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The one unforgivable sin is letting an animal suffer.
Now I'm not saying you would so don't take it that way,
but in your original post people saw that as a likely scenario.
No one here said sell everything and leave.
If you really have a passion for these animals stay, keep your dream but take it slowly, learn
and breed what you want when your needs and the needs of your snakes can be met.

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Originally Posted by brock lesser

The one unforgivable sin is letting an animal suffer.
Now I'm not saying you would so don't take it that way,
but in your original post people saw that as a likely scenario.
No one here said sell everything and leave.
If you really have a passion for these animals stay, keep your dream but take it slowly, learn
and breed what you want when your needs and the needs of your snakes can be met.

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Okay but people don't know that I have the money to pay for them and I have a steady income that is not an allowance it is actually enough to do this I just want people to answer my question.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

listen carefully and please reply answering these questions. I am not in it for the money I am in it for the reptiles. How am I going to take care of the reptiles if I don't make money breeding them? Do you expect me to just magically create the rats and the racks and the tubs and the substrate and the hides and the water bowls? Because I don't know how to do that.I am going to spend all of the money on the reptiles.

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What if your animals don't breed till the next season?
If your only income is selling the babies what will you use to buy everything until you sell babies ?

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Originally Posted by brock lesser

What if your animals don't breed till the next season?
If your only income is selling the babies what will you use to buy everything until you sell babies ?

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I everyone knew that you can get a work permit at 14 I would not be asked this question.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

listen carefully and please reply answering these questions. I am not in it for the money I am in it for the reptiles. How am I going to take care of the reptiles if I don't make money breeding them? Do you expect me to just magically create the rats and the racks and the tubs and the substrate and the hides and the water bowls? Because I don't know how to do that.I am going to spend all of the money on the reptiles.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

Okay but people don't know that I have the money to pay for them and I have a steady income that is not an allowance it is actually enough to do this I just want people to answer my question.

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??? Now I'm confused, you don't have the money but you do?

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

How am I going to take care of the reptiles if I don't make money breeding them?

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Exactly. How? This is a question that you need to answer before owning a pet that depends entirely on you to live.

This is my last post to you because you obviously are hearing what I am saying but not listening to a word any one has told you.

PLAIN AND SIMPLE -

How am I going to take care of the reptiles if I don't make money breeding them?

MOW LAWNS SAVE MONEY

Do you expect me to just magically create the rats and the racks and the tubs and the substrate and the hides and the water bowls?

MOW LAWNS SAVE MONEY


Despite what Obama promises nothing in life is free. You are putting the cart before the horse but let us know how that goes....

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Originally Posted by brock lesser

??? Now I'm confused, you don't have the money but you do?

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I do have the money

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Originally Posted by ElliotNess

This is my last post to you because you obviously are hearing what I am saying but not listening to a word any one has told you.

PLAIN AND SIMPLE -

How am I going to take care of the reptiles if I don't make money breeding them?

MOW LAWNS SAVE MONEY

Do you expect me to just magically create the rats and the racks and the tubs and the substrate and the hides and the water bowls?

MOW LAWNS SAVE MONEY


Despite what Obama promises nothing in life is free. You are putting the cart before the horse but let us know how that goes....

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Last post to me? Thank you so much for not helping at all with my question by the I will gladly let everyone know how this goes.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

listen carefully and please reply answering these questions. I am not in it for the money I am in it for the reptiles. How am I going to take care of the reptiles if I don't make money breeding them? Do you expect me to just magically create the rats and the racks and the tubs and the substrate and the hides and the water bowls? Because I don't know how to do that.I am going to spend all of the money on the reptiles.

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Everyone hopes to have a hobby paying for itself, been there done, I am even one of those making a profit, the difference is that YOUR plan is UNREALISTIC

What you are failing to understand is that based on your first post

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I have about $180 to spend on the snakes.

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it's just not gonna happen.

You need to feed 2 snakes for 2 or maybe 3 years, you will need to buy or build an hatchling rack, an incubator, you will need to feed 6 to 12 extra mouths for an undetermined amount of time (until the hatchling sell whether it is retail or wholesale).

Now here is the reality of the market, normal and single gene animals are hard to move the market is flooded as it is now, and by the time your animals will be ready to breed and produce a clutch the price of said animals will have dropped even more and they will still be as hard to move. Even if you are lucky enough to produce a 2 genes animal you will not see a return.

Again by the time you produce something (based on the initial investment) you will have already spend more then what the clutch is worth, that means you will not make a profit, you will not break even you will be in the red (been there done that too for 2 years when I first started and I initially invest 10K)

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

Exactly. How? This is a question that you need to answer before owning a pet that depends entirely on you to live.

