is this snake overfed or underfed?

http://rs183.pbsrc.com/albums/x25/jp...0?t=1391535661

From above photo, a viewer might say it's fat. This photo was taken 2 days after eating a small rat so it's not bulging due to food.

But i am confused because of the way it looks when viewed on other angles.

Here it is showing a ridge back whis i think is a sign of poor nourishment
http://rs183.pbsrc.com/albums/x25/jp...0?t=1391535804

And this showing a sinewy body
http://rs183.pbsrc.com/albums/x25/jp...0?t=1391535730

The looks are not the worst of my worry. The body is soft, like there is flab in between skin and muscle. I do not know if this is just loose skin from being too thin or if it's actual fat. I do not know much about ball pythons but to my understanding, reptile fat is internal not like us.

I hope you can tell from my photos if i should decrease or increase feeding. Thanks

It definately isnt too skinny. What is he currently eating and how often?

Doesn't look too thin to me. Hard to tell in photos sometimes, but if I had to hazard a guess, I would say it's leaning on the heavier side.

Looks fine to me!

That last photo looks like muscle.

Certainly not an underfed BP.

Looks about right to me...not too skinny and not too fat...

skinny neck, fat body :)

the proportions seem a bit weird, but maybe it went through a phase of rapid weight gain and it just takes some time to get evenly distributed.

it definitively has enough food. if anything i think it had a bit too much and gained a lot of weight in a short time.

whats its weight in grams, and do you have a scale and weigh her regularly? and how old is it? what do you feed, how often, and do you have the weight of the food items in grams? these digital kitchen scales that you can set to zero with an empty bowl on them, and then weigh the snake in the bowl, work really good.

that data will help a lot. i guess it will get better over time if you now keep it at a constant weight. i dont want to come across as rude, but to put it bluntly: its a sausage with a thin neck. that being said, i dont think its a health concern. snakes can be thicker or thinner and be perfectly healthy, its just that this one manages to have a thin neck and a big body at the same time. i may be completely wrong and its something very different, but then, only more information about age and weight and how its weight developed would reveal it :D

Thanks for your replies. current weight is 396 grams. It topped at 450 grams before unloading a big load of poop that it held for the first 3 months i had it. According to the breeder it was hatched in june 2013. I do not weight my rats, but the general size i feed it is the same as an adult mouse, given weekly.

By the way, i forgot to mention that the top view is fat and appears to be what is called a pinhead, but it's only like that because the wide part of the body flattens when relaxed. The body is soft, like there is empty space between the skin and ribs, feels totally diffetent from other balls that are packed solid with good muscle. It's also not as active as my other balls, it stays on one place if i set it down, i rarely see it cruising in the cage and it somewhat has a habit of half assing it's strike and coils prey with it's neck only. The movement also seems weird because i only see it doing the belly crawl and never the smooth serpentine.motion of an active ball python. Nevet goes into a ball too.

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Originally Posted by J.P.

Thanks for your replies. current weight is 396 grams. It topped at 450 grams before unloading a big load of poop that it held for the first 3 months i had it. According to the breeder it was hatched in june 2013. I do not weight my rats, but the general size i feed it is the same as an adult mouse, given weekly.

By the way, i forgot to mention that the top view is fat and appears to be what is called a pinhead, but it's only like that because the wide part of the body flattens when relaxed. The body is soft, like there is empty space between the skin and ribs, feels totally diffetent from other balls that are packed solid with good muscle. It's also not as active as my other balls, it stays on one place if i set it down, i rarely see it cruising in the cage and it somewhat has a habit of half assing it's strike and coils prey with it's neck only. The movement also seems weird because i only see it doing the belly crawl and never the smooth serpentine.motion of an active ball python. Nevet goes into a ball too.

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now it sounds difficult and complicated and i hope the real experts chime in :) i made too many assumptions (sorry for that), and now you say its behavior also shows oddities, and all i can say is that its weird. we need some experts here.

the snake looks fine .. i have some that just coil with there neck and its when i feed them a small meal .. if ur feeding it something as big as big mouse @ 400g u should up its prey size a bit more

A strongly fed bp will likely not ball up much, as it is probably uncomfortable to do so.

I do not know about the movements of your snake as I cannot personally see it. I expect it is just very full and trying to digest all the feedings. Keep your hot spot up around 92-94F to aid in digestion. Digestion consumes a lot of energy and the snakes metabolism will all be used for digestion instead of activity. Keep water bowl full and change often.

I would switch to rats if possible... "shake and bake" a rat in some mouse bedding to help switch your snake to rats.

I have had a few very well fed bps that act similar, and look the same. I have a 2013 1.0 Enchi Albino that I picked up in Daytona at 120g, and fed well in order to breed this season. His proportion was similar to your snakes..... thin head and neck while his body was growing quickly. He is now more well proportioned after a few months. First picture is probably somewhere around 300g. Second pic is just a few weeks ago over when 500+g and just introduced to a big Albino girl- more proportioned than when gaining weight rapidly.

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/h...ps26435c11.jpg

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/h...ps4e44c8f7.jpg

It eats rats, i just mentioned adult mouse for size comparison since i do not weight the rats i'm feeding to my balls. I just go by the common rule of thumb on not exceeding the snake's widest girth.

I do not think full belly is the issue on not balling up, since it's like that even when empty.

What i'm suspecting was this was powerfed before i got it, and with the regular diet i'm giving it's not getting the same nutrition it is used to so it's actually loosing body mass, hence the loose skin. I do know it is growing because twice it shed and there is noticeable increase in length.

I just visited a fellow ball keeper, and an adult male that is off feed for 2 months has the same loose skin and soft body. However, that fat appearance makes me reluctant to feed it more. I guess a strict weight monitoring is in order.

I really apreciate your comments. Will follow and hope mine progresses to a more proportional build and muscle tone.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pythonfriend

now it sounds difficult and complicated and i hope the real experts chime in :) i made too many assumptions (sorry for that), and now you say its behavior also shows oddities, and all i can say is that its weird. we need some experts here.

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No need to apologize. I actually think my albino looks wierd with it's skinny neck and fat looking body, it's the reason i posted. I agree with your opinion on rapid growth, i hope to rectify that by providing proper care.