Female vanilla turns out to be male
5 months ago I bought a 2011 female 1600g (ended up being 1900g) vanilla from a local breeder. I've bought 5 or so snakes from this breeder and knew them fairly well.
I bred that vanilla with my male fire and they locked only one time (many many unsuccessful introductions). The vanilla was not eating and was losing a small amount of weight and I decided to pull my male until the vanilla put on some fat.
The night before last I pulled the vanillas tub to do a thorough clean, and got distracted by something and placed her with my female normal. They were left together overnight.
When I got home from work they were locked! I saw hemipene and everything (but couldn't tell from who). The vanillas tale was on bottom and my normal was on top (and every single lock I've had I noticed male was always on bottom).
After they released I probed both. My normal was still a girl, but the vanilla was male!! Vanilla probed 8 scales both sides and my normal 3 on each side.
Now, I normally double check the sex of snakes I buy, but I assumed I didn't have to (now I know, don't assume) because I knew the person. Also didn't question it because of the lock with my male fire, and also it had locked with the sellers male fire/vanilla (they weren't sure which morph).
Contacted the seller. Their explanation was it was one of the first morphs they bought ever (found that odd since the vanilla is a 2011) AND they bought it as a proven female (also odd because before buying it I asked if it was proven and they said no), and back then they didn't know how to check gender correctly so never got around to it. The $600 I paid is long gone. They offered future credit, or a 1300g female pastel + 300g male firefly. I didn't want or need those balls and told them so.
Worked it out a bit more and they offered a female black pewter blast (black pastel x pastel x pinstripe). What do you think of the trade? I'll be trading the vanilla back for it. I think it's fair but would like some opinions. I've seen it in person before and I loved it. Hatched late October 2013. I'd of course check the gender. Pics and weight will come later today
Re: Female vanilla turns out to be male
Quote:
Originally Posted by
reptileexperts
I'd take the trade . . . and in the end if your normal girl took the lock first try . . . still may end up with some vanilla offspring to savor. But I'd pop / probe the new "girl" before leaving the store.
I'm hoping she doesn't take the lock, I was wanting to get enchis from her this year. I'd be happy with a 2 sire clutch though
Re: Female vanilla turns out to be male
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MrLang
I would take the trade. Single gene females will be as out of style as single gene males pretty soon. I don't plan to add any more single gene females and will be phasing them out over the next year or two.
Sucks that it turns out to be a male. I'd be upset with the seller, but mistakes happen. Now if you got a male and it turned out female, that would be complete negligence. The other way around is somewhat understandable, especially if they bought her as an adult female. You assume someone has double checked by adulthood...
That's true, a triple gene female baby is much better to me than a single gene adult female. I'm not sure on the value of that baby (could not for the life of me find one for sale) but I do feel it's a fair trade.
The thing that sounds strange to me is that at first they said "she" was not proven and then later saying they bought it proven. So that means they bought it as an adult (and it's a 2011 and I bought it in 2013). What I don't understand is how can it be one of the first morphs they bought, they didn't know how to check gender, and they got it so recently. Just sounds odd to me.
But I'm very happy they're willing to work with me and fix the situation
Re: Female vanilla turns out to be male
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Originally Posted by
steve_r34
If ur second guessing ur not happy ...
Funny dont think I sexed my fire when I got him ... I had him out the other night n I wanted to see if he sperm yet cause there was a post in here about how young males could go and hes close to 400 so I was curious ... but went to pop nothing came out .. n I couldnt remember if Ipopped when I got him ... but then I went to pop again thinking wtf ... n he peed so I put him back ... im gonna have to pop him .. but I guess I win if he happens to be a female
Oh I'm not second guessing in the way I'd be unhappy, just curious if it's the morphs its labeled as. The main thing I'm wondering is if its got black pastel or cinnamon because they look similar to me in a pastel-pinstripe combo.
I'm no good at popping so I probe Lol. If I popped everyone then I'd have all females haha. That'd be awesome if you're fire turned out female though that'd be a good situation
Re: Female vanilla turns out to be male
I know you guys are set in your ways about popping, but it wouldn't be a bad investment to get a probe kit. Coming from a sorta newbie (two years into this) it's not that hard. You just have to be careful and gentle when probing. In my opinion, probing seems more accurate. Just a thought...
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Re: Female vanilla turns out to be male
Quote:
Originally Posted by
steve_r34
Man I just popped the life out of this snake and nothing now im buggin because I know how to pop snakes dam I vid on it ... now the person I got him from is real real real good breeder very well know and been around forever so this is kinda bugged out ... idk if its me or what ... but im gonna pop again in a couple days cause she is still little and I just popped the heck out of her ... dam this is gonna be weird if he is a she ..
At this point I'd probably probe (I strictly probe cuz I can't pop worth anything). I've heard of people first popping baby balls and then if it comes up female, probe it to confirm. If you don't feel comfortable probing then I'd find someone near me to do it
Re: Female vanilla turns out to be male
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Originally Posted by
Reptile Frenzy
So your saying the "male" vanilla locked with your male fire? Maybe your fire is actually a female then...i dont see 2 male snakes locking up of course what u thought was a lock up could have been actually just their tails wrapped...
2 males will lock up. Could have been just their tails wrapped but I'm 95% sure it was a lock. I have pictures of it in another thread here http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...-So-excited!!!
Re: Female vanilla turns out to be male
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Reptile Frenzy
i dont see 2 male snakes locking up
Yes they can. Has happened many times and been documented on this Forum.
Re: Female vanilla turns out to be male
Quote:
Originally Posted by
steve_r34
I can't probe for my life ... I can pop fine .. i made a video on it lol ... I just didn't think this breeder would mess up something like this ... its a female I will pop her one more Tim to confirm but he is a she ... sucks I gotta wait longer now for what I wanted but hey now I have a reason to buy a new male .. lmao ... and he must be het ghost ...
Well that's pretty cool! I'll take any of my males turning out to be female any day