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By having a job you can get a work permit at age 14 and it just so happens that I am 14

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Everyone hopes to have a hobby paying for itself, been there done, I am even one of those making a profit, the difference is that YOUR plan is UNREALISTIC

What you are failing to understand is that based on your first post it's just not gonna happen.

You need to feed 2 snakes for 2 or maybe 3 years, you will need to buy or build an hatchling rack, an incubator, you will need to feed 6 to 12 extra mouths for an undetermined amount of time (until the hatchling sell whether it is retail or wholesale).

Now here is the reality of the market, normal and single gene animals are hard to move the market is flooded as it is now, and by the time your animals will be ready to breed and produce a clutch the price of said animals will have dropped even more and they will still be as hard to move. Even if you are lucky enough to produce a 2 genes animal you will not see a return.

Again by the time you produce something you will have already spend more then what the clutch is worth, that means you will not make a profit, you will not break even you will be in the red (been there done that too for 2 years and I initially invest 10K)

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I have $180 to spend on snakes, I have $400 to buy racks and other supplies plus a steady income.

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

By having a job you can get a work permit at age 14 and it just so happens that I am 14

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Then why not start saving money now and buy the animal you want?

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Originally Posted by dylanhagler

I have $180 to spend on snakes, I have $400 to buy racks and other supplies plus a steady income.

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I get that and you still don't understand so I will try one last time $180 in snakes is not gonna produce something expensive or even something that will make a return it is that simple, to make money you need to produce something that people want and that is selling, normal and single gene animals are VERY hard to sell especially males.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

I get that and you still don't understand so I will try one last time $180 in snakes is not gonna produce something expensive or even something that will make a return it is that simple, to make money you need to produce something that people want and that is selling, normal and single gene animals are VERY hard to sell especially males.

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Amen to that!

:popcorn:

Ok. Here's the thing. I know you say you can get a work permit, which translates to me as 'I don't have a job yet but I will.' So kudos to you for getting a job. Good life lessons and such.

But. You're 14. You're still in school and you will be for awhile. Are you going to have the time between your studies, your job, your snakes, and your social life to juggle it all? Being a teenager is hard enough without putting the extra pressure of a job and an intensive hobby like snake breeding. Any part time job you can get will likely not be 'steady income' because most people don't hire kids under the age of 16 or even 18 for liability reasons.

The old saying "You have to spend money to make money" does not apply in this hobby. Do not depend on making money. Don't go into this hobby planning on using what you earn to fund the hobby. Go into this hobby planning to never make a cent. You need to know that if you don't sell a single snake that you will still be able to care for all of them. Because most often people barely make back what they invested. You say you're passionate about the reptiles, and that's awesome. But with where you are in life, maybe you should get one or two good quality snakes and grow them. Don't rush into breeding. Do a ton of research. Figure out what direction you want to take. Start a piggy bank labeled "Snake Funding" and stick to a savings plan. Go to a lot of reptile shows and try and get a sense of how the game works. Ask questions. Talk to people.

I would hold onto your $180 and save a bit more to buy a high quality female hatchling. Raise her up, and use the two or three years to make a solid plan.

This forum is an amazing resource, but if you get an attitude or throw a tantrum like you've been doing for most of this thread, people are not going to want to help you. So be cool and stick with it. We want to see you succeed. :)

At 14 it's better to buy a ball python or two then to spend it on BS... It will take time if you are hoping to have a hobby that will pay for itself... Just be patient (which is hard) and start by buying just one PET snake. Then some upgraded equipment. Save, plan and watch prices. Then buy another snake...

I just got on my computer and added up all of my reptile expenditures since I started recently. I'm mega frugal this year (highly unusual for me and very painful) and I've still spent over $1,500 dollars since MAY! Most of that money is for taking care of my animals and not the animals themselves.

I didn't read every post on here (nor did I have to...) but I take it you're 14 years old. Holy crap I (and probably every one here) wish I would have thought about this when I was 14. I could have an amazing collection. I'm 29 and just now getting into the reptile hobby as a life choice. There are many others that don't get into the hobby until they're much older than me! From what I can tell the largest ball python breeder in my area (for now) started when he was a great deal older than I am. Things will start to fall into place IN TIME.

With 180 dollars... I would just stick to getting 1 snake FOR NOW. Get the best looking baby single gene you can find but be sure to look for quality and shop around. Find one that you like, in that price range you could find a spider which is popular or maybe you could find something more unique. Stay away from recessive for now. Just take care of that one snake for a while. Make sure he has the best living conditions you can provide. Then eventually, the funny thing about money is that eventually you have some, so buy another then bam you have 2.

There are ways to make money if you're a serious risk taker though :D The stock market around election time comes to mind... Back on track... Just buy one snake and take good care of it and understand that you are lucky to be getting into a kick ass hobby at such a young age. So much time is ahead of you. Just my 2 cents.